YASD - MiFi^Makh [title edited]


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Mines Malingerer

Posts: 54

Joined: Wednesday, 9th October 2013, 14:47

Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 14:55

YASD - MiFi^Makh [title edited]

So I'm working through my first rune branch (Swamp). I'm XL 16 and have Axes skill 16.

Mara just dropped a +2 demon blade of electrocution.

I've heard endlessly on these forums about how wonderful demon blades are. Is it worth the XP loss to train up Long Blades and switch at this point in the game? I'm currently wielding a +6 randart war axe with flame brand and a few minor qualities.

edit: forgot to mention i'm also hanging onto a +2 broad axe of freezing in hopes of replacing the intrinsics on the randart waraxe.
Last edited by starhawk on Monday, 16th March 2015, 15:26, edited 2 times in total.
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Zot Zealot

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Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 15:27

Although a +2 demon blade (elec) is a good weapon I personally wouldn't switch at this (late) point of the game.

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starhawk

Barkeep

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Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 15:29

Re: CiP - MiFi^Makh, weapon choice?

You can't alter the intrinsics on a randart (unless something new was added recently), and a war axe is not a great base type for your stage of the game, anyway.

A +2 broad axe of freezing is good (dump enchant weapon scrolls on this, and don't re-brand it via scrolls). I mean, it was good enough to take down Mara in the first place, right? And getting 14 levels in long blades and forgoing your 16 skill levels of axes is significant, even with Minotaur apts. I'd stick with the axe.

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Arrhythmia, Sar, starhawk

Mines Malingerer

Posts: 54

Joined: Wednesday, 9th October 2013, 14:47

Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 17:23

Re: CiP - MiFi^Makh, weapon choice?

Thanks to both of you. I was leaning toward sticking with Axes and it's nice to hear confirmation from folks who are better players than I.

By 'replacing the instrinsics' I meant finding similar qualities on other pieces of gear, thus making me more comfortable in swapping it out. The +Inv +SInv in particular has been super. So far the game has been remarkably stingy on resistance gear and other such intrinsics.

I've made it a bit farther and I think I'll go ahead and swap for the broad axe of freezing, as I have enough scrolls to enchant it to +6. I'll keep the randart around for a swap when I'm worried about invisible enemies (or for hydrae).

  Code:
Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.16-a0-4089-gc94e39e (console) character file.

Stumpfutter the Spry (Minotaur Fighter)            Turns: 36116, Time: 02:48:27

Health: 172/172    AC: 30    Str: 28    XL:     19   Next: 3%
Magic:  28/28      EV: 19    Int:  7    God:    Makhleb [******]
Gold:   2396       SH: 13    Dex: 19    Spells: 2 memorised, 14 levels left

rFire  . . .     SeeInvis +     h - +6 war axe {flame, +Blink +Inv rF- Str+3 SInv}
rCold  . . .     Clarity  .     u - +3 storm dragon armour
rNeg   . . .     SustAb   .     x - +2 shield
rPois  +         Gourm    .     G - +2 hat
rElec  +         Spirit   +     q - +2 cloak {rPois}
rCorr  .         Warding  .     l - +1 pair of gloves
rMut   .         Stasis   .     F - +0 pair of boots (curse)
MR     +....                    Y - amulet of the Median {Spirit rElec Str+4}
Stlth  +.........               I - ring of protection from cold
                                L - ring of Threnn {Fire Dex+3}

@: drained, somewhat resistant to hostile enchantments, very unstealthy
A: retaliatory headbutt, horns 2, talons 1, low mp 1, spit poison 1
a: Spit Poison, Minor Destruction, Lesser Servant of Makhleb, Major Destruction,
Greater Servant of Makhleb, Renounce Religion, Evoke Blink, Evoke Invisibility
}: 2/15 runes: decaying, serpentine


You are on level 2 of the Elven Halls.
You worship Makhleb.
Makhleb is exalted by your worship.
You are not hungry.

You have visited 8 branches of the dungeon, and seen 41 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 1 time.
You have also visited: Labyrinth, Bailey and Ice Cave.

You have collected 5074 gold pieces.
You have spent 2678 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 h - the +6 war axe of Cocytus (weapon) {flame, +Blink +Inv rF- Str+3 SInv}
   (You found it on level 10 of the Dungeon)   
   
   It has been specially enchanted to burn those struck by it, causing extra
   injury to most foes and up to half again as much damage against particularly
   susceptible opponents. Big, fiery blades are also staple armaments of
   hydra-hunters.
   
   It affects your strength (+3).
   It makes you vulnerable to fire.
   It enhances your eyesight.
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It lets you blink.
Missiles
 Q - 30 tomahawks of returning
 U - 7 throwing nets (quivered)
Armour
 l - a +1 pair of gloves (worn)
 q - a +2 cloak of poison resistance (worn)
 u - a +3 storm dragon armour (worn)
 x - a +2 shield (worn)
 F - a cursed +0 pair of boots (worn)
 G - a +2 hat (worn)
Jewellery
 m - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
 I - a ring of protection from cold (right hand)
 L - the ring of Threnn (left hand) {Fire Dex+3}
   (You found it in a labyrinth)   
   
   [ring of fire]
   
   It enhances your fire magic, and weakens your ice magic.
   It affects your dexterity (+3).
   It protects you from fire.
   It makes you vulnerable to cold.
 V - the amulet of Plec {Clar MR+ MP+9}
   (You found it in an ice cave)   
   
   [amulet of clarity]
   
   It provides mental clarity.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
 Y - the amulet of the Median (around neck) {Spirit rElec Str+4}
   (You found it on level 7 of the Lair of Beasts)   
   
   [amulet of guardian spirit]
   
   It causes incoming damage to be split between your health and magic.
   It affects your strength (+4).
   It insulates you from electricity.
Magical devices
 a - a wand of digging (13)
 e - a wand of polymorph {zapped: 5}
 g - a wand of confusion {zapped: 3}
 o - a wand of hasting (3)
 r - a wand of enslavement (9)
 B - a wand of disintegration {zapped: 3}
 D - a wand of draining
 E - a wand of fireball
 H - a wand of digging (8)
 M - a wand of cold
 R - a wand of digging
 S - a wand of fire
 Z - a wand of paralysis
Scrolls
 b - 12 scrolls of remove curse
 c - 5 scrolls of fear
 f - 2 scrolls of magic mapping
 i - 17 scrolls of teleportation
 j - 17 scrolls of identify
 n - 7 scrolls of recharging
 y - 2 scrolls of blinking
 K - 4 scrolls of fog
Potions
 d - 5 potions of restore abilities
 p - 10 potions of heal wounds
 t - 7 potions of agility
 v - 4 potions of flight
 w - 13 potions of curing
 z - 2 potions of resistance
 C - 2 potions of ambrosia
 J - 3 potions of might
 T - a potion of haste
Miscellaneous
 N - an ornate deck of summoning {drawn: 3}
 W - a plain deck of cards
 X - a sack of spiders {used: 1}
Comestibles
 k - a meat ration
 s - 17 bread rations
 A - 14 royal jellies


   Skills:
 - Level 16.1 Fighting
 - Level 16.0(15.9) Axes
 + Level 2.4 Throwing
 + Level 15.4 Armour
 + Level 16.2(16.1) Dodging
 - Level 10.8 Stealth
 - Level 4.9 Shields
 - Level 10.8 Invocations
 + Level 14.8(14.7) Evocations


You have 14 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Flight                Chrm/Air       #.........   100%        3    ####...
b - Apportation           Tloc           #.........   100%        1    ##.....


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:5            Lair (8/8) D:10
  Swamp (5/5) Lair:6        Snake (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:6
    Orc (4/4) D:12            Elf (2/3) Orc:4        Vaults (0/5) D:13
 Depths (1/5) D:15       

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Gozag
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Ru
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh
Jiyva

Shops:
D:14 [   Orc:1 =   Orc:4 [%[:[:?*   Snake:2 }   Snake:3 }

Portals:
Pandemonium: Orc:4

Annotations:
D:8 Psyche


Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations

You reflexively headbutt those who attack you in melee.
You have a pair of horns on your head.
You have sharp toenails.
Your magical capacity is low (-10% MP).
You can spit poison.



EDIT: I did the first 2 levels of Elf fishing for better gear and found a +1 battleaxe of freezing... and a vampiric triple sword. Oh, decisions decisions. Would really like this guy to be my second winner.

Barkeep

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Location: USA

Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 18:02

Re: CiP - MiFi^Makh, weapon choice?

Vamp triple sword is crazy, but it would take a lot of investment, and now you are even later in the game. Best to stick with axes still, I think.

It is really up to you regarding the whole broad axe vs. battleaxe. But if the broad axe is already +6, I would be inclined to simply stick with that, and raise shields skill (thus committing more strongly to 1-handed weapon + shield). Once shield skill is high enough (15, or close to it) you can get spells. (Or if you go with battleaxe and drop the shield, but in that case you'd want more axe skill.)

With your int, I wouldn't put much hope in spells that rely a lot on spell power, but many charms spells, summon butterflies, blink, possibly conjure flame if you like that spell, etc. are worthwhile.

Broad axe is a good weapon, the only issue with it is that it is pretty rare, but that isn't a problem since you already have an endgame-quality one.

I wouldn't be sinking more exp into evocations at this stage, though (the amount you have is good for now IMO). Some investment in throwing makes sense but I wouldn't go too crazy there; once you feel that your nets are hitting things reliably enough, I would switch to a different priority.

That's all pretty minor, though. Overall, your dude looks solid. Biggest weakness: Low MR. Be careful about that!

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starhawk

Mines Malingerer

Posts: 54

Joined: Wednesday, 9th October 2013, 14:47

Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 19:13

Re: CiP - MiFi^Makh, weapon choice?

I agree that as cool as the triple sword is, it's a lost cause XP-wise.

I haven't actually used the enchant weapon scrolls yet - so my choice is between a +6 broad axe of freezing OR a +5 battleaxe of freezing. I love the extra defense from shields, although I hear elsewhere on the forum that it's not 'optimal' play. So I think I will jack Shields skill and commit to the broad axe.

Crossing my fingers!

Barkeep

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Location: USA

Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 19:29

Re: CiP - MiFi^Makh, weapon choice?

The battleaxe is better overall, perhaps, but (at least for me) the problem with shields is mostly that going 1-handed delays one's discovery of, and investment in, a good weapon. Sticking with a war axe when a battleaxe is available is bad, obviously, and it is pretty common for axe-users to get stuck in that situation when they want to use shields.

But if the choice is between battleaxe or shield + broad axe, I would say the difference in power between the two set ups is not big enough in either direction that one should push back against personal preferences. So go with your heart. (I mean, I'd be pushing hard for the battleaxe if it were speed or vampiric or whatever, of course, but that's not the case here.)

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starhawk
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Zot Zealot

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Location: Augsburg, Germany

Post Wednesday, 11th March 2015, 20:05

starhawk wrote:Oh, decisions decisions.

Welcome to crawl.

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Sprucery

Mines Malingerer

Posts: 54

Joined: Wednesday, 9th October 2013, 14:47

Post Monday, 16th March 2015, 14:08

Re: CiP - MiFi^Makh, extended or no? [title edited]

I really appreciate the useful feedback from everyone so far. I've cleared Zot 1-4 and I'm wondering if I should go for my 2nd winner or not. It's very tempting to try and see some of the game's extended content, but I'm not sure this character is powerful enough to even monkey with it. Seems like this guy's resists/defenses/attacks are all REALLY being put to the test in Zot, and I got the impression extended was Even Harder.

(I've been switching between the +6 randart and the +9 axe of freezing based on whether I need SInv)

  Code:
Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.16-a0-4089-gc94e39e (console) character file.

Stumpfutter the Impregnable (Minotaur Fighter)     Turns: 58511, Time: 05:17:12

Health: 239/239    AC: 38    Str: 21    XL:     26   Next: 26%
Magic:  33/33      EV: 22    Int:  9    God:    Makhleb [******]
Gold:   6920       SH: 18    Dex: 18    Spells: 5 memorised, 15 levels left

rFire  + . .     SeeInvis .     P - +9 broad axe (freeze)
rCold  + . .     Rnd*Rage +     u - +5 storm dragon armour
rNeg   . . .     SustAb   .     f - +3 shield {AC+3}
rPois  .         Gourm    .     m - +2 hat
rElec  +         Spirit   .     A - +2 cloak
rCorr  .         Warding  .     l - +1 pair of gloves
rMut   .         Stasis   .     q - +0 pair of boots
MR     +....                    D - amulet of regeneration
Stlth  +.........               I - ring of protection from cold
                                C - ring of protection from fire

@: somewhat resistant to hostile enchantments, very unstealthy
A: retaliatory headbutt, horns 2, berserk 1, low mp 1
a: Minor Destruction, Lesser Servant of Makhleb, Major Destruction, Greater
Servant of Makhleb, Renounce Religion
}: 3/15 runes: decaying, serpentine, silver


You are on level 5 of the Realm of Zot.
You worship Makhleb.
Makhleb is exalted by your worship.
You are not hungry.

You have visited 10 branches of the dungeon, and seen 55 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 2 times.
You have visited 1 bazaar.
You have also visited: Labyrinth, Bailey and Ice Cave.

You have collected 10165 gold pieces.
You have spent 3245 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 h - the +6 war axe of Cocytus {flame, +Blink +Inv rF- Str+3 SInv}
   (You found it on level 10 of the Dungeon)   
   
   It has been specially enchanted to burn those struck by it, causing extra
   injury to most foes and up to half again as much damage against particularly
   susceptible opponents. Big, fiery blades are also staple armaments of
   hydra-hunters.
   
   It affects your strength (+3).
   It makes you vulnerable to fire.
   It enhances your eyesight.
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It lets you blink.
 P - a +9 broad axe of freezing (weapon)
Missiles
 U - 5 throwing nets (quivered)
 Y - 30 tomahawks of returning
Armour
 f - a +3 shield of protection (worn)
 l - a +1 pair of gloves (worn)
 m - a +2 hat (worn)
 q - a +0 pair of boots (worn)
 u - a +5 storm dragon armour (worn)
 A - a +2 cloak (worn)
Jewellery
 C - a ring of protection from fire (left hand)
 D - an amulet of regeneration (around neck)
 I - a ring of protection from cold (right hand)
 Q - an uncursed amulet of resist mutation
 V - the amulet of Plec {Clar MR+ MP+9}
   (You found it in an ice cave)   
   
   [amulet of clarity]
   
   It provides mental clarity.
   It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments.
   It affects your magic capacity (+9).
Magical devices
 a - a wand of digging (12)
 o - a wand of hasting (3)
 r - a wand of enslavement (7)
 B - a wand of disintegration {zapped: 5}
 E - a wand of fireball
 G - a wand of teleportation (3)
 L - a wand of cold
 M - a wand of teleportation (5)
 R - a wand of teleportation (5)
 S - a wand of fire {zapped: 3}
 Z - a wand of paralysis
Scrolls
 b - 19 scrolls of remove curse
 c - 5 scrolls of fear
 i - 14 scrolls of teleportation
 j - 15 scrolls of identify
 n - 13 scrolls of recharging
 x - 3 scrolls of magic mapping
 y - 4 scrolls of blinking
 F - a scroll of summoning
 K - 6 scrolls of fog
Potions
 d - 10 potions of restore abilities
 g - 3 potions of haste
 k - a potion of cure mutation
 p - 11 potions of heal wounds
 t - 11 potions of agility
 v - 4 potions of flight
 w - 19 potions of curing
 z - 2 potions of resistance
 J - 6 potions of might
 O - 4 potions of invisibility
Miscellaneous
 e - a disc of storms
 N - an ornate deck of summoning {drawn: 6}
 T - an ornate deck of cards
 W - a phantom mirror
Comestibles
 s - 26 bread rations


   Skills:
 - Level 20.0 Fighting
 + Level 19.8 Axes
 - Level 4.6 Throwing
 + Level 21.4 Armour
 + Level 21.3 Dodging
 - Level 10.8 Stealth
 - Level 16.0 Shields
 - Level 0.9 Charms
 - Level 12.9 Translocations
 - Level 0.8 Air Magic
 - Level 17.0 Invocations
 - Level 15.2 Evocations


You have 15 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Flight                Chrm/Air       #.........   100%        3    ####...
b - Apportation           Tloc           ###.......   1%          1    ##.....
c - Blink                 Tloc           N/A          1%          2    ###....
d - Slow                  Hex            #.......     99%         2    ###....
e - Repel Missiles        Chrm/Air       #.....       99%         2    ###....


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (15/15)            Temple (1/1) D:5            Lair (8/8) D:10
  Swamp (5/5) Lair:6        Snake (5/5) Lair:4        Slime (0/6) Lair:6
    Orc (4/4) D:12            Elf (2/3) Orc:4        Vaults (5/5) D:13
  Crypt (0/3) Vaults:3     Depths (5/5) D:15            Zot (5/5) Depths:5

Mines Malingerer

Posts: 54

Joined: Wednesday, 9th October 2013, 14:47

Post Monday, 16th March 2015, 15:26

Re: YASD - MiFi^Makh [title edited]

YASD. Orbs of fire are very, very serious business and one dot of rF is not enough. Lesson learned.
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Tomb Titivator

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Joined: Tuesday, 28th January 2014, 16:08

Post Monday, 16th March 2015, 15:36

Re: YASD - MiFi^Makh [title edited]

Yeah, they are tough customers.

The Anti-Magic brand does wonders against them though. I've found that if Im running a melee-centric dude it's become a habit of mine to carry an anti-magic weapon with me wherever I go, but especially in Zot.
If you are offended by something I've posted, just PM me. It probably wasn't intentional.
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Zot Zealot

Posts: 975

Joined: Monday, 15th April 2013, 15:10

Location: Augsburg, Germany

Post Monday, 16th March 2015, 16:25

starhawk wrote:Orbs of fire are very, very serious business

They are dangerous, yes.

starhawk wrote:one dot of rF is not enough.

Well, I often did Zot:5 with rF+. If this is enough depends on circumstances: are you able to support your attacks with (e.g.) a phial of floods, do you have some help (like summons), how strong is your weapon, how many HP do you have, are other ememies around etc.

That being said, if you can get rF++ easily - like switching on a ring - this can be useful. If you don't feel strong enough with rF+ quaff a potion of resistance to get rF++.

Better luck next time!

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