Changing cure poison to be more interesting


Although the central place for design discussion is ##crawl-dev on freenode, some may find it helpful to discuss requests and suggestions here first.

Temple Termagant

Posts: 5

Joined: Sunday, 24th November 2013, 17:20

Post Saturday, 7th December 2013, 15:06

Changing cure poison to be more interesting

While playing a couple venom mages and consulting ##crawl I've found cure poison to be incredibly situational and pretty boring as a spell.
AFAIK it's only useful:
    .When playing a Fo
    .After battles vs most poisonous things (which only means you press 5 less)
    .When playing a venom mage that hasn't yet got the conjurations needed to cast Venom Bolt, so instead uses OTR (only lasts for a couple levels)
    .When going into spider nest/snake pit without rPois (very unlikely in my experience)
Therefore I propose to change the spell to:

Spoiler: show
Transfer Poison
Level 2
School1 Poison
School2 (maybe translocation?)
School3
Source(s)
Young Poisoners Handbook
Casting noise 3
Spell noise 0

Description: Transfers all poison out of your system to target enemy. Ignores AC/EV/rPois but requires a check vs MR which is harder to resist with higher spellpower. Even if the MR check fails, you still lose the status effect. It gains slightly more spell power the more poisoned you are, but always inflicts the same amount of poison. Has smite targeting.


I think these changes would allow it to actually be potentially helpful more than a couple times a game at best.
Thoughts?

For this message the author brosephalon has received thanks:
Klown

Tartarus Sorceror

Posts: 1776

Joined: Monday, 21st February 2011, 15:57

Location: South Carolina

Post Saturday, 7th December 2013, 15:42

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

I like the idea of moving poison from you to someone else, and you are right that cure poison is kind of limited.

If it needs to be weaker, smite targeting can be lost. I'd be in favor of making it a melee range spell like freeze, or even something that charges your melee attacks with poison like confusing touch charges your hands. This poison charge could interact with resistance differently from poison brands like confusing touch checks HD instead of MR like confuse.

I'd also prefer having the player being more poisoned resulting in the enemy becoming more poisoned, but that's a minor quibble.

Does doing it this way remove the decision to give up some spell slots for security against slow death from poison?

Temple Termagant

Posts: 5

Joined: Sunday, 24th November 2013, 17:20

Post Saturday, 7th December 2013, 15:53

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

When I posted this idea in ##crawl, the more poisoned player=more poisoned target was my original idea, but as VolteccerJack pointed out there, this would probably lead to scummy play like having a parked adder/giant mite/whatever weak poisonous on the level above you to get poison levels to make it more powerful, which sounds really tedious. I like the idea of being able to turn potions of poison into an offensive consumable, but i'm not sure how you would accomplish that without said boring play happening
I like the idea of making the spell transfer in melee, perhaps smite targeting is too powerful, especially considering the ignoring of rPois. I'm not sure how much checking HD instead of MR would change the spell, if someone could enlighten me, that would be nice.

Edit, in response to
Does doing it this way remove the decision to give up some spell slots for security against slow death from poison?

I would be inclined to say it would not allow you to transfer poison into the air, but it would allow you to transfer it to the first monster you find, making what would be a slow death from poison into a frantic search.
That, or you could probably just use summon butterfly :lol:

Swamp Slogger

Posts: 169

Joined: Tuesday, 25th October 2011, 00:06

Post Saturday, 7th December 2013, 22:26

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

I think it's not a good idea. Your suggestion makes this spell even more situational.
I personally would like to see Cure Poison targetable for you to be able to cast it on allies. It's a very minor buff but Beogh users would find it useful.
If you spot a grammar mistake in my post I will appreciate if you PM it.

Temple Termagant

Posts: 5

Joined: Sunday, 24th November 2013, 17:20

Post Saturday, 7th December 2013, 22:44

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

Yermak wrote:I think it's not a good idea. Your suggestion makes this spell even more situational.
I personally would like to see Cure Poison target-able for you to be able to cast it on allies. It's a very minor buff but Beogh users would find it useful.

Could you go into some more detail here? The way I see it, being able to smite-target (or melee range target, as jejorda suggests) poison a target while ignoring rPois AND removing your own poison status in the same combat turn sounds much more useful than the rare usage cure poison receives.

Vaults Vanquisher

Posts: 446

Joined: Thursday, 16th June 2011, 22:57

Post Sunday, 8th December 2013, 00:01

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

Apparently I'm in the minority here, but the status quo, having cure poison just cure poison, seems fine to me.
kekekela is my in-game name

For this message the author battaile has received thanks: 2
archaeo, duvessa

Temple Termagant

Posts: 5

Joined: Sunday, 24th November 2013, 17:20

Post Sunday, 8th December 2013, 00:22

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

battaile wrote:Apparently I'm in the minority here, but the status quo, having cure poison just cure poison, seems fine to me.

now that i think about it, it does sound like a complicated change to a simple spell. elegance in simplicity is an effective way of design.
i just really liked the idea of "transfering poison". :oops:
User avatar

Abyss Ambulator

Posts: 1189

Joined: Friday, 28th January 2011, 21:45

Post Sunday, 8th December 2013, 01:05

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

We could keep Cure Poison and add Transfer Poison as a lower level (no higher than 4 I'd say) Poison/Hexes spell. It'd be cool to use and it'd synergize nicely with OTR.
The best strategy most frequently overlooked by new players for surviving: not starting a fight to begin with.
User avatar

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 5832

Joined: Thursday, 10th February 2011, 18:30

Post Sunday, 8th December 2013, 02:42

Re: Changing cure poison to be more interesting

Just use Ignite Poison.
"Be aware that a lot of people on this forum, such as mageykun and XuaXua, have a habit of making things up." - minmay a.k.a. duvessa
Did I make a lame complaint? Check for Bingo!
Totally gracious CSDC Season 2 Division 4 Champeen!

Return to Game Design Discussion

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 77 guests

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by ST Software for PTF.