Food drops / spawns

[delarado]

Unlucky as it is, I have had this a couple of times before. Feel free to tell me to shut up and its just the way it is, but I just had a very frustrating game.

Not a single piece of food from D:7-D11.

D:8-11 was full of zombies and imps. I literally had maybe one or two chunk drops the entire time.

I had to quaff most of my potions to stay alive, and then got killed by nessos because I couldnt use fireball.

I was a DEFE, and was not spamming hungry spells.

Its not fun to not be able to use any spells because the game doesn't give you any food!

[Sandman25]

Yes, sometimes the whole floor is full of undead. You were very unlucky to meet a sequence of such floors. Still remember you are not required to kill everything, you could dive to D12 or at least use high level spells (which are not hungerless) less often.
Or even get to D12, kill a monster, eat some chunks and get back to D11-D8. Some top players do it while going for Hell runes with Trolls where they use late dungeon as chunks source.

[dck]

Grab a whip or dagger or anything fast with a good brand and hit people with it. Sticky flame is the best spell in your starting book and it doesn't need spellpower so once sticky flame has low enough failure rate it's a good idea to get dodging and learning to fight in melee.
This may sound like not the cause of your problem, but if you're casting spells at enough things that hunger becomes a problem in early D because a couple of floors didn't spawn permafood then it just is.

@Sandman
Nobody ever does that because it's a ridiculous and pointless waste of time when you have lots of portable food that doesn't rot called rations.

[Sandman25]

Nobody ever does that because it's a ridiculous and pointless waste of time when you have lots of portable food that doesn't rot called rations.

I am not clear what you are referring to here. About using late D for Hell runes or about getting back to D11 from D12?

[dck]

Entering a deeper level to get food is a ridiculous and dangerous idea and almost never even remotely necessary.
Trolls don't use D for food when they're going for hell runes, at least not trolls piloted by someone sensible.
So both.

[Sandman25]

Well, I don't want to make the player who uses late D as food stockpile look bad so let me just agree to disagree.

[delarado]

This may sound like not the cause of your problem, but if you're casting spells at enough things that hunger becomes a problem in early D because a couple of floors didn't spawn permafood then it just is.

I didn't use melee. I did only cast hungerless spells for two floors, and run from what i could, unless I was cornered by a two headed ogre or something equally scary, in which case i fireballed it.

[dck]

If your only way to deal with huge damage bags wasn't using a spell as loud as fireball that can and will telegraph your position to half of the level you probably wouldn't have had those problems and could've just explored normally without getting in more dangerous situations because you're "running away". Sticky flame with DE EV and melee is really good, try it.
Go kiku for even better melee damage and lots of handy stuff.

[Klown]

Fedhas should step his game up and give you fruit.

[DracheReborn]

I think it would be helpful to post a dump, so that more experienced players can give you tips on how to ration your food (if necessary).

Since you posted in GDD though, it seems you want the devs to change something. Are you asking for more permafood? There's probably too much as it is.

On the other hand, I don't think it's unfair to ask that the level generator not give you too many corpse-less levels in succession. I've run into levels like that once in a while, but I can't ever recall seeing 4 levels straight. Might be a valid complaint, though I have no idea how to reproduce it for a bug report.

[BlackSheep]

I'd be more interested in a save file, as zero food for 5 floors sounds unlikely. I'm curious if the OP missed a food vault somewhere. The game is set up to provide you with more than enough food to get you to Lair with a huge reserve if you play right.

[Amnesiac]

It's hard to imagine having no food for DEFE, I usually have several tens of rations just lying stashed. You probably do something wrong. And with DEFE you can have 20% of your exp going into your spellcasting(80% into conj and fire) and it will reduce your hunger by a lot, while giving you comparable returns is spell power, some mp and spell levels, too.

[galehar]

It seems the issue is bad strategy or missed vault, so I'm moving this to advice.

[delarado]

Here's the morgue file. I've no idea how to get the save file, it was on Lantea webtiles

I may be being a bit over-sensitive, but there definitely was a complete lack of food in this game. I was almost at lair. Every other game I have played, I have to stash a lot food in lair because its weighing me down. (Ive learned rations are quite heavy)

For example, in my current DEFE game I have 8 meat rations, 5 slices of pizza, a choko and 9 bread rations in my stash, and I've played no differently. I have done lair down to 6 on this game, but that is a lot of difference in food levels. I generally stash at least 5 rations in lair as soon as I get there, and I've been there a few times with DEFE now in the last week.

There were maybe not 5 floors of NO food at all, but there certainly was not anywhere near as much food as there normally is, and most of the stuff I was killing did not drop chunks. I ate my last permafood (bread ration) on D:10 I think, after already trying very hard to survive for three or so floors purely on the very limited chunks I could find and using only weak, hungerless spells and running away from anything bigger than a hobgoblin because my food rations were so dangerously low. I've never had to do that before. I always use auto explore, so unless this missed food vault was a secret one, I hopefully didn't miss anything?

I Guess what I was asking was, does the game have a consistent spawn rate for perma food and chunk generating monsters? This has never happened to me before, so it isn't a huge problem - but its very annoying when you are already trying to be economical with your food. I have no idea how to get the save file though I'm afraid...

I am fairly new, and was probably doing it wrong...but this game felt distinctly different from the others, food wise!

  Code:

 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.13-a0-2641-gc68e7bd (webtiles) character file.

12215 Delarado the Arsonist (level 11, 0/54 HPs)
             Began as a Deep Elf Fire Elementalist on Aug 6, 2013.
             Was an Elder of Vehumet.
             Slain by a red ugly thing (9 damage)
             ... on Level 11 of the Dungeon on Aug 7, 2013.
             The game lasted 01:52:51 (18031 turns).

Delarado the Arsonist (Deep Elf Fire Elementalist) Turns: 18031, Time: 01:52:51

HP   0/54        AC  6     Str  8      XL: 11   Next: 54%
MP  14/41        EV 13     Int 21      God: Vehumet [****..]
Gold 369         SH  0     Dex 15      Spells:  8 memorised,  3 levels left

Res.Fire  : . . .   See Invis. : .   a - staff of cold
Res.Cold  : + . .   Warding    : .   K - +1 elf robe
Life Prot.: . . .   Conserve   : .   (no shield)
Res.Poison: .       Res.Corr.  : .   c - +0 wizard hat
Res.Elec. : .       Clarity    : .   y - +0 cloak
Sust.Abil.: . .     Spirit.Shd : .   L - +1 pair of elf gauntlets
Res.Mut.  : .       Stasis     : .   (no boots)
Res.Rott. : .       Flight     : .   (no amulet)
Saprovore : . . .                    f - cursed ring of magical power
                                     A - ring of sustenance

@: somewhat resistant to hostile enchantments, fairly stealthy
A: no striking features
a: Renounce Religion


You were on level 11 of the Dungeon.
You worshipped Vehumet.
Vehumet was extremely pleased with you.
You were hungry.

You visited 1 branch of the dungeon, and saw 11 of its levels.

You collected 541 gold pieces.
You spent 192 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 l - a +1,+1 dagger of distortion (quivered)
 G - a +5,+1 flail of protection
Missiles
 t - 2 javelins
 u - 14 poisoned needles
Armour
 c - a +0 wizard hat (worn)
 y - a +0 cloak (worn)
 K - a +1 elven robe (worn)
 L - a +1 pair of elven gauntlets (worn)
Magical devices
 q - a wand of fire (5)
 r - a wand of flame (7)
 s - a wand of disintegration (5)
 F - a wand of teleportation (3)
 R - a wand of random effects (16)
 T - a wand of enslavement (16)
 U - a wand of random effects (14)
Comestibles
 k - 2 chunks of gnoll flesh
Scrolls
 d - a scroll of immolation
 i - 2 scrolls of enchant weapon I
 p - a scroll of fog
 D - 3 scrolls of remove curse
 M - a scroll of enchant armour
 N - a scroll of blinking
 O - 2 scrolls of amnesia
Jewellery
 f - a cursed ring of magical power (right hand)
 v - an uncursed amulet of stasis
 A - a ring of sustenance (left hand)
 H - an uncursed ring of protection from magic
 I - an uncursed ring of positive energy
 S - an uncursed ring of wizardry
 W - an uncursed ring of poison resistance {unknown}
Potions
 e - 4 potions of curing
 g - a potion of brilliance {unknown}
 h - a potion of agility
 o - a potion of berserk rage {unknown}
 w - a potion of poison {unknown}
 x - a potion of magic {unknown}
 z - 2 potions of heal wounds
 B - 2 potions of degeneration
 C - 2 potions of restore abilities
 J - a potion of mutation
 Q - a potion of invisibility
Books
 b - a book of Flames   
   
   Spells                             Type                      Level
   *Flame Tongue                      Conjuration/Fire             1
   *Throw Flame                       Conjuration/Fire             2
   *Conjure Flame                     Conjuration/Fire             3
   Inner Flame                        Hexes/Fire                   3
   *Sticky Flame                      Conjuration/Fire             4
   *Fireball                          Conjuration/Fire             5
Magical staves
 a - an uncursed staff of cold (weapon)
Miscellaneous
 j - a sack of spiders


   Skills:
 - Level 2.4 Dodging
 - Level 2.4 Stealth
 + Level 11.1 Spellcasting
 + Level 12.5 Conjurations
 + Level 12.7 Fire Magic


You had 3 spell levels left.
You knew the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Flame Tongue          Conj/Fire      ####.        1%          1    None
b - Throw Flame           Conj/Fire      ####..       1%          2    None
c - Conjure Flame         Conj/Fire      ####....     1%          3    None
d - Sticky Flame          Conj/Fire      ####....     1%          4    #......
e - Fireball              Conj/Fire      ####......   1%          5    ###....
f - Mephitic Cloud        Conj/Pois/Air  ####....     1%          3    None
g - Ignite Poison         Fire/Trmt      ###.......   4%          5    ###....
h - Bolt of Fire          Conj/Fire      ####......   2%          6    ######.


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (11/27)            Temple (0/1) D:5             Orc (0/4) D:9
  Lair: D:8-13     

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Elyvilon
Vehumet

Shops:
D:11: =

Annotations
D:11 Nessos

Message History

Aiming: Fireball
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - giant frog
Aim: a giant frog (severely wounded)
You feel a numb sensation. The fireball explodes!
The fireball engulfs the giant frog.
You kill the giant frog!
Vehumet accepts your kill.
You feel your power returning.
The fireball engulfs the red ugly thing.
The red ugly thing resists.
The red ugly thing is lightly wounded.
A hill giant comes into view. It is wielding a giant club.
The hill giant moves out of view. The red ugly thing claws you!
You are engulfed in flames!
The hobgoblin barely misses you.
The red ugly thing claws you. You are engulfed in flames!
* * * LOW HITPOINT WARNING * * *
You see here a giant frog corpse.
The red ugly thing claws you!
You die...

 ...........
 #...........
 #............
  .............
   #C........#
   #.........#
   #..g......#
   #..u......#
   #...@....)#
   #....######
..........
............
..##.....##
   .......
  ##......
   #......#
      ...


You could see a hill giant, a red ugly thing and a hobgoblin.

Vanquished Creatures
  Gastronok (D:9)
  Harold (D:10)
  3 hill giants
  Psyche (D:9)
  2 trolls (D:9)
  A two-headed ogre (D:10)
  A hydra zombie (D:9)
  A hill giant zombie (D:9)
  3 wyverns
  A hungry ghost (D:9)
  A wraith (D:10)
  A steam dragon (D:8)
  A hippogriff (D:10)
  Grum (D:9)
  2 manticores (D:9)
  2 wolves (D:9)
  Edmund (D:4)
  A necrophage (D:10)
  3 sky beasts
  4 phantoms
  An ice beast (D:5)
  5 orc warriors
  A crocodile (D:8)
  Duvessa (D:4)
  4 centaurs
  6 ogres
  3 giant frogs
  A gnoll sergeant (D:11)
  4 water moccasins
  A yak zombie (D:11)
  A hippogriff skeleton (D:9)
  2 troll zombies (D:9)
  7 killer bees
  3 jellyfish (D:10)
  3 electric eels (D:10)
  Dowan (D:4)
  A big fish (D:10)
  3 goliath beetles (D:9)
  4 hounds
  A centaur skeleton (D:8)
  A giant frog skeleton (D:4)
  7 orc priests
  17 orc wizards
  5 worker ants
  6 scorpions
  5 jellies
  4 iguanas
  5 ogre zombies
  2 ogre skeletons
  A mummy (D:9)
  A worker ant zombie (D:8)
  10 adders
  11 gnolls
  A giant centipede (D:10)
  A worm zombie (D:6)
  A giant mite (D:10)
  A worm (D:9)
  An adder zombie (D:9)
  2 giant eyeballs (D:8)
  4 oozes
  41 orcs
  12 bats
  A bat skeleton (D:4)
  7 giant cockroaches
  15 goblins
  21 hobgoblins
  29 jackals
  7 quokkas
  6 giant geckos
  10 giant newts
  2 giant spores
  2 hobgoblin skeletons (D:9)
  A hobgoblin zombie (D:9)
  13 kobolds
  A kobold skeleton (D:4)
  3 orc skeletons (D:9)
  13 orc zombies (D:9)
  16 rats
  A rat skeleton (D:7)
  2 rat zombies (D:7)
  3 ballistomycetes (D:6)
  A plant (D:10)
378 creatures vanquished.

Vanquished Creatures (others)
  A quokka (D:5)
1 creature vanquished.

Grand Total: 379 creatures vanquished

Notes
Turn   | Place    | Note
--------------------------------------------------------------
     0 | D:1      | Delarado, the Deep Elf Fire Elementalist, began the quest for the Orb.
     0 | D:1      | Reached XP level 1. HP: 10/10 MP: 4/4
   315 | D:1      | Reached XP level 2. HP: 15/15 MP: 3/7
   587 | D:1      | Learned a level 2 spell: Throw Flame
  1139 | D:2      | Reached XP level 3. HP: 16/19 MP: 4/10
  2182 | D:3      | Reached XP level 4. HP: 24/24 MP: 11/13
  2469 | D:3      | Learned a level 3 spell: Conjure Flame
  3138 | D:3      | Found a snail-covered altar of Cheibriados.
  3170 | D:3      | Learned a level 4 spell: Sticky Flame
  3520 | D:4      | Reached skill level 4 in Spellcasting
  3520 | D:4      | Reached XP level 5. HP: 19/28 MP: 6/17
  4372 | D:4      | Noticed Edmund
  4373 | D:4      | Noticed a centaur
  4487 | D:4      | Killed Edmund
  4487 | D:4      | Reached skill level 5 in Spellcasting
  4487 | D:4      | Reached XP level 6. HP: 32/32 MP: 20/20
  4654 | D:4      | Killed a centaur
  4654 | D:4      | Reached skill level 5 in Conjurations
  4654 | D:4      | Reached skill level 5 in Fire Magic
  4716 | D:4      | Noticed Duvessa
  4960 | D:4      | Learned a level 5 spell: Fireball
  4986 | D:4      | Noticed Dowan
  5006 | D:4      | Killed Dowan
  5006 | D:4      | Reached XP level 7. HP: 15/36 MP: 12/22
  5087 | D:4      | Killed Duvessa
  5418 | D:4      | Reached skill level 6 in Spellcasting
  5507 | D:4      | Found a radiant altar of Vehumet.
  5516 | D:4      | Became a worshipper of Vehumet
  5541 | D:4      | Noticed a phantom
  5551 | D:4      | Killed a phantom
  5987 | D:5      | Entered Level 5 of the Dungeon
  6227 | D:5      | Found a staircase to the Ecumenical Temple.
  6518 | D:5      | Reached skill level 7 in Spellcasting
  6574 | D:5      | Reached XP level 8. HP: 41/41 MP: 25/25
  6610 | D:5      | Found a white marble altar of Elyvilon.
  7118 | D:5      | Acquired Vehumet's first power
  7118 | D:5      | Offered knowledge of Sandblast by Vehumet.
  7897 | D:6      | Reached skill level 8 in Spellcasting
  8050 | D:6      | Offered knowledge of Sting by Vehumet.
  8195 | D:6      | Found a shattered altar of Ashenzari.
  8367 | D:6      | Reached skill level 9 in Spellcasting
  8461 | D:6      | Reached XP level 9. HP: 45/45 MP: 27/28
  9631 | D:7      | Offered knowledge of Mephitic Cloud by Vehumet.
  9636 | D:7      | Learned a level 3 spell: Mephitic Cloud
  9831 | D:7      | Acquired Vehumet's second power
 10955 | D:8      | Offered knowledge of Dazzling Spray by Vehumet.
 11034 | D:8      | Paralysed by a giant eyeball for 3 turns
 11050 | D:8      | Paralysed by a giant eyeball for 4 turns
 11176 | D:8      | Reached skill level 10 in Spellcasting
 11942 | D:9      | Acquired Vehumet's third power
 12231 | D:9      | Offered knowledge of Ignite Poison by Vehumet.
 12231 | D:9      | Reached XP level 10. HP: 40/50 MP: 23/31
 12238 | D:9      | Learned a level 5 spell: Ignite Poison
 12417 | D:9      | Upgraded the game from 0.13-a0-2640-geebf78d to 0.13-a0-2641-gc68e7bd
 12535 | D:9      | Found a staircase to the Orcish Mines.
 12740 | D:9      | Noticed Psyche
 12744 | D:9      | Killed Psyche
 12744 | D:9      | Reached skill level 10 in Fire Magic
 12913 | D:9      | Noticed Grum
 12935 | D:9      | Killed Grum
 12935 | D:9      | Reached skill level 10 in Conjurations
 13009 | D:9      | Noticed a hill giant
 13026 | D:9      | Killed a hill giant
 13167 | D:9      | Noticed Gastronok
 13333 | D:9      | Killed Gastronok
 13333 | D:9      | Reached skill level 11 in Fire Magic
 14499 | D:9      | Reached XP level 11. HP: 54/54 MP: 32/32
 15413 | D:10     | Entered Level 10 of the Dungeon
 15418 | D:10     | Noticed a hill giant
 15427 | D:10     | Killed a hill giant
 15505 | D:10     | Reached skill level 12 in Fire Magic
 15625 | D:10     | Noticed a hill giant
 15649 | D:10     | Killed a hill giant
 15969 | D:10     | Noticed Harold
 15992 | D:10     | Killed Harold
 16518 | D:10     | Offered knowledge of Bolt of Fire by Vehumet.
 16526 | D:10     | Learned a level 6 spell: Bolt of Fire
 17990 | D:11     | Found Dauhiu's Jewellery Boutique.
 17997 | D:11     | Bought an uncursed ring of sustenance for 192 gold pieces
 18014 | D:11     | Noticed Nessos
 18027 | D:11     | Noticed a hill giant
 18031 | D:11     | Slain by a red ugly thing


Action                   |  1- 3 |  4- 6 |  7- 9 | 10-12 || total
-------------------------+-------+-------+-------+-------++-------
Melee: Club              |       |       |    15 |       ||    15
       Staff             |       |       |    51 |    31 ||    82
       Flail             |       |       |     7 |       ||     7
 Fire: Sling             |       |       |     4 |       ||     4
Throw: Club              |    28 |    13 |       |       ||    41
       Dart              |     2 |     2 |       |       ||     4
       Dagger            |       |       |       |     1 ||     1
       Javelin           |       |       |       |     1 ||     1
 Cast: Flame Tongue      |    77 |    94 |   103 |   184 ||   458
       Throw Flame       |     7 |    41 |   186 |   128 ||   362
       Conjure Flame     |       |     1 |     7 |    25 ||    33
       Sticky Flame      |       |     7 |    43 |    36 ||    86
       Fireball          |       |       |    60 |    23 ||    83
       Mephitic Cloud    |       |       |     4 |    16 ||    20
       Ignite Poison     |       |       |       |    19 ||    19
Evoke: Wand              |     1 |       |       |     7 ||     8
  Use: Scroll            |     7 |    11 |     7 |     3 ||    28
       Potion            |       |       |       |    11 ||    11


[savageorange]

Can you get the .lst file? I guess you have tried 'CTRL+F food', but if not it could be worth a look.

I don't know for sure, but if it's based on a simple 'N times in M, the generated item is food' or 'N times in M, the generated vault is a food vault', then statistics dictates that it's always *possible*, just very unlikely, that the roll 'N in M' fails M or more times in a row.
To be a little more concrete, a 50% fail rate spell should fail roughly ..50% of the time, but it's always possible that, say, you fail to cast it 20 times in a row, because that chance remains the same for each roll: there's a 50% chance of each *individual* roll failing, no matter how many rolls have already been done. If you flip a coin 20 times and it comes up heads every time, that doesn't necessarily mean there's anything wrong with the coin or your flipping, you just encountered an event of very low probability.

The above type of roll is the type used in most of Crawl. If in this case, it instead uses a 'Count the number of items generated, and for every Nth item, *make it a food item*', then it's not statistically vulnerable in the way I described. This is a more controlled method where you can limit the amount of variance pretty precisely.
For example, some games will use a variant of this, where they randomly generate a 'number of turns/items until next foo event' counter every time said counter reaches zero, after actually generating the event of course. The most well known being Bubble Bobble.

Personally I'd prefer the second method, as a player, because I know it's more reliable/controllable, both from the inside and outside of the algorithm.

</statistics is fun>

Just to be clear, I haven't yet looked at the code which does item generation.

[reaver]

I don't know for sure, but if it's based on a simple 'N times in M, the generated item is food' or 'N times in M, the generated vault is a food vault', then statistics dictates that it's always *possible*, just very unlikely, that the roll 'N in M' fails M or more times in a row....Just to be clear, I haven't yet looked at the code which does item generation.

It doesn't work that way. Like branch ends, you are absolutely guaranteed a couple of food vaults. You get at least one bread ration by D:5, and get a second food vault (one out of several options, which "give around 20k nutrition") by D:14. The vaults can spawn before then, but if you haven't seen them by the time you get to those floors, they are guaranteed to spawn. This is done here.

[bcadren]

Honestly; if anything I'd say in 90% of games there's too much food. Primary problem with food is it over-encumbers you fast and butchering corpses is tedious. I feel like though games like this may exist if anything most games need less general food. Spriggans, general vegetarian runs and Fedhas worshipers might have more to complain about because of the relative rarity of fruit, though. Be interesting to see what it'd be like if permafood was slightly more common, but corpse-bothering/chunks weren't allowed.

[and into]

For example, in my current DEFE game I have 8 meat rations, 5 slices of pizza, a choko and 9 bread rations in my stash, and I've played no differently. I have done lair down to 6 on this game, but that is a lot of difference in food levels. I generally stash at least 5 rations in lair as soon as I get there, and I've been there a few times with DEFE now in the last week.

Aside from bad luck, the difference may have been that you were wielding a staff of cold and you are casting fire spells. Were you walking around wielding the staff of cold for a while? A staff of cold gives you a boost to ice elemental spells, but lowers the power of fire elemental spells significantly. That, combined with a bit of bad luck in terms of permafood, could easily have been the problem. (You should have been rocking that flail of protection, as even a crappy dagger of protection is an EXCELLENT caster weapon, +5 AC is great.)

[savageorange]

@Reaver: thanks for the link!
So

CHANCE: 100% (D:5), 25%

means 'always generated on D:5', or does it mean 'generated on D:5 if it has not yet been generated in this game'?
I'm wondering because I'm pretty sure I've encountered two of grunt_ogre_cave in a single game.

(I'm aware that the actual situation is a little more complex, because there are 100% weights for multiple vaults on the same level, implying that there is an 100% chance that one of them will be generated, and a 1/N chance that any particular one of them will be generated.)

@ bcadren: I think we have too much (perma)food partly -because- food management is a hassle, and making food management less annoying would probably also be a step towards calibrating the quantities of food better.

Fedhas is a slightly different annoyance -- as a fedhas worshipper you're at least not *obligated* to expend fruit. To me that's a similar situation as with scrolls or wands -- One of many possible avenues, so not a disaster if it runs out. (of course, there's something to be said for Fedhas worship just plain increasing fruit spawn rates, since fruit is really only particularly useful to a Fedhasite anyway. And it makes sense thematically.)

[reaver]

The food vaults are generated on the last possible level if they have failed all previous rolls, i.e. 'generated on D:5 if it has not yet been generated in this game'. The second food vaults mess around with the generation more. They also have uniq_ and chance_ tags to ensure only one appears. (The chance_ tag is used only for these food vaults.) The double food vault would be a bug.

[XuaXua]

Fruit are useful - they take much less time to eat than rations.

[siprus]

Eating berries is pain in the arse. I want option to eat whole bunch at one. (maybe pressing E with berries makes you eat 10, or untill you run out)

[MoogleDan]

I generally just gobble grapes and sultanas while waiting for HP / MP to come back. It's marginally more productive than just hitting 5!

[BlackSheep]

I just eat the first one and then use ` to repeat the action as many times as needed.

[mopl]

Fruit are useful

if you are worshipping Fedhas.
I still think we need to explain some players that the aim of DCSS is to stay alive, not to stand on a huge pile of food just in case !

[Siegurt]

Fruit are useful

if you are worshipping Fedhas.
I still think we need to explain some players that the aim of DCSS is to stay alive, not to stand on a huge pile of food just in case !

Wait, I thought I needed a giant stack of food to climb out of that hole at the top of the dungeon with the orb, Isn't that what giant food stashes are for?

[mopl]

Fruit are useful

if you are worshipping Fedhas.
I still think we need to explain some players that the aim of DCSS is to stay alive, not to stand on a huge pile of food just in case !

Wait, I thought I needed a giant stack of food to climb out of that hole at the top of the dungeon with the orb, Isn't that what giant food stashes are for?

You're right : how could we survive outside he dungeon without food... You actually can't escape with the Orb if not carrying at least 20 bread rations