Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

Dungeon Dilettante

Posts: 2

Joined: Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 04:01

Post Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 04:24

Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

Hi all,

So I have a 27 DeWz that has cleared all the branches and gotten all the runes except the hells, pan, and the abyss. I managed to get the staff of wucad mu, which is very nice in terms of damage and the channeling ability is great. Combat and damage from enemies is not too difficult - my enemy is GLOW/ rot and statdrain.

I am down to my last 7 potions of heal and heal wounds, I can't afford to keep rotting at this rate. The int drain from crystal ball/ wucad mu is also what forces my character to stop fighting.

My skills are roughly 14 fighting, 11 dodge/stealth, 20 evocations, 27 spellcasting, 22 conjurations, 12-15 for ice, summoning, necromancy, and transmutations. I started out with Sif muna and dropped her after I got most of the spells that I wanted. Currently I have full piety with Vehumet.

What I want is advice re: gearing and playing my character to avoid rot and stat drain. Without any enhancers my worst failure rates are ice storm, 6%, lehudib's crystal spear, 4%, and necromutation, 10%.

The gear I have been using (without success due to too much glow/rotting) is staff of wucad mu, amulet of clarity, ring of sustain abilities and ring of teleport control. That seems pretty optimal in terms of preventing combat deaths. The problem is that even 6 or 10% failure rates have SEVERAL failures in a row way too frequently. I have gone from gray glow all the way to red glow with just one critical failure, and have easily sustained a total of 20-30 points of rot damage thus far. I am running out of potions and don't have any wands of healing.

My second problem is stat drain / mana issues. Licheform characters seem to recover stats very slowly, if at all. I started Gehenna with 35 int, after clearing 2 vaults in Geh7 I was at like 21 int, and the Wucad Mu staff was barely functioning at all. Supposedly I could stack 2 rings of sustain abilities - I was wearing one and still took 14 points of int dmg.

I don't spam haste, and I use semi-controlled blink fairly infrequently, most of my glow comes from getting several miscasts in a row.

Any advice? I don't think rmut prevents lich rotting, does it? Last time I played was like .6 or .7 and I never have had such significant rotting problems on a late game mage. I guess I could just avoid lichform entirely (and thus the spell failure) unless I am facing enemies with torment... but it is so lovely. I would really rather not do that, and if I do, I will probably get nasty mutations. Only one potion of cure mutation thus far in game. I could also avoid using high level spells, but it takes forever to kill high level demons with things like iron shot.

Oh, and I am NOT under penance with Sif Muna. She forgave me a long time ago.

Thoughts? How can I prevent/mitigate rot and stat drain?

Slime Squisher

Posts: 375

Joined: Sunday, 15th January 2012, 16:59

Post Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 04:34

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

Raise your casting skills, wear wiz, channel less. Posting a chardump would help. You can put off hells for easier areas (the rest of them, usually) depending on what you've done; based on your skils it looks like you should have a few branches left.

Off topic: why did you switch away from sif if you were planning on being a lich 24/7? Free no-downside channeling is better than V's abilities (in my opinion) and would have dodged all of the problems you're having.
User avatar

Snake Sneak

Posts: 117

Joined: Sunday, 6th February 2011, 03:18

Post Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 04:38

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

6 to 10% failure on your main high level spells is way too high. Get your Necro to 18 and your Ice to 20.
Annotations
D:3 exclusion: Sigmund

Blades Runner

Posts: 599

Joined: Thursday, 28th April 2011, 07:47

Post Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 10:37

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

I agree on Sif, the early game is easier with Vehumet, you have spells guaranteed and get wizardry for conj/summ, but in lichform Sif channeling is really nice.
If you have a staff of channeling you could use that instead of energy/wucad, at least when time is not critical.
10% fail chance is quite horrible, i agree with one-eyed jack on this as well.
I am quite frightened of glow, and i think rightly so, and avoid it whenever possible. Hells are of course a special place, but everywhere else you should rest as long as you have to to get rid of it.
rMut also helps against getting rot in lichform i think.
Check out my characters at Spielersofa (in German)

Swamp Slogger

Posts: 153

Joined: Sunday, 11th March 2012, 16:16

Post Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 16:49

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

rMut definitely does prevent mutation-related rot in lichform. I had some trouble with it before I got an amulet of resist mutation. Other things you can do besides raising spell skills is spend some time in Pan for a while (lots of heal/curing in there) and use a wand of heal wounds / scrolls of recharging. If you have a Zig you want to brave, you'll find helpful items there as well.
User avatar

Crypt Cleanser

Posts: 645

Joined: Wednesday, 14th September 2011, 09:36

Location: <---

Post Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 18:23

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

minmay wrote:Don't waste wand of heal wounds charges on something as minor as rot - at the very least, use your wands of random effects before anything else.


That's power gaming, I never tough of that before. But sometime used them in hope for invis or speed before going downstairs.

Swamp Slogger

Posts: 153

Joined: Sunday, 11th March 2012, 16:16

Post Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 22:24

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

minmay wrote:Don't waste wand of heal wounds charges on something as minor as rot - at the very least, use your wands of random effects before anything else.


I'd suggest it depends on how many you have. In my last game I had about 20-25 spare charges and several unused scrolls of recharging.

Dungeon Dilettante

Posts: 2

Joined: Tuesday, 20th March 2012, 04:01

Post Wednesday, 21st March 2012, 01:49

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

Thanks for the advice all. I have posted part of my dump file below. I think in all my games I have had only one full win, back in .6, and I haven't played since then. I don't know if casting failures were changed to cause more catastrophic effects, or if the main difference is that I was running Sif in my full win game and the casting failures were thus less catastrophic. You don't appreciate that bonus unless you run a non-sif character.

One-Eyed Jack wrote:Raise your casting skills, wear wiz, channel less. Posting a chardump would help. You can put off hells for easier areas (the rest of them, usually) depending on what you've done; based on your skils it looks like you should have a few branches left.

Thanks. See below for chardump. I don't have any real branches left though - only pandemonium, the hells, and the abyss. I kind of want to avoid pandemonium until I am capable of killing the special pan lords. I might spend some time in the abyss, or just wear wizardry rings.

One-Eyed Jack wrote: Off topic: why did you switch away from sif if you were planning on being a lich 24/7? Free no-downside channeling is better than V's abilities (in my opinion) and would have dodged all of the problems you're having.


Hindsight is 20/20. Like I said, the importance of Sif's protection from miscasts was not apparent until I dumped her. Anyway I think her channeling is very slooow - 1-8 mana kinda sucks. I was prepared to dump her for Vehumet once I got all the books. Anyway, I like Vehumet's range bonuses and mana on kill bonus, but risk free mana is pretty attractive. I am not a terribly experienced crawl player, this is an experience I will learn from. Actually the mana on kill bonus is tremendously useful, especially with ice storm, but it does not surplant channeling mana.

Fungus wrote:rMut definitely does prevent mutation-related rot in lichform. I had some trouble with it before I got an amulet of resist mutation. Other things you can do besides raising spell skills is spend some time in Pan for a while (lots of heal/curing in there) and use a wand of heal wounds / scrolls of recharging. If you have a Zig you want to brave, you'll find helpful items there as well.


Thanks, I will give this a try. However it will require me to remove my amulet of clarity - which is really necessary for using crystal ball / wucad mu in lichform. I lost a high level naga in pan to a careless crystal ball paralysis :(.

minmay wrote:Don't waste wand of heal wounds charges on something as minor as rot - at the very least, use your wands of random effects before anything else.

I have gotten almost all wands except heal wounds, I did use my random effects charges but to no avail.

Thanks for the advice all. For now I think I will try wearing at least 1 wizardry ring and spend some time in the abyss gaining levels and re-building my emergency supply of healing. Want to hold off on pan for now. I will carry around an rmut amulet to deal with red glow. Also feel free to offer any other advice you would care to offer regarding my character build.

  Code:
Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.10.0 character file.

Deep the Archmage (Deep Elf Wizard)               Turns: 198001, Time: 21:56:26

HP 164/164       AC 21     Str 11      XL: 27
MP  50/50        EV 21     Int 35      God: Vehumet [******]
Gold 10942       SH 13     Dex 16      Spells: 17 memorised,  1 level left

Res.Fire  : + + .   See Invis. : +    V - staff of channeling
Res.Cold  : + + .   Warding    : . .  z - +2 robe {rC+ rF+}
Life Prot.: + + +   Conserve   : +    l - +2 buckler {rF+}
Res.Acid. : + . .   Res.Corr.  : +    v - +2 helmet {SInv}
Res.Poison: +       Clarity    : +    J - +2 cloak {rCorr, Cons}
Res.Elec. : .       Spirit.Shd : .    c - +1 pair of gloves "Byplo" {Int+3}
Sust.Abil.: . .     Stasis     : .    W - +2 pair of boots of the Assassin {+Inv Dex
Res.Mut.  : .       Ctrl.Telep.: .    P - amulet of clarity
Res.Rott. : +       Levitation : .    d - ring of wizardry
Saprovore : . . .   Ctrl.Flight: .    X - ring of wizardry

@: lich-form, studying Staves, extraordinarily resistant to hostile
enchantments, extraordinarily stealthy
A: Str -1
a: End Transformation, Renounce Religion, Evoke Invisibility
}: 5/15 runes: serpentine, barnacled, slimy, silver, golden


You are on level 2 of the Lair of Beasts.
You worship Vehumet.
Vehumet is exalted by your worship.
You are not hungry.

You are in lich-form.

You have visited 15 branches of the dungeon, and seen 88 of its levels.
You have visited the Abyss 1 time.
You have visited 1 Labyrinth.
You have visited 2 bazaars.
You have visited 3 portal chambers: volcano, spiders nest, ice cave.

You have collected 12660 gold pieces.
You have spent 1738 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 a - the +22,+13 Staff of Wucad Mu
   (You found it on level 3 of the Tomb of the Ancients)
 m - the +7,+6 Sceptre of Torment
   (You found it on level 3 of the Vaults)
 K - the +5 blowgun "Opuwn" {speed, rElec rF+ SInv}
   (You found it on level 4 of the Elven Halls)   
   
   Attacks with this weapon take half as long, but cause slightly less damage.
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It enhances your eyesight.
Missiles
 p - 3 curare-tipped needles
Armour
 c - the +1 pair of gloves "Byplo" (worn) {Int+3}
   (You found it on level 12 of the Dungeon)   
   
   It affects your intelligence (+3).
 l - a +2 buckler of fire resistance (worn)
 v - a +2 helmet of see invisible (worn)
 z - a +2 robe of resistance (worn)
 J - a +2 cloak of preservation (worn)
 W - the +2 pair of boots of the Assassin (worn) {+Inv Dex+3 Stlth++}
   (You acquired it on level 3 of the Vaults)   
   
   It affects your dexterity (+3).
   It lets you turn invisible.
   It makes you much more stealthy.
   
   These boots were specially designed by the Assassin's Guild.
Magical devices
 r - a wand of fire (4)
 w - a wand of disintegration (5)
 G - a wand of cold (7)
 S - a wand of teleportation (5)
 Z - a wand of draining (10)
Scrolls
 y - a scroll of fear
 B - 2 scrolls of blinking
 C - 2 scrolls of teleportation
Jewellery
 d - a ring of wizardry (right hand)
 e - the ring of Thrawoh {SustAb Dex+4 Dam+6}
   (You found it on level 8 of the Vaults)   
   
   [ring of sustain abilities]
   
   It affects your dexterity (+4).
   It affects your damage-dealing abilities (+6).
 f - an uncursed ring of sustain abilities
 g - the amulet "Ituew" {Gourm Str+3 Dex+2}
   (You found it on level 20 of the Dungeon)   
   
   [amulet of the gourmand]
   
   It affects your strength (+3).
   It affects your dexterity (+2).
 o - the ring "Twelatz" {rElec rF+ MR EV+2}
   (You found it on level 6 of the Pits of Slime)   
   
   [ring of evasion]
   It affects your evasion (+2).
   
   It protects you from fire.
   It insulates you from electricity.
   It increases your resistance to enchantments.
 q - the amulet "Mnis Orghoavo" {rMut Str+4 Dex-1}
   (You found it on level 7 of Tartarus)   
   
   [amulet of resist mutation]
   
   It affects your strength (+4).
   It affects your dexterity (-1).
 t - an uncursed amulet of conservation
 I - an uncursed ring of teleport control
 P - an amulet of clarity (around neck)
 X - a ring of wizardry (left hand)
Books
 E - a manual of Staves (studied)   
   You are currently studying this manual.
Magical staves
 b - a staff of wizardry
 i - a +9 rod of destruction [inacc,magma,cold] (12/12)
   (You took it off a yaktaur captain on level 8 of the Vaults)
 k - a +3 rod of warding (14/14)
   (You found it on level 7 of Tartarus)
 n - a +6 rod of smiting (14/14)
   (You found it on level 7 of Tartarus)
 x - a +1 rod of destruction [ice] (13/13)
   (You found it on level 3 of the Tomb of the Ancients)
 R - a +3 rod of destruction [fire] (10/10)
   (You found it on level 8 of the Lair of Beasts)
 V - a staff of channeling (weapon)


   Skills:
 * Level 15.4 Fighting
 - Level 1.7 Short Blades
 + Level 1.6 Long Blades
 + Level 0.9 Axes
 - Level 12.0 Maces & Flails
 - Level 0.5 Polearms
 + Level 12.9 Staves
 - Level 3.1 Throwing
 + Level 12.3 Dodging
 - Level 14.1 Stealth
 - Level 4.3 Shields
 - Level 8.0 Traps & Doors
 O Level 27 Spellcasting
 + Level 22.5 Conjurations
 - Level 8.6 Charms
 - Level 14.0 Summonings
 - Level 15.3 Necromancy
 * Level 4.1 Translocations
 - Level 15.1 Transmutations
 * Level 5.5 Fire Magic
 - Level 17.0 Ice Magic
 - Level 12.0 Air Magic
 - Level 5.4 Earth Magic
 - Level 1.5 Poison Magic
 - Level 9.0 Invocations
 - Level 20.0 Evocations


You have one spell level left.
You know the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Magic Dart            Conj           #####        0%          1    N/A
b - Iskenderun's Mystic   Conj           #########    0%          4    N/A
c - Orb of Destruction    Conj           #########.   1%          7    N/A
d - Lehudib's Crystal Sp  Erth/Conj      ########..   1%          8    N/A
e - Ice Storm             Ice/Conj       #########.   1%          9    N/A
f - Blink                 Tloc           N/A          1%          2    N/A
g - Malign Gateway        Tloc/Summ      ########..   1%          7    N/A
h - Summon Butterflies    Summ           ########.    0%          1    N/A
i - Haunt                 Summ/Necr      #########.   1%          7    N/A
j - Lee's Rapid Deconstr  Erth           #######...   1%          5    N/A
k - Sublimation of Blood  Necr           #########.   0%          2    N/A
l - Sticky Flame          Fire/Conj      ########.    0%          4    N/A
v - Ozocubu's Armour      Ice/Chrm       ########..   0%          3    N/A
w - Swiftness             Air/Chrm       ########..   0%          2    N/A
x - Flight                Air/Chrm       ########..   1%          3    N/A
y - Haste                 Chrm           ########.    1%          6    N/A
z - Necromutation         Trmt/Necr      #########.   2%          8    N/A


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (27/27)            Temple (1/1) D:6             Orc (4/4) D:9
    Elf (5/5) Orc:4          Lair (8/8) D:9          Shoals (5/5) Lair:6
  Slime (6/6) Lair:6        Snake (5/5) Lair:3        Vault (8/8) D:18
  Blade (1/1) Vault:4       Crypt (5/5) Vault:2        Tomb (3/3) Crypt:3
   Hell (1/1)                 Coc (2/7) Hell            Tar (7/7) Hell
    Zot (0/5) D:27       
   Dis: Hell:1         Geh: Hell:1

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 6393

Joined: Friday, 17th December 2010, 18:17

Post Wednesday, 21st March 2012, 02:13

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

Please put your chardumps inside [code] tags. I have added them to your message.

Slime Squisher

Posts: 375

Joined: Sunday, 15th January 2012, 16:59

Post Wednesday, 21st March 2012, 03:42

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

No offense, but... what the hell is going on with your skills? Why do you have such a high m&f and staves? Why are you training long blades and axes and staves? Do you ever actualy kill things with melee? This late in the game with the problems you're havng there's realy no reason to train more than 1-2 skills at a time, unless you're doing some funky "only manual" conduct.

Edit: You also have fire magic (at -4 crosstraining) focused. The only thing it is giving you is sticky flame spellpower.

I'd recommend swapping out one of the wiz rings for a better one (there is diminishing returns on wizardry bonuses iirc) and funneling xp into casting skills until failure rates are 1-2% with just one. Turn off all the other skills. You can also maybe use the wizardry staff (which I think is stronger than rings) and just swap it out to channel.

Next ditch Malign Gateway for Controlled Blink (if you have it; otherwise turn off tloc) and get it castable.

You still have zot to do which is a notorious shitload of exp. Take it slow and you should be able to clear it with just ice storm and haste. That should get you 1-2% ice storm and necromute and cblink, which is probably enough for the hells (and definitely for pan.)
User avatar

Abyss Ambulator

Posts: 1189

Joined: Friday, 28th January 2011, 21:45

Post Wednesday, 21st March 2012, 05:59

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

Are you evoking that crystal ball with low MP? It's odds of success goes down as your MP does. With that high of Evo, you should be more than safe using it at about 2/3 to 1/2 mana left. My Icestorming Lichformer followed Vehumet himself, though I started with him and, since I had all the spells I needed and a Staff of Channeling, saw no need to go to Sif. In the end, I used the crystal ball to keep my mana high and used the staff to quickly channel when my mana was low. Sif Muna/Staff Channeling might seem slow, but when you can do it hungerlessly, it's waaaaaaaaaaaay faster (and safer!) than resting.

And yeah, your skills are kind of all jacked up there. Get shields to 5 so you can finish getting rid of your buckler casting penalties and then focus on your casting skills as suggested. If you don't mind Vehumet's wrath, you can swap to Ashenzari and fix your skills that way. It's not urgent though. You were tough enough for Tomb, so you're tough enough for the rest of the game.
The best strategy most frequently overlooked by new players for surviving: not starting a fight to begin with.

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 4055

Joined: Tuesday, 10th January 2012, 19:49

Post Wednesday, 21st March 2012, 06:06

Re: Help with avoiding rot in lategame lichform blaster mage

If you're still under Sif wrath you will also automatically miscast about 10% of the time or something, it's part of her wrath (and I don't think it reduces penance, either). This is a very good way to get a lot of glow.

Return to Dungeon Crawling Advice

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 25 guests

cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by ST Software for PTF.