New God: Idnahg, the Zoologist

[infinitevox]

**Preface**
Idnahg offers a drastically different crawl experience from your typical "Kill monster: Gain Piety" types.


Idnahg
"Gotta Tag 'em All!"
Known as the Zoologist, Idnahg delights in watching creatures, and his followers attempt to catalog all of the various species they can find. They wield no real weapons and avoid killing at all costs. They are rewarded with items, abilities, and spells to help them on their eclectic path of discovery.
No backgrounds start with this religion.


RACIAL RESTRICTIONS
--------------------------
Idnahg accepts followers of all backgrounds except Demigods, but Vampires and carnivorous species may have a more difficult time adhering to his tenements.


Appreciates
------------------
Discovering new monsters
Cataloging new monsters (Attack the monster with the Walking Staff or using the Evoke Catalog ability)
Disarming harmful traps (Stand next to a trap and pray)

-Piety is gained by tagging new monsters and getting rid of traps.
-Due to the restriction against killing, exp is now gained as follows:
*EXP/3 is gained from spotting a new monster, and (2*EXP)/3 from getting within melee distance and successfully tagging the monster*
*Tagged monsters grant no EXP from killing them*

Depreciates
------------------
Abandoning him
Wielding a weapon (Except Rods and Magical Staffs)
Drinking a potion of blood
Killing Monsters(Attacking, Spell-casting, Evoking, etc)
Your Allies Killing Monsters
Learning a spell whose sole purpose is to harm

-Unlike other gods, Piety is not lost for inactivity. Idnahg is kind and remembers your service.

Given Abilities
----------------------
Piety level (0): "Explorer"
-Zoology: You no longer gain exp by vanquishing monsters. Instead, exp is now gained (as above). You are granted a Walking Stick upon initiation. This functions as a +5,+0 Magical staff, however it deals 0 damage when used to attack. (Passive)
-Survival: You are no longer impeded or slowed by water and gain rPois+ (Passive)

Piety level (*): "Bug-Catcher"
-Evoke Catalog I: Melee range, when successfully Evoked, it tags the monster and stores the information (Costs 1 MP, 0-50 food, and 2-3 Piety) (Max: 1)
-Evoke Camouflage: Temporarily transform into a cataloged monster (Costs 3 MP, 50-100 food, and 2-3 Piety) When transformed, monsters that share a type are neutral towards you. Duration increases with Evocation skill.

Piety level (**): "Bird Watcher"
-Detect Monsters: Shows the location and relative strength, but not the type, of monsters beyond your field of vision. (Passive) Radius starts at 0 and increases with Piety
-Swap: Swaps the position of you and the monster in the target tile next to you

Piety level (***): "Horse Whisperer"
-Evoke Net: Throws a net at target tile, if occupied by a monster they become entangled, subject to EV (Costs 3MP, 50-100 food, 2-3 Piety)
-Evoke Catalog II: (Costs 1 MP, 0-50 food, and 2-3 Piety) (Max: 2)

Piety level (****): "Snake Charmer"
No Additional Abilities

Piety level (*****): "Lion Tamer"
No Additional Abilities

Piety level (*****): "Alligator Wrestler"
-Evoke Catalog III: (Costs 1 MP, 0-50 food, and 2-3 Piety) (Max: 3)
-Trackless: Monsters forget about you when you leave their LoS (Passive)


Gifts
----------------------
81+
Scrolls and Potions. If you are eligible for a gift and 1d(Piety) >== 72, there's a 10% chance that you will receive a scroll or potion on a given turn. The item given will never be offensive in nature and will always be beneficial. Ignahg can gift potions of experience, although rarely. The gift timeout for each gift is 2d4+4.
(Speed, curing, heal wounds, invisibility, flight, blink, teleport, fog, enchant armor, etc)
(Never: poison, degeneration, immolation, holy word, curse, etc)


Punishments
----------------------
Idnahg delivers his own brand of punishment to those who convert to other gods, with the exception of Elyvilon.
-Those who convert to Xom will carry over 1/2 their piety, as their endeavors amuse the god of Chaos. This still incurs Idnahg's wrath however
Idnahg will not directly harm you himself and the possible punishments are:
%XX: You are Marked for XX-XXX turns
%XX: effects of the Water card from the Deck of Dungeons
%XX: effects of the Tomb card from the Deck of Dungeons
%XX: effects of potion of Paralysis or Confusion
%XX: Idnahg asks another God to enact their wrath upon you instead

Survivable provided you think ahead. It would be wise to keep a scroll of teleport or blink, potion of flight, wand of digging, a stockpile of food, and make sure no monsters are around while you wait out the effects.


Strategy
----------------------
Idnahg offers a completely different crawl experience. Not being able to kill enemies causes a very large change in play-style and tactics.
-Spells that disable but not kill are also acceptable, especially if god given (Sleep, Confuse, Charm, etc)
-Characters whose race has an innate +stealth would do well with Idnahg, as his gifts mesh well with it.
-It may be slow going, especially if you hit a level where the monsters are guarding the stairs, but Idnahg provides his followers with plenty of options. Sometimes the best option is still "Run" though.
-The Item gifting plays a sizable role as characters cannot rely on clearing a level of monsters and must continue to deal with them afterwards.
-Train Evocations

[Lasty]

Sounds like Enslave would be pretty strong here, and possibly summoning/necromancy. You'd probably have to ban most ally creation if you didn't want to make this the god of letting allies kill stuff.

[nicolae]

Known as the God of Peace, Idnahg and his followers avoid direct conflict at all costs, using any means necessary. Followers of Idnahg are patient and thoughtful, they wield no weapons, and do not eat meat. They are rewarded with items, abilities, and spells to help them on their path of peace.

In a game focused primarily around combat and conflict, outright banning conflict seems like a bad fit. Even Elyvilon understands that sometimes you just gotta kill somebody, and on CAO even the most pacifist win still killed 341 monsters.

-Due to the restriction of directly harming anyone, exp is now gained as follows:
*Exp is gained the same way as piety, + a small bonus for entering a new area/level, and + a larger bonus for completely exploring an area/level*

What about something like the experimental Dith piety, where you get XP/piety for seeing monsters?

Given Abilities

Most of the god abilities you proposed are just existing effects. Okawaru and Ashenzari already provide various skill boosts. Dithmengos and scrolls of fog provide fog. Ashenzari, boots of the assassin, and antennae all detect monsters (and all begin with the letter A... weird...) Disjunction, Sleep, and Confuse are already spell effects, and Confusion is a wand too. Every other god has some ability or feature that is pretty much unique to that god. What makes the god interesting if all the benefits can be duplicated by spells, wands, or other gods, without also having to deal with the pacifism conduct?

Gifts

I think these days god gifts are deprecated, design-wise.

[DracheReborn]

What about something like the experimental Dith piety, where you get XP/piety for seeing monsters?

I think you're thinking of the proposed experience mechanic, where you get XP/3 for spotting monsters (in CSZO experimental). And yeah, I think that fits better here than with Dith.

Some suggestions: gameplay-wise it's not similar to Ely at all, but the theme is. How about reflavoring Idnagh as the Zoologist - he wants you to catch and tag monsters (specimens), but killing them is not ok. I think "no killing" is already sufficiently strong conduct without adding stuff like no meat (you already won't get chunks, so ruling out half the permafood seems excessive).

For a new ability, how about nets which always mulch? Think spiderman. It will at least be more unique than sleep/confuse.

Also, you need to figure out how the god stands on ally play. That seems like a giant loophole.

Overall I like the idea, but worry that this god would only cater to specific builds. Stealth characters who ninja runes, for example. But I guess that's unavoidable in a game where 90% of the focus is in different ways of killing things.

[gdami1]

The Spriggan Baker will sue you for unfair competition.

[Roderic]

I miss a swap positions ability which could be very convenient when surrounded

[infinitevox]

I think you're thinking of the proposed experience mechanic, where you get XP/3 for spotting monsters (in CSZO experimental). And yeah, I think that fits better here than with Dith.

I thought that might be too easy, but since it's already a suggestion, that sounds perfect.

Some suggestions: gameplay-wise it's not similar to Ely at all, but the theme is. How about reflavoring Idnagh as the Zoologist - he wants you to catch and tag monsters (specimens), but killing them is not ok.

That's awesome. Takes my half baked idea and fleshes it out to something just as different, but a lot more fun.
With this change, Idnagh could possibly grant abilities that give info about those specimens, or maybe even a polymorph self that adds +stealth. Disguise yourself as a denizen of the dungeon.
I think going with this, the "tag" ability should require melee range. Mostly for flavor.
Could maybe do something with darts of sleep... Hrmm

For a new ability, how about nets which always mulch? Think spiderman. It will at least be more unique than sleep/confuse.

That and the swap position ability mentioned above would fit beautifully, and would solve a lot of the "XX already does this" problems.

Overall I like the idea... But I guess that's unavoidable in a game where 90% of the focus is in different ways of killing things.

That's the entire idea behind this god, something that doesn't revolve around killing. While no game of crawl is the same, I really enjoy things that make me drastically alter my play style. Thats why I usually play demonspawn/draconian wanderer.
I also like Xom though, so take it with a grain of salt.

I go with the philosophy that just because it hasn't been done before doesn't make it wrong.
Thanks for the feedback so far guys.

[DracheReborn]

With this change, Idnagh could possibly grant abilities that give info about those specimens, or maybe even a polymorph self that adds +stealth. Disguise yourself as a denizen of the dungeon.
I think going with this, the "tag" ability should require melee range. Mostly for flavor.
Could maybe do something with darts of sleep... Hrmm

Disguise ability sounds great, but I'd worry about stepping on Dith's toes if it's just +stealth. Maybe an active ability that turns you into a specific monster genus for a short duration? During that time, monsters of that genus become neutral and won't attack you.

I didn't mean for tagging to actually do anything, but now that you mention it... How about fractional XP for just spotting monsters, but you get full XP only if you close to melee range and "tag" it? Tagging still won't actually do anything, but it can be used here as an XP mechanic. Maybe even have a god-granted melee weapon (with 0 damage of course) just for tagging.

For piety, I was thinking that Idnahg wants to complete his zoological catalog so he gives piety for spotting/tagging at least one of each monster type, i.e. give piety for the first orc you tag, the first elephant, the first adder, etc, in a Noah's ark kind of way. Uniques, though, qualify as their own monster type so always give piety. Derived undead like skeletons, zombies, and simulacra are uninteresting (being merely copies of the real thing), but other undead like vampires and ghouls can be interesting in their own right.

For the summons question... I don't think summons should be barred outright but I don't think Idnahg should allow allies to kill on your behalf either. So maybe allies under Idnahg can only be used defensively, i.e. special cased so they only try to follow you but will never attack.

Anyway, just brainstorming here. Feel free to incorporate any (or none) of these in your own ideas.

[infinitevox]

No no, this is good stuff, thanks for the ideas and input.

I think a fun mechanic would be that you have to Tag a monster type before you can disguise yourself as it.

[phobetor]

I really like this idea. A god that opens up an entirely new way to play, but still uses the basic skill sets players uses during a normal game so it isn't to alien. Sounds like a lot of fun.

I do see one problem with the any XP system that doesn't remove enemies. A player could go around peacefully gaining levels then switch to Trog, go back and massacre everything for double XP. This could obviously be worked around (once tagged/ seen or whatever it gives no XP for killing it) but is something to consider.

[infinitevox]

I took some time to roll the idea around in my head before changing anything. I posted in the updated version with all the awesome ideas.

Some things I was thinking could be good additions were:
1. tagged monsters sleep (paralysis) for x turns after successfully tagging them
2. move through plants as well (didn't want to step on feldahs' toes though)
3. Was thinking Idnahg would abandon you if you killed too many monsters. Not sure though, the piety hit might be enough
4. I left the potions & scrolls gifting b/c it's going to be a rough ride when you can't rely on cleared levels to retreat to, and my often times be followed by a lot of creatures.
5. Tagging uniques could grant a bonus EXP on top of the normal amount, just because they'll stick around and you have to get within melee range.

[dpeg]

I have to admit that I don't like the most basic premise of the god: to me, gods can be (but don't have to be) used to transcend Crawl rules and/or to provide different character builds (like the pacifier of Elyvilon; the collection and fostering of many permanent allies with several gods; the change of terrain with Fedhas; the speed reversal with Cheibriados). However, all of these work in the Crawl context!

Your god tries to wipe the slate clean and I don't think that's so good. Yes, it is narrow and one-dimensional to observe Crawl is basically reduced to kill, kill, kill & not get killed (of course, good play demands to learn about not-killing as well). Still, a god which has to provide a full set of mechanics to deal with monsters in new ways is just too heavy -- this is the Nemelex trap.

Put another way: this god does not "open up an entirely new way of play" (phobetor's words), this god enforces it.

For comparison, when I proposed pacification for Elyvilon, I had a full range of pacification use in mind: you can pacificy only trivial monsters (mostly animals) and very hard opponents you'd have otherwise trouble with, and kill everything in between regularly (more xp!), relying on Elyvilon for the self-healing powers. At the other extreme, you can try to play a "pacifist" -- this is indeed a new playing style, but also a challenge. The point is that Elyvilon provides a single new mechanic (pacification), blending it with a well-known rule (xp/2 from summon kills) and leaves it to the player to find a fun/useful measure of how much or what to pacify.

There is also a reason why I kept suggesting the spotting xp for Dithmenos: stealth is the tool which allows you ignore monsters, which is not just convenient but can be extremely relevant. A god with some kind of synergy to Stealth (it wouldn't have to have a stealth boost, actually, and right now umbra scales with piety, which is an improvement, in my opinion) will therefore immediately benefit followers for not just being able to ignore still-asleep monsters, but gain parts of the xp. This opens up choices, because stealthy characters always have the option to go for stabs, too. The zoologist god, however, needs spotting piety *and* xp just to be able to work.

In the end, I am not too happy about the zoologist flavour either, it seems distinctly different from how I look at the Crawl world. Obviously, that's the most minor issue here, and flavour is cheap anyway.

[Roderic]

In the end, I am not too happy about the zoologist flavour either, it seems distinctly different from how I look at the Crawl world. Obviously, that's the most minor issue here, and flavour is cheap anyway.

I think Noah did some similar task of tagging before the Flood

Idnahg is eventually gonna to purge the dungeon and their followers have to choose a monster of each kind to save the genetic pool to let the dungeon start anew.

[whale]

I think that if Idnahg is really "the zoologist", then it makes sense if in the whole description you substitute "nondemon nonundead nonhumanoid beast" instead of "monster".
Actually a real "Pokemon" god might even appreciate killing all the humanoids to let the charming spine frogs and what not live and prosper, in an extremist animal rights defender sort of way.

There is an abundance of beasts all around the dungeon and letting the player actually kill some monsters will solve a lot of issues with this god. The god might even make all beasts neutral, like Slime god does with slimes (but here it can be a temporary evocable).

[tedric]

Vampires and carnivorous species may have a more difficult time adhering to his tenets.

ftfy. "adhering to tenements" is what Spider-Man does.