Berder wrote:Siegurt wrote:I encounter limitations on what I can carry vs what I want to carry in every single game I play, I am forced to make some kind of sacrifice.
While this is true, you do have to make sacrifices - it doesn't mean the sacrifices you make have a large tactical impact. Many of the things I carry in my packed 52-item inventory are useful sometimes, but in practice I need them only rarely. Increasing the inventory size would just add more items that would be used rarely, for a small tactical impact.
Increasing my inventory limit in any fashion decisively and significantly increases my available power level for every fight after the point I would be full.
I deny it. Post your most recent dump with 52 items and tell me 8 more items you would like to add, that would decisively and significantly increase your power level. You might do things like add more elemental evocables - which can be useful, except that you probably already have lots of other evocables you could use instead. The increase in power level would be small.
Ask and ye shall recieve, Here's the inventory of one of my in-progress games (I'm at vault:4)
- Code:
Inventory:
Hand weapons
a - a +8 great mace of electrocution
b - a +8 blowgun
l - a +0 demon whip of freezing
v - the +2 great mace of the Hawk (weapon) {vamp, Stlth+}
(You found it in an ice cave)
It inflicts no extra harm, but heals its wielder somewhat when it strikes a
living foe.
It makes you more stealthy.
Missiles
d - 4 throwing nets
e - 61 poisoned needles
g - 6 needles of confusion
i - 5 tomahawks of returning (quivered)
r - 49 tomahawks
s - 9 needles of sleeping
w - 8 javelins of penetration
O - 7 curare-tipped needles
Armour
q - a +2 pair of boots of flying (worn)
L - the +2 pair of fencer's gloves (worn) {EV+3 Dex+6 Slay+2}
(You acquired it on level 4 of the Snake Pit)
It affects your evasion (+3).
It affects your dexterity (+6).
It affects your accuracy and damage with ranged weapons and melee attacks
(+2).
M - a +2 plate armour of magic resistance (worn)
N - a +2 cloak of poison resistance (worn)
Jewellery
f - an amulet of faith (around neck)
t - the ring of Robustness (right hand) {AC+8}
(You bought it in a shop on level 4 of the Dungeon)
[ring of protection]
It affects your AC (+8).
I - a +4 ring of slaying (left hand)
K - an uncursed ring of protection from cold
Magical devices
m - a wand of digging (18)
n - a wand of invisibility (4)
B - a wand of draining (5)
C - a wand of slowing {zapped: 1}
H - a wand of draining (5)
Q - a wand of cold (4)
W - a wand of disintegration (14)
Scrolls
c - 4 scrolls of immolation
k - a scroll of magic mapping
p - 12 scrolls of teleportation
u - a scroll of blinking
y - 4 scrolls of recharging
E - 11 scrolls of identify
F - 2 scrolls of silence
G - 12 scrolls of remove curse
J - 5 scrolls of summoning
U - 7 scrolls of fear
Y - 6 scrolls of fog
Potions
o - 9 potions of curing
z - 3 potions of lignification
A - 5 potions of brilliance
D - 12 potions of restore abilities
R - 2 potions of ambrosia
T - 2 potions of agility
Miscellaneous
h - a fan of gales
j - a lamp of fire (inert)
P - a lantern of shadows
Z - a phantom mirror
Comestibles
x - 6 beef jerkies
S - 14 bread rations
V - 9 royal jellies
X - 5 meat rations
Slots I think I could cut with no tactical power loss in this game:
1. the demon whip (I honestly just picked it up to see what it's brand was, am pondering whether to drop it or maybe search for a decent shield)
2,3. Some food (I habitually have 3-4 slots for food, and probably only need 2 most of the time)
4. Potion of brilliance (I'm not casting spells right now, although I'm working up to being able to cast haste in plate eventually)
5. /Invis (I don't use this much, this is a Qaz platemail user, so invis is really only useful in a very small handful of situations)
6. /Slow (It's past the point at which I can reliably hit anything with this)
7. ?Remove Curse (I could probably just travel back to the stash for it, I am carrying them so I can wear-id things in V:5)
So I have 7 slots that I'm not really "using" effectively.
Slots I would often have filled that I don't with this character include:
!magic (not casting spells yet)
hat (This character has horns)
sometimes a shield (using a two hander at the moment)
!healing (For some reason I've only generated 2 potions of healing this entire game, and I've used them both, very annoying)
!might (I used my second and last of those recently as well)
Some things that have been generated in this game which I'm not carrying but would like to which would be tactically significant (the category you're actually asking about):
?torment (I have 50% torment immunity, so this is better than usual)
Stone of tremors (I don't know why I didn't pick that up)
6 decks of cards
1 Wand of lightning
1 Wand of draining (Although I have one, a second would let me blow through more charges)
1 Wand of cold
(that's 11 slots)
Some things that haven't generated but would be tactically significant:
Any additional number of branded javelins and/or tomahawks (yes I didn't skip any tomahawks or javelins that have generated in this game)
(that's up to an additional 10 slots for all the available brand types, if I didn't miss any in my mental count)
As mentioned earlier, !HW, !Might, Phial of floods, more wands I'm also missing several needle types.
Also all the big wands (teleport, healing and haste)
So that's 7 slots I'm using suboptimally (form a tactical standpoint), 11 slots I could take up with existing items, and another 20ish (17 plus an arbitrary number of wands/decks) of items that for one reason or another I haven't seen yet.
That's roughly another 25 slots above the inital 52 I could easily use in a *tactically significant* way (And this character is slightly atypical, in that he's not casting spells, and is missing an armour slot, and has only seen 19 wands total generate right before starting V:5, so he has more slots than some)
Berder wrote:Any infinite inventory system is plagued with interface nightmares, decreasing my enjoyment of the game (even if the solution has no tactical impact) I don't want to spend tons of real life time moving things to and from a cart. (Have you ever played nethack? After a point you spend tons of time just moving things in and out of your bag of holding, it is awful)
The real interface nightmare is having a constantly packed inventory and having to drop things frequently.
I have played nethack a little, not enough to encounter the problem you describe. I can't be sure if the same would happen with crawl. I doubt it since the main inventory is already 52 items, and you only would need to move the item when you need to use it. It would take playtesting to verify or disprove your objection.
Anyway, that objection only applies to the "cart" proposal I mentioned, not the "separate namespaces" solution.
Yes was specifically replying to the 'cart' proposal with the bag of holding comment, as nethack's bag of holding is nearly identical from an interface perspective, to your cart proposal.
Separate namespaces would be better, but still an interface hassle as you have to jump through category selections to get to the item you want, Anything where there's a long list of things to choose from is bad (particularly when keyboard is your primary interface), presenting a long list of things to choose from once you've chosen which list to choose from is doubly bad, and having the list of things available to choose from grow unboundedly is triply bad. Find an unbounded inventory system that doesn't present me with an unbounded list and I'll consider it as a possibly not-bad interface. (The balance issue is something that would have to be addressed separately)