Dwarven Fighter Advice.


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Monday, 30th January 2012, 04:52

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 05:16

Dwarven Fighter Advice.

Just need a little bit of advice, I'm level 12 right now my skill are Fighting 11 Maces 14 armor and shields both 13 plus I have evocations at 8. I haven't gotten very lucky with items, only one artifact and it's a ring (resist poison, -cold, +blink and seeInvis) and a morning star of venom. My question is if I should dabble in magic at all, and if I should what low level spells should I wait to see if I get before I go ahead and do it? I have a book with summon small mammals in it, I know that's pretty good for escaping and the such but nothing else remarkable. Right now my only ranged damage is 5 magical hand axes I use to throw. Any advice would be helpful, thanks :)

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 3037

Joined: Sunday, 2nd January 2011, 02:06

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 05:22

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

If you're wearing heavy armor, and you probably should be, then you don't really have the option of learning magic. Good heavy armor gives you enough of a penalty to spellcasting that you won't get even the lowest of spells online in a reasonable amount of time.

If you want better advice tuned to this particular character, you're undoubtedly going to have to post a character dump. We don't even know what version you're playing, or what deity your character is following.

Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Monday, 30th January 2012, 04:52

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 05:42

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

Oh, my bad. How do I get and post a character dump?

Slime Squisher

Posts: 390

Joined: Friday, 24th December 2010, 07:29

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 05:44

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

Press "#" ingame to dump. Then go to crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/username/username.txt, where username = brandon0981 or whatever you use on CAO.
TrCK:
Xom grants you an implement of some kind.
_Something appears at your feet!
4790 gold pieces {god gift}.

DsAr:
You blink. You feel slightly more hungry. Prince Ribbit hits you. You die...
"Hey, that's my toy!"
Xom revives you!

Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Monday, 30th January 2012, 04:52

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 05:49

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

  Code:
Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.9.2 character file.

Dwarfer the Basher (Mountain Dwarf Fighter)                                            Turns: 18587, Time: 01:34:31

HP 104/104       AC 21     Str 26      XL: 12   Next: 44%
MP  11/11        EV  4     Int  6      God: Okawaru [****..]
Gold 304         SH 37     Dex 11      Spells:  0 memorised, 13 levels left

Res.Fire  : . . .   See Invis. : +    o - +1 orc morningstar
Res.Cold  : . . .   Warding    : . .  B - +3 plate mail
Life Prot.: . . .   Conserve   : .    y - -3 large shield
Res.Acid. : . . .   Res.Corr.  : .    e - -1 wizard hat
Res.Poison: +       Clarity    : .    v - +0 cloak
Res.Elec. : .       Spirit.Shd : .    (no gloves)
Sust.Abil.: . .     Stasis     : .    M - +0 pair of boots
Res.Mut.  : .       Ctrl.Telep.: .    (no amulet)
Res.Rott. : .       Levitation : .    T - ring "Seecs" {+Blink rPois rC- SInv}
Saprovore : . . .   Ctrl.Flight: .    D - ring of protection from cold

@: studying Invocations, somewhat resistant to hostile enchantments, extremely unstealthy
A: no striking features
a: Heroism, Renounce Religion, Evoke Blink


You are on level 2 of the Lair of Beasts.
You worship Okawaru.
Okawaru is extremely pleased with you.
You are not hungry.

You have visited 3 branches of the dungeon, and seen 14 of its levels.

You have collected 500 gold pieces.
You have spent 216 gold pieces at shops.

Inventory:

Hand weapons
 g - an uncursed glowing orcish hand axe (quivered)
 k - a glowing orcish hand axe
 o - a +1,+1 orcish morningstar (weapon)
 p - a glowing orcish hand axe
 J - an uncursed runed orcish hand axe
 X - an uncursed morningstar of venom
 Z - a runed hand axe
Missiles
 R - 2 throwing nets
 V - 16 darts of frost
Armour
 e - a -1 wizard hat (worn)
 v - a +0 cloak (worn)
 y - a -3 large shield (worn)
 B - a +3 plate mail (worn)
 M - a +0 pair of boots (worn)
Magical devices
 f - a forked fluorescent wand
 Q - a wand of disintegration (5)
 W - a wand of lightning {zapped: 1}
Comestibles
 d - an apple
 I - 15 sultanas
Scrolls
 a - 3 scrolls of remove curse
 b - a scroll of detect curse
 c - a scroll labeled XOPLUO DOSIG VUIDO {tried}
 j - 2 scrolls of magic mapping
 F - 2 scrolls labeled TRUMMAQEFU {tried}
 U - a scroll of blinking
Jewellery
 D - a ring of protection from cold (left hand)
 T - the ring "Seecs" (right hand) {+Blink rPois rC- SInv}
   (You found it on level 10 of the Dungeon)   
   
   [ring of poison resistance]
   
   It makes you vulnerable to cold.
   It enhances your eyesight.
   It lets you blink.
Potions
 l - 2 potions of heal wounds
 n - a green potion
 q - a metallic purple potion
 u - an inky potion
 C - a silvery potion
 L - a bubbling cyan potion
 O - 3 potions of healing
Magical staves
 S - a -1 rod of summoning (11/11)
   (You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon)
Miscellaneous
 r - a bottled efreet
 Y - a legendary deck of changes {drawn: 2}


   Skills:
 + Level 11 Fighting
 * Level 14 Maces & Flails
 - Level 1 Throwing
 + Level 13 Armour
 - Level 1 Dodging
 - Level 1 Stealth
 - Level 1 Stabbing
 + Level 13 Shields
 - Level 1 Traps & Doors
 - Level 1 Unarmed Combat
 - Level 1 Spellcasting
 - Level 1 Invocations
 + Level 8 Evocations


You have 13 spell levels left.
You don't know any spells.

Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (10/27)            Temple (1/1) D:4             Orc (0/4) D:8
   Lair (3/8) D:10          Swamp (0/5) Lair:2     
Shoals: Lair:3-6     Snake: Lair:3-6   

Altars:
Ashenzari
Cheibriados
Elyvilon
Fedhas
Kikubaaqudgha
Makhleb
Nemelex Xobeh
Okawaru
Sif Muna
The Shining One
Trog
Vehumet
Xom
Yredelemnul
Zin

Shops:
D:4: /  D:5: %  D:6: =*!?  D:10: (

Message History

You kill the bat!
Okawaru accepts your kill.
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
You climb upwards.
There is a stone staircase leading down here.
You climb downwards.
There is a stone staircase leading up here.
There is an open door here.
Things that are here:
a +2,-4 hammer of holy wrath
the quarterstaff of Dim Light {flame, +Blink rC++ Dex+1}
Things that are here:
an uncursed ring of levitation; an uncursed ring of poison resistance
You see here a wand of random effects {recharged}.
Things that are here:
a book of Morphology; the Almanac of Companions and Clay
You drop a Young Poisoner's Handbook.
Okay, then.
Okay, then.
Okay, then.

#.##..##.....#.......
#.P#.###.............
#.##.###.##..#..>....
#.#..#.......#.......
#.#..#.###.#.#......#
#............#.....##
###................f#
  ##.'...[.........##
   ###..............#
     #..<............
     #@/=)...........
    ##..?(...........
    #.......#...'#.##
    ##......P...#####
     #..........f####
     #..........##...
     #..........##...
    ##..........##...
    #.......#...##...
    ##......#...##...
    #.......#...##...


There are no monsters in sight!

Vanquished Creatures
  An unseen horror (D:10)
  Pikel (D:7)
  An oklob plant (D:10)
  2 black mambas
  A weapon mimic (D:9)
  A trapdoor spider (D:9)
  4 spiny frogs
  The ghost of Roger the Poker, an experienced MfSk of Okawaru (D:6)
  A troll (D:10)
  2 blink frogs (Lair:1)
  2 giant toads (Lair:2)
  8 yaks
  A wyvern (D:9)
  A hippogriff (D:9)
  A hungry ghost (D:10)
  Menkaure (D:5)
  2 orc warriors (D:8)
  3 ice beasts
  5 ogres
  A centaur (D:8)
  4 phantoms
  4 sky beasts
  A crocodile (D:10)
  The ghost of PURP the Insei, an average DrMo of Makhleb (D:3)
  3 scorpions
  2 big kobolds (D:10)
  7 giant frogs
  A big kobold zombie (D:10)
  2 quasits (D:8)
  2 shadows
  6 orc priests
  4 imps
  4 hounds
  A hound zombie (D:8)
  2 worker ants
  4 iguanas
  7 orc wizards
  A porcupine (Lair:1)
  4 sheep (Lair:1)
  4 jellies
  A goliath beetle zombie (D:8)
  2 gnolls (D:9)
  A green rat (D:7)
  6 snakes
  A snake zombie (D:7)
  A snake skeleton (D:7)
  A giant centipede (Lair:2)
  5 worms
  A giant mite (D:4)
  A bat skeleton (D:8)
  7 giant geckos
  3 oozes
  44 orcs
  22 bats
  10 goblins
  16 hobgoblins
  8 jackals
  20 kobolds
  4 quokkas
  6 giant cockroaches
  5 giant newts
  An orc skeleton (D:7)
  22 rats
  2 small snakes
  A butterfly (D:2)
  A fungus (D:1)
  2 plants
  A toadstool (D:9)
299 creatures vanquished.

Vanquished Creatures (collateral kills)
  Gastronok (D:9)
  Jozef (Lair:1)
  Maurice (D:9)
  A blink frog (Lair:1)
  A giant toad (Lair:2)
  Eustachio (D:9)
  A crocodile (Lair:1)
  A water moccasin (Lair:2)
  An imp (D:9)
  An orc wizard (D:8)
  A gnoll (D:9)
  2 green rats (D:9)
  A grey rat (D:9)
  3 orcs (D:8)
  A hobgoblin (D:9)
  4 quokkas (D:9)
  4 bats (D:9)
26 creatures vanquished.

Vanquished Creatures (others)
  2 vampire mosquitoes (D:9)
  A slave (D:7)
  A killer bee (Lair:2)
  A scorpion (Lair:2)
  2 worker ants
  A quasit (D:7)
  An iguana (D:9)
  An orc wizard (D:8)
  A jelly (D:7)
  A worm (D:7)
  A giant eyeball (D:7)
  An orc (D:9)
  A bat (D:7)
  A jackal (Lair:1)
  A giant newt (D:5)
  2 rats
  A fungus (Lair:2)
  12 toadstools
32 creatures vanquished.

Grand Total: 357 creatures vanquished

Notes
Turn   | Place    | Note
--------------------------------------------------------------
     0 | D:1      | Dwarfer, the Mountain Dwarf Fighter, began the quest for the Orb.
     0 | D:1      | Reached XP level 1. HP: 19/19 MP: 0/0
   286 | D:1      | Reached XP level 2. HP: 27/27 MP: 1/1
  1018 | D:2      | Reached XP level 3. HP: 33/33 MP: 2/2
  1070 | D:2      | Found a shimmering altar of Xom.
  1849 | D:3      | Noticed PURP's ghost (average DrMo)
  1914 | D:3      | Defeated PURP's ghost
  1914 | D:3      | Reached skill level 5 in Armour
  1914 | D:3      | Reached skill level 1 in Dodging
  1914 | D:3      | Reached skill level 1 in Traps & Doors
  1914 | D:3      | Reached XP level 4. HP: 13/40 MP: 2/2
  1914 | D:3      | Reached XP level 5. HP: 14/46 MP: 3/3
  2170 | D:3      | Reached skill level 5 in Fighting
  2328 | D:3      | Found a glowing silver altar of Zin.
  3055 | D:4      | Found a staircase to the Ecumenical Temple.
  3115 | Temple   | Entered the Ecumenical Temple
  3277 | Temple   | Became a worshipper of Warmaster Okawaru
  3375 | D:4      | Reached skill level 1 in Stealth
  3375 | D:4      | Reached XP level 6. HP: 22/53 MP: 4/4
  3585 | D:4      | Found a white marble altar of Elyvilon.
  3618 | D:4      | Found a blossoming altar of Fedhas.
  3661 | D:4      | Found Dexyoxay's Magical Wand Emporium.
  3692 | D:4      | Got a shimmering quarterstaff
  3693 | D:4      | Identified the quarterstaff of Dim Light {flame, +Blink rC++ Dex+1} (You found it on level 4 of the Dungeon)
  4080 | D:5      | Entered Level 5 of the Dungeon
  4088 | D:5      | Noticed Menkaure
  4099 | D:5      | Defeated Menkaure
  4099 | D:5      | Reached skill level 5 in Shields
  4312 | D:5      | Reached skill level 5 in Maces & Flails
  4400 | D:5      | Reached XP level 7. HP: 60/60 MP: 4/4
  4413 | D:5      | Found Asch's Food Shoppe.
  4501 | D:5      | Acquired Okawaru's first power
  4648 | D:5      | Reached skill level 6 in Armour
  5046 | D:6      | Found Geirghogg's Magic Scroll Shop.
  5054 | D:6      | Bought a scroll of holy word for 82 gold pieces
  5054 | D:6      | Bought a scroll of fog for 22 gold pieces
  5082 | D:6      | Reached skill level 1 in Throwing
  5253 | D:6      | Reached skill level 1 in Spellcasting
  5309 | D:6      | Found Vehimisy's Distillery.
  5317 | D:6      | Bought a potion of heal wounds for 42 gold pieces
  5317 | D:6      | Bought a potion of healing for 28 gold pieces
  5317 | D:6      | Bought a potion of heal wounds for 42 gold pieces
  5430 | D:6      | Found Nuunury's Jewellery Emporium.
  5447 | D:6      | Noticed Roger's ghost (experienced MfSk)
  5660 | D:6      | Defeated Roger's ghost
  5660 | D:6      | Reached XP level 8. HP: 21/68 MP: 7/7
  5847 | D:6      | Found a deep blue altar of Sif Muna.
  6055 | D:6      | Found Rotewkon's Assorted Antiques.
  6202 | D:7      | Reached skill level 7 in Maces & Flails
  6244 | D:7      | Found a shattered altar of Ashenzari.
  6348 | D:7      | Found a burning altar of Makhleb.
  6403 | D:7      | Noticed Pikel
  6450 | D:7      | Defeated Pikel
  6450 | D:7      | Reached XP level 9. HP: 43/74 MP: 5/8
  6619 | D:7      | Your ally freed slave died
  7020 | D:8      | Reached skill level 8 in Maces & Flails
  8338 | D:7      | Identified a -1 rod of summoning (11/11) (You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon)
  8860 | D:7      | Reached skill level 9 in Shields
  9251 | D:8      | Reached skill level 1 in Invocations
  9514 | D:8      | Found a staircase to the Orcish Mines.
  9901 | D:8      | Reached skill level 1 in Evocations
 10422 | D:9      | Reached XP level 10. HP: 46/82 MP: 8/8
 10637 | D:9      | Noticed Maurice
 10651 | D:9      | Defeated Maurice
 10839 | D:9      | Reached skill level 10 in Shields
 11126 | D:9      | HP: 3/82 [yak (7)]
 12092 | D:9      | Reached skill level 10 in Maces & Flails
 12363 | D:9      | Reached skill level 1 in Stabbing
 12454 | D:9      | Noticed Eustachio
 12468 | D:9      | Reached skill level 11 in Shields
 12512 | D:9      | Defeated Eustachio
 12680 | D:9      | Noticed Gastronok
 12830 | D:9      | Defeated Gastronok
 13107 | D:10     | Entered Level 10 of the Dungeon
 13197 | D:10     | Found a staircase to the Lair.
 13818 | D:10     | Got a transparent silver ring
 13868 | D:10     | Identified the ring "Seecs" (You found it on level 10 of the Dungeon)
 14070 | D:10     | Reached XP level 11. HP: 80/90 MP: 9/9
 14284 | D:10     | Found Ehires' Antique Weapon Shop.
 14789 | Lair:1   | Entered Level 1 of the Lair of Beasts
 15004 | Lair:1   | Found a snail-covered altar of Cheibriados.
 15099 | Lair:1   | Noticed Jozef
 15113 | Lair:1   | Defeated Jozef
 15144 | Lair:1   | Reached skill level 12 in Maces & Flails
 15144 | Lair:1   | Reached skill level 10 in Armour
 16805 | Lair:2   | Reached skill level 5 in Evocations
 17054 | Lair:2   | Found a staircase to the Swamp.
 17790 | Lair:2   | Got a yellowed book
 17791 | Lair:2   | Identified the Almanac of Companions and Clay (You found it on level 2 of the Lair of Beasts)
 18232 | Lair:1   | Reached skill level 1 in Unarmed Combat
 18396 | Lair:2   | Reached skill level 14 in Maces & Flails
 18396 | Lair:2   | Reached XP level 12. HP: 92/104 MP: 11/11
Last edited by Grimm on Monday, 30th January 2012, 06:35, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: put chardump in code tags

Snake Sneak

Posts: 107

Joined: Tuesday, 26th April 2011, 03:00

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 13:34

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

A couple of quick notes.

Your wizard hat is worth zero (you could enchant armor on it, eventually, but that's a poor use of enchant armor scrolls. Find a helmet.

Switch to the poison morning star. Beat on things with it till you find out its stats: they might well be better than the one you're using now, and even if they're worse by a point or two the poison benefit could easily make it more deadly.

Your large shield is slowing your attacks, and will continue to do so for a long time (shields 25, or never, I don't remember which number dwarves get for large shields). At this point using a buckler would do better for you, and eventually a normal shield.

Your deck of changes could easily swap your stats, giving you a strength of 6 and leaving you unable to move in your armor. A fighter drawing from a deck might randomly be good; but it might also be very very bad.

Eventually you'll want to train Maces higher, but I'd turn it off for now, and also Evocations; leave fighting, armor, and shields on; turn on throwing, dodging, traps, and invocations to get them up into the 5 to 8 range. None of these is going to be your main feature, but they are all useful secondary abilities, and some capability in them will be worthwhile.

For this message the author Mackerel has received thanks:
brandon0981

Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Monday, 30th January 2012, 04:52

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 22:47

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

Thank you very much for the input!

o_O

Snake Sneak

Posts: 100

Joined: Friday, 30th September 2011, 07:08

Post Monday, 30th January 2012, 23:31

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

You should focus on weapon skills more until reaching mindelay (requires 16 skill for your morningstar. I could be wrong though). The overall damage output generally adds more to your survivability then a couple more SH or AC. Also the -X items make me cry. Try and find a shield that isn't so messed up, and in the future try to kill jellies with wands from a distance.

Magic is worth branching into, but go easy on it. As your shield and armor skill rise casting should gradually become less of an uphill battle, although with the INT of a brick you are never going to be real good at it. Pushing enough Spellcasting to cast spammals or blink would be ok, but its not critical and you may be better off just focusing on your core skills. If you find repel missiles or swiftness you will want to get them castable ASAP though.

Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Monday, 30th January 2012, 04:52

Post Tuesday, 31st January 2012, 00:04

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

Yeah, I honestly didn't even notice how bad the shield was until I posted the dump lol. Sad to say that Dwarfy died on the last level of the orc fort. I'll remember all these tips next time I start up a fighter. Is there any other race I should try with fighter that might be better?

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 3037

Joined: Sunday, 2nd January 2011, 02:06

Post Tuesday, 31st January 2012, 00:54

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

brandon0981 wrote:Yeah, I honestly didn't even notice how bad the shield was until I posted the dump lol. Sad to say that Dwarfy died on the last level of the orc fort. I'll remember all these tips next time I start up a fighter. Is there any other race I should try with fighter that might be better?


Well, I think I should warn you that fighter is a challenge class. If you want a fighter-like background that isn't so hard, berserker is extremely good since you start with a good deity and a useful special ability, and hunter is very good since you start with a solid ranged attack. Gladiators start with throwing nets, which can be used to shut down early ogres or other dangerous monsters, and assassins start with a small stock of curare needles, which are very good at winning you fights until they run out. A fighter's starting benefit is a shield, which is rendered irrelevant as soon as you find a random buckler or shield on the ground.

As far as races go, hill orc is going to be closest to the old mountain dwarf, now that the mountain dwarves have been removed from the game. Minotaurs are also mostly without quirks, but biased towards normal combat. Halflings and kobolds also make for very good fighter-types, but their playstyle is significantly different than the norm.

For deities, seriously consider Trog, Yredelemnul, or Makhleb over Okawaru. While potentially very good, Okawaru is a little fidgety to play with on a fighter, since the powers you get don't give you any of the desperately-needed versatility you should be looking for. Heroism and Finesse mostly just make your normal combat skills a bit (or a lot) better, which doesn't help very much if you're up against something that your normal combat skills are the wrong type of approach for, like a hydra or jelly. Trog, Yred, and Makhleb all provide minions to take hits for you and a variety of useful emergency powers, any of which can change a desperate battle to a curbstomp in your favor.

For this message the author KoboldLord has received thanks:
brandon0981

Temple Termagant

Posts: 6

Joined: Monday, 30th January 2012, 04:52

Post Tuesday, 31st January 2012, 01:17

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

Yeah, having versatility definitely seems like the way to go, thanks for the tips I appreciate it. Do you know why the Mountain Dwarf is getting removed? Just curious.

Dungeon Dilettante

Posts: 2

Joined: Thursday, 4th August 2011, 17:45

Post Tuesday, 31st January 2012, 02:07

Re: Dwarven Fighter Advice.

MDFi are not that bad. i wouldn't consider them a challenge class. turn off all of their skills with minuses. MD don't dodge. i stay away from axes with them mainly. usually best is the great mace. if you have heavy armor and you really should, then shield is less helpful than heavy armour imho. maces are usually best with this class since axes don't do squat against hydras unless you are fortunate enough to find a fire axe which is pretty rare before lair. get okawaru as a good because his skills are pretty useful and his gifts are very nice...eventually.

i get spellcasting to 1 and try to find a spell book with fire brand and use an vorporlize scroll to permanently bind it to the great mace. you don't need much skill to do this. i don't really train spellcasting until i get to zot and then only for blink type spells.

concentrate on maces and try to find a crossbow. until then wands are very useful. avoid sigmund if you see him until you are at least lvl 6.

rPoi and conservation are important to this build along with RMut later on. i always carry lots of scrolls and potions to make up for lack of magic.
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brandon0981

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