noob mode for offline version

[chesse20]

would be nice if there was a mode where there was checkpoints when you get a rune and if you die and respawn at the checkpoint it re-gens the rest of the dungeon that your character had not visited prior to getting the rune. i am saying this as ive played htis game on and off for years and ive only seen the snake pit, shoals, and orcish mines once and ive only been able to get to the 7th floor of the lair.

[removeelyvilon]

Not sure if this helps but if you press + on the numpad you can enter "explore mode" in which you are unable to die. Explore mode games are not scored.

[Shtopit]

If you are curious about higher level opponents and playing with high piety, you can try the dungeon sprints. They aren't easier or even remotely fair, but I did get my first ascension there. The fixed map layout makes for a very different experience.

[Quazifuji]

You can actually achieve checkpoints directly if you want to via savescumming. Whenever you get to a spot where you want a checkpoint, just backup your savefile. When you die, copy the backup back into your save folder. I actually did something similar back when I first starting playing for the same reason. Was tired of never seeing more to the game than dungeon, lair, and orc, so I played a game where I backed up my save file occasionally so I could get the chance to see the rest of the game. It's some hassle, but it works pretty well for what you want.

That said, I don't see any particular reason to not add a full "checkpoint mode" for the offline version, since it would be fully optional and offline high scores aren't really tracked anywhere as far as I know, except that someone would have to implement and maintain it. But that stops a lot of features from getting added.

[ydeve]

The reason to not add a checkpoint mode is that the game isn't supposed to be played with checkpoints. Explore mode (and wizard mode) already exist for those who want to remove permadeath. Directly supporting degenerate play (savescumming) teaches bad habits and does not improve the game.

[goodcoolguy]

This is on the won't do list.

[dowan]

The reason to not add a checkpoint mode is that the game isn't supposed to be played with checkpoints. Explore mode (and wizard mode) already exist for those who want to remove permadeath. Directly supporting degenerate play (savescumming) teaches bad habits and does not improve the game.

Uhh... savescumming teaches bad habits, but pressing "N" to dying teaches good habits?

I'd say having to repeat sections of the game 'teaches' you more than just deciding not to die and continuing to mash the tab key.

But, if you want checkpoints, you'll have to make them yourself. Back up your character whenever you've decided that you've 'earned' a checkpoint, and then you can always go back to it.

I very much doubt anyone would spend the dev time to implement this in game, since it's kind of against the idea of permadeath, plus like Quaz said it would have to be maintained.

[ydeve]

With explore mode you can't undo what's already been done. Checkpoints take that away. If the game offered checkpoints, people would feel like that's legitimate play (it isn't for a roguelike). Explore mode feels like you're playing on training wheels.

[dowan]

Well... you undo dying, that's really the only thing you'd want to undo...

What do you care what other people consider legitimate while they play their offline single player game?

[Shard1697]

they're not playing it right goddamn it

[ydeve]

With savescumming you learn bad habits and dont learn how to play the game right. Explore mode doesnt teach the same bad habits.

[chequers]

Why do you care that people "don't learn how to play the game right"?

[Shard1697]

because I want all people who play crawl, and really all people, to learn to better themselves and reach a new plane of existence. playing roguelikes for hours on end is but the simplest way to reach a new state of awareness...

I don't actually care very much but it's a shame to throw a game like dcss away because you think it's dumb/easy while in fact you've just been bruteforcing it. playing crawl with savestates sounds to me like the fastest way to grow sick of a great game

[ydeve]

inb4 "crawl was never great"

[dowan]

I agree that savescumming constantly takes the fun right out of permadeath games, in my experience. But I just don't see why playing in explore mode also wouldn't do that.

Savescumming is a decent way to keep some stakes in the game if you are trying to see everything. Having to repeat branches isn't as bad as repeating the whole game, but it's enough to make you not want to die. I don't think having to press 'n' is really much of a stake.

Either way, I totally agree that if you think you might want to play through this game more than once or twice, you're only cheating yourself out of the game by savescumming, or playing in explore mode. But it's not a terrible idea for seeing the various content in the game.