Almost got my first rune!!

[AtT]

A bit about myself: I have been playing roguelikes on and off for a while. Originally started with Nethack but found DCSS much more interesting. Something strange happened to me though recently as I was playing. I actually got BETTER. So I decided that I'm going to beat this game. Unfortunately I've been having some trouble

I can usually get to the temple at least with most background, and the lair or D:10 or so with my better ones. I just recently got a Deep Elf Summoner of Vehmut to clear out 7 layers of the lair, then the top 4 of orc when I miraculously quit out without saving due to an incredible array of misclicks and computer errors. Either way, this is a new record and I think I could have gotten my first rune had I not quit. I was very excited. Still though there are many things I have trouble with.

I never really know when to get str, dex, or int. I realize that its important with casters to focus on int with getting a few str for carrying and eventually to avoid draining. I've heard have str and int to at least 10 by late game, which I assume is some time after the lair.

I also am not sure whether to keep skills on manual/auto, focused/unfocused. I tend to keep it on manual and focus out something if its important. and turn all skills off except fighting when I get it on a caster to crank out a few levels to at least 5 or 6. I still have trouble knowing which skills are important to leave on or focus. for example, with a KoBe with dodge +2 and armor -2 should one leave both on, focus one or both? turn off armor?

I tend to do better with casters by far. I've gotten to the lair with a Spriggan Stalker, De Conjurer, Fe Transmuter. The transmuter and stalker died I believe because I let points go into sneak that I shouldnt have. they simply just stopped being able to kill people.

I've been trying Hunter but I have no idea whether to str, dex, or int. So far I like transmuters the best, but am unsure of which species is best. Summoners are great too. Im going to try a SpEn soon but I'll have to see.

I really enjoy death knights, but am undecided on a race. It seems like Kobolds would be good since you can focus on raising zombies instead of eating the bodies, but they do have considerably less str than say a Md.

Basically I'm just looking for basic advice, and will continue to watch others play. Thank you for taking the time to help me I hope I will be able to contribute to the community. Long live @s amirite?

-AtT

[bobross419]

I'd suggest reading through the I think we learned something important today and Questions to small for their own thread thread threads. They are both fairly long, but contain a vast amount of information.

I also had similar questions a while back - I had hit a plateau where I could clear Lair but kept losing shortly thereafter. I had a thread where quite a bit of useful information was sent my way: Noobie Advice Please

Hope it helps.

[AtT]

Hmm I suppose I was a bit paranoid. Maybe making myself too much of a generalist too early.

Thanks I'll read those

[cerebovssquire]

Hmm I suppose I was a bit paranoid. Maybe making myself too much of a generalist too early.

Thanks I'll read those

Since STR and DEX will do much less than INT even a generalist should just go for INT. The few exceptions where other attributes are are heavily armoured fighters (where STR will often do most, though still little) and light armour users (where DEX is usually the best choice). And personally I wouldn't like sticking with SpWz's 3 STR, for an example, but rather raise it to 5 or 6. Same for comparable characters.

[AtT]

I see. I'm now working on a Demonspawn Venom mage and am doing well so far just need to choose a god. I'm just happy that I'm actually improving and can finally start worrying about mid/late game strats. I used to never worry about Kenku's or whatever because level 7 seemed "high."

I've never actually played a spriggan enchanter i'll give it a go soon. I wish I could make a priest of zin work it's a lot of fun to blind heretic priests

[AtT]

also I found a whip of pain and a whip of electocution. the pain whip is better enchanted but I have some scrolls. thinking of picking up kiku? decisions decisions..

[bobross419]

My most successful VMs have followed Kiku. Kiku will give you guaranteed early access to spells that will help complement your Poison based spells - Poison resistant creatures, undead. Unfortunately, you will still run into some issues with resistant creatures such as Summoned monsters, Demons, and things like Ice Beasts.

Kiku seems to build piety rather quickly, so you'll be able to start putting skill points into Summoning at ***** when you get your book so that when you do find a book with Abjuration in it you'll pretty much be set. Until then I'd rely on Abominations (Twisted Resurrection) to complement you when it comes to monsters immune to your spells.

I'm no pro though, but Kiku seems to be a great caster god for nooblets - I've gotten a grand total of 1 god book on all my Sif/Vehemut characters

[AtT]

hmm he seems more reliable than vehemut. and i suppose that answers my whip question too as a pain whip seems to go naturally with kiku's necro stuff i would think. not bad not bad

[RFHolloway]

I really enjoy death knights, but am undecided on a race. It seems like Kobolds would be good since you can focus on raising zombies instead of eating the bodies, but they do have considerably less str than say a Md.

you want a fun race with high strength - try trolls. Sure you eat most of the bodies, but if you carry the rest down to the next level before you animate them you will be surprised how straightforward the early game is.

[AtT]

Ya I'm trying to make a troll monk of nemelex work but i can't seem to find the damn alter lol

[bobross419]

TrMo of Oki or TrMo of Trog both work really well too - Especially in .10 where Mo start at ** piety.

Hero and Berserk are both great tools for a young Tr. Once you get either of these you basically have a free ride to Lair, assuming of course you don't get ganked by a nasty unique or something - And once in Lair you only have to really worry about 6+ headed Hydra or Death Yak/Dire Hephelump packs that you can't corridor fight.

[Grimm]

The trick with elephants is to back yourself into a corner blocked off on all sides but one. Elephants can't push you through a wall, so having your back against one eliminates their gimmick. Then you just cut them up one by one for stew.

[bobross419]

I agree, Grimm, but in Lair its often hard to find just such a defensible position. I usually just run if I can't find a good position that leaves me exposed to more than 2 elephants at a time. They usually die easy to Tr claws though

[AtT]

TrMo of Oki or TrMo of Trog both work really well too - Especially in .10 where Mo start at ** piety.

Hero and Berserk are both great tools for a young Tr. Once you get either of these you basically have a free ride to Lair, assuming of course you don't get ganked by a nasty unique or something - And once in Lair you only have to really worry about 6+ headed Hydra or Death Yak/Dire Hephelump packs that you can't corridor fight.

Monks don't have a god tho? ** piety to the first one you choose? Or do you mean priests/healers?

Yea I like trolls it seems like you you can easily just rush negligently through the first 6 or 8 levels no problem. I usually prefer a class w/ a bit more finesse but the brute force is enticing. Lately I've been getting through the lair fairly consistently with most classes i'm comfortable with but I tend to branch out. Maybe if I focused on a MDFi I could crank out a win but I tend to stop paying attention to pure melee fighters.

With the exception of my spriggan berserker! Got him through L7 and is now around D16/17 I'm going to head back up (and around that nasty green D) and try to clear out orc, some of hive, and maybe snake pit and go for a rune or two after that. Maybe do some of the vaults? I've never actually been this far but I might be able to do vaults? I have a lot of cold resistance and poison as well. Stealth is in the 20s and stabbing close to it, fighting 8 or 9 and idk dodging is fairly high. a well enchanted quick blade (trog) is what i'm using and a whole whack of wands. I would consider a rune a victory and I think he's got a shot! I also have a FeSu on L7 or so might be able to make something work with that. The summoner is taking some abuse lately but the berserker is still going strong. A decent food supply but I'd like to restock in the hive soon.

Ha feels good to actually plan out characters recently I was just picking stuff to keep alive as long as possible see how many levels I could go down. This site and the bots/wiki helped me a lot I don't constantly study it but I enjoy the active community it's great that a roguelike community is so large and active. Seeing the site/forum MADE me pick up crawl again and put forth an effort to getting better. It's one thing to improve at a roguelike and enjoy it personally but its a whole different feeling when others are doing the same thing. And the community is not just even old pros that look down on new players. Really appreciate it guys

[bobross419]

In .10 Monks get ** piety to whichever god they choose

If your SpBe has rPois then you might consider doing Hive for cheap exp, whole lotta surplus food and some items. I'll often do Hive even before Lair if I've got a build capable of handling an Unseen Horror (damn things kill me all the time on my way through D).

[AtT]

oo Maybe i'll give it a go octopodes sound interesting too lol. Well.. I've never seen an unseen horror (err.. encountered one) I fought some ugly things for the first time today they're not so tough. well mostly i was up against green or sleeping anyway but still. Only thing besides lair i've spent intensive time in is orc thats why i was thinking about doing it first b/c i can gauge the difficulty more easily. Oh a spriggan can see them shouldn't be too hard to mange hopefully. The game gets very interesting once you don't die in the first 10 levels.. who knew o.o

[Astarotte]

Getting BETTER is always a fulfilling and satisfying experience.

Happened to me once while I played Angband. I mostly died on reaching level 10-20, then suddenly got the hang of diving and reached levels 50-60. Still not good enough, but BETTER.

Still didn't happen for Crawl thought. >_>

[AtT]

Getting BETTER is always a fulfilling and satisfying experience.

Happened to me once while I played Angband. I mostly died on reaching level 10-20, then suddenly got the hang of diving and reached levels 50-60. Still not good enough, but BETTER.

Still didn't happen for Crawl thought. >_>

It will don't worry. I find I do much better with transmuters/summoners or stabbers. Supposedly MDFi is easy but I never got one very far but to each is own. You got a background preference?

[Astarotte]

It will don't worry. I find I do much better with transmuters/summoners or stabbers. Supposedly MDFi is easy but I never got one very far but to each is own. You got a background preference?

I like the necromancy flavor, I play a lot of necros but ultimately just suck at it!

I sometimes play "easy builds" like SpEn just to get a bit further than usual and appreciate the mid-game, and until now my best characters were two SpEn and a Deep Elf Wizard (DEWz? whatever)

[thenewflesh]

Supposedly MDFi is easy

MDFi largely depends on luck in the early game and on gear later.

Also, once you gear up (crystal plate mail, large shield, demon whip), difficulty gets... a bit weird. As in, all enemies fall in one of two categories: popcorn and extremely dangerous (liches, including Boris fall into the first category for example, steam dragons in the second - even with rElec and 50+ SH) with little to no middle ground. That's assuming that your resistances is about average.

Yes, they get as bad-ass as you can get in xomish Dungeon Crawl environment, but it's such a pain to get them going...

[KoboldLord]

Supposedly MDFi is easy

MDFi hasn't been a strong starting combination since 0.6, when heavy armor was nerfed into oblivion after being overpowered. Heavy armor has come back up to a more moderate power level since then, but fighter is still one of the weakest starting backgrounds. Every source you've ever read from that recommends MDFi was probably written before 0.6.

[AtT]

Hm I did pretty well with one once but I prefer more interesting combos. Point is to have fun anyway eh?