Okawaru

Okawaru is a very problematic god: on the one hand, extremely powerful (and hence popular), due to reliable, strong effects (Haste, Might) and to the long term appeal of getting a good set of armour. On the other hand, it's the most bland of all gods: no theme to speak of (the only gameplay affecting bit is “no friends dying”, forfeiting summons) and all three effects are recycled (potion, potion, acquirement).

Okawaru's divine competition (i.e. gods attractive for melee-focused builds) are Trog and Makhleb, both of which are much better designed. So, we will want to change Okawaru. Over the years, a number of proposals have been made, here is a list.

Comments either to be made within the various proposals or at the very end. Attribute your comments please!


dpeg: gifts as loans

The idea is old, but has got some fresh input from a recent IRC discussion. I am making it as lean as possible. — dpeg 2014-03-19 01:08

My gripes with current Okawaru gifts:

  • too many, too weak in general
  • very few choices involved

The basic proposal:

  • gifts occur more rarely, start earlier than now, and are better (no more mundane animal skins)
  • gifts are temporary, with a duration of about 1000-3000 turns
  • when getting piety, there is a chance (which can depend on toughness of killed monster) that the duration of one gifted worn/wielded item is increased
  • not using gifts (on the floor or in inventory) counts down the timer very quickly
  • keep track of the number of extensions each item got; if that number reaches a threshold (say 10), then the item becomes permanent and is marked as such
  • if the timer of some item reaches zero, then the item “dulls”: it becomes a mundane item (if artefact before), the ego may disappear (not sure yet) and the enchantments decrease — however, you keep the very item, so you don't suddenly stand around naked in a fight

Interface:

  • each temporary gift has to be clearly visible as such; we also want some indication on the timer
  • one option: a - +7 claymore {freezing, temporary gift [===…]}
  • another one: indicate duration in item description
  • I don't know if/how we should indicate how close an item is to becoming permanent

Analysis: With this, Okawaru gifts will hopefully no longer be decisions between grab 'n collect, or dismiss outright. Rather, you can choose to use an item temporarily only (suppose you just got a decent armour item with your only rPois: you might stop what you are doing, and venture into Snake right away). You can also go for some making some gift item permanent: here, it is questionable if you can/should go for all armour pieces Okawaru gives (and you most probably can only go for one weapon) — due to the rule that at each extension attempt one of the currently worn/wielded items is picked.

This could come with an active ability:

  • Extend duration of gifts (substantial piety cost)

Possibly for later (ignore on first implementation!): There might be potential for even more decision making if Okawaru would be also able to improve worn items. One basic approach:

  • When getting piety and the character is not wielding/wearing temporary gifts, then one of worn/wielded items may be improved.
  • Pick one item, biased by item enchantment (worse is preferred).
  • This can also affect artefacts!

The idea is that you can slowly turn one of those -6 helmet {rC++ rF++ rElec} into a much better item. It would take a while and you wouldn't get a +4 helmet at all. And doing so would mean forfeiting gift use.

tromboneandrew: champions

A comment in 2867861. His idea of replacing plain armour/weapon gifts with champions who you have to kill can be used for essentially every proposal on this page.

After piety becomes high enough, instead of just a random weapon or armour drop, add a passive ability: Okawaru might summon a champion to challenge you while praying.

The champion would be a humanoid, whose power is roughly scaled to the character's level, and who is wielding or wearing some kind of Okawaru-gift. Thus, in order to get Okawaru's god gifts, you have to kill Okawaru's champions. The summoned champions would be permanent, well-armed thus having both monster weapon and armour slots filled with either the Okawaru gift or mundane weapons, and provides experience for killing it. The champion would be named similarly to how Beogh Orcs occasionally get named, but otherwise has no special abilities outside of their normal racial abilities. Spellcasting humanoids would not be generated with armour that inhibits spellcasting.

dpeg: Instead of praying for them, Okawaru could also simply add one to an exciting (i.e. high tension) battle. They could be summoned, i.e. temporary. So you have to make killing them a priority if you want to get the items.
vitara: Another idea that builds on this “Champions” idea is for Oky, at really high piety scores, to summon (at longer time-out intervals) a temporary mini-vault portal entrance (if the system allows this to happen), which we can arbitrarily name “The Arena”, or simply automatically force-teleport the player into the middle of it. For portals, the entrance can be generated somewhere in the current battlefield. Inside the open space Arena, powerful monsters or monster packs accompanying a unique or champion “boss” monster await. Okawaru can say something like “LET THE CHALLENGE BEGIN!” before the monsters appear. The most powerful monster(s) will have on them Oky's (high level/randart?) weapon/armor gifts and the player will have to defeat the monsters to get them. Defeated monsters do not leave corpses i.e. “disappear in a puff of smoke” but will leave their gear (if any) behind. Less powerful monsters (e.g. those in a pack) will not have any loot. The powerful monsters (not the “packs”) can appear one after the other depending on their level / HD, or be “summoned” by Oky every 10-20 moves. The monster “packs” can be very large e.g. 20 orcs or elves plus a champion among them, and in a typical open space arena setup this could be spectacular to the point of being overwhelming! If the player defeats all the monsters in the Arena, s/he gets to keep the loot (at least 2-3 items per Arena) and step out with high piety gains and the mini-vault disappears (“Okawaru is very pleased with you.” or “Okawaru says: 'WELL DONE, CHAMPION. USE YOUR GIFT(S) WISELY!'”); if s/he gets defeated/killed, Oky will resurrect him/her but with 1 or 2 HP left; s/he will also be immediately teleported out of the Arena (which would then disappear) and all loot including any that s/he picked up between the duels will be gone. S/he will suffer high piety losses (“Okawaru is very disappointed with you.” or “Okawaru says: 'YOU ARE NOT WORTHY, MORTAL!'”) and if any monsters are left outside the Arena when the player entered, they can kill him/her with a single blow (they heal for as long as the player remains in the Arena). Hope this is not too difficult or lame to implement…

Ramus: divine challenges

2831999

I consider Okawaru to be the deity of:

  • Knights and fighting alone. One's strength should only come from one's self.
  • Challenge and victory. To become stronger, one must exert him or herself and fight more difficult opponents that out rank you.

Simple, yeah? Based on these two principles, I think I have a working Okawaru that doesn't actually change him too much from what he was before but still makes him more interesting.

Okawaru is pleased by:

  • Challenging and defeating opponents stronger than you. (Gauged by your level compared to their average experience)
  • Honouring the fallen (Just pray and you'll bury them)

Okawaru is angered by:

  • Breaking divine challenges and leaving the battle.
  • Allies dying.
  • Leaving the religion.

Okawaru's wrath includes:

  • Dropping all stats at random times.
  • Sending a copy of you (with higher strength, intelligence, and dexerity) that acts like a mermaid.

Abilities Given:

  1. Divine Challenge (Given right off the bat, uses piety.) Allows the player to select an enemy to challenge. All other enemies and allies are stuck in time, sleep, or even neutral until the engagement is over. You act as a mermaid to the enemy and the enemy acts as a mermaid to you. You then engage fight until one dead in which anything that was happening outside continues. If you selected a strong opponent, Okwaru gives you piety. If you fought a unique or someone particularly strong, he gives you a weapon or armor along with piety. If you fought some average, he gives you some piety, enough to make up for using the challenge. Fighting a weak enemy makes you lose piety. The game should run a check while doing this to make sure that there's a direct line between the player and the enemy chosen as so they can reach each other.
  2. Might (Same as before)
  3. Haste (The same)
dpeg If the Divine Challenge is something that has to be invoked over and over to get access to the gifts, that'd become tedious soon (one targeting prompt every time). I like nobody's proposal (from a comment in the FR) about Okawaru champions much better: this achieves something similar more indirect and less active.
“Okawaru the Champion is an aged and powerful god of battle, heroes, and legends. Okawaru's only interest is to boast of the great heroes that worship him, and he will test his followers brutally to ensure that the weak do not enter his ranks. Victors in his challenges are showered with gifts and abilities; the weak are shown no mercy. Okawaru has gone many an age without a worshiper worthy of being called a legend, and his trials have been becoming more and more brutal. There have been whispers of his obsession budding into madness…”
The motivation for the challenges is Okawaru testing his followers to ensure they're worthy of his assistance. An 'early sign of madness' is that he's recently begun testing his followers against each other. When Okawaru wants to put you through a challenge, he'll spawn a “Champion of Okawaru” nearby, who will rapidly seek you out. When you come within LOS of each other, any other monsters give you space for the battle to go down (the other monsters fear/respect Oka enough to do this). Okawaru invocations will not work until one of the followers is dead (hopefully the one he spawned). Your opponent is most likely using a particularly powerful weapon or piece of armor, which you will keep upon victory.
purge divine challenge seems like it could be a neat final tier power. It could be very useful for instance on zot:5 if you could just target an ancient lich from among a swarm of tough monsters to fight alone. If there is a swarm of other monsters it would be difficult to fight around them though. Instead, what if it warped you and the creature you target to a “divine arena” of Okawaru which would be a tiny mini-vault type level to do 1v1 battle in? The victor is teleported back to the dungeon. One issue I can think of with this is that you would not get the monster's loot.

Conduct:

  • If the player uses teleportation or blink at any given time during the divine challenge, it ends and is broken. This greatly angers Okawaru as you as a warrior must follow through on your word.

So why make this (admittedly small) change? Well, before with Okawaru, you got stuff at random. This proved to be annoying as you had really no power over it. It reduces Okawaru to being a deity of running around, killing stuff, sacrificing their bodies, and hoping for better gear. So instead, this is a more steam lined method that actually gives reason for the player to delve ahead in the dungeon and perhaps challenge branches early in the hopes of better gear. Compared to earlier, he was also over powered since any opponent could result in you getting awesome items. Now you must battle enemies that are stronger than you for that weaponry. This way, risky play and a change of order of exploration is rewarded.

So yeah, the Divine Challenge idea is just to support the idea of forging ahead and actually working for that better weapon.

Okawaru should then prevent blink and teleport mutations. Perhaps also enemies blinking and teleporting?

poop: defensive powers

2831617

Okawaru is commonly seen as a bland and overpowered god. However, the previous remedy proposals at FR 2040505 have been extremely controversial. Thing is, I feel Okawaru currently fills two important niches that the redesigns don't:

  • He's a melee god oriented towards defense and escape. You can't teleport or heal while berserking but you can while using might.
  • He's really easy for beginners to learn.

Unfortunately, he also:

  • has no significant downsides and requires no strategy to use. Mahkleb's summons can kill you, even by accident. Trog deplores spellcasting and berserk has significant weaknesses. Lugonu's “banish” doesn't grant XP. Nemelex's abilities are random and often dangerous. On the other hand, Okawaru's might and haste are almost bad making him a strategic bore for the already straightforward heavy melee fighter.
  • gives game-breakingly good gifts, even for spellcasters. Since conjurers don't need melee weapons, any randart weapon Okie gifts is a huge boon; furthermore switching weapons is the fastest in-game action.

Therefore I propose the following tenets for an Okawaru redesign:

  • Make sure each ability Okawaru gives can be easily explained (i.e. summed up in one sentence).
  • Eliminate might and weapon gifts.
  • Focus Okawaru towards AC and defense, in particular grant Okawaru followers more AC somehow.
  • To compensate of giving more armour gifts, limit each randart Okawaru produces to giving one level more resistance than the base object. Make shield/buckler of resistance and other egos (running/strength) more common. That way, you can certainly get a shield of resistance + rElec + (acc+1 dam+2) but not shield of resist everything. Since you can still get blink, map, rage from items, they're still pretty good, but Okawaru won't give a single game-breaker anymore.
  • Make sure each ability has a minor but strategically significant downside.

This way, Trog is far more compelling for characters that require an offensive boost, while Okawaru is useful for ogres and other characters with weak defenses. And since AC (in particular heavy armour) is scheduled to be nerfed soon, giving extra AC wouldn't be overpowered. In addition, I propose the following redesign (which I imagine will be more controversial than the above proposal):

Theme: god of the ramparts, patron of armoursmiths and masons.

Powers:

  • Stonemail (* piety). Already implemented for Xom, better stoneskin. Duration and AC increase with inv skill. Low piety cost. Downside: hinders spellcasting due to EV penalty, so not a no-brainer. Not as good as Beogh's extra ac.
  • Sphere of force (** piety). 3×3 area that partially blocks LOS and slows enemy movement inside it; gives 1/5 fumble attack chance like shallow water. Duration increases with inv. Medium piety cost. Downside: you get slowed, fumbled if you walk through it, significant piety cost, unresistable but weak area denial.
  • Sticky armour (***** piety). Enemies that hit you in melee get stuck in glowing tar, adding duration 3 to any of their following actions. Nasty against hydras, executioners. Med-high piety cost like haste. Downside: enemies have to hit you for ability to work, so weaker than haste except it stacks with haste.
  • Armour gifts. As above, only armour gifts, at most 1 extra resist/randart.

Roles that like this design:

  • Trolls and ogres (extra AC helps, minor missile protection really helps, they don't need might anyway.)
  • Light-armour crusaders, though Okawaru is not that helpful in early game anymore since stonemail hinders spellcasting, EV and meph cloud is better than Sphere of Force in early game (enemies are confused and almost never attack you!)
  • Transmuters like stonemail + statue form, dont' need might in conjunction with blade hands.

Roles that don't:

  • Short blade melee combos can't really deal damage without might, and don't get quick blade/speed brand gifts.
  • Early game fighters have horrible trouble killing tough foes w/o offensive boosts, makes TSO more competitive with Okie.
  • Primary casters. AC alone is not enough to make a primary caster viable in melee.

Wrath: punishers suffer sticky armour/sphere of force. Nasty! No, you're not going Okawaru for armour then Trog for a pointy stick.

dpeg: volatile piety

2040505

Currently, Okawaru is a very bland god. As a new theme, I propose this: Okawaru is a god of war, even mindless war. He likes his followers to battle alone, especially in futile situations. Okawaru dreams of finding the fittest and meanest warrior this way. He absolutely hates even short periods of quietness and peace, and gets upset rather quickly. Okawaru does not really care which implements followers use to battle. He will make sure they are adequately fitted out with armour.

[This whole description is from scratch. However, I have tried to stay close to the old Okawaru in some ways: fixated on battle and of help there, fighting alone, armour gifts.]

Gaining piety:

  • Killing.
  • Killing while wounded (the more, the better).
  • Killing without resting (“chaining”).
  • Multiple kills (offensive spellcasters!)
  • Killing tougher monsters.
  • Kills while berserking.
  • Kills while being negatively enchanted.

Piety erodes rather fast, in a nonlinear manner (the more you have, the faster it decreases).

Piety is a much more short term affair with Okawaru. It is more volatile than with any other god (except Xom). Think of it as a measure of 'excitement'. I would like to use colours of the stat boost for indication of excitement. Say 1-5 blue (as with might), 6-10 cyan, etc.

Dislikes:

  • Having allies. (Okawaru will prevent all accidental aquirements of allies. Penance for purposefully getting allies.)
  • Cowardness, like leaving (stairs/teleportation) with nasties around. This could be probably best simulated by the following system:
    1. piety goes down when hostiles disappear from LOS (except by killing)
    2. piety can go up when lots of hostiles appear in LOS
    3. Leaving the level (via stairs or known shaft) should be punished in a stronger way.

There are no Invocations.

Passive abilities:

  • Boost in the highest primary stat. (Boost two (or all three!) in case of equality. This uses just the current values, taking statrot, might, rings/randarts etc. all into account.) [The hope is that is might lead to an interesting choice: often, specialising in one attribute is good. With Okawaru, you could also try to keep two stats very close, so they get boosted together.] This power is the main reason to choose this god. The temporary boon can grow really high, but also deplete soon in quiet phases. [There is a threshold of boost/2: the boost falls quickly when above that threshold, and much slower when below.]
  • When excited, may regenerate health and/or magic. This is unrelated to killing, so new monsters may enter sight, and magic goes up!
  • When more excited, protection from harm. Should become reliable (but cost piety), and be announced. (You feel Okawaru watching your battle intensely.)
  • When extremely excited, improve one piece of worn gear. Chances as for the scroll; negatively enchanted armour may go up by several steps at once. This can also be a randart (with much lower chances if positively enchanted). May also turn mundane items into randarts (at a small scale).
  • When highly excited and tension is 0 (i.e. after large battles), hand out temporary armour gifts. (They should last for about 1000-5000 rounds, longer if worn.) Their removal will be announced, and will not take place during battle.
  • When extremely excited, a worn armour gift may become permanent.

Punishment (penance): Occurs for too peaceful characters. Sends appropriate minions to fight with. These provide piety, but neither xp nor food. (They disappear summon-style if killed.)

Question: this would be a good god to have a prayer effect. Something that makes Okawaru watch (and increase damage, or better chances for help with Health/Magic or so), at the expense of more drastic measures upon failure (i.e. flight) – probably penance. What do you think? (I want to avoid making praying an automatism.)

Rationale (gameplay): Okawaru provides a completely different feeling. It will often be best to jump right into battle. You'd rely on Okawaru for boosting you, so you can kill better, and for caring about you. Also, you'd try to gauge out extreme levels of piety (“excitement”), for two purposes: short-term, you can keep half of the boost for some time; long-term, you will get your armour boosts then. Broader audience: with the liking of many kills and the Int boosts, this god becomes an option for casters. It could happen that you can cast spells better when being surrounded. With Okawaru restoring mana, this could actually work out. Smoother AC gains: in contrast to the old Okawaru (where getting a great armour gift improves your gear in a very discontinuous manner), the new version makes this smoother. Also, it should sometimes pose interesting questions (which gear to wear, in order to optimise the improvements). Randarts with bad AC and good properties become an option. The temporary armour gifts may affect the choice of location. Suppose you get a randart plate mail of poison resistance and it is your only source.

borsuk I don't like “killing while negatively enchanted” and “killing while wounded”. Abusable. Players in ADOM have been known to slow themselves so they can get more xp for kills. Anyway, it encourages players standing in front of a monster doing nothing, getting hit on purpose, THEN killing it.
On the other hand, he should appreciate fighting against 2 or more monsters at once. Corridor fights are a proven tactic, but Okawaru might view it as cowardly.
If Okawaru dislikes allies, it makes sense that he'd give some limited for of Warding. It should still be disadvantegous to fight summoned creatures, just not as much.
stabwound My issue with changing Okawaru is that he makes many character combos _playable_.
For example, it's an exercise in frustration to play a short blades/dodging melee fighter without Okawaru. The Might ability lets you have enough damage output to actually damage tough enemies. You simply cannot do enough damage through melee to survive orc warriors, black snakes, (death) yaks, spiny/blink frogs (not to mention stone giants, ancient liches, skeletal dragons) etc without Might and maybe even Haste. None of the other gods help you in this manner (besides maybe Trog, which is otherwise a pretty ill-fitting god choice on a light armour user.)
I'm not saying that this god idea is a bad one; I'm saying that this is an issue that needs to be looked at before touching Okawaru.
borsuk recommends daggers of distortion in this case.
Minced It sounds like it would be frustrating (in a really good way) for Okawaru's shiny new armour to disappear, leaving you stranded in your undies. However, I'd like the mechanism for armour permanence to be more player-controllable than “Okawaru is really happy for whatever reason so he made your armour permanent just this once.” Here are two (compatible) mechanisms for doing so: (1) You can “invest” piety to make an armour item more permanent and doing so 2-3 times makes it permanent. (2) Instead of the armour showing up on you, Okawaru summons a horde of shadow creatures, one of which blinks red and is wearing your nice new armour — if you can kill the red one before it ceases to exist the armour is yours. He could also create the blinky red guy when he's really excited (i.e. when you are busy fighting something else…).
An idea to combine this making-temporary-armor-permanent mechanic with the champions idea from the top of the page and also bring in a little additional flavour: All of the temporary armor gifts could feature adjectives like “ghostly,” “phantom” or “spectral.” When they are first gifted, the message should be something like “Okawaru clothes you in the armor of a fallen warrior.” Then, at maximum piety, you can get a new power “You can evoke (evocation not invocation) your spectral armor, thus challenging its original owner to single combat.” Using this ability would teleport the player to a small arena-like vault containing a single randomly-named player-ghost-style monster with good armour and a good weapon. The armour set, of course, should include a copy of the piece of equipment evoked. The ghost should be flavored as an “ancestral avatar” or something rather than an actual ghost, and should be immune to holy wrath, holy word, dispel undead and such. It should also be power balanced in such a way as to always provide an actual threat to player. A portal out of the vault would only appear upon the death of the champion. THere's no backing out of this duel. It may be that other, esoteric, methods of escape exist (self banishment with a weapon of distortion comes to mind), but doing so should cause penance, or perhaps even excommunication. When killed, the champion doesn't drop any loot, but the evoked piece of armor loses its spectral adjective. This could be implemented either so that evoking this ability was a viable (though quite dangerous) method of escape during combat or it could simply be made so that it could only be done with no monsters in LOS (“You can't issue a challenge to single combat with the five-headed hydra so near!”). One additional super neat trick would be occasionally saving the ghost-data of players (maybe just okie-worshippers) who die while wearing good randart armor and recycling that armor as a temporary gift (maybe named for the player, like “Spectral ring mail of 256's downfall”). The player ghost could then be used as the champion. — 256 2010-08-24 17:52
I don't really like the “mini portal vault” idea so much, for these reasons: (a) you have to think about how to prevent abuse; (b) I believe going to the vault and dying feels much more lame than just dying in combat. This is why I prefer to reward the player for either going for tension or for killing specific enemies in ordinary battle (e.g. Okawaru could put a prize tag on some monster and you'd have to hurry to kill it if you want to reap the reward). — dpeg 2010-08-24 22:04
Yeah, I do see what you mean about dying to a champion being unfun. But, at the same time, the temporary armor gift thing just seems to bring such a flavourful a ghosts-of-warriors-past element to Okawaru that it would be a shame not to run with it a little. Here's an interesting little tweak on the idea: What if, at the point when the armour would normally expire (which has already been specified as not being in combat), if piety is sufficiently high then, instead of the armour poofing, the spectral champion (as I described above) arrives and issues a challenge (“Gregor has arrived to reclaim his chain mail. Would you like to challenge him to a duel for the right to wear it indefinitely? [y/N]”). If you say no, then armour and champion both disappear. If you say yes, then the champion stays and fights. The champion will never actually kill you though. If the champion would do damage that would kill you directly, then that damage is prevented and the champion disappears with his armor (“Gregor pulls the killing blow, nods and says, 'a noble effort.' In a puff of smoke, both he and the chain mail disappear.”) If this is implemented however, then the champions should be made somewhat tougher than they would otherwise have been. The idea being that the player would probably need to burn consumables to defeat them, making for an interesting tradeoff about whether burning though a potion of speed and a stack of heal wounds is worth it to keep that armour. Also, it wouldn't be risk free since, while Gregor won't challenge you during combat and won't kill you himself, he will certainly have no qualms about knocking you down to 5 HP just as a Titan rounds the corner. — 256 2010-08-25 02:29
While fun, this idea sounds more like the description of an entirely new god than a “modification” of Okawaru. Okawaru is the god of simple bonuses for mostly-nonmagic-or-hybrid characters who don't want to worry too much about their god; the goal is to make those bonuses less one-sided and less randart-centered. What you just described is the god of recklessly charging forward nonstop and never retreating. This isn't even the first brainstorm I've seen that proposed such a god; it's a basic motif and one that probably will find its way into the game at some point. It is not a “replacement” for Okawaru. The set of players/builds who use the current Okawaru and the ones who would use this new one don't overlap any more than do the current Oka users and the people who would join any of the other non-caster gods if he was removed. — Brickman 2010-11-03 16:50
I see two main risks with this proposal. First: it would be hard to implement without being frustrating for the player. Basically, you're encouraging a playstyle where players jump blindly into dangerous situations…dangerous enough that they'd probably kill you if it weren't for Okawaru's powers. But those powers are random. If you dive into a group of orc warriors solely because Okawaru demands it, you're relying on blind luck for your survival. If Okawaru decides to slack off in accordance with the whims of the RNG, either you die or are forced to make a clever use of your resources to escape, for which you are then punished. It all seems like it would be too far out of the player's hands. Second: with its slowing mechanic, Trog's signature ability, Berserk, already creates a high-offense, commit-or-die style of play. The entire point of Okawaru, relative to Trog, is that he's more flexible about using his abilities carefully and tactically. This rework would make Okawaru and Trog too similar in that sense. Actually, this whole concept of short-lived excitement and leaping blindly into battle seems to fit Trog better than Okawaru, perhaps as an alternative to Brothers in Arms (which overlaps a bit with Makhleb and doesn't really fit the crazed berserker archtype all that well anyway). — Sjohara 2011-02-07 09:29

Alstar

2792373

These ideas could be used elsewhere but would fit most Okawarus.

Passive effects (unlocked at various stages of piety, i.e. excitement):

  • Vampiricism (heal by doing damage).
  • Great Cleave. Hit all adjacent enemies with his weapon (in Okawaru —no allies— style, hit everyone, no matter what).
  • Forbid teleport. Blinking monsters will find they are unable to blink away from the player. Players with teleportitis will find that mutation does not affect them, and neither does enemy-cast teleport other. Players have a higher-than-usual chance of resisting banishment.
  • Fleeing monsters: Monsters that flee from the player will have one of two things happen: They are blasted by divine power (more likely). They are berserked, causing them to attack the player (less likely).
  • Unique Monsters: On the killing blow against a unique monster, the god may decide that the fight was so entertaining that he’d like to see a rematch. In that case, the unique does not die, is healed to full health and is teleported to a random level that the player has already explored (Main dungeon preferred, to make it more likely the character will run into them again).

Flavour: After a particularly good battle, players may have a shower of rose petals follow them for a while (leaves a colored trail behind the player, no in-game effect).

Leaving a battle (teleportation, stairs, blinking, also banishment leading to hostiles leave LOS) is bad.

cloture

Comment in 2040505.

In my opinion, Okawaru should not reward reckless behavior. He is currently the melee god who actually allows you to escape (such as by teleport) whereas Trog gets you locked in place by summon spam during a berserk rage, unable to read scrolls or quaff potions.

The central focus of my Okawaru re-design is about removing the might and haste abilities (possibly weapon gifts) without introducing culture shock. I've got several possible variations on the role of abilities and prayer on this, but best to finish this proposal first.

  • War Cry. This active ability has two components. First, it provides a temporary and significant boost to both piety and invocations that will last for around say a dozen turns. Enough to unlock his second and third abilities. This temporary piety can be used up without damaging your normal piety levels. The second feature of the war cry is that it is very loud (giant spore loud?), and alerts a large area to your presence, luring monsters to your location. It cannot be activated under the effect of silence, but its effects will still function if silence is cast afterwards. It has a timeout counter similar in length to the exhaustion of berserking.
  • passive boost. Provides a minor (10%, or -1 delay) speed and accuracy (+3) bonus to all your actions but movement, including spellcasting. It also provides a boost to your regeneration rate for magic and health when outside of combat and not when under any negative statuses such as poison or slow.
  • War Chant, an ongoing power requiring activation and termination. It provides a half-strength might and haste effect but drains one health every turn of combat. These effects are not cumulative with might potions or haste spells or swiftness or any other magical booster. The greater effect takes precedence. If might or haste is in place, they function as normal, with the Okawaru component disregarded. The casting of silence immediately terminates this ability, as does use of Stop Chanting ability. This ability terminates the temporary piety/invo bonus from war cry. Running low on piety does not terminate this ability automatically.
  • Death Match. This ability functions similarly to sanctuary, except that damage is ok, and nothing can leave until one side or the other is dead. It prevents outside interference, and restricts all blinks/teleports to within the area designated as an arena. The arena is restricted by walls, transparent or otherwise, but is not restricted by water or lava. Mildly similar to clouds, it fills a total area equal to the area of an unrestricted line of sight, but flowing around terrain. This ability has a magic and significant piety cost. If used under the effect of a war cry, the temporary piety disappears.

Last we come into the question of divine gifts and conduct — I could do without — it's not core to my design, but it doesn't exclude any of the existing suggestions regarding weapon/armour remakes. I'm mostly at a loss for what course of action to take. Two rough ideas that are not necessarily part of my above proposal:

  • Divine Armour boosts AC by 3, increases rF and rC by one, may provide rElec, especially if we end up with more than one level of it.
  • Divine Weapon, based on piety, adds +9 to each stat of your weapon, reduced effectiveness the more powerful the weapon is, stepping down at 3 and 6. A theoretical -9, -9 weapon would temporarily be +0. A -6,-6 weapon would become +3. A +3 weapon would gain +4 for a total of +7 (9/2), and a +6 weapon would become +9. A +9 weapon would become +12 temporarily. Use of this ability costs significant piety and may permanently increase the plus of the weapon, including artefacts.

DrPraetor: EV based fighters

Proposed in a mail to crawl-ref-discuss

Target audience: I think of all gods in terms of “who would want to worship this deity?”. Okawaru should be a deity for EV based fighters. If anyone else wants his powers, great. Okawaru can have some strictly numerical self buffs, but the piety costs should be high (10 or 15 each, needs some testing), and they should turn each other off, so that you only use one at a time. The trances are (mostly) numerical but the high cost and exclusivity gives them a tactical feel. None of them are compatible with Berserk. I haven't placed them in order and Okawaru should provide at least two more trances.

  • Counterattack. When you are missed in melee, you have a chance of striking back against your attacker.
  • Swallow Strike. Useful for training Inv, costs mana but not piety. Make an attack with 200% normal delay, but base damage (before AC reduction) is boosted by (50 + Inv * 3)%.
  • Blade Trance. Boosts your Dex by 5 + (Inv/6) points. Provides a bonus to the base damage of “good for the dextrous” weapons equal to Inv/4. Like all trances, costs 15 piety per shot.
  • Slayer Trance. Boosts your stealth by Inv * 5 points. Renders you invisible. Monsters have an increased chance of forgetting you exist and becoming wandering again. Effective stabbing skill is increased by (Inv/3). Like all trances, costs 15 piety per shot. Lasts somewhat longer than the other trances.
  • Defender Trance. Provides a bonus to the base damage of “good for the strong” weapons equal to Inv/5. You get a counterattack chance against any monster that moves next to you. If you have a reach weapon, any monster that moves into a space within 2 spaces of you gets the free stab in the face.

These trances are best for Long Blade/Staff, Short Blade and Polearm (Axe?) use, respectively, although depending on circumstances I think all will see some use. Possibly should add a trance for Axe/Mace users?

Not sure what to do/say about Okawaru gifts.

zauren: avator of battle

2829422

My idea is for a god who grants you an Avatar of Battle that follows you and levels up as you do. You only get one, and it scales with your level; 1 HD per, up to 27. They are a melee person, and have abilities that can be triggered via invocation (at very low costs, ergo.) Okawaru fits here if we consider the current conduct not as “allies bad” but “allies are important and them dying is bad!”.

  • Summon Avatar (0 piety). Brings a permanent 10 speed Avatar with ringmail and a basic weapon (Random type, minimal level; like hand axe or short sword).
  • Revive Avatar (0 piety). Revives them at half health. Costs 3/4ths your current HP and drains all your mana. NOT to be done in combat, in almost all cases.
  • Recall Avatar (* piety). Brings them next to you.
  • Heal Avatar (** piety). 2MP, Piety. Heals them for a fair amount. Should be low enough to use in a hard battle that the Avatar has to mostly solo. Should be much less then potentially them dying.
  • Soul Link (*** piety). Damage you take is split in half with the Avatar. They can die from it. Avatar still takes normal damage. 3 MP, lasts a few dozen turns.
  • Berserk Avatar (**** piety). Makes them go Berserk. 4 MP, lasts normal length. They will attack everything in LOS and chase them uncontrollably. Cannot be recalled during this time. Piety cost.
  • blessings (***** piety, passive). The God will give pluses to armour, pluses to weapons, and do Beogh-style potential healings/hasting/etc when they get kills. Gifting brands that are permanent but occasionally replaced, and linked to what they kill when they get it (Holy when killing a demon, Fire when killing a hydra, Cold when hitting a snake).
  • Guardian Soul (****** piety). Your Avatar 'taunts everything in it's LOS to attack it, while taking much less damage. Lasts a reasonable amount of time. Costs Piety, 5MP.

The Avatar will mirror you. If you have FR+++ so does it. If you have Resist Poison, so does it. If you See Invis, so does it. It should take awhile to gain or lose these so you can't try to game it too much.

Piety rules:

  • Gain for your Avatar killing things.
  • Gain for you killing things (to a lesser degree).
  • Gain for battles! (Getting hurt and regenerating, especially in high tension with your Avatar out.)
  • Gain for helping your Avatar in combat (hasting it, healing it, in battles with wands or spells… no mummies spamming Haste outside combat).
  • Loss for fleeing high tension battles (a la stairs or teleport scrolls).
  • Loss for your Avatar dying. (This should be a huge piety hit, like one * worth.)
  • Loss for not being in battle. (Should take long enough to run to a branch or a storage before being hit with a cumulative piety hit.)
  • Loss for not being with your Avatar. (Should last long enough to get out of the abyss or a shaft before piety being damaged, or give bonus turns to find it again in those two cases.)

Abandonment effects:

  • The god will damage the pluses of your weapons and curse them.
  • Your Avatar will be brought in, with the level the same as yours, and with new weapons and armour each time. Every time they are brought back, they get stronger, like a super-Boris. Chance dependent on your XL for them to be hasted or even berserk. Chance to give them distort/draining brand.
  • A loud battle horn that wakes up everything on the level and makes them able to track you for a period of time.
  • Potential chance of making teleport/blink not work (scroll or wand is not consumed, MP spent though), or fleeing up stairs not work. Should not happen back to back. Suffer for thy cowardice, mortal!!
dpeg Heal Avatar should perhaps use player HP instead of MP. Alternatively, have a single “split health” ability which gives (yourHP+avatarHP)/2 to both of you (this would replace Heal Avatar and Soul Link). Instead of a god, the avatar idea could also be an interesting for an effect from a miscellaneous item.
jpeg Actually defining a player-like monster is a bit tricky. The easiest solution is probably to introduce another monster that is based on the ghost struct, which would allow us to control its exact resistances, hit points and other attributes. The hard part is making skills translate into attributes. We could copy AC and hit points, but that's likely to be overpowered.

Combat Maneuvers

There's something about the editing interface that I don't understand for this wiki. How do I edit the whole page at once instead of just subsections? — DrPraetor 2010-02-22 00:38

In the bottom of the whole page, there's an “edit page” button. — ahyangyi 2010-02-23 15:56

Note that these combat maneuvers could be combined with one or several of the other proposals. — DrPraetor 2010-02-23 05:05

Okay, Okawaru is the deity of battle in the sense that Sif is the deity of spellcasters. Sif has nothing against you fighting, but doesn't help. Likewise, Okie should give abilities which are useful to fighters, but not to spellcasters particularly, and Okie should encourage you to learn a lot of combat skills.

This is hard to arrange, b/c having multiple weapon skills is deeply anti-synergistic. I thought Okie can use combat skills for his combat maneuvers.

Each “combat maneuver” is learned and cast just like a spell. It has a level (which determines the difficulty and the number of spell slots it uses), and you learn them through the normal Memorize dialog, with the combat maneuvers you can learn mixed in (and sorted by success chance and listed by governing skills so new players can easily figure out what is going on). When you cast them, you check using: ((Combat Skill I + Combat Skill II) / 2 + Okie Piety / 20) * Dex, instead of ((avg. magic skill) + Spellcasting / 2) * Int. Spell levels gained from the Spellcasting skill cannot be used for combat maneuvers, and the hunger cost associated with combat maneuvers is reduced by Okie Piety / 10 * Str instead of Spellcasting * Int. However, they don't actually cost magic points.

I believe that covers the needed mechanics. Okie Piety should possibly give you extra levels to spend on these things?

Here is the list to fill out with proposed combat maneuvers. It's going to be quite long, which may be a problem from a coding standpoint. Anyone have a sensible proposal to cut the number by half? All of these maneuvers check (if they check anything) against HD, not MR (ala Confusing Touch): (Note to self: Axes, Blades*, Maces, Polearms, Staves, Unarmed) * You can use either short or long blades for all of these, whichever is higher?

  • Flying Kick (Unarmed/Staves 1) - move adjacent to targeted opponent and kick it. Range is increased by 1 if you are wielding a staff (you vault.)
  • Lunge (Unarmed/Polearms 2) - As reaching, but when using a non-reaching weapon, and accumulative with other powers.
  • Ki Strike (Unarmed/Maces 3) - make a normal attack with extra damage and slows the target (not guaranteed but often works even against major baddies).
  • Blade Dance (Unarmed/Blades 4) - STANCE. Increased Dex and damage from dex-favoring weapons.
  • Whirlwind (Unarmed/Axes 5) - Hit every adjacent enemy several times. Chance (~20%?) that it slows/exhausts you.
  • (Staves/Polearms 3)
  • (Staves/Maces 4)
  • Unconquerable Defense (Staves/Blades 5) - STANCE. Parry with your weapon as if it were a shield - SH rating depends on to-hit bonus and shield skill.
  • Throat Crush (Staves/Axes 2) - requires a free offhand, a bludgeoning weapon, or a shield. Hit the target and do extra asphyxiation damage, with low chance to confuse.
  • (Polearms/Maces 5)
  • (Polearms/Blades 1)
  • (Polearms/Axes 4)
  • (Maces/Blades 2)
  • (Maces/Axes 1)
  • (Blades/Axes 3)

You can only use one STANCE ability at a time.

From my view, write some code to support “combat maneuvers” requires lots of coding, but just adding a lot of plain combat maneuvers don't. — ahyangyi 2010-02-23 15:58


Okawaru and Asroitk

By [user:Ramus2]

Note, before you begin reading, whatever Okawaru was before, he isn't now. I've also wanted to try a dynamic piety-god system where you can switch when needed between two playstyles to match the situation. Results are up to you to decide, but ultimately, you should treat Okawaru and Asroitk as two separate beings with their own altars.

Defensive Melee God

Okawaru, god of war veterans and Asroitk's companion and foil

Flavor

Okawaru is an older god of the Crawl pantheon and prefers to sit back quietly and only intervene when needed. That isn't to say he doesn't enjoy a good fight. Okawaru demands only that his followers keep a cool mind and remember that living for another day is more important than dying today. For Okawaru, the shield and armor make the hero, not the weapon.

Piety

Piety strength is based off of the Shields skill, not Invocations. Keep that in mind while you read.

Okawaru appreciates:

  • Burying the dead. Simply praying over a corpse will give it a grave. Multiple corpses will get several graves that spread out from your single position. (I like this for flavor reasons, it reminds the player of how much blood is on their hands.)

Okawaru dislikes:

  • You harming your allies. It's traitorous.
  • Your allies dying. After all, survival is important for all.

Punishments:

  • Sudden drops in AC, EV, and SH. Bias towards when you're fighting enemies. Temporary but severe.
  • Armour becoming heavier, also causing a drop in EV. Severe cases could be armour doubling in weight temporarily.
Powers
  • (0 stars) Upon joining, Okawaru will grant any character without a shield a basic +0 shield and raise that character's shield skill up to level 1 if that character lacks the skill.
  • (0 stars) Switch to Asroitk, for one whole star worth of piety, your character can instantly switch to working under Asroitk. Okawaru feels that all warriors should follow their own path to glory, so he is fine with the switch. Gives the option to instantly unequip a shield with no delay. Remaining piety is carried over.
  • (1 star) Wait Out The Battle, every time you block a melee attack with your shield, the attacking enemy takes [stars of piety]d4 damage. Very much passive.
  • (2 stars) Will To Go On, 'a'bility skill, costing 4MP and some piety, for the next several turns, length depending on shield skill (perhaps [shields]d3 + 10?), every time the player is hit or blocks an attack with his or her shield, AC goes up by 1. This maxes out at double the normal amount of AC and when the skill reaches the end of its duration, AC is dropped back to its normal amount.
  • (3 stars) Anti-magic Shield, 'a'bility, for 8MP and some piety, the player temporarily has his or her shield gain the reflective property, and when being hit by a conjuration or similar, can make a check for shielding against it, including usually unresistable conjuration spells.
  • (4 stars) Survive, upon death, there a chance, depending on the number of enemies in view, for Okawaru to revive the player to 50% of HP. The cool down period for this is 5000 turns. Chance should be [number of enemies]d3 >= 40.
  • (5 stars) One with Armour, 'a'bility, for large amount of piety and 8MP, all armor and shield hindrances are dropped for a duration determined by armor skill, EV penalties are also dropped at this time. AC rolls are also biased towards being higher.

Offensive Melee God

Asroitk, god of victory in battle and Okawaru's friend and foil

“Go forth and show me your worth!”

Flavor

Asroitk is a younger god of the Crawl pantheon and quite energetic to boot. Being a warrior at heart, Asroitk demands that only the brave who rely on nothing but their own strength and tools follow him, the rest are nothing but cowards and children. Of course, being the young, ruthless, and hasty god that Asroitk is, there have been just a few needless deaths on his hands.

Piety

First off, Asroitk's abilities and their strength is decided by the Fighting skill, not Invocations.

Asroitk appreciates:

  • Killing, of course, victory is only for those who can defeat all. However, no piety if an ally kills an enemy.
  • Killing enemies while touching no walls gets a bonus, because, dammit! You're a man. Real men don't run into corridors!

Asroitk dislikes:

  • Running from battle. If the player attempts to leave the floor when their is a hostile enemy aware of his or her presence, Asroitk will not only drop piety but also move all the enemies in sight up with you. “A true warrior must face the battle!” “Coward! You can not run.”
  • Also running in the more traditional sense as if you keep moving away from an enemy while on screen for a while, your piety will begin to decay, and steadily increase the rate of that decay the longer you're moving away from enemies. Decay is set back to zero once you actually melee hit an enemy.
  • Harming your own allies (note, not having them killed, he's fine with them dying, but you can't lay a finger on them).

Punishments:

  • Drops in strength and dexterity on occasion.
  • Summons a ghost of yourself, biased towards when you're busy fighting a crowd of enemies.
  • Random enemies start acting as Mermaids.
Powers

Any abilities that cost HP to activate draw directly from HP before berserk modifications and guardian spirit. Can't drop HP below 10%

  • (0 stars) Switch to Okawaru, for one whole star worth of piety, your character can instantly switch to working under Okawaru. Asroitk doesn't really mind, Okawaru is just as much of a warrior. Gives the option to instantly equip a shield with no delay. Option not available if wielding a two handed weapon. Remaining piety is carried over.
  • (1 star) Coward's Bane, any enemy that retreats takes [stars of piety]d3 damage each time it moves away from you.
  • (2 stars) Survive the Rush, activation 'a'bility, for 20% of your HP, some piety, and some food, you can strike all enemies adjacent to you. Does not work while you have a shield equipped. Can't be fatal.
  • (3 stars) War Cry, 'a'bility, for 20% of your HP, stuns all enemies within 3 squares and keeps them from moving (but they are still able to attack). Chance to ignore the skill should be measured in fighting skill VS HD. Exceptions should be anything truly mindless (zombies and the like) and demons for being, well, demons. Enemies should have a decent chance at recovering from the condition every turn. Also no shield allowed to be equipped while using this. Can't be fatal.
  • (4 stars) Against All Odds, the more hostile enemies and less allies in sight (includes invisible enemies), the greater your damage output becomes. Should probably start working at four enemies and work as a slaying bonus of +1 per every three enemies after that with fighting skill at one. At 27, it should probably start working as soon as two enemies show up and +1 for every enemy on screen. Again, doesn't work while a shield is equipped.
  • (5 stars) God Slayer, 'a'bility, for 33% of your HP and a good chunk of piety there is a chance of automatically destroying any enemy on attack for several turns, length decided by fighting skill. The skill activates if ([fighting skill] >= 1d50). Perhaps should be raised to 100 or something. Chance is rolled every time you hit an enemy, so if you use Survive the Rush, there's a chance of it activating 8 times. Still doesn't work with a sheild equipped.

Notes on Okawaru and Asroitk

Radical changes, no? Okawaru is pretty much universally believed to be overpowered and boring at this point due to the fact that two of his powers are glorified potions and his gifting is a waiting game. That's not warrior like and also abusable by mummies. So I tossed those out of the window and decided that Okawaru would be a very much “now” god that helps immediately. After a while, I had enough ideas to split Okawaru into two gods and wham, got his more lively counterpart. Why the switching? Well, I figured it'd be interesting and also serve a means for melee characters to be more interesting in the fact that they could switch from kill kill to survival mode when necessary. It's essentially a flip that is totally optional that serves as an interesting choice (would I get out of this if I shell up defensively or will I do better if I just try to flat out kill this guy?). Yeah, tear it up, I know there are some severe imbalances in there.

Comments

Okawaru Compromise Alternate

On the principal that a less radical Okawaru would be easier to push through without riots in the ranks - well… Mountain Dwarf Fighters aren't the win button any more, so now might be the best time to completely toss out the old Okawaru. However, keeping in mind the old dependency on Okawaru, here's a less radical suggestion.

Ability: Fight to the Death

Fight to the the Death grants the user the same old might effect, but it influences all movement cost (but not action costs) significantly. Both yours, allied, and enemy Either it caps all movement at the equivalent of monster speed seven, slowing the approach and retreat, or it doubles movement distances (possibly speed, but I'm a bit wary of attack-moves, but since it is ability only…) towards hostiles/@, but halves speed away from @/hostiles. The movement cap variant would encourage ranged combat, discourage retreating from ranged monsters. The move speed version would encourage close combat, but have potential affects on tactical maneuvering. Both variants would last from the moment they're invoked till the time there are no monsters in sight (ignoring clouds, corners). Escaping from combat (by closing a door, quaffing speed, reading teleport and ending up further away) will end the ability and give a piety hit twice the cost of invoking the ability.

Ability: Dance of Swords

Instead of the general purpose haste, which allows fleeing, Dance of Swords reduces all _player_ action costs by a third - except for movement, and grants a small accuracy bonus (+3). It's effectively haste, but without the running away bit. And cheaper.

Neither of these abilities would stack with haste/speed. — LordSloth 2010-04-25 20:26

I kind of like these. Especially compared to the abysmality of about all other proposals here. This would leave only the issue of grinding for gifts – but that could be easily fixed by making the chance of being granted a gift depend on quality of kills – so sitting in Orc or the Hive wouldn't be highly beneficial anymore. — KiloByte 2010-04-26 09:55
I think this, combined with the idea that Okawaru's gifts show up on champions, is a great (simple, direct) way to translate all of his current abilities into interesting new ones. He could stand to have one more ability though, since most gods have more than two. He strikes me as Trog's more defensive counter-part; that combined with the idea that he's the newbie-god makes me think an ability that increases your AC based on how many walls you're next to would work. — SquashMonster 2010-04-26 02:09
“Fight to the death” effectively seems very similar to Chei, except that monsters aren't smart enough to avoid making terrible decisions under it. Also, it limits legitimate combat options - in that sense, it's also effectively similar to berserk, which takes away from Okawaru's current “safe” appeal. I don't get it thematically, either - why does it disallow haste? Why don't monsters get the Might bonus? Why aren't monsters penalized for escaping?

As the ability's activated by the player, the movement cap version would be used as a haste effect by ranged characters, while melee characters would just trigger it for Might when in the proper position (again like berserk), neither of which seems to be entirely intended (though I like that it's of use to ranged characters, unlike Might). The move speed version would avoid this, if it's something to be avoided, but that's perhaps even more like Chei (and it actively penalizes ranged combat).

“Dance of swords” sounds like further encouragement to learn the haste spell, as it's just less of the same thing (with a mostly negligible accuracy boost). It should have some unique effect, though I don't know what - maybe an AC/EV/SH bonus, though that seems simplistic, and actually hasting would likely be better defensively anyway. Also, ranged characters would find little difference between this ability (as presented) and the first one (movement cap version), save that this one'd be safer.

Regardless, “compromise” seems like a poor idea from the start, and I doubt these changes would appeal to the short-blade characters that threaten “riots” anyway, for whatever that's worth. — OG17 2010-04-26 13:05

Iron-blood Okawaru [Minced]

This Okawaru, rather than simply gifting lots of weapons and armour, is actually *worshipped* by weapons and armour! Lowly flesh-and-blood servants like you are just glorified war-steeds, but still get some nice benefits.

While gifts come less often, Okawaru now “blesses” existing gear of the worshipper's choice with randart properties (much like Cheibriados)! However, he does so by making your armour and weapons sentient, so stealth is impeded by noisy weapons and armour. And randart personalities are not always agreeable: be prepared for spastic, cowardly hats with *tele, rage randarts with anger-management issues, and whiny, ever-suffering auto-cursed gear. Few of Okie's gifts have no downsides, but then again, none are completely useless.

Be prepared for less AC than before, since Okawaru won't bless gear with additional enchantment. Creating gifts is now an interesting, strategic decision that requires resource allocation rather than a simple matter of waiting for the +10 gold dragon armour of infinity to drop into your lap.

Last but not least, Okawaru's abilities now revolve around “awakening” the life within armour and weapons. You can turn that nasty orc warrior's axe against him, or awaken your own armour to steady it against enemy blows! Just don't expect that glaive you found lying around to dance for you if you studied axes or have low invocations skill - weapons are a little particular about who they dance for.

Iron-blood Okawaru (description)

The battlefield is Okawaru's temple, where swords pray to swing true and shields pray for steady guidance. Okawaru also hears the prayers of mortals wielding these swords and shields, awakening their gear to sing praises to the god of bloodstained iron…

Okawaru says “Strike true, Wielder!”

Audience

I do not expect Iron-blood Okawaru to catch on at all until a viable dedicated stealth-god comes along.

  • Pure spellcasters can't make much use of iron-blood okie since weapon-dancing doesn't work well with low weapon skill.
  • anyone seeking rare weapons (double sword, quick blade) would be better served by Trog, since Okie modifies existing gear.
  • short-blade users/stabbers will hate iron-blood Okawaru. Oh well, they'll probably get an awesome stealth god anyway, and it's questionable to have a playstyle (might+short blade ) entirely reliant on a certain god.
  • heavy-armour users will love extra AC ability in late game since it makes heavy armour more viable. In early game, dancing low-tier weapons are weak and will usually be used as escape button.

Abilities Granted

These abilities are not as well formed as Okawaru's general personality is.

  • you can awaken weapons. (make your weapon dance, or make enemy weapon dance at high inv skill. Need some weapon skill too - weapons will not dance for unskilled wielders)
  • you can awaken your armour for extra defense (improved GDR, +AC increasing as you take damage and armour is “excited” - armour will vibrate in excitement for flavor).
  • You can call weapons to kneel in prayer. (halt the attacks of all enemies and allies wielding weapons - good for unarmed combatants).
  • (passive) Okawaru watches over your gear. (decreased mulching, resist corrosion w/o amulet)
  • (gift) Okawaru will infuse your gear with life-force. (turn EXISTING weapon/armour into randart but will not enchant it. Gear will have a “personality” reflected by attributes such as *rage, *mut and have a name to match.)

Piety Gain

Heaven help you if you let your armour get corroded. That is all for now.

Contrast w. Warmaster Okawaru

gifting differences:

  • fewer gifts, but player can choose which armour to “bring to life.” (like Chei worshippers can)
  • Okawaru will not enchant gifts, just give special attributes.
  • summary: a player could ask for five randart dragon armours but they will all be +0 unless the player enchanted them.
  • gear will usually have significant downsides reflected by personality, e.g. spastic item = teleportitis, but also significant upsides.

ability differences:

  • The old Okawaru exists to fulfill the principal needs of a fighter (extra offense, panic button, spiffy gear) in the most simplistic way possible. This Okawaru's abilities are significantly more flexible but fulfill the same aims.
  • The dancing weapon ability can be used as an escape tactic (clog a corridor), an offensive boost, or a debuff (e.g. if used on an orc warrior's axe). This ability is meant to become a mainstay and grows more powerful with invocations investment. As a downside, since using allies decreases XP gain, the ability can't be used as a “win” button like might or berserk.
  • The +AC ability is meant for sustained fights and is little use to early-game characters with low armour skill.

Adding Actual Flavour

If none of the other ideas are implemented, or at least until one is, just adding some flavour would help Okawaru immensely.

Okawaru is a morally neutral deity in the eyes of the good gods, and his followers are called things like “Knight” or “Victor of a Thousand Battles” instead of “Fanfare of Bloodshed.” Beyond the stock blood god mechanics, there's little to suggest Okawaru cares for slaughter and bloodshed any more than the victory itself.

Okawaru's conducts should therefore be changed from “Okawaru likes it when you kill living beings yada yada yada” to “Okawaru likes it when you are victorious in battle” and he should accept the defeat of holy and non-living enemies. The associated message should be changed as well, from “Okawaru accepts your kill” to “Okawaru is honored by your victory” or something.

Corpses should not be “sacrificed” to Okawaru. Instead, he should use messages more like Beogh's orc-blessing.

https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=851

TGW 2010-08-22 09:02

Okawaru Revised

Okawaru's main appeals are the Might and Haste buffs for melee fighting and acquirement-like gifts for (almost) guarantying a good set of armour with some good resists and enchantments. These traits make Okawaru appealing to melee fighters, players who want good armour and weapons, and players playing limited-armour species such as Trolls and Spriggans, but Okie's effects are none the less, boring. However, by tying Okawaru's boons into the new weapon abilities and reducing armour penalties, Okawaru can still appeal to melee fighters, and by using an alternate system for Okawaruto grant armour enhancements, Okawaru could be made more interesting and less a copy of potions and acquirement, while appealing to the same set of characters as before.

piety (1 star) Okawaru enhances your offense in melee.

Okawaru passively reduces delay, and increases accuracy and damage when fighting in melee, based on Invo and piety.

piety (2 star) Okawaru enhances your passive melee fighting abilities

Your passive abilities have a higher chance of firing off based on Invo and piety

piety (3 star) You can call upon Okawaru to make your armour better fit your person.

Cost a small amount of piety, adds AC based on your Invo and how much AC you currently have, and reduces armour penalties for spellcasting, dodging, and fighting.

piety (4 star) Okawaru may bless your armour and weapon with temporary enhancements.

Okawaru will temporarily add properties (slaying bonuses, regen, AC bonuses, resistances, etc) to your armour and weapons. The amount of total properties added depends on your piety and how many you already have. These properties should last long enough to be meaningful. (i.e. if you get rP, you should be able to do a few floors of Snake before it wears off) What properties you get will be random, and come and go as the RNG pleases. You might have rF++ at one point, but later on you might not. As you get more piety though, you should overall have more boons from Okawaru.

piety (6 star) By praying at an altar, Okawaru will bless a weapon or piece of armour with tremendous power…once.

Similar to how Kiku blesses your weapon with pain or gives you the Necronimon, Okawaru will bless a weapon or piece of armour at an altar, turning it into a very good randart using the base piece of armour or weapon as its base, so a +9 robe of resist will at be a +9 robe of resist artefact with other properties, and a regular +1 robe will likely not be as good. The artefact should also have an appropriate name, like 'the Blade of Okawaru', 'the Cloak of Player's Victory', 'the Plate Mail of Okawaru's Finest', etc.

Okawaru's wrath should remain somewhat the same except for that Okawaru should destroy whatever item you blessed or animate it against you. Addition effects that Okawaru could do is dis-enchant armour in the Dungeon, disintegrate your armour in high-tension situations, and make your weapon have more delay and your armour act more cumbersome.

psyshvl 2010-08-23 05:50

Assorted ideas

This is not a complete alternative proposal, but a single idea which would fit (almost) any above system. I think it's very thematic - perhaps a prayer effect ?

Okawaru provides bonus for each adjacent bloodstain, especially bloodstain on player's square
This would have interesting implications:

  • Okawaru would help in tough battles
  • Okawaru would help in long battles
  • Okawaru would encourage to stay there and fight. Position would be important
  • Interactions with especially bloody effects, like Disintegration
  • Wouldn't help archers much.
  • The undead wouldn't benefit much, they would need to make someone else bleed.

If this is implemented, I recommend to make a distinction between fresh blood and bloodstain. Either light red and dark red, or red and brown. Vaults should use old bloodstains.

b0rsuk 2010-08-23 06:30

Pacra: Okawaru, God of Power and Avarice

Okawaru, God of Power and Avarice.

The underground holds nearly unlimited bounty and almost boundless power; the gargantuan god Okawaru desires it all. Okawaru covers his halls with fabulous wealth and expressions of power, yet the Orb of Zot remains unaccounted for in his prodigious collection. Although far from feeble, corpulent Okawaru cannot fit in even the largest dungeon corridor and seeks an avatar that may voluntarily bring the Orb into his collection. Followers can expect fabulous boons related to power and crass materialism from Okawaru, but beware: weakness (and worse, sharing) will not be tolerated by the contemptuous celestial of cupidity.

Followers are encouraged to: (open to any fun ideas.)

  • Stay Engorged whenever possible. Simply being very full is not enough and will not gain piety.
  • Stay as much with them as they can. Playing unencumbered means a greater piety timeout every x turns; Playing encumbered means a far lesser piety timeout.
  • Completely buy out shops. (Sizable piety increase.)
  • Sacrifice corpses, although this does not give piety; it merely satisfies Okawaru's material covetousness.

Followers are discouraged from: (open to any fun ideas.)

  • Accepting help in any form. This includes any summoning ability, spell, scroll, or rod.
  • Casting summoning spells, reading a summoning scroll beyond identifying one, or using a spell from a rod will incur penance.
  • Leaving corpses uneaten or unsacrificed. Having a corpse rot will incur a piety hit.
  • Leaving powerful runes of Zot off of one's person. Every rune found that is not carried will cause a faster piety timeout.

Wrath

Wrath ideas:

  • During wrath, chance of a random non-equippable item in your inventory will disappear: “Okawaru says, Give me that, fool!” and counter drops by 1.
  • During wrath, equal chance of something you try to pick up disappearing: “Okawaru snickers and whispers in your ear: 'Yoink!'”
  • During wrath, chance of a shop you visit suddenly going out-of-business. “The shop seems to be closed. The sigil of 'Okawaru Holdings, Unlimited' is posted on the door.'”
  • During wrath, chance of a random enemy in melee combat gaining the “Taste of Power” skill for d15 turns. “See what you're missing, fool?”

At complete wrath timeout: “Okawaru seems mollified by your involuntary gifts.”

Abilities

  • Taste of Power (* piety) “You feel the rewards of power.” Invokable active ability, costing food and piety. Gives damage and accuracy bonus, increasing in small increments with piety, only maxing at 150. The ability is requisite upon health, just like the sword of power: if your hp goes down, the damage/accuracy bonus similarly goes down. At less than 20% health, both damage and to-hit are subtracted rather than added.
  • Gluttony (** piety) Gives passive gourmand status when (very?) full or better. Gourmand status disappears when dropping below (very?) full.
  • Demonstration of Power (*** piety) Active skill, costing food and piety. If you one-hit an enemy while the ability is cast, surrounding natural enemies have a chance based on invocations and HD to become afraid and run away. “Okawaru laughs at the weaklings you've scattered.” If no enemies are cowed, you incur a further piety hit. “Okawaru snickers at your incompetence.”
  • Avarice Shield (**** piety) “Okawaru guards you and your impressive collection of earthly goods.” Gives a piety-specific AC and EV bonus when encumbered. (Conversely, with the name, could give some sort of shield or shield bonus).
  • (***** piety) Just flavour here: Okawaru states, “I was thinking I'd give you a powerful artifact, but forget it. It's MINE.”
  • Instill Power (****** piety) Onetime sacrifice of a randart of the player's choice at an altar. Randart must have at least three bonuses/detriments, or will be refused “Okawaru has no use for such an inferior object.” Player will receive one permanent, innate quality of a random resistance/bonus/detriment of the object; the object then disappears.

Continuing Passive: Have a ((Inv/135 + Piety/60) * 100) out of 100 chance, where you could otherwise have died, for Okawaru to gain an interest in a random three of your better objects (think artifact weapon/armour/jewelry and the like), and demand requisition of the objects in return for saving you. If refused: “Suit yourself, it's all mine in the end anyway!”

Prayer: [cyan]“Okawaru ignores your spiritual plea.”[/cyan]

Death: Okawaru bellows, “Hands off, my disciple's belongings are mine, all mine!” ===

Pacra 2010-08-30 04:22

There are interesting ideas here. First of all, compare with the Gluttony God (A). The eating conduct is one I like a lot and both proposals contain good ideas for that. Combining this with greed is a nice touch.
I am not sure if a war-like god (i.e. Okawaru) is the best target: this proposal deviates from the current incarnation very far. Still, the idea of using the Sword of Power mechanic is interesting (also for other Okawaru proposals). I am not so sure about demanding encumbrance. The cool thing is that it makes running away less useful, as it should be. Heck, perhaps it would work.
Instill Power is interesting, since there's the question of when (and with what to use it).
The life saving ability is interesting and thematic, but I am not sure if there should be a prompt. Also, I would in general recommend to not mix piety and Invocations skill: as I see it, piety is the resource and Inv means how good you can use abilities. So the life saving ability could have a chance based on number of previous life saving and value of three most valuable, carried items. (No need to use Inv since it is passive.) If it works out, then reduce piety drastically.
dpeg 2010-09-30 23:16
All this greed/glutton flavor does seem out of place here; if anything, it'd belong on Nemelex, the god that collects literally everything. It also makes for a fairly gimmicky playstyle, while I'd think that Okawaru should remain a more neutral choice. — OG17 2010-10-01 02:59
Lots of neat ideas here, but it seems to me that the main reason Okawaru is popular is that many people want a Trog-ish god without giving up spellcasting. Ammo gifts can be a lifesaver, too! — Andy 2011-12-08 21:08
Logged in as: Anonymous (VIEWER)
dcss/brainstorm/god/okawaru.txt · Last modified: 2014-06-03 16:35 by dpeg
 
Recent changes RSS feed Donate Powered by PHP Valid XHTML 1.0 Valid CSS Driven by DokuWiki