Hunter build: armor and fighting skill

[d3k0]

Hi all,
I am quite new to DCSS and I am starting to love this game. Permadeath keeps it interesting, and character development is wonderful.
I dont want to min-max too much (I did a lot in WoW and I dont want to go that way) but I need to understand a bit more a couple of questions.

1) Is fighting skill useful for ranged damage?
From wiki->fighting seems YES:

Fighting is a generic combat skill that provides extra hit points, as well as small bonuses to your accuracy and damage with melee or ranged attacks (but not spells)

From wiki->weapon damage seems YES:

Fighting modifier: Multiply by 1 + (1dFighting)/30 (average bonus: +1.67% for every skill level in fighting)

From wiki->ranged combat seems NO:

Damage = 1d({Base damage - 2 + 1d8 + Racial bonus
+ 1d[Launcher enchantment - 1 + 1d(Ammo bonus) + strbonus]}×Modifiers + Slaying)

What's the right answer?

2) What are pros and cons of using heavier (heavier than leather, i mean) armor on a hunter?
Heavier armor means higher AC but lower EV, so...
less damage for high AC, but less dodging for lo EV then more damage... I am a bit confused

3) Branch levels are like dungeon levels, or should i descend a branch entirely before continuing with dungeon (the only branch I found till now is Orcish Mines)?

Thank you!

By the way, to give you some meter, I only played about 25 characters, and my best at the moment is a 14700 with a lvl11 HeHu, so do not blame me too much if these are stupid quesions pls, total newbie here

[Klown]

3) Keep doing the dungeon until it gets consistently difficult(near death experiences), before doing previous branches. The Lair first, then Orcish Mines. Then a little more dungeon. Then another branch(swamp?)

14700 is really good for only 25 characters in. You must be a patient and careful player.

[MIC132]

1)
http://crawl.develz.org/info/index.php?q=fighting

Going by this I would say it doesn't increase damage, nor accuracy, in ranged combat. And knowledge bots are more up-to-date(and overall more correct) than wiki.

That of course doesn't mean you shouldn't train it at some point, as it gives hp..

2)
Heavier armor is worth it if you train a lot of armor skill and don't mind EV penalty. As a hunter you should avoid getting hit in the first place, so EV is more important.
I think heavy armor also deceases accuracy, though I'm not sure if it applies to ranged.
With enough armor skill, though, it's viable (and should be taken at some point). Mind you, I mean heavy as in just below plate maybe, not crystal plate or something like this.
For hunters of course. Fighters should go with heaviest stuff they find(if strength suffices).

3)
You should descend branches when you feel you are ready for them, and only as far as you feel relatively safe. Also remember that the last level of a branch is always way harder.
To check length and other info, use the knowledge bots, e.g.:
http://crawl.develz.org/info/index.php?q=orcish+mines

Also, proposed branch order:
http://crawl.develz.org/info/index.php?q=hyperelliptic
(Lair doesn't mean Lair with sub branches. Sub branches should be done much later, as they are much harder - in the "get three runes" step.)

[Sandman25]

AC vs EV problem is not specific for hunters, it has more to do with species and spells. For example spell-less CeHu can decide to wear crystal plate armour, it will have 7AC less comparing to Minotaur with the same CPA (not taking into account higher AC from centaur barding comparing to boots) and lower EV (because it is large while minotaur is normal size)

[and into]

2) What are pros and cons of using heavier (heavier than leather, i mean) armor on a hunter?

None, really. Heavy armor only really affects spell casting. So this disadvantage is something to consider if and when you want to branch out into magic, but not before. Even if you do want to do that down the road, your most important thing is to get your character well established with your core defensive and offensive skills.

So, as hunter, you can go either way, and should really decide based on what gives you the best protection at a given point.

Also note that, while you do have to decide between light or heavy armors (either-or), this does not mean one is strictly choosing EV over AC or vice-versa. Most heavy armor users (unless you are literally in the *heaviest* armors in the game) will eventually want to get some dodging to put their EV to a decent level, and the same goes for light armor and AC. So "choosing" one or the other is more a question of prioritizing: Which do I want to get *first*? And the best choice will depend on your species, your aptitudes, your stats, and the items that have generated thus far in the game.

Heavy armor has a penalty to melee but (aside from Unarmed Combat, which is special cased) this penalty is not a very big deal, and your strength and armor skill negate the penalty to melee *much* faster and more effectively than the penalty to spell casting. The malus to melee from wearing heavy armor is only going to be a problem possibly if you get a big red message saying "Your low strength makes wearing this armor difficult" after you have put it on. That's bad because it means the penalties even to melee will be considerable. But otherwise, if you aren't Unarmed or slinging spells, don't worry about it.

Do note that shields are different, they use a different skill from armor even, and wearing them will seriously hamper your ability to use bows or crossbows. (Whereas throwing and slings are not affected by shields.)

[nago]

And into said the most accurate things - I'll just add that ranged combat doesn't care of armor penalties at all, so you could wear whatever armor you want without worrying about str limit *too* much - not that you want to not raise str at all with a ranged user, as it increase the damage output - I don't know exact number, maybe someone else can provide them.

[Sandman25]

See http://crawl.chaosforge.org/Ranged_combat if you want exact numbers for ranged combat.

[Hurkyl]

1)3)
You should descend branches when you feel you are ready for them, and only as far as you feel relatively safe. Also remember that the last level of a branch is always way harder.
To check length and other info, use the knowledge bots, e.g.:
http://crawl.develz.org/info/index.php?q=orcish+mines

You can check length in-game, with Ctrl-O. For any branch you've visited, it will display something like

  Code:

Dungeon (1/27)

to say that the Dungeon is 27 floors, and the deepest one you've visited is floor 1.

When deep enough, this display will also show in what floors a branch you haven't seen; something like

  Code:

Temple (4-7)

[d3k0]

Ok, thank you all for replies.
Now all is quite clear.
At the moment I am at 40 chars, best is a LVL12 HeHu dead at Lair:5 (D:11), killed by a storm of death yaks (sob), about 24000 crawl points.
I understood that the main rule is: Distraction kills. Sufficience kills. Everything can kill you if you are not careful enough.

[mopl]

Ok, thank you all for replies.
Now all is quite clear.
At the moment I am at 40 chars, best is a LVL12 HeHu dead at Lair:5 (D:11), killed by a storm of death yaks (sob), about 24000 crawl points.
I understood that the main rule is: Distraction kills. Sufficience kills. Everything can kill you if you are not careful enough.

http://crawl.develz.org/info/index.php?q=hubris
Btw don't forget to use Knowledge bot !