Using Wands...


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Blades Runner

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Post Sunday, 6th January 2019, 17:06

Using Wands...

I just wanted to ask, since I find myself not using them that often. Maybe it's the DEFE playstyle (Which i play pretty exclusively) and maybe I'm just doing it wrong...

However, wands, I do not find that useful in general. Some are good for when you are stuck without any MP and something is about to die... Or for when you only have fire spells and you need some ice magic.

However, things like polymorph, enslavement and pretty much anything except Acid, Iceblast and digging I find almost useless.

I generally find that a lot of the hexing ones simply don't work against the kind of enemies you'd want to use them on, and the turn trying (And generally failing) to use it is invariably better to spend trying to kill everything than it is trying to enslave it or something.

Interested to hear what everyone elses mileage is...

Halls Hopper

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Joined: Sunday, 26th April 2015, 22:16

Post Sunday, 6th January 2019, 18:45

Re: Using Wands...

I use Para/Poly wands against Nessos, Sonja, Psyche and Maurice. It takes 2-3 tries usually, but once it works, they're done.

I use Enslave against Orc Warriors and other pack leaders.

I use that little flame wand in Shoals to make a bit of steam to block LoS.

I use scattershot against Agnes.

I use Clouds in Depths and Zot to abuse packs.

If I am playing a caster, I will always carry a couple nuke wands for Silent Specters.

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Sunday, 6th January 2019, 21:14

Re: Using Wands...

Wands are great and everyone should use them unless they sacrificed artifice for Ru.

In addition to what was already said: I tend to polymorph shock serpents. Wand of flame kills electric eels usually in one or two hits. At the same time it blocks LOS.
...GEFEMDBeDDFiHOWzVpVMHuEE{HEMoDEHuDDAs}{HaBeKoAK}CeVM{MfWnMiAK}TeAMDrIE{FoVMVSFi}
{MuVMGhGlVpMo}HaWrSpWz{OgGlTrMo}{CeWnMfBeMiSk}DrEE{GrFiFoGl}DgEnFeNe{OpGlHuSu}DDArHaCK
SpAEGrTmDgFEDsCjGhMoHuVM{HaAMBaEn}{HuMoHOWn}DsWzDDHu{DgWnGnBe}FeIE{MiEnMfCj}SpNeBaEE

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nago

Dis Charger

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Post Monday, 7th January 2019, 09:14

Re: Using Wands...

Sprucery wrote:Wands are great and everyone should use them unless they sacrificed artifice for Ru.


This.
Most probably a DEFE is one of the char that benefits less of wands because he can easily get online ranged attack spells and hex spells with good success rate, which are the two things wands "mimick", except digging.

However they're still a strong support early at 0/low Evo and later as backup/emergency support.

Also, elemental evokers are very strong and box and sacks are OP
screw it I hate this character I'm gonna go melee Gastronok

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 7th January 2019, 16:51

Re: Using Wands...

About the only wand I don't use as much as I should is polymorph, not because I don't think it's powerful enough, but because I would want to memorize what type of things I could polymorph stuff into (to know which things I might make more dangerous rather than less), and I don't have the patience for that kind of nonsense.

Since I don't use it very often, I tend to drop it earlyish in favor of some consumable I will use, so the later opportunities are typically lost to me as possibilities.

My favorite use of paralysis over enslavement is to stuff up a corridor when I want to flee from something nasty (like an early pack of bees)
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Dungeon Master

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Joined: Thursday, 23rd October 2014, 03:08

Post Monday, 7th January 2019, 20:49

Re: Using Wands...

enslavement is basically a wand that kills a low MR monster and gives you a ally. for example try enslaving a hasted and mighted deep troll

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Swamp Slogger

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Post Monday, 7th January 2019, 22:16

Re: Using Wands...

Siegurt wrote:About the only wand I don't use as much as I should is polymorph, not because I don't think it's powerful enough, but because I would want to memorize what type of things I could polymorph stuff into (to know which things I might make more dangerous rather than less), and I don't have the patience for that kind of nonsense.

Since I don't use it very often, I tend to drop it earlyish in favor of some consumable I will use, so the later opportunities are typically lost to me as possibilities.

My favorite use of paralysis over enslavement is to stuff up a corridor when I want to flee from something nasty (like an early pack of bees)

Agreed...so I decided to polymorph Sygmund to see what happens since that was the only wand I had.
I got a Sygmund the worm! YaY, I'll take that any day 8-)

Dis Charger

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Post Tuesday, 8th January 2019, 09:21

Re: Using Wands...

Next time try it on Grinder!

(seriously, don't)
screw it I hate this character I'm gonna go melee Gastronok
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Swamp Slogger

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Post Tuesday, 8th January 2019, 09:34

Re: Using Wands...

nago wrote:Next time try it on Grinder!

(seriously, don't)

from the 0.22 tournament Grinder was polymorphed 6 times and killed the character:

Grinder the apocalypse crab
Grinder the crimson imp
Grinder the demonic crawler
Grinder the doom hound
Grinder the ice devil
Grinder the ynoxinul

if your interested in other uniques, take a look at: http://dobrazupa.org/tournament/0.22/killers.html

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Barkeep

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Post Tuesday, 8th January 2019, 15:37

Re: Using Wands...

I like that someone got a crimson imp and it still killed 'em.
I am not a very good player. My mouth is a foul pit of LIES. KNOW THIS.

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Pandemonium Purger

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Post Tuesday, 8th January 2019, 20:30

Re: Using Wands...


  • Sigmund the naga
  • Sigmund the porcupine (shapershifter)
  • Sigmund the steam dragon
  • Sigmund the wolf
The naga is really interesting. You would think that would be quite the favorable polymorph... But the others are so bad. Sigmund the wolf is probably more deadly on D:2 than Sigmund the Sigmund.

  • Pikel the basilisk
  • Pikel the black mamba
  • Pikel the harpy
  • Pikel the harpy
  • Pikel the meliai
  • Pikel the raiju
  • Pikel the sky beast
  • Pikel the spriggan
  • Pikel the warg
OTOH, apparently polying Pikel is a TERRIBLE idea. The only survivable option here is a skybeast (or a raiju if you happen to have rElec.) Pikel even comes with a pack to make the basilisk deadly.

  • Crazy Yuif the porcupine
What's more deadly than a speed 10 unique behind a runed door? A speed 12 animal that's no longer behind a runed door...

Really, there are very few uniques on the death list that look at all safe to polymorph. I know we're looking at worst case results, but the worst case results are often so much worse than the unique.

There are a couple notable exceptions though...

  • Sonja the big kobold
I'd love to know the story behind this. Probably just a curare kill, since kobolds can use blowguns. But Sonja certainly looks like a good poly target if worst case is 'speed 10 humanoid'.

  • Joseph the ice beast
Unless you're a draconian, a straight upgrade.

And that's about it.
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Mines Malingerer

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Post Tuesday, 8th January 2019, 21:59

Re: Using Wands...

I'm betting some of these deaths involved the polymorph happening once the player was already low health. Sonja the big kobold won't make matters better if Sonja the Sonja lethally poisoned you and you don't have curing.

Pikel's table is pretty nasty.
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Temple Termagant

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Post Wednesday, 16th January 2019, 05:33

Re: Using Wands...

Flame seems weak but it is useful to hit enemies in water to create steam clouds that both block LOS and kill them quickly. Usually for electric eels.
Clouds is just big (resistable) damage in a large area (or confusion with the poison one). Once you train evo and get freezing, fire, draining clouds it is a thing of beauty
Scattershot completely blasts low AC monsters like Hydras and two headed ogres
Paralysis is easily one of the most useful wands in my personal experience. Shuts down Sonja and Nessos very hard.
Disintegration is actually harder to resist than other MR-check wands so it's often a nice source of damage.

The only wand that I think is actually garbage is random effects. If a good player can tell me a potential reason to keep them in the inventory I would be quite surprised.
4Gr(15), VS, DD, HO, 2Mi, 2DS, Hu, Gn, Ba, Tr, Ha
9Fi(15), 2CK, Gl, EE, Wn, Mo, Hu
3Ash, 2Ru(15), Goz, Mak, Hep, Nem, 2Xom, Qaz, 3Oka, TSO
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 16th January 2019, 08:34

Re: Using Wands...

lansh wrote:The only wand that I think is actually garbage is random effects. If a good player can tell me a potential reason to keep them in the inventory I would be quite surprised.

Wand of random effects is usable in situations where you don't mind hasting the enemy and/or turning it invisible. So for example, if you are standing on upstairs and the enemy is far away, you can zap it and if it gets hasted, retreat upstairs and use some other downstairs. If you happen to have Yara's Violent Unravelling (a rare case though I guess), it's a big bonus.
...GEFEMDBeDDFiHOWzVpVMHuEE{HEMoDEHuDDAs}{HaBeKoAK}CeVM{MfWnMiAK}TeAMDrIE{FoVMVSFi}
{MuVMGhGlVpMo}HaWrSpWz{OgGlTrMo}{CeWnMfBeMiSk}DrEE{GrFiFoGl}DgEnFeNe{OpGlHuSu}DDArHaCK
SpAEGrTmDgFEDsCjGhMoHuVM{HaAMBaEn}{HuMoHOWn}DsWzDDHu{DgWnGnBe}FeIE{MiEnMfCj}SpNeBaEE

Dis Charger

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Post Wednesday, 16th January 2019, 08:35

Re: Using Wands...

Random effects is good early on if you use it while on the stairs, so you can freely nullify its bad results.

Later there are far better and not annoying to use consumables so it's 100% legit to drop it, but potentially it could be kept and used until there's space in the inventory.
screw it I hate this character I'm gonna go melee Gastronok

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Thursday, 17th January 2019, 01:25

Re: Using Wands...

wand of random effects is also good all game for destroying trees

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