Draconian Transmuter


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

Dungeon Dilettante

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Joined: Saturday, 5th May 2012, 10:28

Post Saturday, 5th May 2012, 10:32

Draconian Transmuter

hi,

a new crawler here.

been trying to get transmuter to work, was trying out a lot of demon spawn but keep dying since it is so weak early on. now im going for draconian and have my best runs on this combination. any advice for the build.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Saturday, 5th May 2012, 10:41

Re: Draconian Transmuter

Sludge Elf/Merfolk Transmuter Guide works pretty well for Draconians too. It has detailled advice on Transmuter's early game.
Disregard the part about Dragon Form, of course - it's an excellent spell for Draconians. Just look at all the things it gives you as a (for you) pure Transmutations level 7 spell that you even get a wizardry bonus to!
Also, Sif Muna is a viable choice and the best god for rushing Dragon Form. With right skilling and normal luck with gifts you will have it before the end of Lair. However, Okawaru will give you a much easier time before Dragon Form. It's up to you and what you want for your DrTm.

Dungeon Dilettante

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Post Monday, 7th May 2012, 14:10

Re: Draconian Transmuter

thanks for the advice, I dont find okawaru helpful at all since Im really stingy with my hunger cost so I usually die before I activate heroism. also its very hard to find the 3 books that contain dragonform so I would think sif muna definately fit the build alot more unless you find the book early then should just go okawaru or evilyvon.

basically the guide works very well for the draconian as well. but you will be less spellcasting and more unarmed combat specialist so might not have to go pure Int and can invest some into Dex or Str in the early game.
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Blades Runner

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Post Monday, 7th May 2012, 16:19

Re: Draconian Transmuter

iirc dracs don't get the wizardry bonus to dragon form anymore. they do get more AC, and it's tm instead of tm/fire, so it's still good.
crawlee: dragon form is not *that* hard to find, and while it's nice to have the option you don't really need any tm spell other than what's in the starting book.
Wins: DDBe (3 runes, morgue file)
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Snake Sneak

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Post Monday, 7th May 2012, 17:24

Re: Draconian Transmuter

crawlee wrote:I dont find okawaru helpful at all since Im really stingy with my hunger cost so I usually die before I activate heroism.

Heroism is extremely cheap in terms of both food and piety, so you don't need to be afraid of using it. Seriously, it costs less nutrition than, for example, Sif's channeling ability.

Dungeon Dilettante

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Joined: Saturday, 5th May 2012, 10:28

Post Monday, 7th May 2012, 22:52

Re: Draconian Transmuter

oh yea, I find that draconian transmuter is way more tankier than the races in the guide so maybe the skill should be skewed toward fighting or less skewed toward dodging?

Zot Zealot

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Joined: Tuesday, 4th January 2011, 15:03

Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 13:51

Re: Draconian Transmuter

If you plan to learn dragon form, than very high dodging is not so useful, because your EV will be terrible in dragon form anyway. If you want to use blade hands, EV still your best defense - since you cannot wear any armour, or use shields.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 20:36

Re: Draconian Transmuter

I absolutely fail to see the logic in saying "SE is better at Dr at casting, so Dr should put points into STR/DEX" - what? The fact that you will be casting higher-level spells than your standard mid-game (or all-game) SETm without great INT, +3 tmut and +2 spellcasting only increases your need for the INT you can get. Plus, STR and DEX are pretty bad.

If you plan to learn dragon form, than very high dodging is not so useful, because your EV will be terrible in dragon form anyway. If you want to use blade hands, EV still your best defense - since you cannot wear any armour, or use shields.


+1 (Dodging helps but you probably have other stuff to train), but don't forget that rings of evasion/Shaolin and Phase Shift are still very useful on a more-or-less constant dragonformer. I guess such a character would mainly use Ice Form if Dragon Form isn't worth the hunger/MP/miscast chance.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 00:17

Re: Draconian Transmuter

Drtm gets more out of dex than setm because dr dex is mediocre whereas se dex is good. I can see putting a point or two into dex on drtm, especially if you are using blade hands and spider form.

My drtm win was in iceform/dragon form almost the entire game. I was a white drac though so I had to blade hands zot :(

Anyway the biggest advice I give about transmuters is that you are primarily a tabdudes character who happens to also cast spells.

Lair Larrikin

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Joined: Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 06:55

Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 07:28

Re: Draconian Transmuter

DrTm spell really require a lot of patience to see what color you are.

I found "ice form" nearly useless unless you want to stay under water. I fight mostly with my snakes; and also from range somehow, even crossbow I picked and used although I train none of them.

You can watch me, archl. A pale draconian now, only close fight and mostly in dragon form which I got the book at level 9, finally put in use at level 12.

Ice magic is bad to me, I use 2 fire spells Evaporate and Ignite Poison

Also, I'm stupid enough to learn "Cure Poison" at level 14 because I hate to wait poison cleared.

Pale Draconian: I have Air+1, and since spider form is a must, with only spider form you dare face killer bee at low level, not iceform, I always use swiftness because it allow more strategy, including crossbow down a troll zombie early, save centaur's arrow more, I damn need arrows to create snakes! You know, it would cost me 400 arrows to clear the elven hall:5.

Hmm, fire magic, I might consider learn a bit after Umarmed and Transmutation reach level 27 and 22. Polymorph others would be fun as well.

Also, stay useful low level spells for good, like animated skeleton, blink, swiftness, summon butterfly, fire brand, Fulsome Distillation, call imp, Evaporate, Passwall, Levitation, etc...

I want a polymoph other NOW!, I want to polymorph my snake to dragons...

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 08:51

Re: Draconian Transmuter

I think damage is going to be the last priority of a character with Blade Hands aiming to use Dragon Form... I'm still not convinced of DEX on DrTm.

Also: Ice Form is strong. I have heard on multiple occasions that it will deal more damage than Blade Hands (with high enough UC, anyway) to anything without rC+. I don't know what brought you to the conclusion that it isn't.

How are Fire Brand and Call Imp useful to DrTm?? You don't even use weapons, let alone unbranded ones, and you have Summon Butterflies as a better meatshield spell...

Vestibule Violator

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Joined: Monday, 3rd January 2011, 17:47

Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 15:53

Re: Draconian Transmuter

I want a polymoph other NOW!, I want to polymorph my snake to dragons...

I'm not sure you understand how polymorph other works.

Also your statement about ice form is objectively bad advice. This spell will own all of lair and much of the midgame. It is easier and cheaper than blade hands, does similar damage to anything not rC+, let's you go through water with no worries and the only downside can be counteracted with one of two relatively common rings.
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Vestibule Violator

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Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 17:01

Re: Draconian Transmuter

archl wrote:I want a polymoph other NOW!, I want to polymorph my snake to dragons...

Evaporate a potion of mutation, then get your minions to wander into the clouds somehow (don't fire directly at them- that'll make them hostile).

Granted, this is kind of silly with summoned allies. Its' much more fun on say a HOPr. Also, the transformations are based on HD, so a snake isn't going to change into anything particularly awesome.

Lair Larrikin

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Joined: Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 06:55

Post Thursday, 10th May 2012, 04:49

Re: Draconian Transmuter

rebthor wrote:
I want a polymoph other NOW!, I want to polymorph my snake to dragons...

I'm not sure you understand how polymorph other works.

Also your statement about ice form is objectively bad advice. This spell will own all of lair and much of the midgame. It is easier and cheaper than blade hands, does similar damage to anything not rC+, let's you go through water with no worries and the only downside can be counteracted with one of two relatively common rings.


I found ice form hardly land a hit on enemy and in lair I do prefer use dragon form and spider form mostly. I don't want to fight on my own, so I call snake or get some skeleton or imp(shadow one can raise zombie).

Iceform I used most was once in a spider nest, nowhere else since in ice form I cannot wield wood to call snakes and without superior power I still moving in normal speed, which is less useful. You shall try to fight killer bee with iceform and spider form for a comparison, even I have a normal cloak - which is also normal for a early character.

Ice form you have only cloak, and very few variety cloak artifact with special ability:

A larger chance to get good artifact boots/hat/cloak with your blade hands,
also with blade hands you can fly and make better damage , as with ice form you can swim, but fly grant you some sneak bonus, which is very useful. you can make quick headcut. I was often able to grab an equipment(ring/boot/cloak) allow me to turn invisibility, with blade hands, many the first time I met hill giant, I manage cut him half within 2 hits.


mageykun wrote:
archl wrote:I want a polymoph other NOW!, I want to polymorph my snake to dragons...

Evaporate a potion of mutation, then get your minions to wander into the clouds somehow (don't fire directly at them- that'll make them hostile).

Granted, this is kind of silly with summoned allies. Its' much more fun on say a HOPr. Also, the transformations are based on HD, so a snake isn't going to change into anything particularly awesome.


Thank you, polymorph own snake won't make them hostile at the first time, I tried on my snake and turned it into friendly steam dragon or a friendly human. And I found casting it on imp I called would do turn them hostile. Thanks for the advice using mutation cloud, but it would be too loud:)

Lair Larrikin

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Joined: Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 06:55

Post Thursday, 10th May 2012, 05:11

Re: Draconian Transmuter

Also, get yourself a way to berserk ASAP. It is ... bloody killer.

A berserking draconian in "Dragon Form" is the most deadly melee character I've ever used, with huge HP pool and also get your swiftness before turning into berserk. draconian of 110% HP * 150% * 2.5 = HitPoint damn monster, you foes would cry :) and its at what speed I cannot say. probably 19, normally none enemy could escape for sure. And you got protected by snakes if you unlucky to finish off all tough enemy.

Must learn spell is: Sticks to Snakes, with this, you can try to conquer Elven Hall. This is one of the best spell, for killing all elves, quick and easy.

Form/Blade hands cancellation : z a, use your default magic, which is very unlikely to fail, this can save you one turn. When you want snake being created faster - OK, sometimes, I fight in a situation, wether you can create snakes faster enough to kill an enemy you normally cannot beat, or soften it to almost dead; or the enemy make its way towards you faster than your creating. - This is how I won over a Deep Elf Blademaster.

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