Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract ideas!


Although the central place for design discussion is ##crawl-dev on freenode, some may find it helpful to discuss requests and suggestions here first.

Lair Larrikin

Posts: 17

Joined: Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 05:56

Post Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 07:05

Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract ideas!

Name: Dragon's Den

Branch Spawned: Anywhere

Monsters: rats, bats, snakes, cockroaches (for weaker dragons); undead humans, (for ice dragon), skeletal warriors (for shadow/golden dragons), drakes coordinating with dragon color, a random dragon OR draconians at the end

Loot: gold, a randart (with stronger dragons) or a ring or two (weaker dragons)

Description: In lower levels of the dungeon, these portal vaults spawn weaker dragons. Deeper in the dungeon, the end dragons are more likely to be stronger. Stronger dragons guard more worthy loot. There should also be a chance to get a draconian ending, where a pack of draconians guard their treasures.

Messages: None.

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Name: Dwarven Workshop

Branch Spawned: Possibly Elven Halls exclusive

Monsters: mostly dwarves, maybe an orc or elf here or there, golems

Loot: a few wands (with a high chance for one of them to be heal wounds, hasting, teleportation), recharging scrolls, gold

Description: These portals could spawn in the Elven Halls, giving those who can navigate their way through the infamously tedious elves in time a useful device.

Messages:
Entering the level:
In the distance: You hear the distant pounding of hammers.
Getting closer: You hear hammers heavily clanging against metal.
Upon portal closing: The pounding hammers fade to silence.
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Name: Elven Library

Branch Spawned: Earlier levels of the dungeon

Monsters: Spellcasters of various intelligent creatures

Loot: A couple of scrolls, books (no gold - libraries are free!)

Description: All books are randart with ONE spell per book. Maybe five or so will spawn, but the chances of getting repeats or lower level spells are VERY likely (though there's still that tiny chance to get something nice). Depicting a library would be difficult to do, and it does seem like a watered down version of a wizlab, but it has the potential to help players early on. Spell casters, however, also have a chance to kill players early (especially those who can't see invisible).

Message: None.

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Name: Religious Temple

Branch Spawned: Anywhere

Monsters: Intelligent monsters OR butterflies

Loot: Varies (read description)

Description: Each "temple" will generate based on a randomly selected god. Monsters spawned are "followers" of the god and possess skills accordingly (i.e. Trog's worshippers will berserk, Yredelemnul/Kiku worshippers will keep raising the dead, Xom's temple will have teleport traps/unreachable treasures, Elyvilon's will have butterflies/friendlies but loot will only include a curing potion, heal wounds, or two). Loot will also vary from god to god. As before mentioned, Xom's prizes could be decent, but unreachable. Trog's could be spellbooks, engulfed in roaring flames. Zin would have gold at the altar. If you happen to be lucky enough to get your own god, all monsters will be friendly or neutral.

Message: None.

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Name: Whirlpool/Sunken Ship

Branch Spawned: Shoals only

Monsters: various merfolk, fish, octopode, a kraken

Loot: gold, a ring or two, chance for a randart

Description: An alternative to this would be a sunken ship. These should spawn at the outer reaches of a shoals map, to almost ensure they are found in deep water. Plus, it gives adventurers the chance to encounter a kraken or lose levitation while trying to find one. Inside, monsters would be similar to shoals, but possibly more specific to the variatons of the branch.

Message: None.
Last edited by catbread on Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 16:44, edited 1 time in total.
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Dungeon Master

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Joined: Sunday, 20th November 2011, 01:52

Post Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 13:03

Re: Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract id

* We're supposed to have portal branches now, not that anybody really uses this term.
* Early dragons, good, early hides and risk/reward, also good, though sensible players would avoid nearly-assured death by dragon. Monster-to-dragon and loot connections/balance seem weak or nonsensical (D:1 trash period? Handful of rings and randarts makes me think you haven't read much of vault code), but the idea (which has been around for a while) is pretty good.
* The Dwarven Halls are planned to eventually become a one-level offshoot of the Elven Halls, but current dwarf variety is too weak (Unborns are Deep Dwarf Necromancer Death Knights? No crossbow or earth elementalist dwarves?) and non-electric golems are horribly tedious to build even a regular portal branch. Wouldn't bother without more content available, and the history of the branch's tangential mythology-based content is not very encouraging.
* Elven Library doesn't sound bad, but do note that the current incarnation of a spellcaster-spam portal branch (the deep elf Bailey) is already nearly overly difficult.
* Holypan doesn't spawn for worshippers of good gods because free loot and friendly monsters is flavourful but quite boring - why not just have some messages calling it a trial or a test of faith?. Loot again seems to be off-kilter (random Xom gifts would be actually worth going through Xom's tricks, etc.) and monsters and gods are not particularly aligned, making quite a bit of spoiler-ish custom content required to really make much of it work. I'd leave this to regular vaults for a while.
* You seem to have pasted your template twice without changing the second one.
* The Whirlpool sounds more like some vault ideas for Shoals rather then a portal branch splitting off from the floor anyway- portal branches should be unique and distinct, and a modified, significantly less randomized floor of the branch it's found in sounds quite weird.

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I think that while earlygame benefits most from more portal vaults (easier to control difficulty, appreciated by larger section of players), the midlategame slog (Vaults, Crypt, Late D) has almost no danger-related portal vaults (thus excluding Bazaars and Troves, there are only late Ice Caves and Wizlabs left) in comparsion, thus leaving an obvious design space gap. I've got my own ideas for a ziggurat-esque offshoot based around timed "gameshow"-esque gauntlets, but the heavy lua required has left me to perpetually put it off for a while, and most of the portal branch will be in the layouts, leaving much of further explanation without code unnecessary.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Joined: Thursday, 10th February 2011, 18:30

Post Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 14:45

Re: Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract id

See The Portal Vaults Page on the Dev Wiki

Contains the following:

Radiant Caverns - mutation/glow focused portal

Colosseum - a $ betting challenge fighting arena

Dreamsmoke Pits - something about blocking line of sight and forges

Dragon's Den - something with dragons; kind of redundant with the dragon den vault and the ice cave ending with frost dragons

Item Portals - short ideas about portals designed around items

Testing Grounds - sort of zig-esque arena/proving grounds / colosseum where you fight instead of bet.

Demon Pit - portal filled with demons; possibly redundant with demon-filled ice cave

Chessboard - portal rules based on chess

Astral Plane - an out of body quest for magical knowledge
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Tartarus Sorceror

Posts: 1776

Joined: Monday, 21st February 2011, 15:57

Location: South Carolina

Post Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 15:14

Re: Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract id

Name: Garden

Branch Spawned: Same as Wizlab

Monsters: Depends on which garden:
A:The black garden from Hercules's labors: Atlas (Giant who shrugs to cast shatter and fireball) and bands of Hesperides (Nymphs, insubstantials with confusing touch, blink, and darkness who walk through trees)
B:The garden Perseus visited, which might be the same as the black garden, guarded by Ladon, the hundred-headed dragon with the mesmerizing voice, that can cast many hexes, and bands of Hyades (Nymphs who create rain clouds and conjure ball lightning)
C:The hunting grounds of Hyas, a master archer, and bands of Pleiades, who summon animals, polymorph animals into larger ones, and transform themselves into invulnerable but inert stars to escape when harmed.
D:Eden, which still contains the Tree of Life even though Eve shared the fruit of the tree of knowledge of good and evil with Adam, is said to be guarded by flaming swords and cherubim. So make hall of blades style long blades of holy wrath, controlled blink, and permanent ring of flames. Supplement them with Angels, Daevas, or the like.

Loot: Several Greek myths talk about golden fruit that let one who eats it become immortal, and the bible says the fruit of the tree of life lets one live forever. There is some etymological evidence the fruit of legend is a quince, and crawl doesn't have quinces yet. Golden Apples are often mentioned. The fruit should do something good for the player to make the risk pay off. Here are some options:
Refill all health and mp while removing mutations and curing statuses like rot, slow, and confusion.
Give a felid-style extra life to any player.
Give death's door style invulnerability for a time.
I'm not sure any of these are the best idea.


----------------------------------------------------

Name: Wasteland

Branches: Same as Labyrinth

Monsters: None

The wasteland is kind of like a labyrinth, in that you wander a lot and don't see many monsters while looking for loot. It's a huge open area, perhaps a cross or an octagon. There are hell like effects:
In the desert wasteland, the sun damages you periodically unless you have rF. Sand storms move around like twisters or wandering silent spectres, and damage you with a check that moderate AC nullifies.
In the tundra wasteland, the cold damages you periodically unless you have rC. Avalanches move around and throw boulders, which usually miss anything with moderate EV.
In the flood wasteland, which has lots of shallow and deep water, strong currents periodically damage anything that isn't flying. Strong winds periodically damage anything that is flying. Messages precede these effects like in volcanoes. Twisters wander around.

Loot:
In all the wastelands, the player starts in the center. In various corners are spots with specific items:
The exit
A teleport trap
Food
Consumables
A pile of one to three acquirement quality items like you'd find in a Labyrinth

Walking between the corners should be far enough that it takes about a ration for a human.

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 3163

Joined: Friday, 6th January 2012, 18:45

Post Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 15:25

Re: Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract id

jejorda2 wrote:Name: Wasteland
Monsters: None
...wasteland stuff...
Walking between the corners should be far enough that it takes about a ration for a human.

Levels aren't that big in crawl. Even twisty levels like a Labyrinth can be navigated in less time.
And if the only enemy is the environment, then players would leave immediately if they don't have the required resistances. If you don't put an exit right near the entrance, which is the norm for portal vaults now, then players won't go in unless they have all the resistances they could need.
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Dungeon Master

Posts: 332

Joined: Friday, 15th July 2011, 22:43

Post Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 19:27

Re: Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract id

I mentioned this in another post, and still haven't gotten to writing up something more formal, but I'd really love to see a portal branch somewhere between the Vaults entrance and d27 that forces you to deal with a random god's wrath while searching for the treasure/exit. Not all gods would necessarily work (Sif wrath on a berserker), and many of them have pretty similar wraths(Vehumet and Makhleb have a lot of overlap), but it could be an excellent challenge for that part of the game.

I also really like the idea of calling it the "Inimical Temple" because then it provides a good counterpoint for the Ecumenical Temple.

Lair Larrikin

Posts: 17

Joined: Tuesday, 12th June 2012, 05:56

Post Wednesday, 13th June 2012, 00:58

Re: Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract id

claws wrote: * The Dwarven Halls are planned to eventually become a one-level offshoot of the Elven Halls, but current dwarf variety is too weak (Unborns are Deep Dwarf Necromancer Death Knights? No crossbow or earth elementalist dwarves?) and non-electric golems are horribly tedious to build even a regular portal branch. Wouldn't bother without more content available, and the history of the branch's tangential mythology-based content is not very encouraging.

First of all, thanks! I appreciate the feedback. However, I'm not entirely sure what you're saying here, and I'd like a bit more clarity. I'm just now getting into this game and community, so sorry if I'm out of the loop on a lot of common issues. Simply navigating the site is still a pretty tedious task for me (shamefully enough admitted). I'm getting something of the drift of "It's been thought of, and it will possibly be done with more resources (the creation of more dwarves)." I don't understand which aspect golems are "tedious." Like, actually killing them, building them as monsters, generating them in the game, or building a portal branch where they're functional? You're right, I haven't read much vault code, but as I said, I'm new and I may be trying to jump into the deep end before learning to swim. (If there's a kiddie pool section, please- show me the way!) In regards to dwarf variety, in it a matter of the sprites not being created yet? I've tried my hand at a few. I'll attach those.


claws wrote: * Elven Library doesn't sound bad, but do note that the current incarnation of a spellcaster-spam portal branch (the deep elf Bailey) is already nearly overly difficult.

Since I think these should occur early on, I think it should be limited to just a couple of spell casters. Maybe an orc priest or two and a slightly stronger Elven librarian whose the main person to deal with. I've given this character a shot, and I'll also attach her sprite.

If loot seems off-kilter, then that can easily be modified. I'm purely brain storming and I appreciate any more realistic changes that you'd have to add.

On a somewhat unrelated note, the Dwarven area in my head is a somewhat humorous reference to Dwarf Fortress. Upon entering it, a message alerts you that one dwarf quits his work, and he immediately goes berserk. From there, everyone starts to attack you. Young/baby dwarves could also attack, almost worthless at doing damage, but they eat your food.
Or alternatively, it could be an almost steam-punk-esque deal. Enchanted tools would follow you, draining you as enchanted weapons do in the hall of blades. Perhaps it could be an alternative of the Hall of Blades.

I get what you're saying about the whirlpool being too similar to the shoals, though. I'll completely rethink the idea.

Here's a couple of sprites (regardless of if my ideas come to life) that I've created.
Attachments
dwarvenworkshop.png
Dwarven Workshop Door
dwarvenworkshop.png (4.22 KiB) Viewed 2378 times
elf-librarian.png
Elf Librarian
elf-librarian.png (3.48 KiB) Viewed 2378 times
dwarf-civilian.png
Dwarf Civilian
dwarf-civilian.png (3.92 KiB) Viewed 2378 times
dwarf-wizard2.png
Dwarf Wizard 2
dwarf-wizard2.png (4.32 KiB) Viewed 2378 times
dwarf-wizard1.png
Dwarf Wizard 1
dwarf-wizard1.png (4.3 KiB) Viewed 2378 times
dwarf-warrior1.png
Dwarf Warrior
dwarf-warrior1.png (4.17 KiB) Viewed 2378 times

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 6393

Joined: Friday, 17th December 2010, 18:17

Post Wednesday, 13th June 2012, 01:27

Re: Portal vault ideas! Please critique, add, or subtract id

catbread: make sure to read the guidelines for posting design suggestions, here: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=1410

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