Amulet of Warding

[danr]

My other thread re "Faith is going all over the place, so I'll hive off at least this one other topic.

Amulets of Warding are pretty useless and could use a buff (or just be removed)

Some thoughts re possible changes to the amulet:
- Have an abjuration effect on summons that hit you?
- Change it into a damage-reflection ability ala the deep dwarf monster ability. The amount of damage reflection could be calibrated for balance so e.g. how often it works (perhaps it needs to be evoked to work for a duration?) and how much damage it reflects back
- Have it increase the chance of spell failure / miscast on summoning spells cast by enemies within LOS. It could have the same effect on the player. So they can't call their buddies, but you can't either. To prevent just amulet swapping for your own summoning, it should make friendly summons have a chance of turning hostile when you equip it.

[Galefury]

A fairly simple (at least design-wise) way to improve warding would be to have a chance of preventing all actions of summoned monsters in sight, not just melee attacks on you. They would move less, cast less, and attack you less. Very useful against all kinds of summons, not just against the fairly nonthreatening melee-only ones.

[BlackSheep]

What about a chance to cause summoned monsters to flee in panic instead of just flinching?

[eeviac]

The biggest problem with warding is that the things it protects from, you don't need protection from. Warding doesn't stop the summoned demons from tormenting/hellfiring/mutating you. It might stop that ice fiend from hitting you, but what in the world are you doing right next to a summoned ice fiend?

[danharaj]

Warding's purpose is better served by walking away.

[rchandra]

warding could give you an evokable (perhaps Mass) Abjuration, like amulet of berserk rage.

[bobross419]

% reduction against otherwise unresistable sources. Hellfire, maybe torment, etc. Wouldn't be too useful early game but would be pretty strong for extended. But it would serve the purpose of "warding" the wearer from harm and give another useful end game option.

[danr]

Either of those last two ideas would make it worthwhile. I'm guessing making something resistable that is currently unresistable would be seen as too big a change to overall game balance - that unresistable stuff is there to make sure even badass characters have to keep on their toes.

[bobross419]

Either of those last two ideas would make it worthwhile. I'm guessing making something resistable that is currently unresistable would be seen as too big a change to overall game balance - that unresistable stuff is there to make sure even badass characters have to keep on their toes.

Ya, but even 15-20% could make it worthwhile. Obviously the % could be tweaked. As it stands Hellfire isn't really all that bad unless I'm facing 3+ Hellfirers at once and Torment is just a huge pain causing a bunch of LOS dancing by melee or just straight up insta-nukes by casters. Maybe it wouldn't be all that worthwhile for some of the better players, but I would at least think twice about rMut vs. Ward in extended, as it stands now I just always go for rMut and damn the rest... And I know that in the past few days its suddenly come to light that rMut is worthless (seems to be the new "resists are pointless" bandwagon), but a lot of players still rely on it as their go to for end game.

[argonaut]

How about it allows you to walk through summons, swapping places or pushing them back, to get at the summoner (or escape). This would be even better if summons disappeared once the summoner was dead.

[Midpoint]

Wading through summons sounds situationally useful for melee. Nice if it let you shoot through the same summons with ranged (like the Fedhas firing through plants ability). With monsters picking up jewelry now, that could be very, ahem, interesting for a player summoner hiding behind a wall of summons who runs into an orc warlord with warding on.

The one time I found myself really using warding was with a SpAK. There were a couple moments when I used corruption as a low level character in a small space (like orc:1). Warding helped me not get killed by neutral summoned abyss monsters moving through tight quarters.

[KoboldLord]

% reduction against otherwise unresistable sources. Hellfire, maybe torment, etc. Wouldn't be too useful early game but would be pretty strong for extended. But it would serve the purpose of "warding" the wearer from harm and give another useful end game option.

It would certainly be useful in the early game. Orc priests kill more characters with their smiting ability than all deaths partially influenced by torment and hellfire combined.

[bobross419]

Good point, KL. i forgot all about those pesky priests.

[snow]

I'm for evocable mass abjuration from the amulet. For one it would allow players to complete zigs without spells.

[danr]

To sum up the suggested buffs:

- some (evokable?) (mass?) abjuration effect
- cause summons to flee in terror, not just flinch away
- mirror damage effect vs summons
- resistance to otherwise unresistable effects
- hamper all attacks of summons, not just melee
- enable player to walk through summons
- enable player to fire through summons

I really like either causing summons to flee. On that note, it could also be an evocable "cause fear" that would then "ward" anything that was susceptible to that spell.

I also really like just letting the player then wade through the summons. It's not so powerful in that it doesn't make anything disappear or do any damage even, but it does just cut through the clutter and enable the player to stem the flow of summons or possibly escape.

That would make it an interesting amulet, create a new melee mechanic, and yet still not be overpowered.

[dpeg]

Another (additional) option: when a summon wants to attack you while you wear the amulet, it may reconsider its step and turn against its master (the summoner) instead. The idea is that (a) you pull out "warding when needed, i.e. after the summon storm, and (b)tactical positioning is required: summons need to be able to attack you and the master. Just a quick thought.

[danr]

Summons that become friendly could also facilitate walking through them. Or would this be a one-time effect, a momentary defection only?

Another variation - it could have a confuse effect on summons within a certain radius. That would achieve the other stated proposal of hampering all their activity. It could be an evocable effect with a radius that declines over time, just like Silence. Summons within the area would be confused, but would instantly regain their sanity once out of the radius.

[giygas]

[quote="danr"Summons within the area would be confused, but would instantly regain their sanity once out of the radius.[/quote]

This sounds like a good idea, but I feel that the mass-abjuration evocable would have much greater utility. This seems a little underpowered because:
- enemies will just walk out of the radius
- enemies can still attack you, just with less of a chance
- this won't protect against torment, once the enemies wander out of the radius

That said, this sounds overpowered for melee characters. Who are the only ones who would have a use for it anyway.

[danharaj]

I'm still not sure any of these suggestions make "warding more useful than walking away.

[bobross419]

I'm still not sure any of these suggestions make "warding more useful than walking away.

A similar argument could be made for just about every item in the game.

[danr]

There's also the consideration of "what is more fun than walking away"?

I realize walking away is often the prudent thing to do, but a) it gets a bit boring, and b) it's not always an option at the point when you realize it's necessary.

The most prudent of all, of course, would be to not enter the dungeon at all.