vt wrote:TheMeInTeam wrote:player melee attacks are frequently pretty competitive with [agony's] average expected damage especially if target is already hurt. For a 5 slot spell it's hard to justify running it.
Agony was really good, and I imagine it to still be good for lots of characters. I feel like I'm belaboring the obvious, but an attack that has a high chance to damage an enemy by half their hp is frequently very useful.
Of course agony's expected damage output per cast will be very low if you just keep casting it over and over on things that are hurt already, but that's just to say you can use a good spell poorly.
It was (still is) a situational spell, but now its situations are fewer. There are:
Monsters with MR immunity --> bad deal
Monsters with any MR value, but immune to negative energy --> bad deal
Monsters with enough MR that even agony is sub-50% odds --> bad deal, rarely can this sort of target tank 2-4 hits at less mana cost and still have > 50% hp.
Monsters with low hp total and low-mid MR --> bad deal (direct damage options frequently hit for > half their health in similar average time, and apply to more targets)
Monsters with high HP + low-mid MR --> good deal
This does somewhat change based on player's weapon and alternative spells, but even with range this spell was strictly dominated not just by other spell schools, but sometimes by alternative necromancy spells while it still had range. Now that it's melee, it's even harder to justify running 5 spell slots on it, especially because you STILL need to run things that actually deal competitive damage once you hit target for 50% health.
Consider magic like irradiate or fireball, which again could strictly dominate agony in many scenarios previously (time/#casts to kill, mana usage, less variance because they don't check MR). Are these spells broadly considered overpowered too?
Compare its average mana expenditure and use case to something like confuse, which is a ranged MR check spell at significantly lower level that trivializes the threat from target in addition to boosting average damage done to it. Melee + level 5 + no immediate reduction in return threat is a big ask compared to spells like confuse, petrify, invisibility, and such just as it's not very favorable against similar tiered direct damage magic. Doing damage to a single isolated target with average-to-bad MR is one of the times where player character needs the help least. It strikes me as a significant reach to call this "overpowered". Something like SLS? Sure. But this? I don't see the basis for it.