New Unique Demon


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Swamp Slogger

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 07:21

New Unique Demon

Image Beware The Torauxn! Image
His name would be Torauxn or and he would be a unique Tier1 Demon
(Not like Cerebov mind you, Think Eye of Draining + Moth of Wrath)
As you can see I have already made the tile he would use if the Dev's are nice enough to put him in game.
I decided to change his name from Oblivion to Torauxn because while i thought Oblivion was a cool name, Torauxn sounds more Dungeon Crawlesque

I tried to design him to "challenge" experienced mages endgame.
Warriors still might have a bit of trouble but Should be ok

I imaging his stats would be something like the following
HP/HD: 150-250
Exp: 5000-9000
Speed: 12-14
Ac: 20
Ev: 10
MR: Immune
Atk1 25 Chaos
Atk2 20
Resistances: rF rC+++ rN++ rP+ rE++ Torm
Spells: Silence Summon Eyeballs
Abilities: Blink, Mana Drain See Invis, Flying, Berserk Other

RED text means an idea has been Brainstormed AWAY
BLUE text means an Idea has been brainstormed IN

Once he enters your LOS he casts silence and because blink is set up as an ability of his he should blink chase you (like an imp or Phantom)
He should spawn with a small band of Eyes of Draining, that with his Ability to berserk the player could severely cripple most mages, providing them with an interesting challenge.
Gave him the spell Summon Eyeballs which would summon more (temporary) Eyes of draining should his starting band run out

Thats just what i imagine him to be, if a Dev would like to use my Tile for something else then by all means go for it.
(Click on the little picture and drag it onto your desktop)
Last edited by omndra on Monday, 16th May 2011, 20:34, edited 11 times in total.

Vestibule Violator

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 08:15

Re: New Unique Demon

Great, what crawl needs is another Mennas. Not. Well, at least this one doesn't have a shield and huge EV. I think an enemy that you have exactly one chance to get away from, which is teleporting as soon as the enemy enters your LOS, should not be in the game. It requires being spoiled. Faster than the player, shuts down almost all escape and attacking options, and blinks after you? Seriously?

Actually the blinking lowers the challenge quite a bit if it's Imp-like. Lose the silence and it might be okay.

hxy

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 11:01

Re: New Unique Demon

Maybe make it only spawn in Pan or Hells. If you can get there you should be able to handle it I think... might be a bit tricky if it appears in the D levels
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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 11:06

Re: New Unique Demon

omndra wrote:I tried to design him to "challenge" experienced mages endgame


hxy wrote:Maybe make it only spawn in Pan or Hells. If you can get there you should be able to handle it I think... might be a bit tricky if it appears in the D levels

D isn't endgame, so I think that's the point. Mennas depth is D:20-27. Omndra, where would you see Oblivion spawn?
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 11:56

Re: New Unique Demon

I don't think there's any real problem with a unique meant specifically to make things more difficult for spellcasters, particularly since this would be toward the end of the game and it's really their own fault if they haven't arranged some other solution, but Silence + fast movement + melee really does tread on Mennas' toes somewhat. Perhaps the proposed unique should spawn with a band instead of going for melee? Green deaths and blue deaths aren't part of anybody's thematic band yet, whether we're talking about a unique or a branch, and they're slightly faster than the normal baseline so it isn't entirely trivial just to walk away. Demons can cast just fine in Silence, so the band would still be able to operate normally while under the influence of their leader.
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Swamp Slogger

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 16:27

Re: New Unique Demon

galehar wrote:
omndra wrote:I tried to design him to "challenge" experienced mages endgame


hxy wrote:Maybe make it only spawn in Pan or Hells. If you can get there you should be able to handle it I think... might be a bit tricky if it appears in the D levels

D isn't endgame, so I think that's the point. Mennas depth is D:20-27. Omndra, where would you see Oblivion spawn?


I would imagine him Appearing pretty far Down, like Whatever Boris has.
I don't want to be all pushy and say "Hey! Make a New Super Panlord! With this tile and here are his stats!"
But It would be nice if he showed up in the D levels, but i think his HP might have to be Nerfed a bit if thats going to happen.

Also i forgot about Mennas. Giving Torauxn Silence would indeed stomp on Mennas's toes.
Maybe replace his Silence with the Mana draining ability that Eyes of draining have, Or He has the Moths of Wraths ability to make the player character go Berzerk.

But that would still give mages the chance to panic and IOOD him.
And sure he can have a band... Of Eyes of draining. Like 4-8 of them
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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 17:06

Re: New Unique Demon

I like the idea of uniques that can appear in hell / pan besides the named Lords. It would help to break things up a little.

I'm not sure I like the flavor of just trying to cripple mages though. And as is, this guy seems kinda self redundant. Antimagic attacks, a band of eyes of draining, 'zerk other, and more drain mp? Just one or two of those together would be a significant problem for a caster. All of them seems uninteresting. Does it really matter that your mp pool is empty if you're berserk?

You really stacked his elemental resists, but left him open to poison and hellfire. Is that intentional? Personally, I don't feel anything should have perfect resists, but it seems an odd combination.

Vaults Vanquisher

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 17:34

Re: New Unique Demon

If I recall correctly (and it hasn't changed), Boris/Mennas can spawn in Dungeon/Vaults/Crypt/Tomb/Blade/Snake/Shoals/Swamp -- not really endgame, most of the time.
Spawning in hellpan (somewhat like Ignacio or the Serpent of Hell) might be nifty.
I'm okay with a unique that's particularly menacing to spellcasters, but the possibility of its presence shouldn't significantly change anyone's plans. Pure spellcasters should still be able to handle it, albeit with great difficulty, and in the case that it really is incredibly hard, fleeing should be reasonable (no blocking all methods of escape forever, no requiring anyone to have a specific method of escape, etc.). Fleeing from Mennas is a bit difficult but pretty okay, since you can flee on sight (even from around corners, thanks to the halo, so Mennas can't surprise silence very well), and in the case that you're too slow and get silenced, as long as he doesn't kill you, you can wait that out.

Vestibule Violator

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 17:43

Re: New Unique Demon

Some things about Mennas: Boris and Mennas can also spawn in Elf (if it hasn't changed). Also more importantly, if the halo colors floor tiles in console that's an information disparity between console and tiles and should be fixed (either way, preferably by giving tiles proper halos). You cant see the halo shining around corners in tiles, you only see what creatures it affects. I don't know the exact halo behavior in console, so I don't feel comfortable filing a bug about this, but someone who is more familiar with it should.

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 19:00

Re: New Unique Demon

oh right I completely forgot about Elf.
and yes, halos color floor tiles yellow in console, which isn't so great when the floor was yellow originally (Snake, at least)
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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 20:06

Re: New Unique Demon

Boris and Mennas have the same depth: 20-27, !Lair, !Slime
We're sliding off-topic, but silence aura is shown fine in tiles. It's pretty ugly, but it works. Also, I'm wondering if it should be shown. If it's your aura it's fine, but how would you detect a silence aura from a distance? I wanted to interrupt travel and autoexplore when a silence aura comes into view, but I got stuck. What message to display???
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Swamp Slogger

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 20:21

Re: New Unique Demon

So Mageykun doesn't like the idea of a Powerful MageKiller?
I wonder why XD
However i will shuffle his Resistances around a bit.
(I was thinking about leaving him open to poison but after some thought i realized that would just encourage players to kite him, and forgot to put it back on)

And yes it does matter if you have no mana when you are berserk, because one might quickly switch to an amulet of clarity and blast him to bits plus it will severely limit escape options once one as been fatigued and slowed by the berserk.
However as he IS surrounded my Eyes of draining maybe he himself could make do without that particular ability himself.
I believe that would make him a bit more interesting to deal with and create more choices for the player to make if they happen to be a mage.

Yeah the more i think about this guy the more i think he should only show up in Pan/Hell
But not as a "Boss" more like a Mini boss.
(That way he could potentially tag team with Cerebov)

NINJAED
The message to display could be something like
"Its quiet.... too quiet"
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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 20:46

Re: New Unique Demon

@Galehar: It's off topic yes, but I can't resist.
I'd just mimic the silence spell description for a warning when you 'see' the aura. You shouldn't mention the silence, because the player doesn't experience it until they actually enter the field. Yes, this promotes spoilers a little, but it fits in with the existing flavor of the spell nicely. And it'll only catch players off guard once.

Aura of silence enters LOS:

"You sense a oppressive, unnatural aura." or possibly
"You sense a oppressive, unnatural aura emanating from <somewhere out of sight / foo>".

You enter the aura of silence:

"You are enveloped in a profound silence!"

Is it necessary to have a message coming out?

"You can hear once again." "Your hearing returns." etc...
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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 21:15

Re: New Unique Demon

omndra wrote:However as he IS surrounded my Eyes of draining maybe he himself could make do without that particular ability himself.
I believe that would make him a bit more interesting to deal with and create more choices for the player to make if they happen to be a mage.

You shouldn't rely only on the eyes to impair a high level caster. If the unique is Pan/Hell only (I think it should), most casters will annihilate them with fire storm or tornado.

mageykun wrote:@Galehar: It's off topic yes, but I can't resist.
I'd just mimic the silence spell description for a warning when you 'see' the aura. You shouldn't mention the silence, because the player doesn't experience it until they actually enter the field. Yes, this promotes spoilers a little, but it fits in with the existing flavor of the spell nicely. And it'll only catch players off guard once.

If I ever fix this, I'll probably make it invisible until you actually enter it. I find it silly to "see" a silence aura. It's only relevant for silent spectres anyway, other monsters will cast silence only after they have seen you.
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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 21:43

Re: New Unique Demon

galehar wrote:We're sliding off-topic, but silence aura is shown fine in tiles.
Continuing the slide, I think Galefury meant the halos that surround holy monsters; I did, at least.


omndra wrote:Yeah the more i think about this guy the more i think he should only show up in Pan/Hell
But not as a "Boss" more like a Mini boss.
(That way he could potentially tag team with Cerebov)
Unsliding, I don't like the idea of coupling it with any particular hellpan lord; they're unique enough as-is and I think a buddy would just weaken that, especially if it either makes them too difficult or throws off their themes.

omndra wrote:NINJAED
The message to display could be something like
"Its quiet.... too quiet"
and I don't like giving it a special message; other non-panlord uniques don't get that, and I see no reason why yours should.
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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 21:54

Re: New Unique Demon

MrMisterMonkey wrote:
galehar wrote:We're sliding off-topic, but silence aura is shown fine in tiles.
Continuing the slide, I think Galefury meant the halos that surround holy monsters; I did, at least.

True, holy aura aren't properly displayed in tiles.

MrMisterMonkey wrote:
omndra wrote:NINJAED
The message to display could be something like
"Its quiet.... too quiet"
and I don't like giving it a special message; other non-panlord uniques don't get that, and I see no reason why yours should.

He was suggesting a message for when a silence aura comes into view. As I said before, this is only relevant for silent spectres, since other monsters will only have a silence aura after they have cast the spell. And they don't cast until they see you.
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Swamp Slogger

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Post Monday, 16th May 2011, 23:32

Re: New Unique Demon

I don't think this guy should be silenced anymore, as thats Mennas thing.
When i posted that i didn't intend for it to come across as my monster should get a special message, thats just absurd.

I am at a loss as to how to make this guy threatening to mainly Casters without him getting instantly Firestormed.
Could he have some kindof Special "Spell Resistance" where he negates 60%-80% Damage taken from spells?

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Post Tuesday, 17th May 2011, 00:15

Re: New Unique Demon

It's not like everyone going into Pan has Firestorm or Tornado, the cool people (not me) just ninja the runes. If you do have Tornado not even the unique Pan lords are that much of a challenge (can someone please nerf Tornado?), and I hope you're not proposing making this thing stronger than Cerebov. Keep in mind that he might show up while you're low on mana or when turning a corner, unlike the fixed uniques you don't know if or where he will show up. And when you're doing Pan nothing that shows up at the edge of LOS should be able to threaten you, or you're going to die horribly to a bunch of fiends or something. Other things players and especially casters might have in Pan: cblink, semi cblink, wand of tele, wand of healing, wand of haste, one or two good attack wands, cboe, amulet of clarity (for cboe), staff of channeling. Probably not all of those, but at least some of those.
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Swamp Slogger

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Post Tuesday, 17th May 2011, 00:39

Re: New Unique Demon

No way he is going to be close to Cerebov.
I' ve got a good idea at how strong I want him to be.

I would like him to somewhere around Geryons strength.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 17th May 2011, 01:20

Re: New Unique Demon

If a unique hangs out mostly in Pan and levels 1-6 of the Hell branches, then that unique can be test-spawner hard for all it matters for the sake of 15-Rune completion. As long as the player doesn't get one-shotted, they can just run or teleport to the exit. I've run into Fire Storm ghosts on unique Pan Lord levels, and I doubt this unique would be all that much worse than the nastiest of player ghosts.

That said, it wouldn't be interesting to have truly unbeatable opponents hanging out. If there's nothing to be done but run for the portal, then that's obviously what everybody will do. No need to even think about it, or evaluate your current level of strength.

Nice thing about Silence is that it synergizes extremely well with any adds the player picks up while trying to escape. Did you wake up an ice fiend while trying to back out of the silence radius? Have fun with the fact that the ice fiend can cast just fine even if you can't. Mennas is really a solo threat, and he doesn't interact interestingly with anything else in the area. He just charges and blocks everything with his shield. There aren't so many support-oriented uniques out there yet.

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