SpEn and distortion brand

[Strat]

So, I've been struggling to get a win with a SpEn using Nemelex (I know, shows how lousy I am at this game). Anyway, I decided to go with Ash this time for a change. Main question at the moment -- I've got daggers of electrocution and distortion early on (by D:5) -- which to go with? I know if I go with distortion I'm pretty well locked in, but with the curse factor anyway ... Any thoughts from people who've been more successful than me (that is, most everyone here)? Thanks.

[kenmtraveller]

I would go with Distortion... it and Pain are arguably the best brands, and distortion is really good for a stabber because it will blink tough, awake critters away from you .
If you do unwield at some point, make sure to have a scroll of vulnerability to read, in case you get a lot of glow.

disclaimer: I've never actually won with a stabber , although i've gotten close several times.

Ken

[Psieye]

Distortion. If you stab it, it's dead anyway. If you fail to stab it, you can make it go away.

[crate]

I would use elec because there are some places I don't like distortion.

[HenryFlower]

A dagger of distortion carried one of my SpEn of Ash to Zot 5 (would have won that game but for heavy inexperience in Zotology). The game went exactly like Psieye said. Easy stuff died, medium stuff blinked, hard stuff just went away (the cumulative odds of an abyss trip mean that if you stab it a bunch of times, it's going to happen).

[Strat]

Thanks for the quick advice to all. Based on that, I've decided to go with the distortion brand. If nothing else, it will reduce some of my indecision on how to go forward -- I'm terrible about not knowing whether to branch out into slings, or conjurations, or long blades, or ... now I'm (mostly) committed, as I'm unlikely to unequip any time soon.

[kenmtraveller]

With a stabber, I wouldn't branch into slings; you are trying to move up to sleeping stuff and stab it, not plink at it from a distance and wake it up.
Not sure about the merits of conjurations/long blades. I do get to a point in the lategame where stabbing starts to fail me and I die because my backup plan isn't good enough. Maybe someone can give some good advice here.

[Psieye]

A lategame stabber has to make a decision: to kill or to ninja. Some stab attempts will inevitably fail and the target will be immune to the regular stab tactics - what do? Kill it some other way or run around it?

[Strat]

Like kenmtraveller, I have the same late game issue -- I've yet to discover a good second plan for the later game where I can reliably either kill OR get away -- even when I'm trying to run, I often get killed from a distance (I'm sure it's bad play on my part, but nonetheless). Anyway, any value in fire dragon armor with a Ash-worshipping SpEn?

[Styro]

In my experience, FDA will hurt your stealth too much and make it more likely for you to need to either fight or run away.

According to the wiki, wearing armour gives this minus to your stealth rating: -6 × (Evasion Penalty)^2

So an EV penalty of -3 from FDA means -54 to your stealth rating, which is a 10-20% penalty for even the stealthiest of characters. If you hope to stab things late-game then I would stick with a robe or something with a smaller EV penalty. OTOH, if you have abandoned stabbing and stealth then FDA is great.

[rchandra]

the penalties are even worse for small and tiny races: observe how much your EV is reduced in the hide. I wouldn't use armour heavier than mottled on a SpEn ever, and would usually prefer a robe of resistance.