What is required for a 30k turn, 3-rune game?


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

Tartarus Sorceror

Posts: 1739

Joined: Tuesday, 13th March 2012, 02:48

Post Sunday, 25th June 2017, 15:53

What is required for a 30k turn, 3-rune game?

I've never won in less than 58k turns, would like some insight into what I'm doing wrong.

inb4 "git gud".

Abyss Ambulator

Posts: 1233

Joined: Wednesday, 23rd April 2014, 21:57

Post Sunday, 25th June 2017, 16:36

Re: What is required for a 30k turn, 3-rune game?

I've only done one semi-serious attempt to get a lower than (extremely) slow turncount: morgue here. That OgFi clocked in at 34k, which is still slow, but a big step nonetheless.

All of my other wins are at least double that.

The main things I did differently from usually:
- No auto-explore.
- No full exploration of levels
- When I felt comfortable with killing things, and not dying, I just went down immediately when possible.
- Little/no backtracking.
- No serious stashing. I tried to leave strategic items at stairs regularly, to keep my available inventory slots up, so that I could pick them up on the way back if necessary.
- No useless branches, like Elf/Crypt. I think I did Orc, because it's fairly quick and can have good rewards.
- Less resting. I didn't heal to full at >75% for example.
- A strong god. Got some lovely weapons from Oka.
- A strong combo helps, probably something ranged would be best, because you don't have to wait for magic to regen and you also lose less HP.

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Rast, stoneychips

Spider Stomper

Posts: 242

Joined: Friday, 17th April 2015, 16:22

Post Monday, 26th June 2017, 03:15

Re: What is required for a 30k turn, 3-rune game?

My turncount experience is lacking but weirdly successful, so pinch of salt.

Play a Deep Dwarf for turncount. Most of your turns are spent regenerating and the only race that compares in healing speed is Vine Stalker; DD is just simpler IMO though. For obvious reasons pick a martial class and healy god (I suggest DDFi^Makh but DDBe and other combos are viable).

Train axes and pray for a vamp axe. If you don't get one don't worry because you can still go pretty damn fast without one. Axes are ideal here because your life isn't very valuable in speedrunning but being able to smack many things at once saves turns. I am a fan of broad axe+shield over non-vamp battleaxe because it lets you do more stupid shit but I know others will disagree. Go for Vaults for 3rd rune; enter the bottom via hatch if one exists and teleport around for the rune. Dive Depths and Zot as hard as possible. Equipment priorities in order are AC, MR, rF; most everything else is superfluous. rF is superfluous outside of Zot.

Turn autopickup off in midgame. Optimally turn it off to start but that can get tiresome. Also everything the above post said is good advice, except don't take Oka on DD obviously. Don't fully explore levels unless absolutely needed (e.g. can't find lair). Never touch o or 5. Don't waste turns luring and killing fodder monsters like D:7 rats; just let them tag along and get splatted when a real fight happens.

Also don't worry about doing anything "wrong" by taking 58k turns usually; the game isn't a race unless you make it one. If you're playing to survive, taking it slow is better in most situations anyway.

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stoneychips

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 5382

Joined: Friday, 25th November 2011, 07:36

Post Monday, 26th June 2017, 23:52

Re: What is required for a 30k turn, 3-rune game?

If you're playing a DD, I'm not entirely sure that MR is needed, since they get +6 per level. Maybe one MR source if you want to have a flat 0% chance of confuse/paralyse, but you're pretty close to 0 automatically.

My record is 40k turns for 15 runes, which is probably pretty close to the 30k for 3 rune timeframe. Really the #1 thing is to just keep diving. Try playing a game where the rule is you have to take the downstairs as soon as you see the third stair. Obviously the more aggressive rule is to take the first downstair, but that can be very, very intense. Feel free to take it somewhat slower for the first few dungeon floors, as they're the hardest. But if you feel "above the difficulty curve" you can also ramp up the rate at which you dive - take the first stair down right away. A good example of this would be a DD who gets a vamp axe or otherwise very strong axe, maybe a good trog gift or you find your first battleaxe after having to use a hand axe early game. Or for a VS, once you get statue form online, you now want to dive the next several floors/branches quickly because your power level just shot way up.

Not autoexploring and having a good idea of how to walk around a level to expose the most area/not have to backtrack is also big, but I'm personally too lazy for this - you only need to do this for extreme high scores. You can get to 30k 3 rune wins by autoexploring as long as you are diving aggressively.

Also pick a branch order that minimizes backtracking - consider doing orc first, then running lair and doing the rune branches without leaving lair. Or skip orc entirely - it's not required. Likewise with elf; crypt you need to go through somewhat at least for tomb, but you certainly don't have to clear the end vault of crypt if you don't want to. Again, 30k 3 runes is a somewhat forgiving pace, so you can do the end vault for the loot if you want to.

This isn't necessarily the fastest order possible, but the order I took was Dungeon until orc (d:11), orc, then find lair (was also on d:11), lair, snake, shoals (aka lair branch 1 then 2), dungeon until vaults is found, vaults to 4, crypt, tomb. Yes, tomb was my third rune, before the vaults:5 rune. This was a VS with statue form, and before the removal of stairs in tomb. Then finish vaults:5, backtrack to slime, then finally enter depths for the first time. Pan -> exit through the abyss for abyss rune, then hell, then zot and escape.

There would be several shortcuts you could take to make that above order more efficient - go to slime immediately after shoals to avoid running back, completely skip orc, etc. You have to balance how strong you think you are with how much you're willing to walk backwards. Backtracking from vaults:5 to slime instead of doing slime when I was still in lair seems like it added approximately 700 turns to go back and maybe only around 400 to get back to depths afterwards. Hard to know exactly from just the morgue's notes, although if someone wants to watch the recording and get an exact count, let me know :) Roughly +1000 turns for not being willing to take on slime at level 20 or so.

Obviously you don't have to do slime for a 3 rune speedrun, but it's an example of branch ordering being important to consider, and you generally have to take the closest branch, rather than the easiest branch.

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