Let's restring hellfire

[sardonica]

to "HellPain" or "HellAttack" or "HellOuchies" or anything which doesn't have "Fire" in it

That way it would be clear that rF does nothing.

I can't think of a good reason NOT to rename it.

[evilmike]

Despite ignoring your fire resistance, there are still a number of ways hellfire is related to fire:

- Things which are immune to hellfire are also immune to fire (the player can't get rHellfire, but monsters can)
- It burns scrolls
- It's heavily used in a fire themed branch (Gehenna) and is cast by a number of fire-themed uniques (Azrael, Asmodeus, and the Serpent of Hell [Geh flavour] are the ones I can think of)

This is clearly a fire-based attack. Instead of renaming it, it would be better to simply add a line somewhere (say, in the manual) that says something along the lines of "Fire resistance does not help against hellfire."

[pratamawirya]

Or show a message such as:

The hellion gestures.
The blast of hellfire hits you! Ouch, it's really not from this world!

[Deimos]

I thought of that too, but that really only helps those who get hit with it and still not notice. Not that it isn't common, but its better to tell them before the situation even appears.

And I'd suggest something like "It burns through your resistances!" to make it extra clear, in your example.

[njvack]

The blast of hellfire hits you! The goggles do nothing!

[Dustbin]

There are two other things that bother me a lot more: it ignores AC, and it has two versions with different targeting and different damage yet does very little to make it clear they're different. At the very least, I have trouble remembering whether brimstone fiends have hellfire, hellfire burst, or both.

I'd really like for the two different types to be made easier to tell apart as well, even if it's just another name like agony and torment have (I realise they're not really as close, but you get the idea).

[XuaXua]

Hell Energy. Hellergy.

[Bloax]

And I'd suggest something like "It burns through your resistances!" to make it extra clear, in your example.

I think this is the best solution.

[Jeremiah]

We could add hellfrost, hellpoison, hellectricity and helldraining, all of which ignore resistances and AC. Hell, we could have hellmutation, helleportation and hellbanishment too. Then players would quickly learn that anything starting with "hell" cannot be resisted.

[sardonica]

And I'd suggest something like "It burns through your resistances!" to make it extra clear, in your example.

I think this is the best solution.

This still implies that resistances do something

[Deimos]

Your resistances do nothing to protect you from the attack!

[MaXimillion]

Just change it from the current The blast of hellfire engulfs you! to The blast of irresistible hellfire engulfs you!

[KoboldLord]

Add rHellfire as a resist on the resistance list in the % screen. One pip, and you can't actually fill it in. But it's on a different line than rFire.

[njvack]

... and the rHellfire slot on % leaves open a possibility for a some means (divine, mutation, fixedart) of actually getting the resist, someday...

[Jabberwocky]

Adding rHellfire to the Sword of Cerebov would make sense.

[pratamawirya]

Adding rHellfire to the Sword of Cerebov would make sense.

No, I think it'd be overpowered (since rHellfire also gives 100% rF).

[Tiber]

Adding rHellfire to the Sword of Cerebov would make sense.

No, I think it'd be overpowered (since rHellfire also gives 100% rF).

For monsters, yes. But this game has never been big on player/monster symmetry, so there's no reason it'd have to be this way for the player.

[sardonica]

Adding rHellfire to the Sword of Cerebov would make sense.

No, I think it'd be overpowered (since rHellfire also gives 100% rF).

Ummm... once you have the Sword of Cerebov, it doesn't matter...

... because you no longer need the Sword of Cerebov.

[Bloax]

And I'd suggest something like "It burns through your resistances!" to make it extra clear, in your example.

This still implies that resistances do something

It burns THROUGH your RESISTANCES.

Through in this situation implies that it goes right through them. I don't think it gets any clearer without sounding overly silly.

[KoboldLord]

The trouble with a message like 'It burns right through your resistances!' is that this message implies there's something unusual about the fact that it goes through your resistances, when in fact it will do that every single time. It's more appropriate to use that sort of message if, say, you have a temporary debuff that causes you to take damage from fire as if you didn't have any resistance, like the effect of Cerebov's sword. Plus, it's unnecessary message clutter for everybody who does properly understand that resistances don't work against hellfire.