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dcss:brainstorm:species:propose:golem [2011-12-06 10:23] greepish [Golem 1] |
dcss:brainstorm:species:propose:golem [2011-12-21 17:22] (current) XuaXua Page moved from dcss:brainstorm:species:golem to dcss:brainstorm:species:propose:golem |
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| ==== Golem 3 ==== | ==== Golem 3 ==== | ||
| - | [[user:Curio]] discussed in [[https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1519|this thread]]. | + | [[user:curio]] discussed in [[https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1519|this thread]]. |
| Patch: [[https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4400|4400]]. | Patch: [[https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4400|4400]]. | ||
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| >(Reposting an idea from the Tavern thread:) I like most of the flavor here, but I really don't think the game needs yet another large, tough, strong, equipment-restricted race with lousy magic. We already have trolls and ogres for that. Yes, the resistances distinguish these golems to some degree, but resistance to torment and mutation becomes relevant much, much too late to make up for the crippling lack of speed. Either a troll, naga, or mummy would be a superior choice for virtually any build. | >(Reposting an idea from the Tavern thread:) I like most of the flavor here, but I really don't think the game needs yet another large, tough, strong, equipment-restricted race with lousy magic. We already have trolls and ogres for that. Yes, the resistances distinguish these golems to some degree, but resistance to torment and mutation becomes relevant much, much too late to make up for the crippling lack of speed. Either a troll, naga, or mummy would be a superior choice for virtually any build. | ||
| > | > | ||
| - | >Instead, I propose the following: give golems really GOOD magic aptitudes, and even an innate wizardry bonus. However, instead of following the standard spell hunger formula, golems lose a flat, not-insignificant amount of nutrition for every point of mana regenerated which is not mitigated by anything, ever. (The flavor: golems have a very easy time channeling the magical energies that naturally course through their bodies into spells, but are carelessly expending their very essence in the process.) If the golem food clock (which is already dependent on a resource less readily available than chunks) is tuned finely enough, this could create some really interesting tension: you have easy access to powerful magic, and are all but forced to use it due to the fact that your slow speed puts you at such a disadvantage, but must do so as sparingly as possible to keep from destroying yourself. A little bit like spriggans (but the complete opposite in every non-magical respect), except golems are never "over the hump" the way late-game spriggans tend to be, since hungerless casting would be unachievable for them. Getting the nutrition numbers right would be tough, but it would make golems much more distinct among the races in general, and the large races especially. --- //[[user:Sjohara]] 2011-09-25 07:42// | + | >Instead, I propose the following: give golems really GOOD magic aptitudes, and even an innate wizardry bonus. However, instead of following the standard spell hunger formula, golems lose a flat, not-insignificant amount of nutrition for every point of mana regenerated which is not mitigated by anything, ever. (The flavor: golems have a very easy time channeling the magical energies that naturally course through their bodies into spells, but are carelessly expending their very essence in the process.) If the golem food clock (which is already dependent on a resource less readily available than chunks) is tuned finely enough, this could create some really interesting tension: you have easy access to powerful magic, and are all but forced to use it due to the fact that your slow speed puts you at such a disadvantage, but must do so as sparingly as possible to keep from destroying yourself. A little bit like spriggans (but the complete opposite in every non-magical respect), except golems are never "over the hump" the way late-game spriggans tend to be, since hungerless casting would be unachievable for them. Getting the nutrition numbers right would be tough, but it would make golems much more distinct among the races in general, and the large races especially. --- //[[user:sjohara]] 2011-09-25 07:42// |
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| ==== Golem 4 ==== | ==== Golem 4 ==== | ||
| - | [[user:TwilightPhoenix]] in [[https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2282|this thread]]. | + | [[user:twilightphoenix]] in [[https://crawl.develz.org/tavern/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2282|this thread]]. |
| Patch: [[https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4400|4400]]. | Patch: [[https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=4400|4400]]. | ||
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| You can temporarily meld with stone to heal yourself at the cost of losing a part of yourself. (Level 10) \\ | You can temporarily meld with stone to heal yourself at the cost of losing a part of yourself. (Level 10) \\ | ||
| - | >To add some brief explanations that didn't make it from the topic. Breathless means curare immunity, inability to use blowguns, and unable to drown. Combined with their heavy weight, they're able to wander around at the bottom of deep water, but they move extremely slowly (at minimum has similar affect of hitting them with Slow, at maximum it's always Slow Movement 3 when in deep water. Whatever's balanced), attacks always land (or, at least, EV is reduced to zero), and their ability to fight back while in water is extremely hampered. Maybe also make any fire spells they try to cast from underwater will just create a bunch of steam instead? Breathlessness also originally meant they'd be mute (they'd cast via gesturing), but a comment from Galehar on the forums stating they should either be fully affected by perma-silence or not be perma-silenced at all means making them mute probably isn't a good idea. --- //[[user:TwilightPhoenix]] 2011-08-17 23:45// | + | >To add some brief explanations that didn't make it from the topic. Breathless means curare immunity, inability to use blowguns, and unable to drown. Combined with their heavy weight, they're able to wander around at the bottom of deep water, but they move extremely slowly (at minimum has similar affect of hitting them with Slow, at maximum it's always Slow Movement 3 when in deep water. Whatever's balanced), attacks always land (or, at least, EV is reduced to zero), and their ability to fight back while in water is extremely hampered. Maybe also make any fire spells they try to cast from underwater will just create a bunch of steam instead? Breathlessness also originally meant they'd be mute (they'd cast via gesturing), but a comment from Galehar on the forums stating they should either be fully affected by perma-silence or not be perma-silenced at all means making them mute probably isn't a good idea. --- //[[user:twilightphoenix]] 2011-08-17 23:45// |
| **Aptitudes** \\ | **Aptitudes** \\ | ||
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| > Comments: 3-5 HP for large rocks won't work. You can throw a large rock repeatedly against a wall until it shatters, and then it will become much more valuable than 3-5 HP. Better to have large rocks heal large amounts. For compensation, the melding into walls should go, it was dubbed un-golemy. There is the drawback that players will go back to large rock piles in order to heal up. | > Comments: 3-5 HP for large rocks won't work. You can throw a large rock repeatedly against a wall until it shatters, and then it will become much more valuable than 3-5 HP. Better to have large rocks heal large amounts. For compensation, the melding into walls should go, it was dubbed un-golemy. There is the drawback that players will go back to large rock piles in order to heal up. | ||
| - | >> More HP for large rocks is fine, the numbers were just theoretical. The wall thing was sort of a panic button in case you ran out of rocks and that's what came to mind. They could probably survive without it, however. Going back to large rock piles for health sounds like the similar issue of stashing food and other consumables. It's not desirable, but figuring out how to deal with that would likely also solve stashing. --- //[[user:TwilightPhoenix]] 2011-08-17 23:45// | + | >> More HP for large rocks is fine, the numbers were just theoretical. The wall thing was sort of a panic button in case you ran out of rocks and that's what came to mind. They could probably survive without it, however. Going back to large rock piles for health sounds like the similar issue of stashing food and other consumables. It's not desirable, but figuring out how to deal with that would likely also solve stashing. --- //[[user:twilightphoenix]] 2011-08-17 23:45// |
| > Should stone/rock enchantment matter in any way for healing purposes? (Players will want to enchant rocks in any case for anti-mulching.) | > Should stone/rock enchantment matter in any way for healing purposes? (Players will want to enchant rocks in any case for anti-mulching.) | ||
| - | >> Not something I thought of, admittedly. I can see the advantages of allowing it. Enchanted rocks giving more health would create the decisions of "Do I enchant my weapon to kill stuff better or enchant my rocks to stay alive better?" and "Do I throw my enchanted large rock to kill this Ettin, risking it breaking, or do I keep it to heal myself after he hits me with those giant spiked clubs?" On the downside, it might lead to players hording their scrolls until they find a pile of large rocks. --- //[[user:TwilightPhoenix]] 2011-08-17 23:45// | + | >> Not something I thought of, admittedly. I can see the advantages of allowing it. Enchanted rocks giving more health would create the decisions of "Do I enchant my weapon to kill stuff better or enchant my rocks to stay alive better?" and "Do I throw my enchanted large rock to kill this Ettin, risking it breaking, or do I keep it to heal myself after he hits me with those giant spiked clubs?" On the downside, it might lead to players hording their scrolls until they find a pile of large rocks. --- //[[user:twilightphoenix]] 2011-08-17 23:45// |
| - | I like the idea behind a golem species. But since golems are not alive, perhaps the story could be told from the point of view of the golem's creator. That is to say, a wizard (safely on the surface) imbued a hunk of *material* with magical energy and sent it into the dungeon to get the Orb. Furthermore the golem does not have to be large, a golem could just as easily have been created such that it could fit into armour. --- //[[user:Tenaya]] 2011-09-28 00:51// | + | I like the idea behind a golem species. But since golems are not alive, perhaps the story could be told from the point of view of the golem's creator. That is to say, a wizard (safely on the surface) imbued a hunk of *material* with magical energy and sent it into the dungeon to get the Orb. Furthermore the golem does not have to be large, a golem could just as easily have been created such that it could fit into armour. --- //[[user:tenaya]] 2011-09-28 00:51// |