Demonspawn Mutations

This page is for discussing new (not yet implemented) DS mutations. We are very interested in hearing opinions about the mutations that are already in trunk. For feedback, please go to Demonspawn.

Demonspawn Transmuters seem like an interesting species/class combination. Mutations that give resistances and AC/EV bonuses will carry over in transmuted forms, mitigating some of the problems associated with armor melding upon transforming. Transmuters focus on Unarmed Combat for dealing damage, and Demonspawns can get many mutations that benefit Unarmed Combat (claws, horns, etc), as well as melee combat in general (spines, scales). However, the aptitudes for Unarmed and Transmutations are both -1, making the early game quite difficult, and the use of late game spells difficult as well. Also, due to the random nature of the mutations, it seems like hybrid melee/casting classes make sense for greater flexibility, but the -1 aptitudes all over the place make it difficult for hybrid classes that need to be proficient in many skills. Furthermore, from a consistency standpoint, it would make sense to me that a race that naturally gains random mutations would have a good (or at least not poor) aptitude for transmutations. I think bringing Unarmed Combat and Transmutations up to 0 would be enough to turn Demonspawn Transmuters into a recommended (and even more fun!) species/class combination. — bein 2010-09-18 23:26

General brainstorming

IRC Logs

12:39 <@dpeg> Eronarn: I really that DS can be mutated in several different aspects. A stabber-like facet (which is much more than just boring Stealth boosts) is very interesting.
12:39 < Eronarn> yes, agreed
12:40 < Eronarn> dpeg: my thought for non-stealth-boost NS is something like: you can take on a shadow form, where you walk along (but not through) walls. totally invulnerable, but the only action you can take is movement.
12:40 < Eronarn> needs fleshing out, obviously
12:41 <@dpeg> but active powers are less cool then passive ones, generally speaking
12:41 <@dpeg> idea is interesting, and could be made passive
12:42 < Eronarn> it could be made semi-passive by letting you just walk into wall tiles, rather than use an activated ability
12:42 <@dpeg> Eronarn: yes. If we want to make it harder, that process could take some time or so.
12:43 <@dpeg> I assume you could still be hit?
12:43 < Eronarn> i was thinking we could use whatever affects rock worms as a guide
12:43 < Eronarn> i believe they're immune to most targeted damage, but can still be hit by things like confuse
12:43 < Eronarn> or torment
12:44 <@dpeg> Eronarn: then it'd be too easy from the perils of melee combat
12:44 < Eronarn> well, if you could stay in the wall, yes - but if it has, say, an MP drain maybe not so much
12:45 < Eronarn> one other caveat that could be added to such an effect could be, you can only merge into a wall while you're not being watched


  • A rank is one level of a mutation, such as the difference between fire resistance 1 and fire resistance 2.
  • A facet is a group of ranks which together comprise some thematic power. For instance, throw flames, fire resistance 1, and hellfire.
  • A body rank is a rank which removes a slot, such as horns 1 or claws 3. A body facet is a facet which includes one body rank.
  • A tier is a power level. Tier 3 powers are very awesome and define the character; tier 2 powers have a large influence in a fraction of the game, such as one branch; tier 1 powers are always in the background. Every facet is assigned a tier number; some mutations also have tier numbers assigned to one or more truncation. These tier numbers will always be smaller, because getting less of the power is less awesome.

New mutations

We need you for this! New mutations should be cool, they should come in a package (ideally three, but there's no hard limit), and they should try to avoid being redundant with existing spells, items, or god abilities.

See Mutations Feedback and Proposals for regular mutations.

New Mutations (infinitevox)

Full Muts

Coded by chequers Sturdy Frame

Sturdy Frame - Tier 2 (Substitutes for Scales Facet)

  • You wear your armour with ease. (Reduction in Encumbrance Rating and EV penalty from armour; -2 ER, min 0)
  • You barely notice your armour. (-4 ER)
  • Your armour is like a second skin. (-6 ER)

Wings - Tier 1 Bodyslot

  • You have a small pair of wings. (Evokable Flight, Prohibits Cloaks)
  • You have a pair of wings. (Controlled Flight, Prohibits Cloaks)
  • You have large powerful wings. (Move Delay -1, Prohibits Cloaks)

Durability - Tier 2

  • You are more durable than average. (Reduce damage taken by a very small amount [1] )
  • You are very durable. (Reduce damage taken by a small amount [1-2] )
  • You are extremely durable. (Reduce damage taken by a fair amount [2-3] )

Web - Tier 2

  • You can excrete a weak web. (Creates a weak web on same tile as player, Costs: Breath, Hunger) [Player unaffected, web breaks on 2nd attempt]
  • You can spit a weak web. (Can spit a web at an enemy, Costs: Breath, Hunger) [Same properties as Rank 1, now Ranged]
  • You can spit a strong web. (Can spit a web at an enemy, Costs: Breath, Hunger) [Functions similar to Throwing a Net]

New Mutations (Eronarn)

Raw Ideas

Storing this list here because I don't want to lose it to the Pastebin expiry and have to dig through logs to find it. It will eventually be fleshed out.

facet is about sensing life force, two levels so far: one level lets you see living-only invisible creatures and through clouds. next lets you see same through a square of walls. potential third levels: more squares of walls, intermediate level of through trees/etc., intermediate level of see genus vs. see species.

facet of shadow mastery: only general ideas here. Some reduction or increase of LOS (lantern of shadows / peering into the shadows… better). Possibly some of the activity-based stealth bonuses that have been proposed: like hiding near a wall.

facet of smoke-form: First, peer through smoke (can see through more of it). Next, fade away in smoke (easier to block LOS to you with it). Final, step through smoke (some type of controlled blink effect).

facet of smoke-attack: (thick, choking smoke. Like steam, but asphyx instead of fire.) First, your fire effects generate smoke. Next, a scroll of fog style effect. Last, a smoke breath attack.

Necromancer facet: general “affinity for death” sort of thing. I was thinking a passive conversion of undead to follow you, instead of raising, but not working on powerful ones. Other abilities could be stealing essence from corpses, or buff to undead under your control, or give better/instant-speed orders to undead via your affinity.

miasma facet: First immune to miasma and trailed by miasma. Next able to “spread the winds of pestilence”: “You hear a wind whistling but don't feel anything”. Like the wind spells proposed, but only for miasma, extending it + moving it to fill more area. Third level gives you miasma form (fade away into a cloud of miasma.)

draw power facet: Weaker than current draw power overall but comes earlier and in three levels. Power on your kills, power on your damage (like vampirism, sort of, but stacking with it / weaker), power on any kills on screen. (Third level intended to be as powerful in aggregate as current one-level mut.)

warping facet: Only some ideas, but: Stabbing bonus when blinking next to something. Create illusions of you every time you blink to distract. Blinks you do take no time the first time each round: e.g., you can cast blink and you're somewhere else but no time has passed.

No concrete notes but general idea of having a distortion facet. Capstone some kind of temporal/translocational storm ability.

Primal chaos facet: No L1 yet. L2 is chaos-cloud breath. L3 is call down a storm of chaos.

<DanaC> Stone Facet: T1 - Stoneskin (+AC, vuln shatter) T2 - Summon Gargoyles? Animate Statues? T3 - Earthquake (AoE Damage/slow, random change floors→walls and vice versa)

Full Implementations

Sense Life Force

  • You can sense the presence of the living.
  • You can feel the essence of the living.
  • You can see the souls of the living.

You can “see through” clouds, trees, water, mislead, illusions, and invisibility when observing plant or natural creatures (possibly with some exceptions, e.g., shadow dragons). At the first level of this mutation you can tell the difference between a plant (including trees) or a natural creature. At the second level you can see a glyph. At the third level you can tell the identity - species, role, unique identity.

Pain Resistance

  • You can tolerate pain.
  • You can withstand pain.
  • You can shrug off pain.

Reduce the damage taken by pain effects - including holy “convulsion” damage - by a flat amount equal to MutLevel/3 * XL.

  • brickman: If that's all it does the description is highly misleading–as an unspoiled player, I know I would assume something described that broadly would translate into an advantage in normal combat, like a few points of the deep dwarves' damage reduction. I certainly wouldn't think of the pain spell and holy damage. It also seems underpowered, enough that I would feel cheated if I got it early in the game–how far in do you need to get before you even see anything that causes pain? Perhaps a little more if it applies to holy wrath, but even then it's completely useless 90% of the time.

Primal Chaos

  • You can manipulate chaos.
  • You can breathe seething clouds of primal chaos.
  • You can become a being of primal chaos.

Shows up as three separate mutations, but gained as one facet. The first level of this mutation confers a “favored to chaos” status: chaos clouds and weapons are somewhat more likely to hurt your enemies or to help you. The second level provides a breath weapon of chaos clouds. The third level enables a Chaos Spawn form: new mutations every round tending towards unarmed ones (tentacles, claws, etc.), which are likely to cause slot loss and merge armor; boosted chaos favor; chaos brand on unarmed attacks.

Smoke Form

  • You can peer through smoke.
  • You can fade into smoke.
  • You can travel through smoke.

Shows up as three separate mutations, but gained as one facet. The first level of this mutation makes smoke less effective at blocking your LOS to other creatures. The second level of this mutation makes smoke more effective at blocking other creatures' LOS to you. The third level of the mutation functions like Passwall, but through smoke. Casting it takes only a turn, but doesn't give a free turn on the other side (and it dumps you into the last smoke tile, not the first open tile).

I “implemented” an empty player::is_insubstantial stub, could we use it here? :) — evktalo 2010-02-26 22:13

Smoke Attack

  • You can breathe choking smoke.
  • You can surround yourself with choking smoke.
  • You can breathe clouds of choking smoke.

Shows up as two separate mutations (1, 2/3), but gained as one facet. Choking Smoke is LOS-blocking, asphyx-damage causing smoke. 2 and 3 are like the steam draconian breath weapon, and use the breath weapon timer, but generate choking smoke instead of steam.

Mirror Image

  • You can summon illusions that distract foes.
  • You are surrounded by illusions that distract foes.
  • You are surrounded by deadly illusions.

Brain Feed

  • You have an appetite for psychic energies.
  • You have an unusual appetite for psychic energies.
  • You have an insatiable appetite for psychic energies.
  1. dpeg: I like it. Special effect for eating brains? A la MP regain?

DS mutation list (dpeg)

Of the following list, these are good to go in, in my opinion — dpeg 2009-12-29 11:30

  • Control Demon (passive rather than active)

Bodily mutations


New bodily mutation: various forms of flight, loss of cloaks slot; can also add deformed body 1 if we want.


Could give unarmed reaching. Or constriction. If we want to, we could give tentacles (including monsters's) reaching.

dolorous on tentacles: On the monster side, tentacles allow attacking monsters while unarmed, and while said monsters are submerged in anything, not just shallow water. Would this be game-breaking if done for players? (Currently, tentacles only show up on tentacled monstrosities, chaos spawns, [very] ugly things, and kraken tentacles.)

Stinger, Tail

Lacking ideas, but these would be nice to have.

Demonic mutations


Active ability. Tries to permanently turn all living (intelligent?) monsters into demons, hostile or not. Chance depends on level vs HD, it is easier for allied monsters. Possessed hostile monsters may become neutral or even allied.

More suggestions (Lemuel)

“Your skin is reflective”, “Your skin is highly reflective”, “Your skin is perfectly reflective”.

30, 60, 90% chance that beams striking you bounce [like lightning off a wall] and leave you unharmed. No effect on bolts, just beams.

More suggestions (nrook)

A “blessed by Tartarus” branch could be interesting. Tier 1: you are aided by a skull advisor (flying skull). The skull is named and comes back after a while if it dies. Tier 2: the skull teaches you to animate the dead (or some other Tar-themed ability). Tier 3: the skull gets spells.

More suggestions (psyshvl)

Sound I

Level 1: Detect sounds. When ever an out of sight or invisible monster makes a sound that is heard by the player (the foo shouts!) the position of where the sound originated from is marked. The louder the sound, the larger the marking (it's harder to pinpoint where quiet breathing came from then it is to pinpoint where a shout or explosion came from)

Level 2: Passive noise reduction

Level 3: Silence wave. Generates a special type of cloud that act like silence.

Sound II

Level 1: Detect sounds. Identical to Sound I.

Level 2: Choas Screech. Attempts to berserk and/or confuse monsters in LOS. Works best on humanoids, then animals, then demons, and not at all constructs/undead.

Level 3: Sonic Roar. Bolt type of attack that has similar multipliers to itself like shatter has, but should be overall weaker. Should do the most damage to Green Crystal Walls, Glass Walls, and Crystal Golems.

Insect I

Level 1: Acid Spit

Level 2: Tame Insects.

Level 3: Insect Body. When struck, permanently confused insects are created. At lower levels creates butterflies, at higher ones wasps. Amount generated depends on amount of damage received.

Insect II

Level 1: Acid Spit

Level 2: Tame Insects.

Level 3: Parasite. Works only on non undead/construct/demon and functions as a beam. The monster takes residual damage based on its size. A large monster will have a smaller percent of its life sapped each turn. When the monster dies from the damage, generate neutral insects from it. If the monster leaves a corpse through other means, the insects burst out of the corpse later. Insect quantity and quality depend on the monsters size and hit die respectively.

Insect III

Level 1: Acid Spit

Level 2: Tame Insects.

Level 3: Convert Into Insect. Slows a monster and a few turns later, turns it into a cocoon. Some time later, the monster emerges from the cocoon as a hostile insect whatever-it-was (Same thing as the original but less AC and HD and maybe flies) . The time to emerge from the cocoon should be short enough that it is risky to try and turn the monster into an insect while fighting other monsters around it. If the cocoon is destroyed before the monster emerges from it, either kill the monster or have it turn into a much inferior larva version. The cocoon should have high enough AC that the player can't easily destroy it before the insect monster emerges. Again, does not work on constructs/undead/demons.

More suggestions (Timbermaw)


these would probably fit a demigod, if they had such powers.

  1. Psykinetic Launcher 1: A power that let's you fire bolts, arrows, sling bullets and needles without the respective launcher. Quivering the missiles would probably be needed. Just hit a and the power hotkey to fire. At level 1, it would work as a +3 +3 launcher.
  2. Psykinetic Launcher 2: Would upgrade to a +6 +6 launcher.
  3. Psykinetic Launcher 3: Could probably end on psykinetic launcher 2, but if implemented, level 3 could have +9 +9.
  4. Repel missiles: (passive), could be a little weaker than the spell.
  5. Reflect missiles: (passive). Could have level 1 and 2.
  6. Liquid Control (or burst of wind) (name needs fixing): Let's the demonspawn clear the water temporally on a certain area, revealling hidden fish, swamp worms, lava snakes, etc etc, thus enabling them for attacking. (alternatively could be used to shower monsters with nearby liquids ie: throwing lava at Ice Beasts, water at firedrakes and uh, dragons – temporally disabling their breath attacks)
  7. Conjuration Control: let's the demonspawn change the arc of spells. Instead of going —–, it could make an elliptic curve hitting targets on the same X axis, provided they are far enough so the projectile can arc between them. (needs a formula, probably)


producing web could be from mouth, thus it unables the use of full helmets, or unables the mutation if so.

  1. Web Thrower: every time you attack, chance to launch a web from “somewhere” (mouth, hands, tail). If it hits, monster gets entangled in the web. Can also provide a throwing net or throwing web every once in a while.
  2. Web: or, instead, separate mutation that creates a web.
  3. Spider Sense (Spider Reflexes, reflexes): Grants a bonus to evasion.
  4. Web Shield: Activate to create a shield made of web (spider web material is more resistant to damage than steel), normal shield penalties apply. Power could be based on how many other Spider mutations you have.
  5. Mutate to Spider: just throwing this in as a bonus. Could be useful for running away.
  6. Another web: induces slow.


  1. Shell: Gain some AC but lose EV (and also movespeed, maybe)
  2. Giant Hooves (part of a hooves mutation): activate to cause AOE slow (or stun). Your movespeed is permanently reduced when you get this mutation.
  3. Imp (terribly afraid of dying): Passive, when you get to low HP during combat, makes you blink 3-5 times randomly in the same turn (like Xom's power, but with blink). Could possibly land you far away, on the same place or in the middle of all the enemies. Does not waste a turn.
  4. Bloodthirsty: Makes you hunger more when using spells but lets you recover satiation while fighting (possibly HP too - no need to kill to recover hp - little recovery). Can also save you from death (if not a strong blow) and leave you at 1 hp.
  5. Demonic Stare: Paralyzes random monsters in LOS.

More suggestions (RoboCicero)

Seed of Destruction

  1. Each time you attack with a weapon, there is a chance you inflict additional elemental damage.
  2. Each time you kill a enemy, there is a chance the body is explodes with great force away from you
  3. Each time you kill a enemy, there is a chance the body is explodes with incredible force away from you

The second and third levels of this skill works like this – the player upon killing an enemy spawns a piercing beam facing away from the killing blow with damage based on HD and distance based on the mutation level.


  1. Prices for shops, ziggurats, and treasure troves are reduced by 10%.
  2. Prices for shops, ziggurats, and treasure troves are reduced by 20%.
  3. bribe, gold armor, gold strike, ???

I'm sort of at a loss for the third ability. It should be something that lets the demonspawn spend the extra money they have lying around (as you usually end up with thousands of gold by end-game anyhow). Bribe demon would be interesting – so would some kind of activatable gold armor (10 gold per point of damage), activatable gold strike (randomly deal bonus damage, losing gold in the process)

How about at rank 3, you can summon a demonic shop. The game creates a random shop for a short amount of time (<100 turns) on the spot you're standing on with a demonic name for the owner. If you use the ability again, prior to some cooldown, the same shop shows up, so you have to wait a long time for a new type of random shop. This fits thematically, since the goal is for the DS player to be able to adapt, and you won't know what kind of shop it's going to be.


  1. You are able to eat meat at any time.
  2. Your metabolism is unusually slow
  3. You draw stength from being full (bonus damage if hunger level is at satiated or more)

Except for the last one, this isn't particularly interesting. There is a glutton god proposal that includes eating more than just food (rock walls and 'J' monsters), which would be an interesting addition here. maybe at rank one, you get a slower metabolism, at rank 2, you get some extra damage when full, and at rank 3, you can consume 'J' enemies, but this has the breath weapon cooldown(?)

Detritis Shell

  1. You can convert weapons and armor into a protective barrier
  2. You can quickly convert weapons and armor into a thick protective barrier
  3. You can almost instantly convert weapons and armor into a thick protective barrier.

Each time you take damage while the shield is active that damage is reduced by a certain number based on the current strength of the shield (perhaps ciel(sqrt(shield power))?). The shield naturally decays over time. Second level of the mutation increases the conversion rate, while each level of the mutation decreases the action cost of item conversion.

This would promote the lugging around of equipment, perhaps something which uses nearby equipment passively? This might inadvertently consume desirable gear though. — Cryptic 2013-04-11 23:07

More suggestions (StudioMK)

Demonic Wings (Cloak facet)

Demonic Wings

  • Demonic wings form on your body.
  • Demonic wings spread from your body!
  • Demonic wings tower over your body!
You can leap short distances (maximum 2 squares).
You can leap over the ground (maximum 5 squares + ability to leap over monsters + lose ability to wear cloaks).
You can leap huge distances (maximum 10 squares).

Allows you to leap a distance when activated. Requires one turn to activate whilst:

"You spread your wings!"

Whilst spreading wings, the character's size should increase (or decrease EV). The wings are of such a nature that sustained flight is impossible and they are instead used to 'jump' a distance. Leaping should take one turn, plus the preparation turn. On the leap turn

"You leap!"

the character should have Flight status and a boost to EV, this disappearing when landing.

It should cost a small amount of nutrition, based on distance to leap.

If you are Hungry, the following has a chance of happening:

"You are too tired to spread your wings."

If you are too encumbered the following has a chance of happening after your wings are spread:

"You barely lift off the ground!"

At higher tiers and with greater strength you will be able to get by. At tier 1, the ability is heavily dependent on weight.

If you are trapped in a net:

"Your wings tangle in the net!"

Chance for:

"Your wings lift the net away!"

at tier 2.

"Your towering wings rip the net apart!"

at tier 3.

Depending on distance, and Dexterity

"You leap too high and hit the ceiling!"

can occur. This will cut the leap to minimum distance (one square) and might do damage. It's essentially the same as a miscast blink.

At tier 3, distances over eight squares have a chance to cause exhaustion.

If you choose to leap *onto* a square occupied by a monster, your character will strike the monster with an additional boost to damage.

"You leap onto the Kobold!"

followed by either:

"The Kobold is struck by surprise! You hit the Kobold!"


"The Kobold anticipates the attack. You miss the Kobold!"

In both cases you will land infront of the monster, as opposed to on his square. Possibly increase chance of stabbing if used on a completely unaware creature (with sufficient stealth).

At tier 2 you will have a chance to push the monster back, landing on his square instead of infront:

"The Kobold is knocked back! You hit the Kobold!"

At tier 3, when traveling larger distances, there is a chance that the action will blow items/small creatures back by one square. There is also a chance to hold up any monster for one turn if they are too large to be blown back or cannot be blown back. This gives you an additional head start.

"You leap! Sigmund is caught by a gust of wind!"

Additional effects such as dust cloud could also take place.

You should also be able to 'leap' on your square, eg. the square you're standing on. This has the 'blow' effect, but doesn't move you anywhere. At tier 1, using the ability will blow away any gases. At tier 3, activating on your square can, as listed above, hold up some creatures or even blow them back.

"You spread your wings! The Orc Warrior hits you!"
"You flap your wings mightily! The Orc Warrior is blown back!"

Of course, this will cause the same amount of nutrition as required to get the effect by leaping a great distance.

The one turn preparation time will discourage this, as the increase in size will make the character easier to hit.

Maybe this ability can be given to creatures such as Imps.

The Imp leaps towards you!

would be nice to see.

If tier 3 range is too great, then perhaps replace it with even greater damage bonus, plus have the wings act as an additional melee (they are rather big). Or give the wings an additional activatable ability that acts as a sort of, air projectile.

This is an interesting idea. I like how leaping is not just/yet flying. However, I see some issues: Jumping is generally tedious interface-wise (we know this from Nethack knights, or also from old weapons of reaching). One way to solve this would be by making the jumps semi-controlled (like blinks).
I am not so sure about the stabbing power. It may work out, but it could also be too strong. — dpeg 2010-12-14 15:13

Blood of Familiars (Summoning/Transmutation facet)

Blood of Familiars

  • You feel a strange sensation in your veins.
  • It's as though a monstrous energy runs through your blood.
  • Your blood is seething a demonic energy!
You have the power of beasts in your blood!
You have the power of monsters in your blood!
You have the power of demons in your blood!

Allows you to perform a melee attack with the strength of a random monster, depending on tier.

Costs nutrition and health.

Beast attack will choose a random beast, depending on your XL, and perform a single melee attack with said beast.

Your hand transforms into the claws of a Griffon! You miss the Orc!

Same for monster and demon.

An Imp springs from your chest! You hit the Ice Demon!

You also have a chance to block a random hit. A percentage based on your XL (increases very slowly, best at tier 3), if passed, will then choose a random monster to absorb the blow for you. If the monster chosen would be one-hitted, the effect is cancelled. You will still lose HP from the transmutation process however.

A Giant Frog mutates from your body and absorbs the hit!

Attacks that splatter your blood on the floor have the chance of summoning a random creature based on your tier and XL. The creature will start with very low HP and will die after a number of turns. These creatures may not necessarily be happy that you created them, especially if they are severely wounded.

Your blood spatters onto the ground and grows into a Yak (severely wounded)!

Holy creatures are not considered.

Possibly allow ability 'Sacrifice blood' where the character switches to a sharp implement and sacrifices some HP to spatter blood on the floor. Greater XL will increase the chance of the blood summoning a creature, as well as the starting HP of said creature.

At tier 3 you will have a great chance of creating a creature as rolls for beasts/monster will also occur. If the beast/monster roll is successful, allow multiple to be spawned so the HD is equal to XL.

More suggestions (JeffQyzt)

Netherworldly Contamination facet

  • Summons/allies gain demonic characteristics (perhaps as per demonspawn mutations)
  • Chance to substitute equivalent HD demon when using any summon spell/effect
  • Demon summoning spells/effects have chance of summoning +1 demon
  • Use of translocation effects has a chance to bring pull neutral demons as well

Fear facet

  1. Unsettling Visage: opponents slightly more likely to flee (good for casters/ranged, bad for melee)
  2. Terrifying Manifestation: 'a'bility to generate an effect like fear spell or a scroll of fear, perhaps w/alternate AOE
  3. Embodiment of Terror: Passive aura causes morale checks in LOS


  • Touch of Cruelty: Attacks do extra “Pain” flavored damage (could apply to spells/ranged too)
  • Unholy Touch: Attacks do extra “Drain” flavored damage (could apply to spells/ranged too)

More suggestions (78291)

Spellcaster oriented mutations

* Spellpower boost based on the percentage of hp remaining as a counterpart to powered by pain – in this case taking damage increases the strength of your spells but doesn't guarantee that you have the mp to cast them. Mutation level could either effect the maximum amount of power boost or the boost values per percentage. This is useless for melee characters if that is an issue.

* Gain temporary stat increase upon killing a monster which would fade away quickly if not sustained or increased by subsequent kills. Mutation level could increase the stat caps or the duration of the effect. Either HD or experience value could determine if the monster is worthy of sustaining the effect. This benefits casters more as they have more ways to kill multiple monsters at once and benefit from increased int.

More suggestions (Seth)

* Unholy Aura: Demonspawn are surrounded by a short ranged aura, possibly only one tile in each direction (8 tiles total). For each tile that is occupied by an enemy, the DS gets a boost to his attack power (or speed, or whatever works best). Basically, if the demonspawn wants to take advantage of this mutation, he can't hide in corridors and must fight in the open (or else it's just a handy emergency situation thing).

Alternatively, expand the range of the aura to 2 or 3 tiles in radius and give the demonspawn a bonus to magic power instead, encouraging magic users to get closer than they'd normally prefer to enemies.

Each level of the mutation increases the bonus given.

More suggestions (Bein)

  • Branded Unarmed Attacks: Now that the breath muts are gone, it may make sense to add in branded unarmed attacks. It would be nice if these usually matched with the brand of the scales mutation acquired, or the ice/fire mutation you get. This makes sense with the body slot mutations (flaming horns!). This would be extra cool for the monstrous mutation set. Maybe have some small chance of getting chaos/distortion/confusing touch instead of fire/ice/poison/etc.
  • Air/Earth facets: Following a structure similar to that of the fire/ice facets (resistance/ passive effect / damaging effect (passive or active) or passive defensive effect) :

Air facet

  • rElec
  • Control Flight
  • Emit Fog (passive): Whenever struck for high damage (say > 1/3 HP), or struck by silver or hit for holy damage, you emit a cloud of fog. Also, there is a chance of this occurring every time you are hit while your HP is low (say < 1/4)

Alternatively, L3 could be

Sparks (passive): Whenever struck, you emit electricity to strike your foes, like static discharge. Not quite the same as Spiny or Passive Freeze, as enemies who did not strike you are also affected.

Earth facet

  • +10% HP (iirc, Robustness has been removed as a DS mutation, if not, make that and the Earth facet mutually exclusive)
  • Stoneskin (~3AC)
  • Shake (active). Weaker version of Shatter.


Rough black scales seem weak compared to iridicent scales. At level 3 you get 1 extra AC point, but lose 3 dex. The latter gives particularly visible effect with high dodging skill. Maybe bumping total AC by 1 or 2 more points would be fair? — doublep 2010-11-29 18:37

Torment resistance by itself doesn't seem appropriate for a tier 3 mutation. While the tier 2s and body slots are supposed to be conditional and force you to change your playstyle, the other tier 3 mutations are generally always useful (+30% HP, fire, rN+++). Unless you worship kiku and are willing to burn through piety you could probably complete an entire three-rune run without ever seeing torment, at least until the orb run and not counting a handful of scrolls of torment. Torment resistance is only meaningful in the orb run. Something more practical outside of the extended endgame needs to be added to the torment resistance facet. — Brickman 2010-12-14 18:05

Uhm, not strong enough??? Say that again… While playing a minimal game may indeed let you see very few tormenters, it is ubiquitous anywhere else. Even having a whole facet give nothing but torment resistance would be hugely powerful. Not everything has to be useful in all cases – if we cared only about minimal wins we could as well axe TSO who is mostly useless there while being way over the edge in a full game. — KiloByte 2010-12-14 21:34
There's no note next to demonspawn suggesting that new-ish players shouldn't try them, and in fact I bet frustrated, struggling or bored players on the level of “haven't won yet” or “can occasionally pull off 3 runes” are very likely to try out demonspawn characters. Thus I don't think there should be a facet which (randomly) fills the most valuable slot but does nothing at all until the extended endgame. I recognize though that adding a second function to the torment resistance facet would require watering down the actual torment resistance to compensate–it is a percentage resistance, right? — Brickman 2010-12-15 03:42
The problem with the torment resistance is that it isn't even that good in the extended endgame. I tried a 15 rune game with a DS who had this mutation and bailed out after 7 runes and 3 very near deaths. Since it's all or nothing, it has high variance in outcome and thus high danger. 16% of the time a monster torments twice, you will get hit by both and 6.4% of the time 3 straight torments will hit you. Unless you have randarts/gear to get 2-3 pips of negative resistance (hard to do with all the other resists you need to cover in Hells/Pan), the mutation is not that useful. In fact, depending on your character, the Robust/RN+++ mutations are not much worse vs. torment compared to the torment resistance. Here's a couple of scenarios:

60% Torment Resistance and no RN, 200 HP - 3 consecutive Torments : 22% No Damage : 42% 100 HP : 30% 50 HP : 6% 25 HP

RN+++, 200 HP - 3 Consecutive Torments : 55 HP guaranteed

Without RN through items, the torment resistance mutation is actually worse 36% of the time. Here's another comparison (Robust vs. Torment Resistance, giving the player RN+++ through items):

260 HP RN+++, 2 Torments : 110 HP Guaranteed

200 HP RN+++, Torment Res. : 36% 200 HP (2 misses): 48% 130 HP (1 Hit): 16% 85 HP (2 Hits)

The torment resistance should really be a tier 2 mutation on value; without significant RN (or Kiku) it isn't sufficient on its own. — RangerC 2010-12-15 05:39
If it is made tier 2, something should be done to ensure you don't get both it and rN+++. — Brickman 2011-01-25 04:15

Demonic magic

Useful mostly to casters, of course.

  • You can cast (but not read scrolls, pray or yell) without speaking, i.e. silence has little effect on casters. Spell casting also become a tiny little bit quiter as a result, but effect is negligible on loud spells because their sound mostly comes from their effect, not casting itself.
  • You can random blink (promotes to semi-controlled if you control teleport) at will at no cost, but with a cooldown. Useful to everyone.
  • Certain “demonic” spells over level 4 cost 1 MP less: Summon Demon, Demonic Horde, Summon Greater Demon, Agony, Malign Gateway, Summon Ugly Thing, Summon Horrible Things, Twisted Resurrection, Beastly Appendage. Mostly summoning and necromancy, with a few other school spells.

doublep 2012-03-18 11:35

Sturdy backbone

Tier one, i.e. a “scale” mutation, like thin sceletal structure.

  • You have a [no adjective/very/exceptionally] sturdy backbone. Capacity is +25% / +50% / +75%, armour (but not shield) EV penalty is -15% / -25% / -35%.

This is generally useful to everyone, but especially useful if you wear a medium or heavy armour. Spells become easier to cast, less fighting interferences, etc. I'm not sure if EV reduction should be applied before or after potential penalty due to insufficient strength. — doublep 2012-03-18 12:32

Yet more suggestions (nicolae)


  1. “You can occasionally counteract your enemies' magic.”
  2. “You can sometimes counteract your enemies' magic.”
  3. “You can often counteract your enemies' magic.”

Enemy spellcasters in your LOS will sometimes lose a turn when they attempt to cast magic, with a probability of 10%/20%/30%. There is also a bonus to MR, +30 per rank.

Large Brain

  1. “You have a large brain.”
  2. “You have a very large brain.”
  3. “You have an incredibly large brain.”

Head slot mutation. Gain 1/3/5 Intelligence, rank 3 also grants Clarity. Helmets prohibited at rank 1, all hats prohibited at rank 3.

Sanguine Armour

  1. “Your wounds form a thin protective layer of dried blood.”
  2. “Your wounds form a protective layer of dried blood.”
  3. “Your wounds form a thick protective layer of dried blood.”

As your health decreases, you gain an increasing bonus to your AC.

Stone Hands

  1. “Your hands have a rocky texture.”
  2. “Your hands are covered in a layer of stone.”
  3. “Your hands are made of heavy stone.”

Hand slot mutation (kind of like Hellboy's stone hand). Improves damage of unarmed attacks. Adds 0/1/2 AC. At rank 3, gloves are prohibited.


  1. “Your unholiness creates an aura of darkness.”
  2. “Your unholiness makes your evil weapons more powerful.”
  3. “Your unholiness makes your evil weapons and magic more powerful.”

You radiate an umbra of radius 2/4/6, and are unaffected by umbras. At rank 2, attacks you make with evil weapons receive a damage bonus (which stacks with other existing bonuses, such as pain brands and demon weapon bonuses). At rank 3, also counts as a spell enhancer for any evil magic spells.

Logged in as: Anonymous (VIEWER)
dcss/brainstorm/species/demonspawn_brainstorming.txt · Last modified: 2015-11-13 18:13 by infinitevox
Recent changes RSS feed Donate Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0 Valid CSS Driven by DokuWiki