Shoals Surfer
Posts: 299
Joined: Wednesday, 15th May 2013, 18:04
novelty characters
The GSC army was quite robust, but even with haste they were too slow to be very helpful.
Any other fun/good/bad/new/old novelty character ideas?
If it doesn't fit anywhere else, it belongs here. Also, come here if you just need to get hammered.
Shoals Surfer
Posts: 299
Joined: Wednesday, 15th May 2013, 18:04
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 5382
Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36
Shoals Surfer
Posts: 299
Joined: Wednesday, 15th May 2013, 18:04
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 11111
Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00
Halls Hopper
Posts: 58
Joined: Thursday, 27th February 2014, 03:07
Cocytus Succeeder
Posts: 2184
Joined: Tuesday, 3rd February 2015, 22:05
Halls Hopper
Posts: 58
Joined: Thursday, 27th February 2014, 03:07
bel wrote:Sustain abilities ring does nothing on a demigod now.
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 5382
Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36
linear wrote:Tasonir - There was a post recently characterising Haunt as something you use to tie up enemies while you kill them with something else. The Haunt summon list is so weak.
Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.17-a0-1435-geafbe2f (webtiles) character file.
tasonir the Caller (Mummy Summoner) Turns: 12954, Time: 00:44:33
Health: 80/80 AC: 7 Str: 12 XL: 11 Next: 9%
Magic: 19/19 EV: 14 Int: 17 God: Sif Muna [****..]
Gold: 585 SH: 0 Dex: 13 Spells: 6 memorised, 7 levels left
rFire . . . SeeInvis . a - +1 dagger (venom)
rCold + . . Clarity . x - +1 robe {MR+}
rNeg + + + SustAt . (no shield)
rPois ∞ Gourm . k - +2 helmet
rElec . Spirit . G - +0 cloak
rCorr . Warding . (no gloves)
rMut . Stasis . (no boots)
MR ++... u - amulet of regeneration
Stlth ++........ M - +5 ring of slaying
j - ring of protection from fire
@: very resistant to hostile enchantments, unstealthy
A: no food or potions, fire vulnerability, cold resistance 1, negative energy
resistance 3, torment resistance, unbreathing
a: Channel Energy, Forget Spell, Renounce Religion
You are on level 10 of the Dungeon.
You worship Sif Muna.
Sif Muna is greatly pleased with you.
You are not hungry.
You have visited 2 branches of the dungeon, and seen 11 of its levels.
You have collected 585 gold pieces.
Inventory:
Hand weapons
a - a +1 dagger of venom (weapon)
(You found it on level 6 of the Dungeon)
b - a +3 flail
(You took it off Blork the orc on level 6 of the Dungeon)
c - a +0 whip
(You took it off a kobold on level 1 of the Dungeon)
p - a +0 blowgun
(You took it off a kobold on level 3 of the Dungeon)
Missiles
n - 4 tomahawks of dispersal
q - 62 poisoned needles
v - 3 throwing nets (quivered)
Armour
k - a +2 helmet (worn)
(You found it on level 2 of the Dungeon)
x - a +1 robe of magic resistance (worn)
(You took it off Pikel on level 6 of the Dungeon)
E - a shield
(You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon)
G - a +0 cloak (worn)
(You took it off Crazy Yiuf on level 7 of the Dungeon)
Jewellery
j - a ring of protection from fire (left hand)
(You found it on level 2 of the Dungeon)
u - an amulet of regeneration (around neck)
(You took it off an orc on level 4 of the Dungeon)
C - an uncursed ring of stealth
(You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon)
M - a +5 ring of slaying (right hand)
(You took it off an orc on level 8 of the Dungeon)
N - an uncursed ring of sustain attributes
(You found it on level 9 of the Dungeon)
Magical devices
t - a wand of draining
(You found it on level 8 of the Dungeon)
D - a wand of polymorph
(You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon)
H - a wand of fire
(You found it on level 8 of the Dungeon)
L - a wand of disintegration
(You found it on level 9 of the Dungeon)
Scrolls
d - a scroll labeled KUZ LETOUZO
e - 5 scrolls of remove curse
f - 2 scrolls labeled IHUSKY QUL PYF
g - 2 scrolls of amnesia
h - 3 scrolls of teleportation
l - 4 scrolls of magic mapping
m - 2 scrolls labeled XIR WEERISOER
o - 4 scrolls of enchant weapon
r - 2 scrolls of immolation
s - 4 scrolls of fear
A - a scroll labeled YTATZY SAMU
B - a scroll labeled RAIDDU SEFFUBI
I - 4 scrolls of identify
J - a scroll labeled ARUOVO ASIMOF
Books
i - a book of Clouds
(You found it on level 4 of the Dungeon)
w - a book of Beasts
(You found it on level 5 of the Dungeon)
y - a book of Callings
F - a book of Enchantments
(You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon)
K - a book of Power
(You found it on level 8 of the Dungeon)
Miscellaneous
z - a box of beasts
(You found it on level 8 of the Dungeon)
Skills:
- Level 5.3 Fighting
- Level 6.4 Short Blades
+ Level 4.2 Dodging
- Level 1.5 Stealth
+ Level 5.8 Spellcasting
- Level 3.7 Conjurations
+ Level 7.1 Summonings
- Level 4.0 Ice Magic
- Level 3.9 Air Magic
- Level 3.6 Poison Magic
You have 7 spell levels left.
You know the following spells:
Your Spells Type Power Failure Level Hunger
a - Summon Small Mammal Summ #### 1% 1 N/A
b - Call Imp Summ ####.... 1% 2 N/A
c - Call Canine Familiar Summ ####.... 1% 3 N/A
d - Summon Ice Beast Ice/Summ ###..... 14% 4 N/A
e - Summon Butterflies Summ ####.... 1% 1 N/A
f - Mephitic Cloud Conj/Pois/Air ###..... 10% 3 N/A
Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations
Branches:
Dungeon (10/15) Temple (1/1) D:7
Lair: D:8-11 Orc: D:9-12
Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Gozag
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Ru
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations
You do not eat or drink.
Your flesh is vulnerable to fire.
You are immune to poison.
Your flesh is cold resistant.
You are immune to negative energy.
You are immune to unholy pain and torment.
You can survive without breathing.
Message History
There is a stone staircase leading down here.
There is an open door here.
There is an open door here.
You see here a yak skeleton.
Things that are here:
an uncursed dagger; an uncursed blowgun
N - an onyx ring
Health restored: 80
There is an open door here.
You open the door.
There is an open door here.
You see here a sapphire potion.
There is an open door here.
There is an open door here.
You open the door.
There is an open door here.
You open the door.
A kobold comes into view. It is wielding a dagger.
Found a scroll of identify. Found an escape hatch in the floor.
Put on which piece of jewellery? (? for menu, Esc to quit)
You're wearing all the rings you can. Remove which one?
(? for menu, Esc to cancel)
< or j - a ring of protection from fire; > or M - a +5 ring of slaying
You remove your +5 ring of slaying.
N - a ring of sustain attributes (right hand)
The kobold shouts!
Put on which piece of jewellery? (? for menu, Esc to quit)
You're wearing all the rings you can. Remove which one?
(? for menu, Esc to cancel)
< or j - a ring of protection from fire; > or N - a ring of sustain attributes
You remove your ring of sustain attributes.
M - a +5 ring of slaying (right hand)
The kobold barely misses you.
A worker ant zombie comes into view.
You hit the kobold. The kobold is poisoned.
You barely miss the kobold.
You kill the kobold!
You barely miss the worker ant zombie. The worker ant zombie bites you.
You take 1 damage, and have 79/80 hp.
You hit the worker ant zombie.
You barely miss the worker ant zombie. The worker ant zombie misses you.
You hit the worker ant zombie.
The worker ant zombie bites you but does no damage.
Health restored: 80
You hit the worker ant zombie.
You hit the worker ant zombie.
The worker ant zombie closely misses you.
You hit the worker ant zombie.
The worker ant zombie bites you but does no damage.
You hit the worker ant zombie.
You hit the worker ant zombie. The worker ant zombie bites you.
You take 2 damage, and have 78/80 hp.
You hit the worker ant zombie.
You destroy the worker ant zombie!
No target in view!
No target in view!
No target in view!
No target in view!
There is an open door here.
Things that are here:
a dagger; a kobold corpse
I - 4 scrolls of identify (gained 1)
As you open the door, it creaks loudly!
There is an open door here.
Done exploring.
Health restored: 80
Done exploring.
There is an open door here.
There is an open door here.
Things that are here:
a dagger; a kobold corpse
There is an open door here.
There is an open door here.
Things that are here:
a club; a scale mail
Things that are here:
a spear; a robe
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
There is an open door here.
An orc comes into view. It is wielding a flail.
The orc shouts!
You puncture the orc!
You kill the orc!
No target in view!
No target in view!
There is a stone staircase leading down here.
(m)acro, (M)acro raw, keymap [(k) default, (x) level-map, (t)argeting, (c)onfirm, m(e)nu], (s)ave?
Aborting.
You can't eat.
You can't do that.
Unknown command.
Unknown command.
Search for what [Enter for "plate", or ? for help]? weapon
Unknown command.
You climb downwards.
Found 19 gold pieces.
Found a snail-covered altar of Cheibriados.
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
Unknown command.
Saving game... please wait.
..#.
#.#.
...
####$.###
........#
......_.#
........#
.......@+
......+.#
..... ###
....
...
##
There are no monsters in sight!
Vanquished Creatures
Pikel (D:6)
A gargoyle (D:8)
A two-headed ogre (D:9)
18 yaks
A wyvern (D:9)
A hungry ghost (D:8)
4 orc warriors
A slave (D:6)
A water moccasin (D:5)
2 phantoms (D:9)
An ogre (D:8)
2 ice beasts (D:6)
A sky beast (D:8)
5 giant frogs
A gnoll sergeant (D:5)
A scorpion (D:9)
7 killer bees
A wight (D:9)
2 crimson imps (D:6)
4 orc priests
12 orc wizards
A giant frog zombie (D:8)
A quasit (D:7)
2 giant frog skeletons
Ijyb (D:4)
2 hounds
A gnoll shaman (D:8)
A centaur skeleton (D:8)
Natasha (thrice) (D:3)
2 iguanas
4 worker ants
2 hound zombies
2 worker ant zombies (D:9)
A hound skeleton (D:5)
5 adders
18 gnolls
A shadow imp (D:6)
An adder zombie (D:9)
2 worms
An adder skeleton (D:7)
A giant gecko (D:3)
32 orcs
2 bat skeletons (D:6)
A giant cockroach (D:8)
22 goblins
9 hobgoblins
9 jackals
18 kobolds
2 quokkas
5 bats
3 giant gecko skeletons
7 giant newts
2 jackal zombies
15 rats
247 creatures vanquished.
Vanquished Creatures (collateral kills)
Gastronok (D:8)
A yak (D:7)
A deep elf mage (D:9)
A phantom (D:5)
A centaur (D:9)
Blork the orc (D:6)
2 giant frogs
2 hounds
A giant frog skeleton (D:5)
Crazy Yiuf (D:7)
A gnoll shaman (D:4)
An orc priest (D:4)
2 centaur skeletons (D:4)
6 gnolls
An adder (D:4)
2 shadow imps
An adder zombie (D:9)
8 orcs
2 hobgoblins
A kobold (D:1)
A giant newt (D:4)
A rat (D:9)
39 creatures vanquished.
Vanquished Creatures (others)
3 orcs (D:6)
A quokka zombie (D:6)
A rat (D:6)
5 creatures vanquished.
Grand Total: 291 creatures vanquished
Notes
Turn | Place | Note
--------------------------------------------------------------
0 | D:1 | tasonir the Mummy Summoner began the quest for the Orb.
0 | D:1 | Reached XP level 1. HP: 13/13 MP: 3/3
399 | D:1 | Reached XP level 2. HP: 7/19 MP: 1/5
807 | D:1 | Found a shattered altar of Ashenzari.
1046 | D:2 | Reached skill level 4 in Summonings
1049 | D:2 | Reached XP level 3. HP: 18/24 MP: 4/6
1053 | D:2 | HP: 6/24 [gnoll/flail (10)]
1280 | D:2 | Learned a level 2 spell: Call Imp
1284 | D:2 | Learned a level 3 spell: Call Canine Familiar
1557 | D:2 | HP: 1/24 [worm (10)]
1562 | D:2 | Reached XP level 4. HP: 1/30 MP: 7/7
2045 | D:3 | Noticed Natasha
2050 | D:3 | Killed Natasha
2101 | D:3 | Noticed Natasha
2107 | D:3 | HP: 6/30 [Natasha (3)]
2108 | D:3 | Killed Natasha
2186 | D:3 | Noticed Natasha
2453 | D:3 | Killed Natasha
2514 | D:3 | Reached XP level 5. HP: 10/35 MP: 5/9
2515 | D:3 | Reached skill level 3 in Spellcasting
2515 | D:3 | HP: 7/35 [hobgoblin/club (4)]
3097 | D:3 | Reached skill level 5 in Summonings
3602 | D:4 | HP: 7/35 [worker ant (2)]
3898 | D:4 | Found a sacrificial altar of Ru.
3908 | D:4 | Reached XP level 6. HP: 41/41 MP: 11/11
3950 | D:4 | Reached skill level 1 in Short Blades
4204 | D:4 | Reached skill level 2 in Short Blades
4205 | D:4 | HP: 10/41 [killer bee (7)]
4205 | D:4 | HP: 4/41 [killer bee (6)]
4533 | D:4 | Noticed Ijyb
4556 | D:4 | Killed Ijyb
4711 | D:4 | Reached skill level 3 in Short Blades
4833 | D:4 | Found a shattered altar of Ashenzari.
4833 | D:4 | Found a basalt altar of Yredelemnul.
4968 | D:4 | Reached XP level 7. HP: 40/46 MP: 12/12
5099 | D:4 | Reached skill level 4 in Short Blades
5522 | D:4 | Learned a level 4 spell: Summon Ice Beast
5678 | D:5 | Entered Level 5 of the Dungeon
6055 | D:5 | Learned a level 1 spell: Summon Butterflies
6312 | D:5 | Reached skill level 1 in Ice Magic
6756 | D:5 | Paralysed by a gnoll for 3 turns
6762 | D:5 | Paralysed by a gnoll for 4 turns
6771 | D:5 | HP: 10/46 [gnoll sergeant/tomahawk (5)]
6796 | D:5 | HP: 10/46 [gnoll sergeant/tomahawk (7)]
6812 | D:5 | HP: 8/46 [gnoll sergeant/trident (7)]
7010 | D:5 | HP: 6/46 [phantom (9)]
7013 | D:5 | Reached skill level 2 in Ice Magic
7013 | D:5 | Reached XP level 8. HP: 9/52 MP: 9/13
7334 | D:6 | Noticed Pikel
7349 | D:6 | Noticed Blork the orc
7350 | D:6 | Reached skill level 1 in Fighting
7416 | D:6 | HP: 12/54 [slave[Pikel] (5)]
7417 | D:6 | Killed Blork the orc
7423 | D:6 | HP: 11/54 [Pikel/whip of flaming (5)]
7425 | D:6 | HP: 4/54 [Pikel/whip of flaming (6)]
7428 | D:6 | Killed Pikel
7428 | D:6 | Reached skill level 3 in Fighting
7428 | D:6 | Reached skill level 5 in Short Blades
8082 | D:6 | Reached skill level 4 in Fighting
8420 | D:6 | Reached skill level 6 in Short Blades
8476 | D:6 | HP: 9/61 [orc warrior/mace (20)]
8962 | D:6 | Reached skill level 5 in Fighting
8962 | D:6 | Reached XP level 9. HP: 39/68 MP: 14/14
9224 | D:7 | Reached skill level 2 in Dodging
9251 | D:7 | Learned a level 3 spell: Mephitic Cloud
9261 | D:7 | Found a white marble altar of Elyvilon.
9261 | D:7 | Found a glowing golden altar of the Shining One.
9262 | D:7 | Found a glowing silver altar of Zin.
9307 | D:6 | Reached skill level 3 in Dodging
9313 | D:6 | HP: 9/68 [yak (16)]
9585 | D:7 | Reached skill level 4 in Dodging
9649 | D:7 | Found a staircase to the Ecumenical Temple.
9658 | Temple | Entered the Ecumenical Temple
9682 | Temple | Became a worshipper of Sif Muna the Loreminder
9776 | D:7 | Reached skill level 1 in Conjurations
9776 | D:7 | Reached skill level 1 in Air Magic
9822 | D:7 | Reached skill level 1 in Poison Magic
10078 | D:7 | Noticed Crazy Yiuf
10094 | D:7 | Killed Crazy Yiuf
10202 | D:8 | Noticed Gastronok
10232 | D:8 | Killed Gastronok
10232 | D:8 | Acquired Sif Muna's first power
10232 | D:8 | Acquired Sif Muna's second power
10232 | D:8 | Reached skill level 3 in Conjurations
10232 | D:8 | Reached skill level 3 in Air Magic
10232 | D:8 | Reached skill level 3 in Poison Magic
10232 | D:8 | Reached XP level 10. HP: 57/74 MP: 8/15
10265 | D:7 | HP: 18/74 [orc wizard/magic dart (9)]
11149 | D:8 | Noticed a gargoyle
11179 | D:8 | Reached skill level 4 in Spellcasting
11179 | D:8 | Reached skill level 6 in Summonings
11279 | D:8 | Killed a gargoyle
11477 | D:8 | Found a stormy altar of Qazlal.
12221 | D:9 | Reached skill level 3 in Ice Magic
12237 | D:9 | Reached skill level 5 in Spellcasting
12329 | D:9 | HP: 10/74 [yak (12)]
12342 | D:9 | HP: 12/74 [yak (5)]
12455 | D:9 | HP: 18/74 [yak (2)]
12566 | D:9 | Reached XP level 11. HP: 80/80 MP: 19/19
12577 | D:9 | Reached skill level 7 in Summonings
12590 | D:9 | Acquired Sif Muna's third power
12611 | D:9 | Reached skill level 4 in Ice Magic
12953 | D:10 | Entered Level 10 of the Dungeon
12953 | D:10 | Found a snail-covered altar of Cheibriados.
Action | 1- 3 | 4- 6 | 7- 9 | 10-12 || total
-------------------------+-------+-------+-------+-------++-------
Melee: Whip | 16 | | | || 16
Unarmed | 6 | | | || 6
Dagger | 73 | 246 | 542 | 412 || 1273
Flail | | | 17 | 94 || 111
Fire: Blowgun | | 18 | | 7 || 25
Throw: Throwing net | | | 1 | || 1
Cast: Summon Small Mamm | 7 | | | || 7
Call Canine Famil | 1 | 6 | 25 | 11 || 43
Call Imp | | 11 | 26 | 13 || 50
Mephitic Cloud | | | | 3 || 3
Evoke: Wand | | | 2 | || 2
Use: Scroll | | 6 | 2 | 1 || 9
Stab: Sleeping | 2 | 3 | 5 | 6 || 16
Distracted | | | 3 | 3 || 6
Confused | | | | 3 || 3
Table legend:
A = Turns spent in this place as a percentage of turns spent in the
entire game.
B = Non-inter-level travel turns spent in this place as a percentage of
non-inter-level travel turns spent in the entire game.
C = Inter-level travel turns spent in this place as a percentage of
turns spent in this place.
D = Turns resting spent in this place as a percentage of non-inter-level
travel turns spent in this place.
E = Turns spent auto-exploring this place as a percentage of
non-inter-level travel turns spent in this place.
F = Non-inter-level travel turns spent in this place divided by the
number of levels of this place that you've seen.
A B C D E F
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Total | 100.0 | 100.0 | 0.6 | 1.9 | 7.1 | 374.0
Dungeon | 99.3 | 99.4 | 0.5 | 2.0 | 7.2 | 408.8
Temple | 0.7 | 0.6 | 3.7 | 0.0 | 0.0 | 26.0
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Table legend:
A = Kills in this place as a percentage of kills in entire the game.
B = Kills by you in this place as a percentage of kills by you in
the entire game.
C = Kills by friends in this place as a percentage of kills by
friends in the entire game.
D = Other kills in this place as a percentage of other kills in the
entire game.
E = Experience gained in this place as a percentage of experience
gained in the entire game.
F = Experience gained in this place divided by the number of levels of
this place that you have seen.
A B C D E F
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Total | 100.0 | 100.0 | 100.0 | 100.0 | 100.0 | 1094.1
Dungeon | 100.0 | 100.0 | 100.0 | 100.0 | 100.0 | 1203.5
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Slime Squisher
Posts: 330
Joined: Thursday, 10th May 2012, 03:29
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 5382
Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36
Vestibule Violator
Posts: 1508
Joined: Monday, 21st November 2011, 07:40
Slime Squisher
Posts: 357
Joined: Saturday, 14th December 2013, 01:35
Pandemonium Purger
Posts: 1283
Joined: Thursday, 16th April 2015, 22:39
linear wrote:DD of Zin
n1000 wrote:ebarrett recommended to me SpFE as a fun combo. It's a fantastic character with a playstyle that fits the "trickster archetype," in his words. You can dash around while inner/sticky/conjure flaming to set up great explosions. I recommend not going too far into conjurations, even though such a build would be strong, and trying to keep a scrappy, pesky pixie in mind. Be resourceful and kill things with whatever tools you can scrounge up.
SpFE played this way is not only fun and challenging, but fairly powerful. In a single, whimsically suboptimal attempt (I worshipped Vehumet specifically for Dazzling Spray and then switched to Jiyva...) I managed to splat on Zot:5 in 39000 turns. I wasn't trying to go particularly fast but kept a willingness to flee downstairs in line with how I envisioned a trickster spriggan ought to play. The character is without a doubt the most fun I've had in a non-winning game.
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 4478
Joined: Wednesday, 23rd October 2013, 07:56
Pollen_Golem wrote:Speaking of transmuters, what about KoTm of Dith? Doesn't seem common but sounds alright. Could work on a Spriggan as well if not better.
Shoals Surfer
Posts: 280
Joined: Monday, 17th December 2012, 16:04
Halls Hopper
Posts: 58
Joined: Thursday, 27th February 2014, 03:07
tasonir wrote:From the terrible character ideas thread: Troll of Gozag.
Halls Hopper
Posts: 58
Joined: Thursday, 27th February 2014, 03:07
Lacuenta wrote:i can take them to Hell and back.
Halls Hopper
Posts: 58
Joined: Thursday, 27th February 2014, 03:07
Pollen_Golem wrote:linear wrote:DD of Zin
Do you even realize what you're implying?
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 6454
Joined: Tuesday, 30th October 2012, 19:06
linear wrote:Pollen_Golem wrote:linear wrote:DD of Zin
Do you even realize what you're implying?
My Invo-focused Zin run was with HO. A DD pumping Invo with +3 aptitude would have lots of MP for HW wand recharging. I think that could work without Necromancy or vampiric weapons?
Shoals Surfer
Posts: 280
Joined: Monday, 17th December 2012, 16:04
linear wrote:Lacuenta wrote:i can take them to Hell and back.
Unfortunately orc armies get decimated once you find enemies with Torment.
Cocytus Succeeder
Posts: 2184
Joined: Tuesday, 3rd February 2015, 22:05
Pandemonium Purger
Posts: 1283
Joined: Thursday, 16th April 2015, 22:39
tasonir wrote:Also I'm not entirely sure if it should count, but ogre transmuter who uses unarmed sort of applies. Probably never as good as a GSC, but statue form + unarmed works very well with them if you just pretend GSC's don't exist.
Swamp Slogger
Posts: 173
Joined: Saturday, 23rd November 2013, 23:58
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 5382
Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36
Pollen_Golem wrote:tasonir wrote:Also I'm not entirely sure if it should count, but ogre transmuter who uses unarmed sort of applies. Probably never as good as a GSC, but statue form + unarmed works very well with them if you just pretend GSC's don't exist.
Why do you have to pretend GSCs don't exist? I thought statue form gives a 50% increase to all damage, which should be great on a GSC.
Abyss Ambulator
Posts: 1244
Joined: Thursday, 10th March 2011, 19:45
Dungeon Master
Posts: 3618
Joined: Thursday, 23rd December 2010, 12:43
tasonir wrote:From the terrible character ideas thread: Troll of Gozag.
Pandemonium Purger
Posts: 1283
Joined: Thursday, 16th April 2015, 22:39
rockygargoyle wrote:Why would you start as transmuter if you plan on using GSC?
0 | D:1 | dpeg, the Troll Monk, began the quest for the Orb.
906 | D:2 | Found an opulent altar of Gozag.
1113 | D:2 | Found a sparkling altar of Nemelex Xobeh.
1123 | D:2 | Found a sacrificial altar of Ru.
1138 | D:2 | Found a deep blue altar of Sif Muna.
1140 | D:2 | Found a bloodstained altar of Trog.
1144 | D:2 | Found a blossoming altar of Fedhas.
1347 | D:2 | Found a radiant altar of Vehumet.
1352 | D:2 | Found a white marble altar of Elyvilon.
1352 | D:2 | Found an ancient bone altar of Kikubaaqudgha.
1352 | D:2 | Found a basalt altar of Yredelemnul.
1353 | D:2 | Found a burning altar of Makhleb.
1356 | D:2 | Found a glowing golden altar of the Shining One.
1357 | D:2 | Found an iron altar of Okawaru.
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 5382
Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36
Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.17-a0-1469-g9f39193 (webtiles) character file.
tasonir the Grappler (Troll Fighter) Turns: 14870, Time: 00:41:36
Health: 108/122 AC: 18 Str: 27 XL: 12 Next: 94%
Magic: 11/11 EV: 9 Int: 4 God: Gozag
Gold: 1747 SH: 12 Dex: 13 Spells: 0 memorised, 11 levels left
rFire + + . SeeInvis . - Unarmed
rCold x . . Clarity . H - +2 fire dragon armour
rNeg + . . SustAt . b - +0 shield
rPois . Gourm + j - +1 hat
rElec . Spirit . a - +1 cloak
rCorr . Warding . (gloves unavailable)
rMut + Stasis . (boots unavailable)
MR +.... P - amulet of resist mutation
Stlth .......... k - ring of positive energy
R - ring of protection from magic
@: somewhat resistant to hostile enchantments, extremely unstealthy
A: unfitting armour, claws 3, fast metabolism 3, gourmand, regeneration 2,
shaggy fur 1, tough skin 2
a: Potion Petition, Call Merchant, Bribe Branch, Renounce Religion
You are on level 3 of the Orcish Mines.
You worship Gozag.
Gozag is noncommittal.
You are very hungry.
You have visited 4 branches of the dungeon, and seen 19 of its levels.
You have also visited: Labyrinth and Volcano.
You have collected 5229 gold pieces.
You have paid 3482 gold pieces to Gozag.
Inventory:
Hand weapons
D - an uncursed blowgun
(You took it off Sonja on level 3 of the Orcish Mines)
J - a scimitar of flaming
(You found it in a volcano)
Missiles
e - 8 curare-tipped needles
t - 11 javelins (quivered)
u - 2 throwing nets
Armour
a - a +1 cloak (worn)
(You took it off Maurice on level 12 of the Dungeon)
b - a +0 shield (worn)
j - a +1 hat (worn)
(You found it on level 9 of the Dungeon)
H - a +2 fire dragon armour (worn)
(You found it in a labyrinth)
Y - a +2 robe of cold resistance
(You found it in a labyrinth)
Rods
W - a +2 iron rod (9/9)
(You took it off a minotaur in a labyrinth)
Jewellery
k - a ring of positive energy (right claw)
(You found it in a labyrinth)
P - an amulet of resist mutation (around neck)
(You found it on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts)
R - a ring of protection from magic (left claw)
(You found it on level 2 of the Lair of Beasts)
Magical devices
i - a wand of hasting (6)
(You took it off a hobgoblin on level 7 of the Dungeon)
y - a wand of lightning
(You found it on level 3 of the Dungeon)
L - a wand of digging
(You found it on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts)
Q - a wand of draining
(You found it on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts)
T - a wand of fire
(You found it on level 2 of the Lair of Beasts)
Scrolls
g - 9 scrolls of remove curse
o - 5 scrolls of magic mapping
p - 5 scrolls labeled YTOSER UZOTU
q - 5 scrolls of blinking
r - 5 scrolls of teleportation
s - 2 scrolls labeled YZEADA OSUCHI
w - 2 scrolls of recharging
z - 3 scrolls of fear
B - a scroll of identify
C - a scroll labeled VISUACLELI
M - a scroll labeled VEECAD TITHA
N - a scroll labeled JIATSI OQOUVEL
O - a scroll labeled POJAOF NUTOTE
V - a scroll labeled ZIHUPSU BEUT
Potions
c - 3 potions of might
f - 2 potions of resistance
h - 2 potions of agility
l - a potion of brilliance
m - 3 potions of cure mutation
n - a fuming black potion
v - a sedimented dark potion
x - 2 potions of haste
A - 4 potions of curing
E - 2 potions of cancellation
F - 2 potions of flight
K - a brown potion
U - a red potion
X - a potion of heal wounds
Books
G - a book of the Warp
(You found it on level 6 of the Dungeon)
I - an Akashic Record
(You found it on level 8 of the Dungeon)
Z - a book of Beasts
(You found it in a labyrinth)
Miscellaneous
S - a phial of floods
(You found it on level 2 of the Lair of Beasts)
Comestibles
d - 4 bread rations {@e1}
Skills:
+ Level 8.5 Fighting
- Level 9.1 Throwing
+ Level 5.4 Armour
+ Level 4.1 Dodging
- Level 9.0 Shields
+ Level 11.8 Unarmed Combat
You have 11 spell levels left.
You don't know any spells.
Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations
Branches:
Dungeon (12/15) Temple (1/1) D:5 Lair (3/8) D:10
Orc (3/4) D:12
Swamp: Lair:3-6 Shoals: Lair:3-6 Snake: Lair:3-6 Spider: Lair:3-6
Elf: Orc:3-4
Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Dithmenos
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Gozag
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Qazlal
Ru
Sif Muna
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin
The Shining One
Beogh
Shops:
D:6 ! D:12 [ D:13 % D:15 % Vaults:1 %
Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations
You are too large for most types of armour.
You have claws for hands.
Your metabolism is lightning-fast.
You like to eat raw meat.
You heal very quickly.
You are covered in fur (AC +1).
You have very tough skin (AC +2).
Message History
You throw a javelin. The javelin misses Sonja. You feel sick.
Sonja shoots a curare-tipped needle.
The curare-tipped needle closely misses you.
Sonja moves out of view.
You take 1 damage, and have 112/122 hp.
You feel sick.
Sonja twirls her cape.
You take 1 damage, and have 111/122 hp.
Aim: Sonja, wielding a blowgun
You throw a javelin. The javelin completely misses Sonja. You feel sick.
Sonja shoots a curare-tipped needle.
You block the curare-tipped needle.
Sonja shoots a curare-tipped needle.
The curare-tipped needle hits you.
You are more poisoned.
You have difficulty breathing.
You feel as though you will be slow longer.
You take 9 damage, and have 102/122 hp.
Unknown command.
Aim: Sonja, wielding a blowgun
You throw a javelin. The javelin misses Sonja.
You feel very sick.
Sonja shoots a curare-tipped needle.
The curare-tipped needle hits you.
You are more poisoned.
You have difficulty breathing.
You feel as though you will be slow longer.
You take 10 damage, and have 92/122 hp.
Unknown command.
Unknown command.
Unknown command.
Aim: Sonja, wielding a blowgun
You throw a javelin. The javelin completely misses Sonja.
You feel very sick.
Sonja unwields an uncursed blowgun.
Sonja wields an uncursed dagger of venom.
It begins to drip with poison! Sonja completely misses you.
Sonja hits you with an uncursed dagger of venom.
Sonja completely misses you.
You take 4 damage, and have 88/122 hp.
You mangle Sonja!!
You kill Sonja!
You feel very sick.
You take 2 damage, and have 86/122 hp.
You feel very sick.
You now have 1747 gold pieces (gained 15).
Your pack is full.
Things that are here:
an uncursed dagger of venom; an uncursed blowgun; 2 curare-tipped needles
You feel very sick.
You take 6 damage, and have 80/122 hp.
You can't carry that many items.
Your pack is full.
Things that are here:
an uncursed dagger of venom; an uncursed blowgun; 2 curare-tipped needles
Drop what? 52/52 slots (_ for help) (? for menu, Esc to quit)
You drop a scorched morningstar.
You feel very sick.
You take 2 damage, and have 78/122 hp.
D - an uncursed blowgun
You feel very sick.
You take 2 damage, and have 76/122 hp.
Drop what? 52/52 slots (_ for help) (? for menu, Esc to quit)
You drop 3 scrolls of amnesia. You feel sick.
You take 1 damage, and have 75/122 hp.
e - 2 curare-tipped needles
You feel very sick.
You take 2 damage, and have 73/122 hp.
You feel sick.
e - 5 curare-tipped needles (gained 3)
You feel sick.
You take 1 damage, and have 72/122 hp.
You feel sick.
e - 7 curare-tipped needles (gained 2)
You feel sick.
You take 2 damage, and have 70/122 hp.
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
e - 8 curare-tipped needles (gained 1)
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
Things that are here:
3 scrolls of amnesia; a scorched morningstar; an uncursed dagger of venom
You are feeling hungry.
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
t - 8 javelins (gained 1)
t - 11 javelins (gained 3)
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
You feel sick.
You are no longer poisoned.
You feel yourself speed up.
You are feeling very hungry.
You regained 36 hp, and now have 108/122 hp.
Saving game... please wait.
≈##.....## ##...
≈≈#......### ##....
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##..........##.###*## ##.#..#.
#......))..#*....##.## #...#.##
##.##..)####*#.......# ##......#
[...#..).####*#...#.#* ##.#......
[...##...<#.####...#####........#
)#..##.#.#....#.@...##.#...#....#
##......###........#.......#.....
..#.##.#.##...............##?....
...##..............#.............
..####..###....................#.
..## #))######...................
...###...## ##..................
..###.....### ##................#
..# ####..#.## ##...........##.##
There are no monsters in sight!
Vanquished Creatures
A minotaur (Lab)
Sonja (Orc:3)
A lindwurm (Volcano)
An ugly thing (D:11)
A manticore (D:11)
2 molten gargoyles (Volcano)
Maurice (D:12)
A black mamba (Lair:1)
A kobold demonologist (D:11)
2 gargoyles
A fire drake (Volcano)
4 trolls
2 komodo dragons
3 two-headed ogres (D:12)
6 slime creatures (D:12)
Grinder (D:3)
8 blink frogs
A deep elf mage (D:12)
6 fire bats (Volcano)
2 hungry ghosts
18 yaks
7 hippogriffs
A basilisk (Lair:2)
A mottled dragon (Volcano)
A soldier ant (D:11)
5 wargs
A porcupine (Lair:1)
5 water moccasins
2 sky beasts
A black bear (D:9)
12 orc warriors
A hell hound (Volcano)
6 ice beasts
3 phantoms
A wasp (D:9)
5 ogres
2 necrophages
2 big kobolds
12 centaurs
2 crocodiles
17 giant frogs
4 scorpions
19 killer bees
3 crimson imps
8 wights
An electric eel (D:8)
A centaur skeleton (D:9)
2 quasits
2 giant frog skeletons
9 hounds
Crazy Yiuf (D:6)
25 orc priests
Ijyb (D:3)
5 iguanas
2 jellies
6 worker ants
22 orc wizards
3 hound skeletons
11 adders
7 gnolls
6 river rats (Lair:2)
A worker ant zombie (D:5)
3 shadow imps
An ooze (D:6)
5 worms
8 giant geckos
141 orcs
A ball python (D:1)
3 bat skeletons
2 bat zombies
4 giant cockroaches (D:2)
15 hobgoblins
3 jackals (D:5)
2 quokkas
13 bats
A giant gecko zombie (D:7)
5 giant newts
13 goblins
21 kobolds
14 rats
545 creatures vanquished.
Vanquished Creatures (others)
6 fungi (Lair:1)
3 plants (Lair:1)
9 creatures vanquished.
Grand Total: 554 creatures vanquished
Notes
Turn | Place | Note
--------------------------------------------------------------
0 | D:1 | tasonir the Troll Fighter began the quest for the Orb.
0 | D:1 | Reached XP level 1. HP: 22/22 MP: 0/0
573 | D:1 | Reached XP level 2. HP: 26/29 MP: 1/1
828 | D:2 | Reached skill level 3 in Unarmed Combat
846 | D:2 | Found a sacrificial altar of Ru.
891 | D:2 | Reached XP level 3. HP: 32/36 MP: 2/2
1003 | D:2 | Reached skill level 4 in Unarmed Combat
1019 | D:2 | Reached XP level 4. HP: 39/44 MP: 3/3
1393 | D:3 | Reached skill level 5 in Unarmed Combat
1419 | D:3 | Noticed Grinder
1435 | D:3 | Killed Grinder
1435 | D:3 | Reached skill level 6 in Unarmed Combat
1435 | D:3 | Reached XP level 5. HP: 19/50 MP: 4/4
1435 | D:3 | Reached XP level 6. HP: 22/59 MP: 5/5
1518 | D:3 | Noticed Ijyb
1527 | D:3 | Killed Ijyb
1626 | D:3 | Found an iron altar of Okawaru.
1729 | D:3 | You fall through a shaft for 2 floors!
1729 | D:5 | Entered Level 5 of the Dungeon
1771 | D:5 | Reached skill level 3 in Fighting
2166 | D:4 | Reached skill level 3 in Shields
2241 | D:4 | HP: 9/61 [orc wizard/magic dart (7)]
2243 | D:4 | Reached XP level 7. HP: 17/67 MP: 6/6
2687 | D:5 | Reached skill level 4 in Fighting
2687 | D:5 | Reached skill level 4 in Shields
2931 | D:5 | Reached XP level 8. HP: 73/79 MP: 7/7
3130 | D:5 | Found a staircase to the Ecumenical Temple.
3401 | Temple | Entered the Ecumenical Temple
3437 | Temple | Became a worshipper of Gozag Ym Sagoz the Greedy
3533 | D:6 | Reached skill level 5 in Fighting
3536 | D:6 | Found Wicidir's Distillery.
3649 | D:6 | Noticed Crazy Yiuf
3655 | D:6 | Killed Crazy Yiuf
3655 | D:6 | Reached skill level 5 in Shields
4051 | D:7 | Reached skill level 6 in Fighting
4051 | D:7 | Reached skill level 6 in Shields
4108 | D:7 | Reached skill level 7 in Unarmed Combat
4182 | D:7 | Found a radiant altar of Vehumet.
4198 | D:7 | Reached XP level 9. HP: 85/89 MP: 8/8
4360 | D:7 | HP: 19/89 [killer bee (9)]
4361 | D:7 | Reached skill level 8 in Unarmed Combat
4665 | D:7 | Noticed a moth of wrath
4667 | D:7 | Found a bloodstained altar of Trog.
4827 | D:7 | HP: 20/89 [killer bee (4)]
4829 | D:7 | Reached skill level 9 in Unarmed Combat
4832 | D:7 | HP: 12/89 [poisoned by a killer bee]
4837 | D:7 | HP: 8/89 [poisoned by a killer bee]
4842 | D:7 | HP: 5/89 [killer bee (7)]
5447 | D:8 | Reached skill level 10 in Unarmed Combat
5842 | D:8 | HP: 13/89 [electric eel/bolt of electricity (14)]
5845 | D:8 | HP: 6/89 [cloud of steam (8)]
5869 | D:8 | HP: 19/89 [giant frog (3)]
6021 | D:9 | Found a shattered altar of Ashenzari.
6175 | D:9 | Reached skill level 11 in Unarmed Combat
6176 | D:9 | Reached XP level 10. HP: 92/98 MP: 9/9
6382 | D:9 | Found a basalt altar of Yredelemnul.
6388 | D:9 | Found a white marble altar of Elyvilon.
6391 | D:9 | Found a stormy altar of Qazlal.
6427 | D:9 | Found a glowing golden altar of the Shining One.
6817 | D:10 | Entered Level 10 of the Dungeon
7066 | D:10 | Found a staircase to the Lair.
7083 | D:10 | HP: 18/100 [orc priest/divine providence (12)]
7102 | D:10 | HP: 24/100 [warg (7)]
7106 | D:10 | Reached skill level 7 in Shields
7107 | D:10 | HP: 21/100 [gnoll/spear (6)]
7140 | D:10 | Reached skill level 7 in Fighting
7687 | Lair:1 | Entered Level 1 of the Lair of Beasts
7708 | Lair:1 | Reached skill level 1 in Throwing
7735 | Lair:1 | Reached skill level 2 in Throwing
7795 | Lair:1 | Reached skill level 3 in Throwing
7961 | Lair:1 | Noticed a black mamba
7968 | Lair:1 | Killed a black mamba
7968 | Lair:1 | Reached skill level 4 in Throwing
7968 | Lair:1 | Reached XP level 11. HP: 100/110 MP: 10/10
8526 | Lair:2 | Reached skill level 5 in Throwing
8645 | Lair:2 | Reached skill level 6 in Throwing
8996 | Lair:2 | Reached skill level 7 in Throwing
9064 | Lair:2 | HP: 24/110 [blink frog (15)]
10128 | D:11 | Found a labyrinth entrance.
10137 | Lab | Entered a labyrinth
10221 | Lab | Noticed a minotaur
10230 | Lab | Killed a minotaur
10230 | Lab | Reached skill level 8 in Throwing
10245 | Lab | Identified a +2 iron rod (4/9) (You took it off a minotaur in a labyrinth)
10246 | Lab | Identified a +2 rod of shadows (13/13) (You found it in a labyrinth)
10319 | D:11 | Reached skill level 9 in Throwing
10340 | D:11 | Found an opulent altar of Gozag.
10422 | D:11 | Reached skill level 1 in Armour
10785 | D:11 | Reached skill level 8 in Shields
10834 | D:11 | Reached skill level 2 in Armour
10836 | D:11 | Noticed a soul eater
11023 | D:11 | Reached XP level 12. HP: 109/119 MP: 11/11
11548 | D:12 | Found Gygib's Armour Emporium.
11587 | D:12 | Reached skill level 3 in Armour
11675 | D:12 | Found a staircase to the Orcish Mines.
11846 | D:12 | Noticed Maurice
11853 | D:12 | Killed Maurice
11961 | D:12 | Reached skill level 4 in Armour
12040 | D:12 | Reached skill level 9 in Shields
12170 | D:12 | Got a scorched morningstar
12323 | D:12 | Reached skill level 3 in Dodging
12478 | D:12 | Reached skill level 8 in Fighting
12531 | Orc:1 | Entered Level 1 of the Orcish Mines
12980 | Orc:1 | Found a roughly hewn altar of Beogh.
13906 | Orc:2 | Reached skill level 5 in Armour
14263 | Orc:3 | Found a dark tunnel.
14268 | Volcano | Entered a volcano
14497 | Volcano | Found a burning altar of Makhleb.
14565 | Volcano | Reached skill level 4 in Dodging
14792 | Orc:3 | Noticed Sonja
14799 | Orc:3 | Killed Sonja
Action | 1- 3 | 4- 6 | 7- 9 | 10-12 || total
-------------------------+-------+-------+-------+-------++-------
Melee: Unarmed | 78 | 116 | 428 | 1218 || 1840
Throw: Javelin | | | 2 | 12 || 14
Invok: Call Merchant | | | 1 | 3 || 4
Potion Petition | | | 1 | || 1
Evoke: Wand | | | 1 | || 1
Use: Potion | | 2 | 4 | 1 || 7
Scroll | | | 11 | 8 || 19
Stab: Sleeping | | | 2 | 2 || 4
Distracted | | | | 7 || 7
Eat: Chunk | 14 | 10 | 10 | || 34
Fruit | | | 5 | 11 || 16
Royal jelly | | | 1 | 1 || 2
Beef jerky | | | 6 | 2 || 8
Meat ration | | | 1 | 4 || 5
Bread ration | | | | 10 || 10
Pizza | | | | 1 || 1
Table legend:
A = Turns spent in this place as a percentage of turns spent in the
entire game.
B = Non-inter-level travel turns spent in this place as a percentage of
non-inter-level travel turns spent in the entire game.
C = Inter-level travel turns spent in this place as a percentage of
turns spent in this place.
D = Turns resting spent in this place as a percentage of non-inter-level
travel turns spent in this place.
E = Turns spent auto-exploring this place as a percentage of
non-inter-level travel turns spent in this place.
F = Non-inter-level travel turns spent in this place divided by the
number of levels of this place that you've seen.
A B C D E F
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Total | 100.0 | 100.0 | 0.5 | 0.9 | 9.8 | 224.6
Dungeon | 65.3 | 65.3 | 0.6 | 0.8 | 11.0 | 256.6
Temple | 0.8 | 0.8 | 2.6 | 0.0 | 0.0 | 38.0
Lair | 11.2 | 11.2 | 0.6 | 2.1 | 10.9 | 176.7
Orcish Mines | 17.3 | 17.3 | 0.5 | 0.7 | 6.9 | 271.7
Labyrinth | 2.6 | 2.7 | 0.0 | 0.0 | 0.0 | 125.0
Volcano | 2.7 | 2.7 | 0.0 | 0.0 | 6.2 | 129.0
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Table legend:
A = Kills in this place as a percentage of kills in entire the game.
B = Kills by you in this place as a percentage of kills by you in
the entire game.
C = Kills by friends in this place as a percentage of kills by
friends in the entire game.
D = Other kills in this place as a percentage of other kills in the
entire game.
E = Experience gained in this place as a percentage of experience
gained in the entire game.
F = Experience gained in this place divided by the number of levels of
this place that you have seen.
A B C D E F
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Total | 100.0 | 100.0 | -nan | 100.0 | 100.0 | 1766.8
Dungeon | 63.9 | 63.9 | -nan | 100.0 | 58.0 | 1792.5
Lair | 7.9 | 7.9 | -nan | 0.0 | 19.5 | 2412.7
Orcish Mines | 25.8 | 25.9 | -nan | 0.0 | 10.5 | 1296.3
Labyrinth | 0.2 | 0.2 | -nan | 0.0 | 2.9 | 1071.0
Volcano | 2.2 | 2.2 | -nan | 0.0 | 9.1 | 3394.0
+-------+-------+-------+-------+-------+----------------------
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 5382
Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36
Pandemonium Purger
Posts: 1283
Joined: Thursday, 16th April 2015, 22:39
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 6418
Joined: Friday, 6th July 2012, 12:48
Ziggurat Zagger
Posts: 5382
Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36
Sar wrote:All books now ID on pickup.
Pandemonium Purger
Posts: 1386
Joined: Sunday, 5th April 2015, 22:37
linear wrote:Pickled - I don't know how novel these are:
3. Someone posted a TeBe win recently. It never occurred to me to throw away the great casting abilites of a Tengu, but they do have two aux attacks. ]
Tasonir - There was a post recently characterising Haunt as something you use to tie up enemies while you kill them with something else. The Haunt summon list is so weak.
tasonir wrote:Pollen_Golem wrote:tasonir wrote:Also I'm not entirely sure if it should count, but ogre transmuter who uses unarmed sort of applies. Probably never as good as a GSC, but statue form + unarmed works very well with them if you just pretend GSC's don't exist.
I should probably fsim this, because now I'm curious which does more damage. As crazy as this may sound, I feel like unarmed might actually come out ahead on my kind of transmuter. With Chei, I had 45 str, which is +15 damage in statue form, +27 from skill, +6 base?
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