iron rod
Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.
Abyss Ambulator
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Joined: Thursday, 10th March 2011, 19:45
Re: iron rod
It's mostly good for doing a lot of damage to a single adjacent, low-AC target, as AC is counted against each shot separately. Works great against jellies etc.
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
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Abyss Ambulator
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Re: iron rod
I wouldn't use it against an OOF or iron dragon though.
Dungeon Master
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Re: iron rod
edit: fixed invo->evo. Thanks, bel.
Cocytus Succeeder
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Re: iron rod
Halls Hopper
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Re: iron rod
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
- Code:
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 29)
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 20)
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 17)
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 25)
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 22)
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 20)
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 21)
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 24) x2
The burst of metal fragments hits the six-headed hydra.(damage 21)
You kill the six-headed hydra!
- Code:
The burst of metal fragments hits the iron dragon.(damage 0) x6
The burst of metal fragments hits the iron dragon.(damage 9)
The burst of metal fragments hits the iron dragon.(damage 0)
The burst of metal fragments hits the iron dragon.(damage 7)
The burst of metal fragments hits the iron dragon.(damage 19)
The iron dragon is lightly wounded.
- Code:
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 18)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 1)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 12)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 14)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 4)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 9)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 0)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 8)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 6)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 11)
The burst of metal fragments hits the titan.(damage 5)
The titan is moderately wounded.
- Code:
The burst of metal fragments hits the Enchantress.(damage 22)
The Enchantress blocks the burst of metal fragments.
The burst of metal fragments hits the Enchantress.(damage 23)
The burst of metal fragments hits the Enchantress.(damage 10)
The Enchantress blocks the burst of metal fragments. x2
The burst of metal fragments hits the Enchantress.(damage 10)
The Enchantress is moderately wounded.
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
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Re: iron rod
Lasty wrote:It's fine against OOFs at high power (18+ Evo or so). It won't kill them outright, but it does pretty solid damage. At a similar power level, two shots is reasonably likely to kill an ancient lich.
To answer the actual question, as rods go it's okay, just be aware that it is completely useless at range (and against an orb of fire) and relatively inconsistent. I'd rather have it than lightning, certainly, probably ignition or destruction too but not by a lot.
Dungeon Master
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Re: iron rod
Tartarus Sorceror
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Re: iron rod
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
FeEE{HOIEMiAE}GrGlHuWrGnWrNaAKBaFi{MiDeMfDe}{DrAKTrAMGhEnGnWz}
{PaBeDjFi}OgAKPaCAGnCjOgCKMfAEAtCKSpCjDEEE{HOSu
Bloat: 17: RaRoPrPh{GuStGnCa}{ArEtZoNb}KiPaAnDrBXDBQOApDaMeAGBiOCNKAsFnFlUs{RoBoNeWi
Ziggurat Zagger
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Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00
Re: iron rod
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
I play offline.
Ziggurat Zagger
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Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00
Re: iron rod
Sprucery wrote:Why don't we get exclamation mark indicators for all kinds of damage?
By the way do you know ranges for all those exclamation marks? They are non-linear, correct?
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
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Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
Sandman25 wrote:By the way do you know ranges for all those exclamation marks? They are non-linear, correct?
Quick and rusty source-diving from attack.h and attack.cc (from 0.15.2 source, I don't have more recent one with me):
So if I'm reading that right it's
. = 1 - 6
! = 7 - 17
!! = 18 - 35
!!! = 36 - 71
!!!! = 72 - 143
!!!!! = 144 - 287
!!!!!! = 288 - 575
!!!!!!! = 576 - 1151
etc.
FeEE{HOIEMiAE}GrGlHuWrGnWrNaAKBaFi{MiDeMfDe}{DrAKTrAMGhEnGnWz}
{PaBeDjFi}OgAKPaCAGnCjOgCKMfAEAtCKSpCjDEEE{HOSu
Bloat: 17: RaRoPrPh{GuStGnCa}{ArEtZoNb}KiPaAnDrBXDBQOApDaMeAGBiOCNKAsFnFlUs{RoBoNeWi
Ziggurat Zagger
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Joined: Tuesday, 30th October 2012, 19:06
Re: iron rod
LearnDB wrote:Sequell: ![1/2]: If you hit something and the message ends with !, that means you did 7-17 damage. !!: 18-35. !!!: 36-71. !!!!: 72-143. !!!!!: 144-287. !!!!!!: 288+; and so on. Yikes!
Or if you prefer:
https://loom.shalott.org/learndb.html#!
Halls Hopper
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Re: iron rod
Ziggurat Zagger
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Joined: Wednesday, 23rd October 2013, 07:56
Re: iron rod
duvessa wrote:Have you actually tried this? It's not especially frequent to even damage an orb of fire with an iron rod evoke, let alone do "pretty solid" damage, at 18 evo. I am pretty sure meleeing the orb of fire with the rod will do more damage if it's well enchanted.
Now I'm confused. From a recent YAVP (SpEn of Gozag):
byrel wrote:Iron rod was good too, with 2-3 shots killing an OoF at point blank.
FeEE{HOIEMiAE}GrGlHuWrGnWrNaAKBaFi{MiDeMfDe}{DrAKTrAMGhEnGnWz}
{PaBeDjFi}OgAKPaCAGnCjOgCKMfAEAtCKSpCjDEEE{HOSu
Bloat: 17: RaRoPrPh{GuStGnCa}{ArEtZoNb}KiPaAnDrBXDBQOApDaMeAGBiOCNKAsFnFlUs{RoBoNeWi
Lair Larrikin
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Re: iron rod
Sprucery wrote:duvessa wrote:Have you actually tried this? It's not especially frequent to even damage an orb of fire with an iron rod evoke, let alone do "pretty solid" damage, at 18 evo. I am pretty sure meleeing the orb of fire with the rod will do more damage if it's well enchanted.
Now I'm confused. From a recent YAVP (SpEn of Gozag):byrel wrote:Iron rod was good too, with 2-3 shots killing an OoF at point blank.
Tried it on my last high evo character. Barely scratched it in 3 shots. I think 22 evo. Anything with more than 2 or 3 pips of ac the damage falls off a cliff
Re: iron rod
Sprucery wrote:duvessa wrote:Have you actually tried this? It's not especially frequent to even damage an orb of fire with an iron rod evoke, let alone do "pretty solid" damage, at 18 evo. I am pretty sure meleeing the orb of fire with the rod will do more damage if it's well enchanted.
Now I'm confused. From a recent YAVP (SpEn of Gozag):byrel wrote:Iron rod was good too, with 2-3 shots killing an OoF at point blank.
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
I play offline.
Ziggurat Zagger
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Joined: Wednesday, 23rd October 2013, 07:56
Re: iron rod
Sandman25 wrote:There is a dump with iron rod vs OoF in this thread...
Yes, I was very puzzled by the statement about killing OoFs with 2 - 3 shots. You would need to do 75 damage per shot for 2 shots, 50 damage for 3 shots, on the average. Even if the damage has high variance, you would have to roll 2 or 3 very high damage rolls in a row. Compared to 0,0,0,18,0,0,0,0,0 that seems just unbelievable.
FeEE{HOIEMiAE}GrGlHuWrGnWrNaAKBaFi{MiDeMfDe}{DrAKTrAMGhEnGnWz}
{PaBeDjFi}OgAKPaCAGnCjOgCKMfAEAtCKSpCjDEEE{HOSu
Bloat: 17: RaRoPrPh{GuStGnCa}{ArEtZoNb}KiPaAnDrBXDBQOApDaMeAGBiOCNKAsFnFlUs{RoBoNeWi
Vestibule Violator
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Re: iron rod
I did have 25+ Evo; maybe that helped? I suppose maybe I was actually getting 75% of it's HP in 3 shots, so maybe it would have taken 4.
Edit: One of those times there might have been caustic shrikes involved, which would have reduced AC. However, note that this lines up with Lasty's experience. It's entirely possible that Sandman just got unlucky in his 9 tries. There's clearly a high variance.
Dungeon Master
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Re: iron rod
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 11111
Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00
Re: iron rod
You can see it vs hydra who luckily has 0 AC so we know iron rod with 27 Evo deals 17-29 damage per shot and there are 7-11 shots. Orb of Fire has AC 20 so it is expected to reduce damage by 10 on average and get 7-19 damage per shot.
But if AC is applied thrice like for Sandblast and LRD, then OoF is expected to reduce damage by 30 on average and then expected damage is close to 0. In this case you and Lasty were lucky, not I was unlucky.
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
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Vestibule Violator
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Re: iron rod
Lasty wrote:To be fair, I never got anything close to "orb of fire dead in 4 shots" -- I just did not-terrible damage.
Sure, but your Evo was 18+; mine was 24+. It's quite plausible that that would take the damage from 10-15%->25%.
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
FeEE{HOIEMiAE}GrGlHuWrGnWrNaAKBaFi{MiDeMfDe}{DrAKTrAMGhEnGnWz}
{PaBeDjFi}OgAKPaCAGnCjOgCKMfAEAtCKSpCjDEEE{HOSu
Bloat: 17: RaRoPrPh{GuStGnCa}{ArEtZoNb}KiPaAnDrBXDBQOApDaMeAGBiOCNKAsFnFlUs{RoBoNeWi
Vestibule Violator
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Joined: Monday, 21st November 2011, 07:40
Re: iron rod
Sprucery wrote:Note that Sandman25's test had Evo 27.
Yes, and was a single cast of the rod. There's a lot of room for variance there.
Vestibule Violator
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Joined: Monday, 21st November 2011, 07:40
Re: iron rod
OoF have an AC of 20; that means on average they block 10 damage. Ignoring the randomness of the variables, that should result in a total of 200 damage getting through if all beams hit. If <half hit, you're looking at <100 average damage, which is 2-shot range.
OTOH, if it triple reduces, we would very rarely do damage, and I lucked out a lot.
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
I play offline.
Vestibule Violator
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Re: iron rod
byrel wrote:most probably off to the sides, though it's possible for the beams to actually miss as well.
(and orbs of fire have lots of EV too: 20)
Dungeon Master
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Vestibule Violator
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Re: iron rod
Sandman25 wrote:Can you please share file name and line number for the rod damage and AC effect?
Like I said, I couldn't find the AC effect. The rod pellet system is calculated here: spl-damage.cc:3040 Ignore the comment about pellets being O(Beams^2); the code indicates that pellets = beams.
The definition for the damage per scattershot pellet is in zapdata.h:1186
Interpreting that line can be done at beam.cc:345
Err number of pellets = beams. They're randomly distributed among the beams with a strong center bias, so some beams do no damage, while center ones carry multiple pellets (each with independent AC reduction if I understand right).
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: iron rod
https://github.com/crawl/crawl/blob/cf6 ... e.cc#L3040
Full Windows 64 bit version can be downloaded at https://www.dropbox.com/s/7ufdv1a2qbn6b ... 9.zip?dl=0
I play offline.
Vestibule Violator
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Re: iron rod
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