showing all spells in one window

[HardboiledGargoyle]

Untitled.png (40.38 KiB) Viewed 3357 times

the following two codeboxes fit into a standard console window and thus demonstrate one way that it can be done. (The spell lists below are only a little incorrect.) This can be done separately as a pure UI improvement without any other changes, but is especially useful if you want to turn spellbooks into consumable items that grant spells you are allowed to memorize at any time, as if from the player's personal spellbook/library. This would happen if you pressed 4 with this menu open, and the next step would be to press e.g. D to see the description of Cause Fear:

  Code:

Select a spell level and then a spell to read its description, or memorize it.
Spells you don't have are displayed dark gray. You have 21/24 spell levels left.

  *LEVEL 1* [e]CPoison [h]MCloud  [F]FLance  [h]FBall   [h]Dispers [g]ROFlames
 [a]ASkelet [f]EHiber  [i]OArmour [G]FPrism  [i]Irrad   [i]FCloud  [h]SServitor
 [b]Apport  [g]RMsl    [j]Passwall[H]IceForm [j]IBSphere[j]Haste   [i]SGDemon
 [c]BAppend [h]SRay    [k]PProj   [I]IMBlast [k]LRD     [k]HydForm [j]SHydra
 [d]Corona  [i]SOGolub [l]Recall  [J]LLiquef [l]BOLight [l]Invis   [k]BReviv
 [e]FTongue [j]Slow    [m]Regen   [K]OTRad   [m]MEnglac [m]IronShot
 [f]Freeze  [k]SOSlay  [n]SpWeapon[L]POGolub [n]Silence [n]MConfus  *LEVEL 8*
 [g]Infusion[l]STSnakes[o]SpForm  [M]Petrify [o]SDemon  [o]ORefrig [a]ChLight
 [h]MDart   [m]SOBlood [p]StDisch [N]StFlame [p]SForest [p]PArrow  [b]CBlink

  Code:

 [i]Pain    [n]Swift   [q]StArrow [O]SIBeast [q]SMViper [q]PCloud  [c]DDoor
 [j]SBlast  [o]TFlame  [r]SGGolem [P]SLSpire [r]BOVenom [r]Simulac [d]Discord
 [k]Shock   [p]TFrost  [s]TOther  [Q]TIcicle [s]WWeapon [s]SCreat  [e]Disjunc
 [l]Sting              [t]TDance                        [t]StatForm[f]LCSpear
 [m]SButter  *LEVEL 3* [u]VpDrain  *LEVEL 5*  *LEVEL 6*            [g]Necromut
 [n]SSMammal[a]CCanine            [a]Agony   [a]AOAbjur  *LEVEL 7* [h]SHThings
            [b]Confuse  *LEVEL 4* [b]BlHands [b]BOCold  [a]DFBall   
  *LEVEL 2* [c]CFlame  [A]AStrike [c]BODrain [c]BOFire  [b]DrForm    *LEVEL 9*
 [a]Blink   [d]DSpray  [B]AlIntox [d]BOMagma [d]CBLight [c]Haunt   [a]FStorm
 [b]CImp    [e]GGravit [C]ADead   [e]CEmbrace[e]Darkness[d]MGateway[b]Glaciate
 [c]CTouch  [f]IgPoison[D]CFear   [f]DUndead [f]DChannel[e]MMenag  [c]Shatter
 [d]CRot    [g]InFlame [E]CUndead [g]ExWounds[g]DMsl    [f]OOD     [d]Tornado

[duvessa]

this seems significantly harder to read than the scrolling list

[dpeg]

I agree with duvessa.
For various purposes, including this one, it might be useful to have a two column display. There are a bunch of subtle issues with that, I don't think it is outright trivial. (Other uses would be: optional display for Ctrl-F, Ctrl-X etc.)

[HardboiledGargoyle]

a scrolling list is better for reaching Lair, but then you collect several books and pile them up and you end up with a huge long list of spells in an order that is often unhelpful. With all spells on one screen, you never have to scroll, and you get used to the layout so that your eyes remember where to look to see whether a certain spell is available. You also get a better sense of what spells are at your disposal if you can see it all at once. But, yes, a list ordered by chance of spell success can be more useful. What two column display? This one has 7 columns, the game has 1.

[duvessa]

I agree with duvessa.

brb, updating my forum signature

[HardboiledGargoyle]

A better illustration. Let's suppose you find Annihilations, Burglary, Cantrips, Death, Earth, and Flames. What spells do you have?
As the game goes on, you may become more eager to know what spells you're missing than what spells you already have.
BTW it's not hard to keep all the spells in any spell level to 1 column only, but I don't know if that's important, and I think the lack of empty spaces here looks nice.

Untitled.png (40.38 KiB) Viewed 3392 times

[Tiktacy]

I think HBG has a really nice idea going here.

I think it would be overwhelming for many new players to see that as the default, but allowing to change to that view instead would alleviate the issue with having to scroll through to find the spells your want that are seemingly in a random order after factoring in level.

I would also like to add that, to make it a bit more useful, to have all spells available on all floors and in shops be color coded, making it easier to decide on how you want to allocate your spell levels. So for example: Spells you know would be white, spells you have access to at that moment would be light green, spells that are available but simply not in your inventory or at your feet would be dark green, spells only available in shops would be yellow, and unavailable spells would be gray. Those of course are just examples, but its just an example of how one might do that.

Lastly, it appears that you put some work into this, so props to you HBG for going the extra mile.

[Tiktacy]

I just realized if this were added, the devs could get rid of spellbooks requiring to be carried and make it so reading them once gives you access to all spells in contains permanently. As it stands, the only thing really preventing this is the bad user interface of spells when there are a lot of spells available(which this can potentially solve).

[duvessa]

Oh, I didn't realize from the OP that you wanted to show unseen spells in the list as well. Yes, I'd like to have that screen.

[Siegurt]

I'm not clear on how you are intended to select spells which have the same letters in the suggestion, do you hit a number for the spell level and then the letter? Do you arrow around? How would I interact with this list?

[HardboiledGargoyle]

Yes, Siegurt, that's the idea. I select a spell level, those spells stand out somehow, then I press a letter. You can even have commands for changing the 'highlighted' spell level by 1. Console games often have interfaces like this for large menus, due to lack of mouse support. Crawl tends to make you scroll in the memorization screen anyway, with PageUp and PageDown, and has no problem assigning the same letter to multiple spells. The first line can be more like what is normally seen in Crawl's menus:

  Code:

[1-9: specify spell level. z/x: shift spell level. a-u: view spell. Esc exits.]

[HardboiledGargoyle]

I just realized if this were added, the devs could get rid of spellbooks requiring to be carried and make it so reading them once gives you access to all spells in contains permanently. As it stands, the only thing really preventing this is the bad user interface of spells when there are a lot of spells available(which this can potentially solve).

Recent thread. That would also reduce the cost of Book Amnesia. Destroying a book has 2 costs:
-you can no longer memorize spells you have in that book and nowhere else.
-you cannot use that book to forget spells anymore.
This would get rid of the first cost, but I actually think that's a good thing. Currently, you have to be careful not to destroy such a combination of books that you lose access to spells you may still want, and that's a large part of why book amnesia makes players averse to using it. And that's a bad thing since book amnesia is not so damn important anyway.

[Tiktacy]

I just realized if this were added, the devs could get rid of spellbooks requiring to be carried and make it so reading them once gives you access to all spells in contains permanently. As it stands, the only thing really preventing this is the bad user interface of spells when there are a lot of spells available(which this can potentially solve).

Recent thread. That would also reduce the cost of Book Amnesia. Destroying a book has 2 costs:
-you can no longer memorize spells you have in that book and nowhere else.
-you cannot use that book to forget spells anymore.
This would get rid of the first cost, but I actually think that's a good thing. Currently, you have to be careful not to destroy such a combination of books that you lose access to spells you may still want, and that's a large part of why book amnesia makes players averse to using it. And that's a bad thing since book amnesia is not so damn important anyway.

Book amnesia is basically an easter egg anyway.

[Sar]

minmay says he wants to have that screen because having all the spells in the game fitting neatly on one screen would be a strong argument against adding more spells

[Tiktacy]

minmay says he wants to have that screen because having all the spells in the game fitting neatly on one screen would be a strong argument against adding more spells

There already exists a spell for just about every niche imaginable. Any "new spells" would most likely be better suited as replacements for older and less interesting ones, if at all.

Also, I think you can reduce the size of the font to make more room anyway.

[Sar]

I don't think that's how terminal pseudographics work.

[HardboiledGargoyle]

while I agree that hindering the addition of further spells is a positive side-effect, size of font is overshadowed by respect for the standard console window which is 80x24 characters. The biggest spell level has 22 spells (from a to v) which leaves room for e.g. 1 instruction line and 1 line with "LEVEL #" headers. Remove spells until each level has at most 20 spells, put in a description line and an empty line, and you can get a very even, neat view, though with some empty spaces at the bottom.

  Code:

  Level 1   Level 2   Level 3   Level 4   Level 5   Level 6   Level 7       <- lined up

 spells                                                      spells
 spells                                                      spells
                                                              Level 8

  Level 9                                                    spells
 
 spells

[Rast]

While I like the idea of reducing the number of spells in the game, that screen seems a bit crowded.

[duvessa]

minmay says he wants to have that screen because having all the spells in the game fitting neatly on one screen would be a strong argument against adding more spells

sadly you might notice that the existing number of spells is already too large to fit on one screen in the mockup screenshot

[Sar]

first you get the spell screen in, then you remove some spells for them to fit

[HardboiledGargoyle]

funny, but that's how we set the max number of spells you can have memorized to 21.