Delver chat


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Pandemonium Purger

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Post Tuesday, 14th July 2020, 23:30

Delver chat

Post here to talk about the new background, Devler

You start on d:5, on staircase leading down, at clvl1, a (3) wand of digging, scroll of magic mapping, fear and fog, and a potion of haste. I have absolutely no idea how to play it. I think you need a strong melee character like troll or a fast species like spriggan to hope to survive what I think is the goal of getting to temple, getting a desirable god as fast (turncount wise) as possible before getting back up to d:1

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Here I am shortly before finding out duvessa, a jelly, and a scorpion were all it would take for me to get to my first goal. I died, of course. Maybe you can do better?
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Mines Malingerer

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Post Wednesday, 15th July 2020, 01:05

Re: Delver chat

I think the devteam's idea was more that you race for D:1 as fast as possible. Don't know if that would have gone any better, though. I assume they're supposed to be very much a challenge background.

Crypt Cleanser

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Post Wednesday, 15th July 2020, 01:35

Re: Delver chat

Have had decent success (8/11 runs with random species delvers getting back to dungeon exit) so far. Seems very important to avoid fighting as much as possible until you find good shit, whether that be a god or floor loot, that lets you kill something worth hella xp. One run that was a stack of poison darts to kite an ogre to death, one run it was like a venom scim that let me kill a few popcorn and gnoll guys, one run it was an iceblast wand. Then you just get strong enough to go up and come back down, or at least not get oneshot by an orc priest. Haven't tried diving for temple first, though I did find it while climbing once or twice and I've taken some dungeon altars. Seems hard to avoid everything all the way up, but you do get a ton of free starting stealth and it's actually kind of valuable when you cannot simply kill the dudes and don't have safe floors to retreat to.

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Mines Malingerer

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Post Wednesday, 15th July 2020, 01:44

Re: Delver chat

But there's no species for which they're a recommended background, correct? Any species for which you think they should be?
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Pandemonium Purger

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Post Wednesday, 15th July 2020, 02:46

Re: Delver chat

Centaur. Sadly, you will never play one.

The solo winning legendary CeDe:

https://crawl.kelbi.org/crawl/morgue/Li ... 040905.txt

Any fast species works well with De. I did have success with a troll until swamp. Probably won't play that again. I believe the idea is to find temple ASAP, then get to d:1 and go back down. If not, I don't know what the hell this background is about. It also looks like lightli started on d:4, not d:5 like the current De
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Mines Malingerer

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Post Wednesday, 15th July 2020, 02:58

Re: Delver chat

Spriggan delver is an interesting image.

Tomb Titivator

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Post Thursday, 16th July 2020, 14:43

Re: Delver chat

Any species with decent +stealth apts and stealth modifier does well as delver. Starting with 6+ stealth allows you to kill enough stuff to level.

Just wish the "short blade" start would be a dagger instead of short sword, to go with the stabbing theme.

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Mines Malingerer

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Post Friday, 17th July 2020, 05:23

Re: Delver chat

twelwe wrote:Centaur. Sadly, you will never play one.

((cries in horse))
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Dungeon Dilettante

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Post Wednesday, 22nd July 2020, 14:32

Re: Delver chat

Having played a few delvers now I'd say that stealth-capable + the ability to not immediately die to an (awake) popcorn monster are key; so races that are strong melee fighters at levels 1-3 (octopode, demigod) can do the initial delving OK. Of course you loose a few starts to walking around a corner or up a stairway right into something deadly, but it's kind of fun to hunt the way up.

The larger problem is from that point forward: the role is just *so weak* overall that the transition from stealth-and-run to being able to actually kill non-popcorn can be very difficult. You have zero spellcasting so even if you find a book it takes way too long to get even level 1 or 2 spells online (and forget about doing it in any armour, which you need to wear to live, but which also kills your stealth....). You don't have poison or hexes to complete a stabber build. And the lack of fighting-related skills plus need to stumble upon a decent weapon quickly makes even stabilizing as a fighter hard.

Granted, sometimes the RNG provides so if you are playing a character with flexible apts (again, a 'pode or demigod or similar) then you can lean on whatever excellent weapon you find on the floor long enough to sustain into another nice gift (had a 'pode find a dagger of pain, then books with all the necro spells, an end-game-quality randart ring.... yeah that can work). But I've lost several delvers after clearing level 1 and heading back down as an L3 or L4 character... you have to *keep playing keepaway* from most of the threats all the way down the dungeon.

I'd maybe recommend boosting armour & dodging skill a bit, or looking into some way to make delving + spellcasting more possible (start with 2 spellcasting but no spells?) to preserve the build-what-you-find but just make it a little easier to do so.

But still, when viewed as a total challenge character (not just the initial survival, but building the character into something functional) like wanderers, it's fun!
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Tartarus Sorceror

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Post Saturday, 1st August 2020, 10:04

Re: Delver chat

twelwe wrote:Centaur. Sadly, you will never play one.

Is it walled off from the class? Or is it being cut?
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Saturday, 1st August 2020, 17:54

Re: Delver chat

Shtopit wrote:
twelwe wrote:Centaur. Sadly, you will never play one.

Is it walled off from the class? Or is it being cut?

Cut at the (nearly the) same time delver was added.
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Tartarus Sorceror

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Post Saturday, 1st August 2020, 18:31

Re: Delver chat

Siegurt wrote:Cut at the (nearly the) same time delver was added.

That makes me rather sad. I know I wrote negatively about Ce in the past, but in the meantime I have learnt to have fun with it and changed my position (mostly because of ranged tab).
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Halls Hopper

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Post Yesterday, 10:11

Re: Delver chat

Not directly related to delver, but this background does make me wish sif muna would give a random basic starting spell book at 1*. Having a third "break into spellcasting" god would greatly improve the lives of our delving deep elf and felid friends.

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