YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan


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Shoals Surfer

Posts: 311

Joined: Wednesday, 15th August 2012, 07:13

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 05:02

YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

After yet another Slime- induced death, I'm seriously wondering if I should ever touch that place without being some form of Conjurer. My actual death was in the Abyss, but I blame the Royal Jelly as the true cause of death. After it tanked all of my attempts to kill it(It simply melts away into its hordes of Acid Blobs every time I get it to yellow health, and then regenerates and returns as I either flee via porting or slowly hack my way through), a berserkitis attack left me unable to escape from the horde of spawned jellies around me, and attacking them would just make the zerk last even longer. Surrounded by 4 Acid Blobs and at 80 health, I didn't think I'd survive a slow, random teleport or semi-controlled blinks, thanks to their speed and ranged capability. So naturally, I thought "Well, I'll just escape to the Abyss, chug healing, and wait off slow and then return. After all, a Centaur is well suited to fleeing through the Abyss, and I can just gate out if I get cornered." So I disappear into the abyss... and land in a large, open area with two Yaktaur Captains about 5 squares away, who immediately whip out their crossbows and take my health down to about 25. My options are basically- chug Heal Wounds, or do something else and die immediately to crossbow bolts. So I start chugging Heal Wounds, which isn't really outpacing the damage very well, so by my last one I'm only at 50 health, and a Wretched Star has come into view. I try to disappear under a cloud of butterflies, which almost worked, but in the end there was too much open space to block all the ranged attacks, and I died... due to the same sort of situation I had tried to escape in Slime.
I should have just Corrupted the center and not worried about slimes eating the loot.

What I learned:
1: Apparently, regular monsters that you banish will show up in the abyss, just like Uniques. I don't see how else there could've been a pair of Yaktaur Captains waiting for me(I banished a fair few of the bastards- this was one of the few games where they remained a threat throughout the whole run, and banishing the Captain made the rest of the pack substantially easier to shoot down)

2: Doing Slime without heavy-duty Conjurations requires outrageous melee power. I've had a level 26 GSC-wielding Dragon Armoured Ogre try and fail to kill the Royal Jelly, I should've known that a 20 AC centaur with a decent Great Sword of Speed wouldn't have been enough. Even some Chump with a Bolt of Foo would've had a better chance against the jolly golden jelly, because you can continue attacking even when there's 5 Acid Blobs between you and TRJ.

3. The dangerousness of Yaktaurs is quite dependent on your EV. It was a very good thing I had such excellent ranged combat and speed, because yaktaur packs would chew through my HP even with Repel Missiles. Upgrading to Deflect would've probably saved me this game, from Acid Blobs and Yaktaurs alike. All Phase Shift really did for this character was ensure that I didn't have to eat every single Rock that Giants threw.

4: Just because Berserkeritis is safe 99% of the time doesn't mean that the last 1% won't be fatal. I could have easily removed my bad mutations this game, but was too enamored with my rainbow scales and MR. A sensible man would've foreseen the trouble Teleportitis could cause in a -cTele area(Though I was lucky with it), and the fact that Berserk can turn an accidental button mash into a YASD.

5: Eldritch Tentacle is super cool, but highly impractical. I summoned it to help me fight an Ancient Lich, and I killed the lich with arrows while the tentacle just sorta slithered around drunkenly nearby, finally managing a hit after 10 turns. I don't really understand the AI of tentacles, but I love the flavor of this spell.

6. Ranged combat is highly practical, but not very cool. Kiting everything with a Longbow is only slightly more dynamic than spamming Dragons and mashing through -more-
  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.12-a0-1616-ge3ef79a (tiles) character file.

575272 Uneasy the Portalist (level 26, -1/215 (216) HPs)
             Began as a Centaur Abyssal Knight on Feb 12, 2013.
             Was the Champion of Lugonu.
             Killed from afar by a wretched star (26 damage)
             ... with an orb of energy
             
             ... on Level 1 of the Abyss on Feb 14, 2013.
             The game lasted 08:59:54 (88576 turns).

Uneasy the Portalist (Centaur Abyssal Knight)      Turns: 88576, Time: 08:59:54

HP  -1/215 (216) AC 18     Str 21      XL: 26   Next: 75%
MP  23/39        EV  9     Int 12 (16) God: Lugonu [******]
Gold 3235        SH  0     Dex  9 (10) Spells: 13 memorised,  2 levels left

Res.Fire  : + . .   See Invis. : +   a - +1,+4 great sword of the Known World {spee
Res.Cold  : . . .   Warding    : .   S - +2 elf leather armour
Life Prot.: . . .   Conserve   : .   (no shield)
Res.Poison: +       Res.Corr.  : +   h - -1 helmet "Shreirche" {rPois rF+ MR Acc+5
Res.Elec. : +       Clarity    : .   s - -1 dwarf cloak
Sust.Abil.: . .     Spirit.Shd : .   r - -1 pair of gauntlets
Res.Mut.  : .       Rnd.Telep. : +   D - +0 centaur barding "Stroec" {rElec Dam+5}
Res.Rott. : .       Ctrl.Telep.: x   w - amulet of resist corrosion
Saprovore : . . .   Flight     : .   i - ring of sustenance
                                     C - ring of teleport control

@: exhausted, hasted and slowed, very quick, extremely resistant to hostile
enchantments, very unstealthy
A: hooves 3, berserk 2, deformed body, deterioration 1, herbivore 1, speed 2,
fast metabolism 1, magic resistance 1, electricity resistance, spit poison 1,
teleportitis 1, tough skin 3, AC +4, Str -1, Dex -2
a: Spit Poison, Depart the Abyss, Bend Space, Banish, Corrupt, Enter the Abyss,
Renounce Religion
}: 4/15 runes: serpentine, barnacled, silver, abyssal


You were on level 1 of the Abyss.
You worshipped Lugonu.
Lugonu was exalted by your worship.
You were near starving.

You visited 9 branches of the dungeon, and saw 68 of its levels.
You visited the Abyss 4 times.
You also visited: Labyrinth.

You collected 8644 gold pieces.
You spent 5429 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 a - the +1,+4 great sword of the Known World (weapon) {speed, Str+3}
   (You found it on level 17 of the Dungeon)   
   
   Attacks with this weapon take half as long, but cause slightly less damage.
   
   It affects your strength (+3).
 b - the +2,+10 longbow "Piercer" {velocity, EV-2}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 25 of the Dungeon)   
   
   Any arrow fired from it inflicts extra damage.
   
   It affects your evasion (-2).
Missiles
 q - 49 arrows of dispersal
 v - 196 arrows
Armour
 c - a +1 cloak of preservation
 h - the -1 helmet "Shreirche" (worn) {rPois rF+ MR Acc+5 SInv}
   (You bought it in a shop on level 25 of the Dungeon)   
   
   It affects your accuracy (+5).
   It protects you from fire.
   It protects you from poison.
   It increases your resistance to enchantments.
   It enhances your eyesight.
 r - a -1 pair of gauntlets (worn)
 s - a -1 dwarven cloak (worn)
 D - the +0 centaur barding "Stroec" (worn) {rElec Dam+5}
   (You acquired it on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   It affects your damage-dealing abilities (+5).
   It insulates you from electricity.
 S - a +2 elven leather armour (worn)
Magical devices
 p - a wand of teleportation (7)
 U - a wand of disintegration (9)
Comestibles
 k - 5 bread rations
Scrolls
 m - 4 scrolls of fog
 n - 8 scrolls of identify
 y - 3 scrolls of teleportation
 G - 14 scrolls of remove curse
 P - 5 scrolls of blinking
 Z - 5 scrolls of fear
Jewellery
 d - an uncursed ring of teleportation
 e - an uncursed ring of protection from magic
 i - a ring of sustenance (right hand)
 j - an uncursed ring of protection from cold
 l - an uncursed ring of see invisible
 u - the ring of Ibov {Hunger +Fly rN+}
   (You found it on level 1 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   [ring of life protection]
   It lets you fly.
   It speeds your metabolism.
 w - an amulet of resist corrosion (around neck)
 x - an uncursed amulet of the gourmand
 A - an uncursed ring of regeneration
 B - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
 C - a ring of teleport control (left hand)
 F - an uncursed ring of wizardry
 J - an uncursed ring of sustain abilities
 K - an uncursed ring of protection from fire
 O - a +6,+4 ring of slaying
 X - an uncursed amulet of conservation
Potions
 H - a potion of resistance
 M - 3 potions of speed
 N - 3 potions of curing
 V - a potion of berserk rage
Books
 o - a Grand Grimoire {highlevel}   
   
   Spells                             Type                      Level
   Demonic Horde                      Summoning                    6
   *Mass Abjuration                   Summoning                    6
   Haunt                              Necromancy/Summoning         7
   Summon Greater Demon               Summoning                    7
   *Malign Gateway                    Summoning/Translocation      7
   Summon Horrible Things             Summoning                    8
 z - Sif Muna's Compendium of Dislocation and Intoxication
   (You found it on level 3 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   Spells                             Type                      Level
   Sting                              Conjuration/Poison           1
   Apportation                        Translocation                1
   Summon Scorpions                   Summoning/Poison             4
   *Dispersal                         Translocation                6
   *Disjunction                       Translocation                8
Magical staves
 Q - an uncursed staff of wizardry
Miscellaneous
 f - an ornate deck of war {Foxfire}
 R - a legendary deck of escape {drawn: 1}
Rods
 t - a +9 rod of destruction [lightning,fireball,iron] (13/13)
   (You found it on level 5 of the Vaults)


   Skills:
 - Level 15.0 Fighting
   Level 4.2 Short Blades
 - Level 3.2 Long Blades
 - Level 1.5 Maces & Flails
   Level 10.5 Polearms
 - Level 1.1 Staves
   Level 5.5 Slings
 - Level 21.0 Bows
 - Level 3.0 Throwing
 - Level 9.0 Armour
 - Level 7.0 Dodging
 - Level 0.1 Stealth
 - Level 5.0 Traps
 + Level 14.5 Spellcasting
   Level 3.1 Conjurations
 - Level 11.0 Charms
 - Level 15.0 Summonings
 - Level 4.4 Necromancy
 - Level 21.3 Translocations
 - Level 0.1 Fire Magic
 - Level 0.3 Ice Magic
 - Level 3.3 Air Magic
 - Level 3.4 Poison Magic
 - Level 12.3 Invocations
 - Level 2.2 Evocations


You had 2 spell levels left.
You knew the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Cure Poison           Pois           ####......   2%          2    None
b - Controlled Blink      Tloc           N/A          1%          7    #######
c - Phase Shift           Tloc           #######...   1%          5    ####...
d - Freezing Aura         Chrm/Ice       ####......   1%          2    None
e - Fire Brand            Chrm/Fire      ####......   1%          2    None
f - Malign Gateway        Summ/Tloc      #######...   4%          7    #######
g - Regeneration          Chrm/Necr      #####.....   1%          3    None
h - Summon Butterflies    Summ           ######...    0%          1    None
i - Dispersal             Tloc           #######...   1%          6    ######.
j - Disjunction           Tloc           #######...   12%         8    #######
k - Mass Abjuration       Summ           ######....   2%          6    ######.
r - Repel Missiles        Chrm/Air       #####.....   1%          2    None
s - Animate Skeleton      Necr           N/A          1%          1    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (27/27)            Temple (0/1) D:4             Orc (4/4) D:7
    Elf (3/3) Orc:3          Lair (8/8) D:8          Shoals (5/5) Lair:3
  Snake (5/5) Lair:3        Slime (6/6) Lair:8       Vaults (5/5) D:19
  Blade (0/1) Vaults:3      Crypt (5/5) Vaults:3       Tomb (0/3) Crypt:3
    Zot (0/5) D:27       

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Elyvilon
Kikubaaqudgha
Sif Muna
Vehumet
Zin
the Shining One
Beogh
Jiyva

Shops:
D:8: /  D:10: [  D:22: /*((/  D:25: =[(([  D:27: %*  Orc:2: /  Orc:4: /??(  Shoals:5: *
Snake:1: ?

Portals:
Hell: D:21 D:22 D:23 D:24 D:25 D:26 D:27
Abyss: D:24 D:25 D:26
Pandemonium: D:24
Trove: D:10 (give 2 scrolls of acquirement)

Annotations
D:12 pitmail
D:17 bread
D:21 exclusion: downstairs
D:22 !Boris, exclusions: downstairs and upstairs, Boris
D:23 exclusion: upstairs
D:25 bread
D:27 exclusion: door
Snake:3 meat
Slime:6 Royal Jelly
Vaults:3 exclusion: 2 doors
Crypt:1 exclusion: curse skull
Abyss:1 Fannar, Kirke, Rupert


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You have hooves in place of feet.
Armour fits poorly on your strangely shaped body.
You digest meat inefficiently.
You cover ground very quickly.
You have a fast metabolism.
You have extremely tough skin (AC +3).
You are partially covered in iridescent scales (AC +4).
Your body is slowly deteriorating.
You are resistant to hostile enchantments.
You are resistant to electric shocks.
You can spit poison.
Your muscles are strong, but stiff (Str +1, Dex -1).
Space occasionally distorts in your vicinity.
You are weak (Str -2).
[You often lose your temper in combat.]
[You are clumsy (Dex -1).]


Message History

The mystic blast hits your butterfly.
Your butterfly dies!
You swap places.
You swap places.
The orange demon barely misses your butterfly.
The orange demon completely misses your butterfly.
Casting: Summon Butterflies
Confirm with . or Enter, or press ? or * to list all spells.
Unknown command.
You swap places.
The yaktaur captain unwields an uncursed crossbow.
The yaktaur captain hits your butterfly!
Your butterfly dies!
You feel yourself speed up. The orange demon hits your butterfly.
The orange demon completely misses your butterfly.
The orange demon misses your butterfly.
The orange demon completely misses your butterfly.
The wretched star glows turbulently.
The orb of energy hits you!
You die...

      .............
    ......... .cc..
   .......X(.(.(...
   #...#...(..b....
   #..b..###(#.....
    #...##b#c#.#.##
      #bb.X...c.#.#
      #.bb4##.# ...
     .##..*##~.....
      #@..#b.##*...
   #.0..b#b..# ..#
  #...##b.~~.#
....## .....~#
..#    ###...~.
          #.#7
           .7


You could see a yaktaur captain, a wretched star, an orange demon and a large
abomination.
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Psst, hey kid... you like roguelikes?

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 4055

Joined: Tuesday, 10th January 2012, 19:49

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 06:07

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

I hope you were fighting TRJ inside the stone vault walls. If you weren't then that's one big reason you died (since you decided to open yourself to 8 attacks per turn instead of 3 for no reason, and also TRJ can't produce jellies if too many nearby spots are filled). Then you just kill TRJ and all the jellies in one go ... don't run away until TRJ is dead.

Most characters with good melee should be able to melee TRJ, though you will want might + haste + agility when you fight it.

Admittedly your character has absolutely awful defenses so I'm not sure this character could really melee TRJ. Wearing light armour on centaurs is generally not a very good idea since you have awful dex and a bad dodging apt and large size, whereas for heavy armour you end up with about as much AC as a non-centaur would.

For this message the author crate has received thanks:
battaile

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 11111

Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 07:16

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

Indeed Repel Missles isn't that great vs missiles since it decreases to-hit to a random amount between 0% and 100% of original value.
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Shoals Surfer

Posts: 311

Joined: Wednesday, 15th August 2012, 07:13

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 07:41

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

Oh, I know to fight TRJ in the stone vault. The problem is that TRJ runs away from ME! It leaves close combat by trading places with it's own summoned slimes, forcing me to actually fight the summons rather than just focus on the Duke of Deliquescence himself. This behavior is why I've only managed to kill it with conjurations/a bandolier of attack wands/summons- The Prince of Protoplasm just won't stay adjacent to my melee characters, instead letting his minions do his dirty work.

The awful defenses certainly weren't helping, but I think I may have also evaluated my own melee combat ability poorly. Sure, I had "Quite Fast" on a Great Sword, but it was only +1/+4, (+ some bonus slaying) - whatever the Speed penalty was, and I only had 3 long blade skill, which probably meant that I was attacking fast, but not hitting as hard as a "Real" melee fighter would have been. I was chewing through enemies with a combination of sword and Longbow, but His Slimyness is too fast for me to get many arrow shots in before he closed to melee, and he would've eaten arrow anyway. Additionally, centaur speed ensured that I was usually only fighting one tough monster at a time, so I didn't actually know how much 3 Acid blobs would hurt in melee until I got trapped in the stone vault knee deep in jellies and berserk.

But despite all that, I felt like it was the Abyssal welcoming committee that was what truly ended me, more so than any misplays in Slime. I had gone into the fight with the Emperor Amoeba with the plan of killing him ASAP, then retreating to the Abyss if a Teleport seemed too slow to avoid the remaining jelly entourage. I was expecting to deal with the melee brutes of the Abyss in the usual contorted terrain, not spammy Vault range attackers in an open field on the very first turn of arrival.
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Abyss Ambulator

Posts: 1243

Joined: Thursday, 10th March 2011, 19:45

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 07:44

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

I think I have lost more high level characters in Slime than anywhere else.

It's particularly dangerous because you can't rely on haste as you might need to use Stasis to prevent paralysis by giant eyeballs.

I also don't get why Enter the Abyss is presented as some kind of super escape button when it's likely to put you in just as much danger as you were escaping from, and costs you HP as well.
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Shoals Surfer

Posts: 311

Joined: Wednesday, 15th August 2012, 07:13

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 08:05

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

Jeremiah wrote:I also don't get why Enter the Abyss is presented as some kind of super escape button when it's likely to put you in just as much danger as you were escaping from, and costs you HP as well.


I Agree, I actually didn't realize all the negative effects of Enter the Abyss before I used it. This ability apparently not only reduces max HP and MP, but can reduce CURRENT HP and MP all the way down to 1, according to the bots. Ouch- I have a new hypothesis as to where all my HP went, and it doesn't involve blaming the Yaktaurs.

It seems like a distortion unwield is actually a superior method of getting to the abyss than the official god power, which seems unintuitive to me.
1) Enter the Abyss-
Pros- Fast, Reliable at decent Invocations
Cons-costs a chunk of mana, requires Invocations, permanently reduces character power, renders you vulnerable to being killed on arrival, only available at High Lugonu piety

2) Distortion unwield
Pros-Only requires a free inventory slot and a non-cursed weapon
Cons- Unreliable, can cause bad muts(which are curable, unlike Max HP redux and death), can damage you(but not as much as enter the abyss?)

Something seems off here... especially considering that a high-level Lugonu follower certainly has access to the Distortion Unwield, which seems much more strategically appealing than Enter the Abyss.
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Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 4055

Joined: Tuesday, 10th January 2012, 19:49

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 08:09

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

Enter the abyss is good. It's significantly better than disto unwield usually, since if you have enough time to safely disto unwield (you only get abyssed about 20% of the time, so you probably want about 4-5 turns and have to be ready to accept 30+ self-damage) then you almost certainly have enough time to do something entirely different anyway.

It is not intended to be perfectly reliable. If you want 100% reliable life-saving from your god then worship Ely and use divine protection (of course that will leave you in the same situation that would have just killed you...).
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Shoals Surfer

Posts: 311

Joined: Wednesday, 15th August 2012, 07:13

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 08:34

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

I didn't know the actual chances of being abyssed from a distortion weapon, I thought it was more like 1/3. If it's 1/5 though... yeesh. I guess it really isn't very appropriate as an escape option then. Enter the Abyss might indirectly kill you if there's any sort of ambush waiting for you, but if a situation is so dangerous that you need to escape to another plane of existence, I guess fumbling around with distortion would likely just make you die in the Dungeon instead of the Abyss.
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Abyss Ambulator

Posts: 1243

Joined: Thursday, 10th March 2011, 19:45

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 09:02

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

Unwielding distortion was the main way of getting to the Abyss when it was the only reliable way out of Pan (and escaping the Abyss put you back in the Dungeon.)

I'm not exactly sure what happens now as it's been changed quite a lot, but AFAIK if you go to the Abyss from Pan, when you escape you end up back on the same Pan level.

To be fair, I haven't played a Lugonu character for a long time, but I think Enter the Abyss used to be better as you could escape into the Abyss, then immediately use Lugonu's power to leave the Abyss, which was more likely to put you in a safe place back in the Dungeon, either on a staircase or in a random place. So Enter the Abyss + Leave the Abyss was like an instant teleport at the cost of piety and HP.

But now AFAIK leaving the Abyss puts you back where you were before you entered, so it doesn't work any more as an escape.

Cocytus Succeeder

Posts: 2297

Joined: Saturday, 14th April 2012, 21:35

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 09:25

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

While TRJ does outright 'run away' at very low health, what you're describing is his 'tactically retreat behind my army'. A good melee dude should be able to just kill his army as he generates and hides behind it, tanking the attacks that come his way. That wasn't an option for this CeAK's defences.

crate wrote:If you want 100% reliable life-saving from your god then worship Ely and use divine protection (of course that will leave you in the same situation that would have just killed you...).

Alternatively, Zin's Sanctuary which also guarantees further attacks won't happen for a while. I don't think it protects you from DoT effects but it's rare (beyond earlygame) for the cause of death to be direct DoT.
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Vaults Vanquisher

Posts: 451

Joined: Sunday, 11th September 2011, 00:07

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 15:28

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

You don't need "outrageous melee power" to walk up to the royal jelly and punch it in the face, it's just that you had extremely terrible defenses and 3 skill points in your current weapon, not to mention some wacky skill dilution. The game just did what it had to do and killed you off for doing so many things wrong - if you had survived the encounter unscathed, then I'd start worrying.
Your warning level: [CLASSIFIED]
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Shoals Surfer

Posts: 311

Joined: Wednesday, 15th August 2012, 07:13

Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 19:26

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

ebarrett wrote:You don't need "outrageous melee power" to walk up to the royal jelly and punch it in the face, it's just that you had extremely terrible defenses and 3 skill points in your current weapon, not to mention some wacky skill dilution. The game just did what it had to do and killed you off for doing so many things wrong - if you had survived the encounter unscathed, then I'd start worrying.


My last 2 attempts at Meleeing TRJ were high-weaponskill fighters, one of which had a Vampiric Triple Sword, the other with a Giant Spiked Club of Holy Wrath. Neither were able to kill the Royal Jelly before getting bogged down in the summons that TRJ retreated into, and if they didn't have good Melee capacity, I don't know what character would. On the other hand, I've had no problem killing TRJ with various spellslingers who knew Bolts of Foo(and their defense was even worse than this centaur's, I imagine), so I thought it fair to say that Melee is much, much harder to finish Slime with than with spells.

While you are absolutely correct in that my defenses were disgraceful, despite having only 3 Long Blades, I was at "Quite Fast" with that sword. I don't know how much Skill applies to Melee Damage, but the sword was actually an excellent means of slicing and dicing.
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Cocytus Succeeder

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Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 19:30

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

wizzzargh wrote:I don't know how much Skill applies to Melee Damage, but the sword was actually an excellent means of slicing and dicing.

Short answer: A LOT, and not just because you swing faster.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 19:42

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

If you want to see melee kills of trj, you can watch the majority of my kills of trj.

I don't agree that it's harder to melee slime than it is to clear it with spells, unless you're using fire/ice storm or tornado.
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Shoals Surfer

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Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 19:58

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

I really wasn't expecting that so many people actually kill TRJ in melee. Clearly, I am doing something terribly wrong... and not just with this character, but with all of my melee dudes!
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 21:31

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

I think it's certainly reasonable to kill TRJ with melee, but it's also probably easier to kill him with spells. I generally have completed both non-slime lair subbranches, vaults, and abyss before I do slime. At that point a DE caster has no trouble getting fire storm/ice storm online, and that'll kill TRJ in 3 turns.

  Code:
 89901 | Slime:6  | Noticed the royal jelly
 89904 | Slime:6  | Killed the royal jelly


from http://crawl.develz.org/morgues/0.10/Ta ... 101639.txt

If you're not as magically gifted as a deep elf you might take a bit longer, but it's still easier imho. Of course I've killed TRJ more often as melee because I play more melee, but those fights have a tendancy to go much longer if you need to retreat up the stairs, or even if you do kill TRJ in one pass then you have to clean up the floor afterwards as well. Make sure you have rCorr, obviously, and very high weapon skill. Your main problem was that you had 3.2 long blades skill and were using a great sword. Granted it was of speed, so the delay wasn't terrible compared to a non-speed great sword, but it should have been twice as good in either case. Raise your melee weapon skill even higher especially before doing TRJ because you can't use your main weapon, bows, against a jelly.

Cocytus Succeeder

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Post Friday, 15th February 2013, 22:16

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

After you're at min delay on some big 2h weapon, the other requirement to melee the TRJ fight is very good defences and probably a stack of potions. It's a given you'll be hasted and have drank Might + Agility for extra combat prowess. A few heal wounds may be necessary if your defences are merely 'almost good enough', but this MiPr of mine finished the battle with barely 100 HP lost total, after all the TRJ reinforcements were killed.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Saturday, 16th February 2013, 08:23

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

My SpEn killed TRJ after using vulnerability spell, then Confuse and two dagger strikes. Does it count as melee? :)

Mines Malingerer

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Post Sunday, 17th February 2013, 22:02

Re: YASD- From The Frying Pan into... the Frying Pan

I had a similar experience recently with a DsNe of Ash. Min delay +7/+7 double sword at min delay with lots of support magic. The only reason I could kill TRJ was because I had some minor conjurations support magic. Sticky flame and fireball to finish him off as he hovered back around his minions. I didn't have might, but really I had everything else going for that character. I almost died there after TRJ died to my sticky, outran the army with haste/swift. That is one serious encounter for melee.

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