Confusing Touch seems really powerfull


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

Spider Stomper

Posts: 191

Joined: Monday, 7th April 2014, 06:11

Post Wednesday, 12th October 2016, 07:10

Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

I am currently playing a FeEn of Fedhas and happened to find confusing touch before lair. I have only little previous experience with this spell on a troll monk, but barely used it, since a Troll did not need stabbing bonus to wreck things. On a Felid though, this spell seems even OP.

The spell was basically free for an En, costing only 1 spell slot and since you only need to be able to successfully cast it, no hexes training is needed. (Especially if you had trained hexes for the starting spells anyways) It gives you several shots at confusing the enemy with a single mana used. It ignores MR (as far as I know). Since a Felid is training UC anyways, hitting things is not an issue. There is no reason to use EH at all, since landing it on an enemy in Lair is usually around 50% or below and it costs 2mp each try. I admit that standing in melee range to be able to confuse enemies, is a big downside on Felids, but thats why I have not forgotten regular confusion.

Are there any monsters that can not be confused with the touch? Magic immune monsters, which are pretty rare? Will this spell carry me all through 3 rune game? I came a cross earthmagic books, so I got ranged damage covered in any case.

So far this spell seems to be the best lvl1 spell by far and I am afraid it will be nerfed. :P (To be fair, I actually thik it could be switched to be a god ability.) I also really like the touch spell concept. There should be more of these. :)
User avatar

Swamp Slogger

Posts: 182

Joined: Tuesday, 8th July 2014, 10:18

Post Wednesday, 12th October 2016, 10:00

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

it is resistable by HD afaik, and you cannot deal unarmed dmg while you got it on you. i usually learn it on my unarmed chars also lategame but well dont use it so much as i like..
problem is if you dont confuse the enemy (i dont know all HDs, only that death yaks are quite high for example and cerebov quite low for his strength) and are in a 1on1 situation is you cant deal dmg. on a felid sure the stabbing bonus is insane anyway (made 8! with a statue felid once) and you can retreat but yea the spell aint bad.. as well as regular confuse belongs in the "goodspells" category imo and i always insta learn it

Spider Stomper

Posts: 191

Joined: Monday, 7th April 2014, 06:11

Post Wednesday, 12th October 2016, 10:27

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

I could handle death yaks quite easily, altough they did not stay confused very long. It just meant that I needed to stay focused on what was going on and not use Tab. :P Corridors help with keeping your victim in place, but then again, you should always fight in corridors anyway.

Good to know about the statue form, I have the spell and I got a Transmut manual. :P

Slime Squisher

Posts: 395

Joined: Wednesday, 6th July 2016, 02:40

Post Wednesday, 12th October 2016, 10:36

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

Powerful? Nope, you'll see that it's almost useless beyond lair, as it is just waste of turn for HD 15+ monsters.
Having spell lv1 is appropriate for Confusing Touch.
http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/papilio.html

Done 15-rune wins with all playable species, backgrounds, gods!
User avatar

Swamp Slogger

Posts: 182

Joined: Tuesday, 8th July 2014, 10:18

Post Wednesday, 12th October 2016, 11:21

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

for me confuse isnt about the stabbing so much on my non stealthy chars, but to use it versus casters which can be dangerous for your characters. and on a felid with hexes id say you got that niche where confusing touch can be useful (max power prob). and i definitely lava drowned cerebov once with this spell while prob not strong enough to melee him

the goodspells comment was for regular confuse as its power is high enough for low MR targets on hybrids with just like 12 spellcasting.. and no investment in hexes or just like 5

the spell was really rare btw and lvl 2 just like 1 version ago

Shoals Surfer

Posts: 329

Joined: Wednesday, 19th December 2012, 13:23

Post Wednesday, 12th October 2016, 12:43

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

MrRokkomies wrote:Confusing Touch seems really powerful

Shhhh, don't say that, aren't you afraid of the nerfhammer? It has already left felids without the Haste spell, high stealth modifier and Passage of Golubria in Zot/on the orb run.
From my experience (halfway through a greatfelid run), Confusing Touch is one of the better spells a melee-based cat can hope for. It's good against most natural monsters with high MR (for example, spriggans, shadow/gold dragons and Orb Guardians) but if you get your statue/dragon form up, you might find your raw damage output to be better than it. Check this page to see how it behaves gainst non-natural foes (it's also a good idea to check monsters' HD there) and remember to position yourself properly if you have to use it against a crowd.
Offline greaterplayer (who cares). I don't always play online, but when i do, i streak felids.
Zot:5 on easy mode video
Double Skullcrusher

Halls Hopper

Posts: 62

Joined: Tuesday, 1st November 2011, 20:16

Post Wednesday, 12th October 2016, 19:06

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

I love Felids, I love Enchanters, I love Hexes, I love UC, I love stabbing, and I love Transmutations. In theory, I'm perfectly positioned to love Confusing Touch. I've historically tried to learn it on every viable character, early or late-game. I confess I might not have found the right use case apart from those like "Felid in the Early Game," which is really the ideal condition for that spell. Every time I try to use it I'm underwhelmed, and something else seems like a better option -- Confuse spell, dazzling spray, or even regular melee. In a good case, it feels like a novelty, and in most cases, it feels more like a wasted turn and a dam reduction.

For the edge case of an UC stabber like Felid, it will definitely be very useful in early game, but most other cases make me think lvl 1 is quite fine. Even the nerf to lvl 2 in trunk (still the case?) seems unnecessary.
User avatar

Tartarus Sorceror

Posts: 1749

Joined: Monday, 14th October 2013, 01:05

Post Thursday, 13th October 2016, 01:41

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

Confusing touch feels really powerful up until you are stuck uselessly patting a dangerous enemy. I don't tend to use it because I don't like memorizing HD.

Crypt Cleanser

Posts: 714

Joined: Saturday, 5th December 2015, 06:56

Post Thursday, 13th October 2016, 05:32

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

It doesnt seem to confuse enemies for every long. Then again, ive never tried it on a dedicated hexer with high spellpower... much safer to cast confuse at range and then close in on the helpless enemy on such characters.

Spider Stomper

Posts: 191

Joined: Monday, 7th April 2014, 06:11

Post Thursday, 13th October 2016, 06:00

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

lethediver wrote:It doesnt seem to confuse enemies for every long. Then again, ive never tried it on a dedicated hexer with high spellpower... much safer to cast confuse at range and then close in on the helpless enemy on such characters.


So it would seem, especially on a felid that is faster than most enemies. Then again, playing it safe all the time is really tedious. In lair, I usually end up with something like 40%-60% success rates on common enemies, that I would like to hex. Hydras being the biggest threaths, but comodos and blink frogs too. This makes me run out of mp occasionally and forces me to run away to recharge, especially if there are more than one threath nearby. Packs are also hard to hex with one magic bar. Confusing touch conserves MP a lot and allows you to freely use it on the not-so-big-a-threth-but-not-yet-popcorns. Also, regular confusion is really hard to land on a death yak in Lair, touch is far easier. They also have the pack issue. The short duration on bigger mobs is less of a problem, when you are already in melee range. Then again, you are in melee range of dangerous enemies, so there is that....

In conclusion, it would seem the spell is really good untill lair/orc, but will loose its power soon after that. It will have some use even in extended, but you will need other methods post lair/orc.

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 4341

Joined: Friday, 8th May 2015, 17:51

Post Thursday, 13th October 2016, 12:26

Re: Confusing Touch seems really powerfull

Confusing Touch is much better than Confuse vs monsters with high MR and low HD. For example, Deep Elf Sorcerer has MR 120 but only 14 HD. 14 HD means (30-14)/30=53% success of confusion. This is unreachable with Confuse spell.
Underestimated: cleaving, Deep Elf, Formicid, Vehumet, EV
Overestimated: AC, GDS
Twin account of Sandman25

For this message the author VeryAngryFelid has received thanks:
ZoFy

Return to Dungeon Crawling Advice

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests

Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by ST Software for PTF.