Use crosstrained skill, not base skill

[Hurkyl]

To the best of my knowledge, when crosstraining is involved, one's base skill in some skill is completely irrelevant. Consequently, I propose the UI should communicate in terms of the crosstrained level of skill, not the base skill. Two relevant UI elements are:

• In the skill training screen, the cost number
• Messages when you achieve a skill level

[Sprucery]

But doesn't the skill cost for training the next level depend on the level of the base skill?

[Hurkyl]

I believe that your (total) skill level is determined simply by the skill points you put into the skill plus a fraction of the skill points you put into the related skills. The base skill level is simply a measure of how many skill points were allocated directly rather than acquired through cross training, and so isn't really relevant to anything.

[neil]

I think that is reasonable, since you can't lose levels of crosstraining (though I suppose draining affects crosstrained skills more significantly).

One difficulty is that this would imply that (say) axe users get messages about their m+f and polearms going up (at the same time), even if they're not interested in such weapons. On the other hand, that could be avoided by only giving messages about skills you're actually putting XP into (which is probably how it's implemented anyway).

[Siegurt]

I believe that your (total) skill level is determined simply by the skill points you put into the skill plus a fraction of the skill points you put into the related skills. The base skill level is simply a measure of how many skill points were allocated directly rather than acquired through cross training, and so isn't really relevant to anything.

You are incorrect, the number of skill points it takes to raise a skill doesn't increase when you train a related skill, the training cost portion of the screen accurately represents what it's supposed to represent.

You could make an argument for alerting at modified levels instead of base levels, but then you have to decide what to do with all the temporary (positive and negative) modifiers.

[neil]

I believe that your (total) skill level is determined simply by the skill points you put into the skill plus a fraction of the skill points you put into the related skills. The base skill level is simply a measure of how many skill points were allocated directly rather than acquired through cross training, and so isn't really relevant to anything.

You are incorrect, the number of skill points it takes to raise a skill doesn't increase when you train a related skill, the training cost portion of the screen accurately represents what it's supposed to represent.

The number of skill points to raise the *base* skill doesn't increase, but the number of skill points to raise the *enhanced* skill by a level is higher than if you weren't crosstrained. The faster progression of the base skill is counteracted by the cross-training bonus (which is a number of skill points) becoming worth fewer levels as you progress the base skill.

[Siegurt]

Hm, good point, perhaps the "training cost" should be effected by the _ (modified/unmodified) status then, Although it'd look weird if my drained skills suddenly appear to cost less to increase, it might be misleading or confusing if it factors in temporary changes to skill.

[Pollen_Golem]

How about ceasing the blue nonsense and simply make e.g. training LBl dump an additional free 40% skillpoints into SBl? Then blue font will be used for Okawaru and Ashenzari but not crosstraining.

When you lower a skill using Ashenzari skill transfer, make it deplete related crosstrained skills.

Keep track of skill points beyond getting a crosstrained skill to 27, to allow training all skills to 27 before crosstraining bonuses.

[Hurkyl]

That sounds like a good change to simplify the mechanic.

However, the implementation would still have to keep track of how much training was done normally; otherwise it would let skill transfer siphon off the SBl cross training to fuel LBl training, which is probably too good. I think the net effect would be that, if you have the piety to spare, you get to boost the rate you train LBl by just over 30%.

[Pollen_Golem]

Oh, like if you trained LBl to 27, then siphoned off all of your SBl skill to dodging, thus getting significant sub-27 skill in LBl with absolutely no skill in SBl.

I hadn't thought of that. You could halt Skill Transfer when you deplete a skill to the minimum level you can have with current crosstraining, but yeah - that's ugly. It's exclusively a Skill Transfer problem, though - just 1 rarely used god ability.

[WingedEspeon]

How about ceasing the blue nonsense and simply make e.g. training LBl dump an additional free 40% skillpoints into SBl? Then blue font will be used for Okawaru and Ashenzari but not crosstraining.

When you lower a skill using Ashenzari skill transfer, make it deplete related crosstrained skills.

Keep track of skill points beyond getting a crosstrained skill to 27, to allow training all skills to 27 before crosstraining bonuses.

This is a bad idea because the game deceases the amount of skill xp you gain based on based on how much skill xp you have already gained.