Make it clear Minotaurs don't retaliate on blocked attacks.

[milski]

See title.

[Midn8]

I think that both riposte and headbutt should trigger on a block because shields lower your EV and I am pretty sure shields go first (you try to block an attack b4 trying to dodge it). Also I like the idea of adding SH to longblades, but thats a different story.

[jwoodward48ss]

No, add SH to staves!

[neil]

Rather than making headbutt etc. trigger on shield blocks, I would suggest checking dodging before shields. That way being better at shield blocks neither increases the chance of getting a headbutt (as it would if blocks triggered headbutts) nor decreases it (as it currently does: a successful block means you don't even try to dodge).

[Sar]

reflection nerf!

[Siegurt]

Rather than making headbutt etc. trigger on shield blocks, I would suggest checking dodging before shields. That way being better at shield blocks neither increases the chance of getting a headbutt (as it would if blocks triggered headbutts) nor decreases it (as it currently does: a successful block means you don't even try to dodge).

As a side benefit, this would be a slight downgrade for rMsl/dMsl.

[jwoodward48ss]

How about adding together dodge/block chances, using that for notHit chance, and then using the relative size to determine which it is? Nice and neutral.

[duvessa]

reflection nerf!

...and a shield buff otherwise.

[Implojin]

Rather than making headbutt etc. trigger on shield blocks, I would suggest checking dodging before shields. That way being better at shield blocks neither increases the chance of getting a headbutt (as it would if blocks triggered headbutts) nor decreases it (as it currently does: a successful block means you don't even try to dodge).

I was looking for something to write, so I put a patch for this on mantis. I've tried to keep the existing behavior otherwise intact while moving the dodge check up.

https://crawl.develz.org/mantis/view.php?id=10722

[jwoodward48ss]

reflection nerf!

...and a shield buff otherwise.

[jwoodward48ss]

reflection nerf!

...and a shield buff otherwise.

...for characters with aux-attacks.

Also, my solution has the benefit of "shields don't hurt Mi" without any sort of buffs or nerfs at all, except maybe slightly, ever so slightly,

[duvessa]

reflection nerf!

...and a shield buff otherwise.

...for characters with aux-attacks.

No, for everyone. When you block an attack, subsequent blocks on that turn are more difficult. Right now, if you're meleeing a hydra or autoexplore into a centaur pack, your SH gets eaten up within the first few attacks, then your EV is all that's left. With this change, your EV would apply first to every hit, meaning that you only lose block value when your EV roll fails, meaning that fewer attacks will hit you.

[jwoodward48ss]

Ah, didn't know that. Seems kind of minimal, though, as in the ONLY PART OF THE GAME THAT MATTERS, decent SH and decent EV are frequently XOR - one or the other, not both.