Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

Although the central place for this kind of discussion is on the CDO wiki, some may find it helpful to discuss potential requests and suggestions here first.

Vaults Vanquisher

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Joined: Saturday, 5th November 2011, 01:17

Post Saturday, 12th November 2011, 03:24

Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

So out of curiosity I tried playing a healer as a pure healer: only using pacifying, never attacking. I chose spriggan as they last the longest without chunks and can run away from unpacifiables. After several attempts at running like mad and pacifing only very low hp monsters and any animals, I eventually starved to death in lair.

So I thought, how could elyvilon actually be made into a purely pacifist god?

Apreciates: same

Deprecates: same, with "hurting living foes" (PENANCE)


Destroy weapons-same
Protection from harm-same
Lesser self-healing-same

(ADDED)Pass through neutral at * (piety cost 1,2,3?). Simply pass through netural monsters while in effect.

Lesser healing- food cost eliminated, MP increased from 1 to 2. Each use of lesser healing additionally causes a temporary increase of "Healing damage" of 1 point which lasts 20 turns. These stack. When determining whether a monster is pacified, healing factor is compared not with MaxHP, but with MaxHP-HealingDamage.

(ADDED)Self-Healing (replaces greater healing) ***-TBA numbers in between lesser healing and greater healing
(ADDED)Healing (replaces greater healing) ***-TBA numbers in between lesser healing and greater healing. "healing damage" increased to 1d3. NO piety, NO food, MP 3

Greater self healing- Moved to ****- same
Greater healing moved to ****- (piety, same MP) Same, only reduced flat healing and added healing damage of 1d(Invocations). For Undead and demons, no healing damage is done and no healing check is performed, instead 2d(invocations) real damage is done. Since piety is used and it must be repeatedly casted many times, this really is only done as an emergency.

(ADDED)Fear no evil (Passive)*****- When X Monsters greater than 5 HD are on the screen, movement speed is lowered by 3

JOINING REQUIREMENT: <X monsters slain (600?). Elyvilon does not appreciate murderers.

The 50% exp gain from pacification is kept, possibly reduced somewhat. Thus, elyvilon users have to be very careful about where their exp is spent.
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Vestibule Violator

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Post Saturday, 12th November 2011, 09:30

Re: Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

She appreciates healing, but she is not that blind: some monsters cannot be pacified, and she'd rather not punish for the destruction of an ancient dangerous being than punish him who desperately tries to save his life to save many others later on.

So should you. If you want peace, prepare for war: remember that most creatures in the Dungeons of Zot do not want to be peaceful: basically, you have to enforce the will of peace into their minds.
And remember that even the most peaceful worshippers, the Tibetian monks, do not negate the importance of martial arts: not only they discipline you, but they help you to protect yourself when in danger.
What would you do if an eye of draining or a ghost moth sucked away all your mana and left you defenseless?

If you want to play as a pure pacifist, choose a Deep Dwarf or a Minotaur.
If you find any mistakes or typos in my post, feel free to PM me about it. Thanks in advance!

The Verse flows throughout Aquaria...
Through each ripple and wave...
Through every living being...
The Verse binds us all as one.

Vaults Vanquisher

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Joined: Saturday, 5th November 2011, 01:17

Post Saturday, 12th November 2011, 09:44

Re: Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

MyOtheHedgeFox wrote:What would you do if an eye of draining or a ghost moth sucked away all your mana and left you defenseless?

Wand of teleport, scroll of blink/teleport/fear/fog, potion of speed/mana/berserk(if near stairs), hopefully casted swiftness/haste because that's the first thing you do around them ;) , or controlled blink first since you should have that by ghost moth/slime pit stage.

Keep in mind thoat isn't a pure pacifist, ~500 kills is hardly pacifism.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Joined: Tuesday, 28th June 2011, 20:41

Location: Berlin

Post Saturday, 12th November 2011, 12:07

Re: Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

Having to teleport or run away whenever a monster can't be pacified sounds really unfun and tedious. Inserting a low-kills-reuquirement is a horrible idea, for one thing TSO will accept people with Necromancy skill, etc. Also, you couldn't switch to Elyvilon after a certain amount of time.
Before ghost moth/slime pit stage you will encounter vampire mosquitoes, worms, slime creatures, jellies and other annoying mindless monsters. Teleporting away also isn't a long-term solution if you want to clear the level for experience, since you'll encounter the danger again.

Current Elyvilon requires a certain amount of pacification but isn't as limited to a playstyle that is either a one-button-"kill" or utterly useless against some monsters, which is what your proposal basically does.

Dungeon Master

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Joined: Thursday, 23rd December 2010, 12:43

Post Saturday, 12th November 2011, 14:16

Re: Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

Elyvilon allows pacification but trying to play a "pure pacifist" is a deliberate conduct. We have no intention of forcing it upon players. In particular, we are not concerned with how huard such a challenge would be. It turns out, as usual, that some players actually manage to pull it off.

There is a huge difference between "pacify for piety gain" and "forced to pacfiy everything". We won't cross that line.

For this message the author dpeg has received thanks:

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Saturday, 12th November 2011, 15:54

Re: Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

Have you ever tried a pacifist-conduct game in Nethack, or one of the other games that supports it? I find it mind-numbingly boring. In Crawl, this problem would be even worse, because Crawl has fewer reliable ways of disabling an attacker without killing it. Paralysis in Nethack works just fine even against endgame threats like the Wizard of Yendor, and teleportation works instantly against whole crowds at once, but paralysis and teleportation in Crawl have to get through nigh-unassailable MR when you're dealing with anything threatening. Ultimately, a true-pacifist Elyvilonite absolutely must spam the same single ability at every threat, and never diverge from that one single ability ever. I don't think there is any way to make this process enjoyable.

Spider Stomper

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Post Saturday, 12th November 2011, 16:00

Re: Elyvilon as a more pacifist god

I think the recent changes to Elyvilon are very good (faster piety clock) but IMO the food cost of lesser healing should be lowered a bit. The reason many players don't choose this god more often is that the food clock can be very annoying.

For this message the author CommanderC has received thanks:

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