Standardize launcher ammunition

[Factorialite]

When playing a ranged character, there are several different types of weapons. This is good: bows are different than crossbows are different than slings. What doesn't feel as good is that there are 3 (or 4 if you include stones) different types of ammunition: bolts, arrows, sling bullets, and stones. This perhaps made sense when ammunition could be branded, but it doesn't make sense anymore. It's a tedious facet of the game that seems to exist only as a nod to flavor. Different amounts of unique launcher ammo is not going to change which launcher you use; all it will do is make the player unduly suffer if they don't come across arrows/bolts/sling bullets for some reason. Last, some characters don't take on a ranged attack option until later in the game (based on what they see). This change allows them to take all ammo they find in anticipation of picking up a ranged option rather than having to through the whole dungeon just to pick up the ammo for whatever respective weapon they choose. I propose all launcher ammo be consolidated to the standard item "ammunition", which fits into any launcher.

[watertreatmentRL]

The entire design space of launchers could be covered easily by three or four kinds of bows. It seems to me that's the way to address the situation you describe here.

[Elitist]

The entire design space of launchers could be covered easily by three or four kinds of bows. It seems to me that's the way to address the situation you describe here.

I feel like something similar could be said about melee weapons, though. And if that's true, I don't think the dev team cares because they've put a lot of time and effort into differentiating melee weapons from one another, which I really appreciate and would be sad to see go.

[watertreatmentRL]

That's true: You could go down to a system with just axes, polearms, knives, and swords without any major loss. That would also be good. I do not believe the developers buy into this sunk cost idea of yours.

[Elitist]

That's true: You could go down to a system with just axes, polearms, knives, and swords without any major loss. That would also be good. I do not believe the developers buy into this sunk cost idea of yours.

I really think we'll have to agree to disagree, because the change to long blades tells me that they do.

I really like the thought of cutting down on launchers and their ammunition, if only to remove the early game penalty for using them. Alternatively, we could do something ridiculous like ToME does, which is give all launchers a maximum amount of shots that can be fired consecutively, and then have a player rest to recharge their quiver.

[Fingolfin]

Alternatively, we could do something ridiculous like ToME does, which is give all launchers a maximum amount of shots that can be fired consecutively, and then have a player rest to recharge their quiver.

You mean spells and mana ?

[amaril]

It's a tedious facet of the game that seems to exist only as a nod to flavor. Different amounts of unique launcher ammo is not going to change which launcher you use; all it will do is make the player unduly suffer if they don't come across arrows/bolts/sling bullets for some reason.

The existence of multiple types of ammo serves to differentiate the different ranged options. Slings have abundant ammo in the very early game & are cheap to use, but become less powerful as the game progresses. The player will never have enough bullets to use on everything. Bows require a little more investment/remain powerful all game, but the player has far fewer arrows than bullets/stones until the late dungeon when centaur packs start appearing. Crossbows are powerful but require a lot of investment to get to low delay, and the player may not have enough ammo to depend upon xbows until vaults. "[Making] the player unduly suffer if they don't come across arrows" is arguably good design--it could be rephrased as "making the player adapt."

Ultimately, though, ammo doesn't do enough to differentiate the ranged weapons, and is a huge hassle to pick up & be careful not to lose (in deep water etc), so I would be happy to see ammo go/ become unified and always mulch. The one place where ammo effectively differentiates weapon types is with throwing, which has scarce enough available ammo that the player must be selective in their use of it. Throwing is problematic tho because it is the worst offender re: inventory screw and item destruction.