How to get somewhere with a KOAS

[necrosonic]

I've got one 4 rune win with a melee guy and now I'm giving a sneaky guy a go. I can't seem to really get anywhere though. I can make it to Lair and have even picked up a rune before, but I always get overwhelmed by swarms who notice me before I can stab. I feel so weak with this sort of character I have usually burned up a lot of my "escape" potions and scrolls by the mid game.

I've been using Makhleb as my main God, bad idea? I've also tried using Dith a few times but that feels even worse to me somehow. Also should I be using a dagger or a short blade? And should I be investing at all in magic?

Not posting a morgue as I'd just like some general advice, thanks.

[removeelyvilon]

My advice to you is to start as an enchanter instead of assassin. That way you have easy access to hexes magic such as ensorcelled hibernaiton and confuse which allow for opportunities to stab.

Dithemenos is ironically not great for most stabbing builds because while it increases your chances of sneaking up to something with umbra and shadow step, it doesn't offer much in the way of alternate options to overcome enemies that wake up before you can eviscerate them (which is always a possibility even at incredible levels of stealth) or are resistant to your hexes. Makhleb is actually good in that regard: you can summon demons/use greater destruction to handle stuff you otherwise couldn't (but be careful with demons, they can arrive hostile).

[Magipi]

If you really want to stab most enemies, start as an enchanter. An assassin is really a gladiator who has a blowgun. Stabbing is a rare bonus.

should I be using a dagger or a short blade?

For stabbing, use a dagger. For figting, use something that does not suck (= not a short blade, unless it is elec or pain or disto).

And should I be investing at all in magic?

If you did not pick Trog, then yes.

[ajon]

I did a KoBe as a stabber. If you wake things, berserk, BIA, or trogs hand and run all work well.

Also, don't try to stab packs. Wake the things at the edge and lure them. Its tempting to get the easy kills, but it usually just ends with you being noticed by everything when you're two steps away.

[TonberryJam]

Also, use needles on the hard hitters. AS is a build that seems to need some good god support for melee.

[tabstorm]

If you insist on doing stealth stabbing, you are best using Trog and training throwing to get needles. Stealth stabbing is easily the worst character archetype in DCSS, in general, so you might want to try to win an easier character first.

[necrosonic]

Thank you for the responses. I have tried some Enchanter starts and I am still kind of stuck at Lair. I might make a post soon in YASD and post morgues for this. The idea of playing the Assassin Stabber as more of a gladiator character hadn't occurred to me, I had some luck with that but couldn't get a rune. I was trying to use a decent long sword and minor Mak summons for when folks woke up and stab with dagger/disable all the rest.

Tomorrow I'll try the Trog route some have suggested.

My goals are to win one melee dude, one sneaky dude and one magic dude. And maybe after that try one 15 rune. I've got the melee 4 rune win but this is proving to be tougher so thanks again for the advice.