Trunk: Dj caster of Ash OP?


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Slime Squisher

Posts: 406

Joined: Thursday, 16th June 2011, 18:36

Post Sunday, 31st October 2021, 05:19

Trunk: Dj caster of Ash OP?

I tried out the new Djinn with new (to me) Ashenzari in Trunk and promptly escaped with the Orb! https://crawl.kelbi.org/crawl/morgue/Sh ... 194214.txt

It felt interesting and fun. I like the constraint of working with an innate, unfolding spell set.

My one concern from a game design perspective is that Ash adapts in a very friendly way when choosing equipment-cursing boosts to offer to an Innate Caster (spell schools unavailable, Spellpower determines all).

Not offered to Djinni:
Alchemy: Poison Magic, Transmutations
Beguiling: Conjurations, Hexes, Translocations
Companions: Summonings, Necromancy
Elements: Fire Magic, Ice Magic, Air Magic, Earth Magic

Ash thus only offers:
Cunning: Dodging, Stealth
Evocations: Evocations
Fortitude: Armour, Shields
Introspection (aka Self): Fighting, Spellcasting
Melee Combat: All melee weapon skills, including Unarmed Combat
Ranged Combat: Slings, Bows, Crossbows, Throwing

My clear priorities were Introspection and Cunning. Since for Djinni there are only 6 boosts to draw from and they're offered in pairs, it is more likely than not to get one of those two for each Curse-opportunity offered. I was able to stop skilling Spellcasting (-3 apt) at 18.6 because I had a boosted skill of 27 due to getting Introspection on 6 slots by passing up bad combos. As I started clearing Zot:5 on a 3-rune run I also had 27 Dodging and 27 Fighting. Shields and Amour both ended up around 25 because with a small pool it wasn't hard to get a bunch of Fortitude boosts too. It honestly felt more generous than I imagine Ash is meant to be.

My thought for how to improve this would be to have Ash continue to draw from all 10 boosts for a skill-restricted character, and represent deactivated skills in the boost in grey text. Only ensure that at least *one* of the pair of boosts offered is usable. eg: for the first boost pick from all 10, and if the first one chosen is all greytext, keep it but pick the second from the shorter list that character can use. Otherwise pick the second boost from all 10 as well.

For much of that game I would have taken a curse offer with Introspection + greytext without reservation. On a Djinni it's just so good. ("HP casting" so Fighting = both durability and sustained damage output, and Spellcasting is the entire killdudes kit.)
Won with: KeAE^Sif, NaWz^Sif, NaTm^Chei, SpEn^Nmlx, GrEE^Qaz, HOFE^Veh, MiBe^Trog, DrFE^Hep, FoFi^Zin, CeHu^Oka, DjFE^Ash, DrIE^Ru, FeSu^Jiy, GnCA^Usk.
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Long-term goal: complete the pantheon.
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Pandemonium Purger

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Joined: Monday, 24th October 2011, 06:13

Post Sunday, 31st October 2021, 16:13

Re: Trunk: Dj caster of Ash OP?

Yeah that sounds way too fun :evil:
seattle washington. friends for life. mods hate on me and devs ignore my posts. creater of exoelfs and dc:pt

Abyss Ambulator

Posts: 1131

Joined: Tuesday, 4th January 2011, 15:03

Post Sunday, 31st October 2021, 18:28

Re: Trunk: Dj caster of Ash OP?

If djinns of makhleb are not overpowered, then djinn of ash also not.

Yes, you had good skills, but:
- as a djinn, even if you have high spellcasting, you can only get the high level spells late in the game. In my djinn game I started as a fighter, went makhleb, and had no problem casting any spell I got. So higher spellcasting would only meant higher spellpower. However
- you did not switched to a conjuration staff: your spellpower was lower than a djinn of makhleb
- you had good defense skills, but due to cursed equipment you could have a little bit worse equipment (you could not enchant them after you cursed them, neither to switch quickly when you find something new).
- You had higher hp, but no heal on kills

I think djinn of ash can be good, but so djinn of makhleb. I found djinns strong, but not extremely so.

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nago, petercordia
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Pandemonium Purger

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Joined: Monday, 24th October 2011, 06:13

Post Monday, 1st November 2021, 18:19

Re: Trunk: Dj caster of Ash OP?

I wish Djinn gifts came half as often and selectable amongst two spells
seattle washington. friends for life. mods hate on me and devs ignore my posts. creater of exoelfs and dc:pt

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