Advice for conjurer?

Sunday, 27th August 2017, 19:05 by jazzadellic

I don't really know what the hell I'm doing. Even after reading a few guides. The guides just seem to be general advice and don't specifically want to say what the most optimal setup is for everything. I don't know what my goal for skills is other than I guess maxing out conjuration, spellcasting & fire magic. The only spell I know is a must have is firestorm. All the guides say about the other spells basically boils down to "these are cool spells!" but I don't have enough memorization points to learn them all. I've never gotten farther than the Lair with a caster. I'm at the lair now with my current caster attempt ;o) I'm pretty certain I'm not going to get much further unless I have a clue what I should be doing with my skills and spells. Any tips on optimal skills & spells would be much appreciated. At this point I've mainly been using these spells: magic dart, searing ray, mystic blast, and just recently I added fireball and battlesphere to my repertoire.

Code:: Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.20.1 (tiles) character file. green mold the Destroyer (Deep Elf Conjurer) Turns: 18172, Time: 02:23:08 Health: 75/75 AC: 13 Str: 5 XL: 12 Next: 39% Magic: 38/38 EV: 18 Int: 37 God: Vehumet [*****.] Gold: 544 SH: 3 Dex: 15 Spells: 10/31 levels left rFire + . . SeeInvis + X - +1 whip (elec) rCold + . . Gourm . (no shield) rNeg . . . Faith . m - +2 robe of Vines {NoPotionHeal Regen+7} rPois . Spirit . q - +3 hat of Pondering {ponderous, MR+ MP+10 Int+5} rElec . Reflect + s - scarf {rC+ rF+} rCorr . Harm . z - +0 pair of gloves MR ++... N - +2 pair of boots Stlth ++........ R - +3 amulet of reflection Regen 3.1/turn I - +6 ring of intelligence MPRegen 0.3/turn C - ring of see invisible @: slow A: icy blue scales 1, sturdy frame 1 a: Renounce Religion You are on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts. You worship Vehumet. Vehumet is extremely pleased with you. You are not hungry. You have visited 3 branches of the dungeon, and seen 13 of its levels. You have collected 544 gold pieces. Inventory: Hand Weapons X - a +1 whip of electrocution (weapon) Armour m - the +2 robe of Vines (worn) {NoPotionHeal Regen+7} (You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon) It increases your rate of regeneration. n - a +0 hat of magic resistance q - the +3 hat of Pondering (worn) {ponderous, MR+ MP+10 Int+5} (You took it off Gastronok on level 10 of the Dungeon) It affects your intelligence (+5). It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments. It affects your magic capacity (+10). s - a scarf of resistance (worn) z - a +0 pair of gloves (worn) N - a +2 pair of boots (worn) T - a +2 robe of magic resistance W - a +3 leather armour of cold resistance Jewellery l - an uncursed ring of poison resistance C - a ring of see invisible (right hand) I - a +6 ring of intelligence (left hand) R - a +3 amulet of reflection (around neck) U - a +1 ring of protection Scrolls d - a scroll of identify o - 2 scrolls of amnesia p - 4 scrolls of remove curse t - 2 scrolls labeled BOOSAM CUUSH y - 2 scrolls of blinking A - 2 scrolls labeled MIALULOTAH B - 2 scrolls labeled VIPPAV CACK F - 2 scrolls labeled XIEPIF YQIEG BAT G - 3 scrolls labeled BOYNAX RIDOACO M - 2 scrolls labeled MEPEAREONOTT O - 3 scrolls of recharging Potions a - 2 potions of curing e - 7 potions of might g - a potion of cancellation i - a potion of resistance r - 3 potions of lignification x - 7 potions of flight E - a sedimented brown potion P - 3 potions of brilliance Y - 5 black potions Z - a potion of heal wounds Books b - a book of Conjurations Spells Type Level a - Magic Dart Conjuration 1 b - Searing Ray Conjuration 2 c - Dazzling Spray Conjuration/Hexes 3 d - Fulminant Prism Conjuration/Hexes 4 e - Force Lance Conjuration/Translocation 4 f - Iskenderun's Mystic Blast Conjuration 4 f - a book of Power Spells Type Level a - Iskenderun's Battlesphere Conjuration/Charms 5 b - Venom Bolt Conjuration/Poison 5 c - Bolt of Magma Conjuration/Fire/Earth 5 d - Iron Shot Conjuration/Earth 6 e - Orb of Destruction Conjuration 7 f - Spellforged Servitor Conjuration/Summoning 7 h - a book of Geomancy Spells Type Level a - Sandblast Earth 1 b - Passwall Transmutation/Earth 2 c - Stone Arrow Conjuration/Earth 3 d - Petrify Transmutation/Earth 4 e - Lee's Rapid Deconstruction Earth 5 H - a book of the Dragon Spells Type Level a - Flame Tongue Conjuration/Fire 1 b - Cause Fear Hexes 4 c - Bolt of Fire Conjuration/Fire 6 d - Dragon Form Transmutation 7 e - Dragon's Call Summoning 9 S - a book of Flames Spells Type Level a - Flame Tongue Conjuration/Fire 1 b - Throw Flame Conjuration/Fire 2 c - Conjure Flame Conjuration/Fire 3 d - Inner Flame Hexes/Fire 3 e - Sticky Flame Conjuration/Fire 4 f - Fireball Conjuration/Fire 5 Miscellaneous w - a lightning rod (4/4) Comestibles c - 5 bread rations D - a meat ration Skills: - Level 8.6 Fighting - Level 9.5 Dodging - Level 2.8 Stealth + Level 10.3 Spellcasting + Level 13.8 Conjurations + Level 8.1 Fire Magic You have 10 spell levels left. You know the following spells: Your Spells Type Power Failure Level Hunger a - Magic Dart Conj #### 0% 1 None b - Searing Ray Conj ###### 0% 2 None c - Iskenderun's Mystic Conj #######. 1% 4 None d - Conjure Flame Conj/Fire #######. 1% 3 None e - Sting Conj/Pois #### 1% 1 None f - Fireball Conj/Fire #######... 1% 5 #...... g - Iskenderun's Battles Conj/Chrm ######.. 1% 5 #...... Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations Branches: Dungeon (11/15) Temple (1/1) D:6 Lair (1/6) D:11 Orc (0/2) D:10 Altars: Ashenzari Cheibriados Dithmenos Fedhas Gozag Hepliaklqana Nemelex Xobeh Okawaru Qazlal Ru Trog Uskayaw Vehumet Zin The Shining One Shops: D:7 = Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations You are partially covered in icy blue scales. (AC +2) Your movements are slightly less encumbered by armour. (ER -2) Message History Confirm with . or Enter, or press ? or * to list all spells. Aiming: Iskenderun's Mystic Blast Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - oklob plant Aim: an oklob plant (almost destroyed) The orb of energy hits the oklob plant. You destroy the oklob plant! Vehumet accepts your kill. You feel your power returning. Your battlesphere fires! You start resting. You hear a distant blaring wail to the northwest. Your battlesphere wavers and loses cohesion. You start resting. Magic restored. Found an iron altar of Okawaru. Found a scroll of identify. All of the chunks of flesh in your inventory have rotted away. d - a scroll of identify Okay, then. Unknown command. #(.>..+..#...>.............## # ##.....#..#.......#..#..P#### .####.#.(.##..##.(.(.#...#..## .......#.####..#.....#...#...# ..##.......#............##...## ............##......#...##....# ##...........#..####...##.....# ##.......P..##.......######### ###...........##.....#### #..######.###...##.#....# ..###### ## ######.#...## ..###P.##### ##.......# .........#.####.......@##### ..#####....................# ..# ######...#...........# .## ######.....#..### # ###......# #......# ####...# #..## #### There are no monsters in sight! Vanquished Creatures Gastronok (D:10) 2 hydras (D:11) An unseen horror (D:11) Pikel (D:8) An orc sorcerer (D:10) An oklob plant (Lair:1) Joseph (D:9) A spiny frog (D:11) A rime drake (D:11) A kobold demonologist (D:11) 3 trolls 5 blink frogs 4 hippogriffs 4 yaks (Lair:1) A shadow (D:9) A wyvern (D:10) 2 wraiths Eustachio (D:5) A spriggan (D:8) Grum (D:9) 2 hungry ghosts (D:10) 3 wargs (D:10) Duvessa (D:5) 4 water moccasins 4 orc warriors A hornet zombie (D:6) 4 sky beasts 2 black bears 2 ice beasts (D:8) 2 necrophages 3 phantoms 4 centaurs 9 ogres 12 wolves 2 crocodiles 3 big kobolds 7 bullfrogs Blork the orc (D:6) A gnoll sergeant (D:9) Dowan (D:5) A wyvern skeleton (D:9) 7 scorpions A water moccasin skeleton (D:11) 21 killer bees An electric eel (D:11) 2 howler monkeys 4 crimson imps 2 bullfrog zombies A centaur zombie (D:8) 4 centaur skeletons 4 jellies 5 orc priests 20 hounds 3 human skeletons (D:6) 12 orc wizards 2 bullfrog skeletons (D:6) 5 iguanas 11 worker ants A killer bee zombie (D:8) A hound zombie (D:6) 8 gnolls 6 adders A shadow imp (D:9) An ooze (D:6) An adder zombie (D:5) An adder skeleton (D:9) 5 worms 8 leopard geckos 39 orcs 6 bats 6 goblins 6 hobgoblins 15 jackals 13 kobolds 3 quokkas A ball python (D:8) 8 frilled lizards A jackal skeleton (D:8) A leopard gecko skeleton (D:6) 3 orc zombies (D:6) 5 rats 348 creatures vanquished. Vanquished Creatures (others) A slave (D:9) 1 creature vanquished. Grand Total: 349 creatures vanquished Notes Turn | Place | Note -------+----------+------------------------------------------- 0 | D:1 | green mold the Deep Elf Conjurer began the quest for the Orb. 0 | D:1 | Reached XP level 1. HP: 10/10 MP: 6/6 586 | D:1 | Reached XP level 2. HP: 15/15 MP: 6/8 608 | D:1 | Learned a level 2 spell: Searing Ray 896 | D:1 | Reached skill level 5 in Conjurations 1211 | D:2 | Reached XP level 3. HP: 19/19 MP: 7/9 1435 | D:2 | Found a snail-covered altar of Cheibriados. 1618 | D:2 | Found a glowing silver altar of Zin. 1619 | D:2 | Found a shattered altar of Ashenzari. 1776 | D:3 | Noticed an ogre 2398 | D:3 | Reached XP level 4. HP: 24/24 MP: 7/11 2400 | D:3 | Noticed an ogre 2744 | D:3 | Killed an ogre 2744 | D:3 | Reached skill level 6 in Conjurations 2744 | D:3 | Reached XP level 5. HP: 28/28 MP: 7/12 3014 | D:4 | Noticed an ogre 3185 | D:4 | Reached skill level 7 in Conjurations 3316 | D:4 | Noticed a phantom 3425 | D:4 | Killed a phantom 3425 | D:4 | Reached XP level 6. HP: 24/32 MP: 5/13 3502 | D:4 | Learned a level 4 spell: Iskenderun's Mystic Blast 3691 | D:4 | Reached skill level 8 in Conjurations 4039 | D:4 | Reached skill level 9 in Conjurations 4039 | D:4 | Reached XP level 7. HP: 36/36 MP: 6/14 4252 | D:4 | Found a blossoming altar of Fedhas. 4459 | D:5 | Entered Level 5 of the Dungeon 4468 | D:5 | Noticed Eustachio 4477 | D:5 | Killed Eustachio 4963 | D:5 | Noticed Duvessa 4964 | D:5 | Noticed Dowan 4969 | D:5 | Killed Duvessa 4969 | D:5 | Reached skill level 10 in Conjurations 4981 | D:5 | Killed Dowan 5311 | D:5 | Reached XP level 8. HP: 3/41 MP: 0/15 5856 | D:5 | Reached skill level 11 in Conjurations 6485 | D:6 | Found a staircase to the Ecumenical Temple. 6670 | D:6 | Noticed Blork the orc 6675 | D:6 | Killed Blork the orc 6675 | D:6 | Reached skill level 12 in Conjurations 7127 | D:6 | Learned a level 3 spell: Conjure Flame 7251 | Temple | Entered the Ecumenical Temple 7264 | Temple | Became a worshipper of Vehumet 7421 | D:6 | Reached skill level 1 in Fighting 7462 | D:6 | Reached XP level 9. HP: 47/47 MP: 10/16 8157 | D:7 | Gained mutation: Your flesh is cold resistant. (rC+) [mutagenic meat] 8158 | D:7 | Gained mutation: You do not regenerate when monsters are visible. [mutagenic meat] 8159 | D:7 | Gained mutation: You have a pair of small antennae on your head. [mutagenic meat] 8160 | D:7 | Gained mutation: You are frail. (-10% HP) [mutagenic meat] 8161 | D:7 | Gained mutation: Your muscles are strong. (Str +2) [mutagenic meat] 8209 | D:7 | Lost mutation: You have a pair of small antennae on your head. [potion of mutation] 8209 | D:7 | Lost mutation: Your muscles are strong. (Str +2) [potion of mutation] 8209 | D:7 | Lost mutation: You are frail. (-10% HP) [potion of mutation] 8209 | D:7 | Lost mutation: Your flesh is cold resistant. (rC+) [potion of mutation] 8209 | D:7 | Lost mutation: You do not regenerate when monsters are visible. [potion of mutation] 8209 | D:7 | Gained mutation: Your movements are slightly less encumbered by armour. (ER -2) [potion of mutation] 8209 | D:7 | Gained mutation: You are partially covered in icy blue scales. (AC +2) [potion of mutation] 8314 | D:7 | Reached skill level 5 in Spellcasting 8414 | D:7 | Reached * piety under Vehumet 8414 | D:7 | Offered knowledge of Sting by Vehumet. 8420 | D:7 | Learned a level 1 spell: Sting 8625 | D:7 | Found Ephued's Jewellery Emporium. 8835 | D:7 | Found an iron altar of Okawaru. 8935 | D:7 | Reached skill level 5 in Dodging 9408 | D:7 | Reached skill level 1 in Fire Magic 9716 | D:7 | Learned a level 5 spell: Fireball 10047 | D:8 | Reached skill level 5 in Fire Magic 10062 | D:8 | Offered knowledge of Throw Frost by Vehumet. 10183 | D:8 | Reached ** piety under Vehumet 10633 | D:8 | Reached XP level 10. HP: 54/54 MP: 11/20 10777 | D:8 | Found a stormy altar of Qazlal. 11663 | D:9 | Noticed Joseph 11895 | D:9 | Killed Joseph 12233 | D:9 | Offered knowledge of Static Discharge by Vehumet. 12316 | D:9 | Noticed Pikel 12598 | D:8 | Killed Pikel 12726 | D:9 | Reached skill level 5 in Fighting 12932 | D:10 | Entered Level 10 of the Dungeon 13021 | D:10 | Reached *** piety under Vehumet 13124 | D:10 | Noticed an orc sorcerer 13300 | D:9 | Noticed Grum 13504 | D:9 | Killed Grum 13583 | D:10 | Killed an orc sorcerer 13583 | D:10 | Reached XP level 11. HP: 64/64 MP: 9/21 13735 | D:10 | Offered knowledge of Airstrike by Vehumet. 14537 | D:10 | Learned a level 5 spell: Iskenderun's Battlesphere 14622 | D:10 | Noticed Gastronok 15024 | D:10 | Killed Gastronok 15327 | D:10 | Found a staircase to the Orcish Mines. 15494 | D:11 | Reached **** piety under Vehumet 15517 | D:11 | Offered knowledge of Lightning Bolt by Vehumet. 15633 | D:11 | Noticed an eight-headed hydra 16241 | D:11 | Found a staircase to the Lair. 16403 | D:11 | Killed an eight-headed hydra 16403 | D:11 | Reached skill level 13 in Conjurations 16916 | D:11 | Noticed an unseen horror 16919 | D:11 | Killed an unseen horror 16919 | D:11 | Reached XP level 12. HP: 63/75 MP: 26/27 17068 | D:11 | Noticed a six-headed hydra 17115 | D:11 | Killed a six-headed hydra 17198 | Lair:1 | Entered Level 1 of the Lair of Beasts 17406 | Lair:1 | Reached ***** piety under Vehumet 17593 | Lair:1 | Offered knowledge of Bolt of Draining by Vehumet. 17811 | Lair:1 | Reached skill level 10 in Spellcasting 18131 | Lair:1 | Found an iron altar of Okawaru. Skill XL: | 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 | ---------------+-------------------------------------+----- Conjurations | 5 6 7 9 10 12 13 | 13.8 Dodging | 3 5 9 | 9.5 Fighting | 1 2 6 8 | 8.6 Spellcasting | 5 9 10 | 10.3 Fire Magic | 6 8 | 8.1 Stealth | | 2.8 Action | 1- 3 | 4- 6 | 7- 9 | 10-12 || total -------------------------+-------+-------+-------+-------++------- Melee: Short sword | 4 | 1 | 17 | || 22 Dagger | | | 9 | || 9 Whip | | | | 18 || 18 Fire: Shortbow | | | 31 | || 31 Throw: Stone | 8 | 1 | | || 9 Cast: Magic Dart | 52 | 30 | 77 | 140 || 299 Searing Ray | 8 | 19 | 63 | 105 || 195 Iskenderun's Myst | | 3 | 48 | 70 || 121 Sting | | | 7 | 37 || 44 Fireball | | | 3 | 15 || 18 Iskenderun's Batt | | | | 24 || 24 Use: Scroll | | | 9 | 11 || 20 Potion | | | 1 | || 1 Eat: Chunk | 5 | 5 | 19 | 18 || 47 Bread ration | | | 3 | 2 || 5 Fruit | | | 2 | || 2 Royal jelly | | | | 4 || 4 Armor: Robe | 2 | 2 | 27 | 22 || 53 Leather armour | | | 29 | 79 || 108 Dodge: Dodged | 8 | 28 | 92 | 270 || 398 Block: Other | | | 9 | 50 || 59 Reflection | | | 2 | 2 || 4

Sunday, 27th August 2017, 20:01 by Airwolf

Ok, you're looking good. You have great spells available.

Read the identify scroll on the 5 black potions.

Read one of each of the un-identified stacks of scrolls. (All of them have >1 scroll: in general, consider not reading if you only have 1.) Acquire staves if you happen to read a scroll of acquirement.

Sting is garbage at this point. Amnesia it it when you get a chance, but it's only 1 slot, so don't worry too much.

Bolt of Fire would be my next target. It's very strong and full LOS with Vehumet.

Then probably Iron Shot or maybe Orb of Destruction. I'd eventually shoot for both of these and Bolt of Fire, which I think many here will disagree with. At any rate, 2 or 3 of these are your mid/late-game staples.

Fiire Storm is awesome, but not necessary. 2 or 3 of the previous will win the game for you.

Maxing Spellcasting, Conjurations, and Fire are not necessary, and is pretty expensive. Don't neglect Fighting and Dodging, which you've done a good job with so far. I don't think maxing those spell skills is a bad idea on a Deep Elf, though. Again, many will probably disagree.

Train some Maces & Flails ASAP to get that electrowhip working well. That's a solid weapon for a good while and killing things without MP will be handy. If there's an electric short blades laying around, use and train that instead due to aptitudes. 6–8 Maces & Flails soon.

For now, use Battlesphere + Magic Dart on tough monsters or packs when you have space before they get next to you and maul you. Use Mystic Blast or Fireball if you don't have space (and don't bother with Battlesphere if you don't have it up). If a monster is adjacent, you can usually aim Fireball to get them but not you. Keep in mind for high EV monsters that Mystic Blast can be dodged, but Fireball can't, but Fireball is very loud.

Eventually transition to mostly casting Bolt of Fire, with Iron Shot and/or Orb of Destruction against fire-immune monsters. (Pay attention to what is fire immune/resistant: examine monsters etc.) Orb of Destruction is a bit funky, so figure out how to use it before you need it (read up and try on weaker monsters). OoD is full LOS, but IS is not, which is why I like having both.

Otherwise, play cautious. Lure, keep your noise down when possible, etc. Low MP is an emergency: teleport, haste, etc. An adjancent nasty (hydra etc.) is an emergency.

EDIT: Non-conjurations are good, too, and you have amazing apts for them, especially Hexes. Memorize, train, and use the stronger ones as they become available.

Sunday, 27th August 2017, 21:09 by jazzadellic

Thank you Airwolf, that was exactly the kind of information I needed. The guides can be a bit too vague. I like hearing specific things that work, from experience. Very helpful information!

Monday, 28th August 2017, 06:39 by Airwolf

Great. Glad to help.

Let us know how it goes.

Monday, 28th August 2017, 07:33 by VeryAngryFelid

I would remove the hat of pondering. It can be good for conjurers but not in this case IMHO:
1) It makes robe of vines not that great because you cannot run away from normal speed monsters waiting to regen HP. Being unable to heal AND being unable to run away is dangerous
2) It makes sticky flame not that great because you cannot run away from normal speed monsters
3) It is very dangerous for inexperienced players, again because you cannot run away from normal speed monsters when something was underestimated

Monday, 28th August 2017, 07:36 by Majang

Should you splat this character, you might want to start your next attempt with a gargoyle. Not as powerful as a DE, but a lot more survivable, and towards the endgame its a killing machine as good as the DE.

Monday, 28th August 2017, 08:12 by edgefigaro

Context regarding Iron Shot + OoD:

A general midgame (spell levels 5-7) target core for casters is having 1 Bolt spell, 1 AoE, and 1 Single Target. This gives the character a very flexible kit to deal with most threats. Iron Shot and OoD are both single target spells. In some situations, for example where a character doesn't have access to a good bolt or a good AoE spell, having both Iron Shot and OoD can make a lot of sense.

However, generally mages go through a period of either not skilling or lightly skilling defenses and utility as they are pushing to get their core spells castable. After you get your core online, defenses and utility are higher priority in the short term. After that you can go back for diversifying your higher level attack magic kit if you want.

It can be reasonable to get both Iron Shot and OoD, but it is frequently unreasonable to get both too soon.

Monday, 28th August 2017, 14:56 by njvack

One thing to keep in mind with OoD is that yes it's strong but you may (as I do) find it extremely annoying to use.

Monday, 28th August 2017, 20:16 by jazzadellic

@VeryAngryFelid -- Yes I had concerns over the speed issue, but I found the hat really early and man it just looked too good to pass up. The extra MP really came in handy because I was having a problem of running out of MP in the middle of fights. I guess that wouldn't be as much of a problem now, but in a few cases I was all the way down to just a few MP at the end of a big battle. I'll consider taking it off because those are all good points. I've been playing really defensively & carefully though so I haven't really had too many problems yet. There was maybe 1 time I thought I was going to die because something got in melee range and took half my health with one swing...Forget what it was now.

@Majang --- Yes I've read that Gargoyles are much more durable, I think also Draconians were recommended for the same reason. I've played a few draconians & gargoyle casters in the past, and for one reason or another didn't get very far with them. I'm actually doing better atm with the DE than I ever did with gargoyle or draconian, maybe the extra aptitudes made the difference. But yes I'll likely try gargoyle again.

I've gained a few levels and have been using bolt of fire a lot for both single targets and lined up targets. It just seems to be better for single targets at this point, than the magic dart. I use fireball for clusters. Despite the noise factor, it seems to be worth it because the next group that charges in from the noise just gets another fireball to the face ;o) And the next, and the next. Grabbed iron shot for fire resistant critters. Still use magic dart occasionally and searing ray as they are still pretty good at killing trash mobs or finishing off weakened enemies. I did read a little on the OoD and it does sound annoying, haha, so I haven't added it.

I'm still a little unsure of what additional spells I should add. I think I've found more spell books in this game than I ever have before, including the bazaar place which had 2 book shops. I purchased one of them which had blink & controlled blink in it. I could have purchased another but couldn't tell which if any I needed or wanted. I've been kind of keeping some free spell levels available in case Vehumet offers me something really nice like firestorm.

Could someone take a look at all the spells I have available to learn and let me know if any are really good to have? I'm also wondering if one should focus all their skill points in one magic school, or spread them out a little? Some of the other schools spells look nice. @Airwolf - you mentioned getting some of the stronger hex spells as they came available, any in particular you recommend looking out for? I don't really know which hex spells are the good ones haha. I was looking at a couple of necromancy spells that looked nice like maybe animate dead one so I could have some tanks to soak up damage and aggro, and the regeneration might be nice for survivability. Current stats:

Code:: Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.20.1 (tiles) character file. green mold the Devastator (Deep Elf Conjurer) Turns: 36833, Time: 05:34:38 Health: 96/96 AC: 14 Str: 5 XL: 16 Next: 85% Magic: 46/46 EV: 20 Int: 39 God: Vehumet [******] Gold: 1633 SH: 8 Dex: 15 Spells: 9/43 levels left rFire + + . SeeInvis . L - +1 whip (elec) rCold . . . Gourm . X - +3 warlock's mirror {reflect} rNeg . . . Faith + m - +2 robe of Vines {NoPotionHeal Regen+7} rPois . Spirit . q - +3 hat of Pondering {ponderous, MR+ MP+10 Int+5} rElec . Reflect + s - scarf {rC+ rF+} rCorr . Harm . z - +1 pair of gloves MR ++... N - +2 pair of boots Stlth ++........ u - amulet of faith Regen 3.1/turn I - +6 ring of intelligence MPRegen 0.3/turn T - ring of fire @: slow A: icy blue scales 1, sturdy frame 1 a: Renounce Religion You are on level 1 of the Lair of Beasts. You worship Vehumet. Vehumet is exalted by your worship. You are not hungry. You have visited 4 branches of the dungeon, and seen 24 of its levels. You have visited 1 bazaar. You have also visited: Labyrinth and Bailey. You have collected 2501 gold pieces. You have spent 868 gold pieces at shops. Inventory: Hand Weapons L - a +1 whip of electrocution (weapon) Armour m - the +2 robe of Vines (worn) {NoPotionHeal Regen+7} (You found it on level 7 of the Dungeon) It increases your rate of regeneration. q - the +3 hat of Pondering (worn) {ponderous, MR+ MP+10 Int+5} (You took it off Gastronok on level 10 of the Dungeon) It affects your intelligence (+5). It affects your resistance to hostile enchantments. It affects your magic capacity (+10). s - a scarf of resistance (worn) z - a +1 pair of gloves (worn) B - a +2 robe of positive energy N - a +2 pair of boots (worn) X - the +3 warlock's mirror (worn) {reflect} (You found it on level 14 of the Dungeon) Jewellery l - an uncursed ring of poison resistance u - an amulet of faith (around neck) C - an uncursed ring of see invisible I - a +6 ring of intelligence (left hand) R - a +3 amulet of reflection T - a ring of fire (right hand) U - an uncursed ring of protection from fire Scrolls d - 3 scrolls of fog j - a scroll of amnesia o - a scroll of magic mapping p - 3 scrolls of remove curse t - 8 scrolls of teleportation v - 4 scrolls of identify y - 2 scrolls of blinking A - 2 scrolls of vulnerability F - 2 scrolls of fear O - 5 scrolls of recharging Potions a - 4 potions of curing g - 2 potions of cancellation i - 2 potions of resistance r - 3 potions of lignification x - 8 potions of flight E - 2 potions of haste P - 6 potions of brilliance Books b - a book of Conjurations Spells Type Level a - Magic Dart Conjuration 1 b - Searing Ray Conjuration 2 c - Dazzling Spray Conjuration/Hexes 3 d - Fulminant Prism Conjuration/Hexes 4 e - Force Lance Conjuration/Translocation 4 f - Iskenderun's Mystic Blast Conjuration 4 e - Yhit's Tome of the Traveller and the Birds (You bought it in a shop in a bazaar) Spells Type Level a - Apportation Translocation 1 b - Shroud of Golubria Charms/Translocation 2 c - Blink Translocation 2 d - Teleport Other Translocation 3 e - Airstrike Air 4 f - Controlled Blink Translocation 8 f - a book of Power Spells Type Level a - Iskenderun's Battlesphere Conjuration/Charms 5 b - Venom Bolt Conjuration/Poison 5 c - Bolt of Magma Conjuration/Fire/Earth 5 d - Iron Shot Conjuration/Earth 6 e - Orb of Destruction Conjuration 7 f - Spellforged Servitor Conjuration/Summoning 7 h - a book of Geomancy Spells Type Level a - Sandblast Earth 1 b - Passwall Transmutation/Earth 2 c - Stone Arrow Conjuration/Earth 3 d - Petrify Transmutation/Earth 4 e - Lee's Rapid Deconstruction Earth 5 n - a book of the Dragon Spells Type Level a - Flame Tongue Conjuration/Fire 1 b - Cause Fear Hexes 4 c - Bolt of Fire Conjuration/Fire 6 d - Dragon Form Transmutation 7 e - Dragon's Call Summoning 9 w - a book of Clouds Spells Type Level a - Poisonous Vapours Poison/Air 2 b - Mephitic Cloud Conjuration/Poison/Air 3 c - Conjure Flame Conjuration/Fire 3 d - Freezing Cloud Conjuration/Ice/Air 6 e - Ring of Flames Charms/Fire 7 H - a book of Battle Spells Type Level a - Infusion Charms 1 b - Shroud of Golubria Charms/Translocation 2 c - Song of Slaying Charms 2 d - Spectral Weapon Hexes/Charms 3 e - Regeneration Charms/Necromancy 3 K - a book of Misfortune Spells Type Level a - Confusing Touch Hexes 1 b - Confuse Hexes 3 c - Gell's Gravitas Translocation 3 d - Petrify Transmutation/Earth 4 e - Metabolic Englaciation Hexes/Ice 5 f - Yara's Violent Unravelling Hexes/Transmutation 5 S - a book of Flames Spells Type Level a - Flame Tongue Conjuration/Fire 1 b - Throw Flame Conjuration/Fire 2 c - Conjure Flame Conjuration/Fire 3 d - Inner Flame Hexes/Fire 3 e - Sticky Flame Conjuration/Fire 4 f - Fireball Conjuration/Fire 5 V - a book of Necromancy Spells Type Level a - Pain Necromancy 1 b - Animate Skeleton Necromancy 1 c - Vampiric Draining Necromancy 3 d - Regeneration Charms/Necromancy 3 e - Animate Dead Necromancy 4 f - Control Undead Necromancy 4 Miscellaneous G - a crystal ball of energy J - a lamp of fire Comestibles c - 3 bread rations k - 21 fruits D - 9 meat rations Skills: - Level 9.6 Fighting - Level 3.5(7.3) Maces & Flails Level 12.7(13.0) Staves - Level 11.4 Dodging - Level 2.8 Stealth - Level 6.0 Shields + Level 14.1 Spellcasting + Level 15.9 Conjurations * Level 12.3 Fire Magic You have 9 spell levels left. You know the following spells: Your Spells Type Power Failure Level Hunger a - Magic Dart Conj #### 0% 1 None b - Searing Ray Conj ###### 0% 2 None c - Iskenderun's Mystic Conj ######## 0% 4 None d - Conjure Flame Conj/Fire ######## 0% 3 None f - Fireball Conj/Fire ########.. 1% 5 None g - Iskenderun's Battles Conj/Chrm ######.. 1% 5 None h - Bolt of Fire Conj/Fire ########.. 1% 6 None i - Iron Shot Conj/Erth ######.... 1% 6 None j - Blink Tloc N/A 1% 2 None Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations Branches: Dungeon (15/15) Temple (1/1) D:6 Lair (6/6) D:11 Shoals (0/4) Lair:4 Snake (0/4) Lair:2 Slime (0/5) Lair:6 Orc (2/2) D:10 Elf (0/3) Orc:2 Vaults (0/5) D:13 Depths (0/5) D:15 Altars: Ashenzari Cheibriados Dithmenos Fedhas Gozag Hepliaklqana Nemelex Xobeh Okawaru Qazlal Ru Trog Uskayaw Vehumet Xom Zin The Shining One Beogh Jiyva Shops: D:7 = D:13 } Orc:2 =[(( Annotations: D:14 exclusion: Roxanne, Roxanne Innate Abilities, Weirdness & Mutations You are partially covered in icy blue scales. (AC +2) Your movements are slightly less encumbered by armour. (ER -2)

Monday, 28th August 2017, 21:08 by Airwolf

Thoughts, in no particular order:

Train some Earth, maybe 5 soonish, 10 eventually, for spellpower on Iron Shot. This increases damage and, more importantly, accuracy.

Maybe slowly push Spellcasting, Conjurations, and Fire up to 12–15. Get more Fighting and Dodging soon. Consider Evocations if you've found good items.

Strong lowish-level Hexes: Confuse, Tukima's Dance, Cause Fear. I'm probably missing some, too.

Cause Fear is the only spell in your inventory that I'd recommend getting and skilling soon. Is not as strong as Confuse or T's Dance, but can save you if you get surrounded.

Animate Dead is great, but allies are hard to use with conjurations.

Blink is good and memorize and skill it immediately if available. Controlled Blink is game-breakingly good, but expensive to train. It's a good target once you've got everything else you need.

Iron Shot makes Mystic Blast obsolete. Amnesia MB when you can or need the slots.

You got the 2 hardest S branches. Definitely do Orc first. I think Shoals is actually the easier one for this guy because Naga Warriors etc are tough and hit hard, Naga Sharpshooters hit hard, Salamanders have some rF, and fire + water in Shoals make steam to obscure LOS and do a little residual damage. Be very careful in either. Naga Warriors and Najanjas will destroy you quickly if adjacent. Merfolk Javeliners, Nymphs, Aquamancers, Kraken, Sea Snakes hit hard.

Enhancer staves (conjurations or fire here) are good if one has dropped. Fire would be a decent melee weapon too, with 5-10 Evocations.

Monday, 28th August 2017, 21:29 by jazzadellic

Thanks again for the advice. I had already gone to Orc, and was just about to hit the Lair branches. Sounds like Shoals will be next. One thing I was wondering about controlled blink is that by the time I can get it working, I might be in the last stage of the game i.e., Zot realm & escaping, where IIRC blink is no longer controllable? Or is that just the scroll version? I'm going for a 3 rune run as I have yet to complete one.

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 04:38 by VeryAngryFelid

This is what I talked about. Without that hat you would be in better position now. I mean you should treat being at low MP as your mistake, similar to being almost dead as melee character. Unless you are hybrid of course, that's why the hat is great for hybrids who can rely on teleport for those rare situations where they need to escape

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 04:40 by VeryAngryFelid

Make sure to clear Snake before Shoals, it's much easier usually.

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 05:30 by edgefigaro

Hat of pondering is a great hat and only gets better the further into the game you are. However is a dangerous hat whose drawback is magnified on newer players, as the ponderous effect is rather subtle.

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 06:12 by VeryAngryFelid

edgefigaro wrote:Hat of pondering is a great hat and only gets better the further into the game you are.

It depends. MP increase becomes less useful the more MP you already have, you can find a great helmet/MR/Int items.

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 06:16 by Majang

jazzadellic wrote:One thing I was wondering about controlled blink is that by the time I can get it working, I might be in the last stage of the game i.e., Zot realm & escaping, where IIRC blink is no longer controllable? Or is that just the scroll version? I'm going for a 3 rune run as I have yet to complete one.

Quite right. You should treat Controlled Blink as an extended-game spell. If you only plan on three runes, you can forget it, as it becomes useless about the time you are able to cast it. Of course you can shoot for the needed translocations earlier, but this would mean that all your other spells or your defences will suffer. You can compromise by using Passage of Golubria with a much lower investment, but it also does not work in Zot.

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 08:54 by Shtopit

The feeling that draconian and gargoyle aren't as good (or effective) as elves probably depends on the fact that they are much less minmaxed than deep elves when it comes to magic. They have other advantages, but they are species that work better as hybrids.

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 09:15 by Majang

Shtopit wrote:The feeling that draconian and gargoyle aren't as good (or effective) as elves probably depends on the fact that they are much less minmaxed than deep elves when it comes to magic. They have other advantages, but they are species that work better as hybrids.

I disagree, at least for the gargoyle - because of its strong defences you can focus most of your skills investment into magic skills, where they also have strong aptitudes. This means that it is easy to have a character that uses a weapon for popcorn only.

Tuesday, 29th August 2017, 17:45 by Airwolf

Yes, what Majang said about Controlled Blink. (It is uncontrolled in Zot just like scrolls.)

Also, see VAF's advice about Snake vs. Shoals. I stand by my recommendation that Shoals is easier for a Fire conjuror, but I might be wrong. Which ever you choose, be careful and go to the other one if things are going badly.

Clear Dungeon to D:15 first, if you haven't already.

I think Hat of Pondering is a tough call. I'm sloppy enough that I would avoid it, but its upsides are strong.

Monday, 4th September 2017, 14:07 by crawlnoob

Hat of Pondering on a DECj of Veh is like butter on bacon. Everybody is going to tell you it's too much and you don't need it or even, that it is bad for you, but they are wrong and it's delicious and you should do it.

You have an obscene amount of ranged firepower involving one of the best ways to killdudes (conjurations) and because of Veh, you have even more of it than normal and you need less of it to killdudes AND you can start killing them earlier than usual. Then you add the hat which is like more of the same. Sure, like butter on bacon it miiiight kill you one day, but frankly, if you need to take a step back while going this route and doing so might kill you, you are already doing something else wrong, and that involves not destroying everything on screen before it can get within three squares of you and having enough MP left over to light everything else on fire, too.

Frankly, if it's an issue, I just teleport 99% of the time anyhow. Random square is almost always better than one square away from the problem that could definitely kill you.

Monday, 4th September 2017, 14:56 by NhorianScum

Majang wrote:
Shtopit wrote:The feeling that draconian and gargoyle aren't as good (or effective) as elves probably depends on the fact that they are much less minmaxed than deep elves when it comes to magic. They have other advantages, but they are species that work better as hybrids.

I disagree, at least for the gargoyle - because of its strong defences you can focus most of your skills investment into magic skills, where they also have strong aptitudes. This means that it is easy to have a character that uses a weapon for popcorn only.

Ironicly DE's are the lowest damage blaster due to their inability to survive damage spikes while wearing *harm. (Augmentation DS wearing harm is the blastiest mage by a mile).

Also something something optimal play and defenses (ignoring EE/AE where everything dies outside LoS).

Waterworld is way easier than smitebalest pit on any dude that can use a wand of flame much less use fire conj.

Monday, 4th September 2017, 15:08 by mikee

So here's what I wrote about hat of pondering 4 years ago; the important parts are still relevant: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=7045&p=96251&hilit=+pondering#p96251

Uh too long didn't click: sometimes it's ok to wear the hat but if you're not sure then it's not. Being slow involves a lot of drawbacks besides just "I can't run away without teleporting" or whatever.

Monday, 4th September 2017, 16:08 by Shtopit

Random advice: the energy ball can be useful when slow, if used at the right moments.

Monday, 4th September 2017, 19:11 by Majang

Shtopit wrote:Random advice: the energy ball can be useful when slow, if used at the right moments.

I don't know. The best success rate with 27 Evo is 89%, which gives you an 11% chance of total MP loss and/or confusion. I find that unacceptable. I'd rather waste a few more turns on less effective channelling with a staff of energy.

Tuesday, 5th September 2017, 04:58 by VeryAngryFelid

The ball requires some special tactics. First you should never evoke it if losing mp can kill you. Second you should not evoke it too early: evoke it at lowest mp when it has the same success chance (see wiki for those numbers). Losing 20%mp with 11% cjance is acceptable when you get 20%mp with 89% chance

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