I think we learned an important lesson today.


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

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Tartarus Sorceror

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Post Tuesday, 24th April 2012, 20:30

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Kirbypowered wrote:Don't assume just because it's only a skeletal yellow wasp that you can simply mash the forward key until it's dead. Watch your health bar.

Do you mean a yellow wasp zombie? Yellow wasps don't leave skeletons.
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Vestibule Violator

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Post Tuesday, 24th April 2012, 20:36

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Obviously he meant exoskeleton.

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Post Tuesday, 24th April 2012, 23:33

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Berserk KoBe + Constricted by Naga Warrior + 2/112 HP left = literally nothing you can do except attack, but you're not strong enough to kill the naga in one more hit.
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Post Wednesday, 25th April 2012, 11:16

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

tormodpwns wrote:Berserk KoBe + Constricted by Naga Warrior + 2/112 HP left = literally nothing you can do except attack, but you're not strong enough to kill the naga in one more hit.

If playing trunk, you can try escaping too (the formula is much better than in 0.10). Chance is low but better than nothing.
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Post Thursday, 26th April 2012, 00:13

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Three lessons today:

Wands of cold don't seem to leave clouds over water anymore. This means while they're still strong against electric eels, they're no longer the awesome nearly guaranteed 1hit wonders they used to be. I was somewhat miffed to discover this is a game that's had 5 electric eel floors so far (good gods, could we get a cap on that or something?).

Kirke's hogs don't seem to give the "that kill felt curiously unrewarding message" anymore. Cue me finding a hog, beginning to worry, killing it, thinking I'm safe, and then rounding a corner and stumbling across her. (Thankfully, killed the deceitful witch anyways).

Giant rocks can 2-shot hydrae. :)

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Post Thursday, 26th April 2012, 01:41

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

mageykun wrote:Wands of cold don't seem to leave clouds over water anymore. This means while they're still strong against electric eels, they're no longer the awesome nearly guaranteed 1hit wonders they used to be. I was somewhat miffed to discover this is a game that's had 5 electric eel floors so far (good gods, could we get a cap on that or something?).


A wand of cold produces a bolt of cold, and bolt of cold doesn't produce clouds at low power level, so I'm thinking it might be your power level. It still seems to work for me on my semi-recent trunk build.

Oh, and just to contribute something. The see invisible charm spell really sucks. It's better than nothing of course, but the duration is short for a level 4 spell and ghost moths will drain you your mana before you notice and use it. And before anyone comments, no I really shouldn't have gone to Spider 5 with just the spell. I haven't been there and I wasn't thinking about or preparing for ghost moths. At least I still live.

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Post Thursday, 26th April 2012, 22:15

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Jabberwocky wrote:
Kirbypowered wrote:Don't assume just because it's only a skeletal yellow wasp that you can simply mash the forward key until it's dead. Watch your health bar.

Do you mean a yellow wasp zombie? Yellow wasps don't leave skeletons.

Ah, yes. Checking the morgue file, it was most certainly a yellow wasp zombie. I figured that was wrong, I just didn't think to check.

Lost my best crawler yet yesterday, ten times better than anyone before. Went into the snake pit without poison resistance or healing/curing potions. Died in relative safe conditions due to poison. I think the lesson is pretty clear.

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Post Friday, 27th April 2012, 21:44

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

You may think you can take a hit, but a titanic slime creature will Crush you.
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Post Friday, 27th April 2012, 23:16

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Hatches do not determine where they lead until the first time you use them (had one take me into an area I had dug out of the rock).
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Post Saturday, 28th April 2012, 02:36

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Don't berserk against a constricting monster if there's any chance it will outdamage you. Naga warriors are shitty and should die.
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Abyss Ambulator

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Post Saturday, 28th April 2012, 18:35

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Sanctuary comes with a free holy word. This is a bad thing when you are using it as a "get out of jail free" card in tomb with low hp.

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Post Saturday, 28th April 2012, 18:46

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

That seems wrong. Using Sanctuary shouldn't get you killed.
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Post Saturday, 28th April 2012, 18:48

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

moocowmoocow wrote:Naga warriors are shitty and should die.

Y E S
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Blades Runner

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Post Sunday, 29th April 2012, 10:32

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Careful of playing trunk, especially with tiles. I had no idea what was going on. Suddenly my horde of zombies turned into a horde of artifact tiles, I got confused as to what was going on, was smited a few times, then stumbled backwards onto a dart trap and died.
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Tartarus Sorceror

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Post Sunday, 29th April 2012, 13:07

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

That sounds like a bug. Can you report it?
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Post Sunday, 29th April 2012, 13:44

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Deimos wrote:Careful of playing trunk, especially with tiles. I had no idea what was going on. Suddenly my horde of zombies turned into a horde of artifact tiles, I got confused as to what was going on, was smited a few times, then stumbled backwards onto a dart trap and died.


I told them they never should have added LSD-coated items to trunk. But did they listen?
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Post Sunday, 29th April 2012, 14:08

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Jabberwocky wrote:That sounds like a bug. Can you report it?

It's a know bug. A surprisingly persistent one, actually. The reports go back a few versions.

(I think it's a trunk problem that crops up as some side effect of new tile additions? So far as I can tell, it doesn't seem to occur in stable).

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Sunday, 29th April 2012, 18:29

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

nicolae wrote:I told them they never should have added LSD-coated items to trunk. But did they listen?

It's important to have Acid resistance.

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Post Monday, 30th April 2012, 04:10

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

So apparently summon elemental should not be the first elemental spell your deep elf wizard learns and uses... was a good character up until that point.

BTW hi, new to the game have managed to get to around level 12 so far and have gotten the majority of the way into the lair or the orcish mines before making a stupid mistake. Or starving. Yeah that ones a killer there.
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Post Monday, 30th April 2012, 18:46

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Grimm wrote:
nicolae wrote:I told them they never should have added LSD-coated items to trunk. But did they listen?

It's important to have Acid resistance.

That is a good, basic strategy.

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Post Wednesday, 2nd May 2012, 06:22

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

For a melee Oc, Slime pits are somewhat tricky to tackle.

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Post Thursday, 3rd May 2012, 10:02

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Mephitic Cloud actually does damage if you cast it on yourself.
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Post Friday, 4th May 2012, 02:06

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

A Naga can constrict a zombie/skeleton of a monster that is normally too large, such as a Hill Giant.
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Post Saturday, 5th May 2012, 04:10

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

When attempting to summon a demon (via ability from what'shisface god), failing, and trying again, the demon will spawn hostile (every time?).

Should've learned when I did it with a minor demon summon, but no. Up against a Griffon, tried the stronger summon and got a Blizzard Demon. If I was thinking straight I could've summoned a bunch of minor demons to act as meat shields but, alas, I did not. I was doing so well... :(
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Post Saturday, 5th May 2012, 05:01

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

It's not every time, thankfully.
Henzell wrote:Summons a temporary executioner, green death, blizzard demon, balrug, or cacodemon. Hostility chance is reduced (but never to 0) by invocations skill. Hostile if 1d(20 + Invocations * 3) <= 4 (e.g. 1/5 at 0 skill, 1/11 at 8 skill, 1/17 at 16 skill).

And usually the best cure for a hostile summon is a friendly summon or two to kill it, or distract it while you get away. So you had the right idea.

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Blades Runner

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Post Saturday, 5th May 2012, 09:35

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

The Minotaur in the Labyrinth isn't always a pushover. I was running a DsGl with a Demon Whip of Electrocution (Probably one of the best melee weapon type/race/brand combinations you can get in the game, to my knowledge) with Heroism on. I charged at the Minotaur and then charged in reverse. In just a handful of turns his Staff of Death kicked my DS in faster then ever.

In hindsight I should have activated Finesse, albeit it's odd because I can hardly recall even taking damage from him in past runs.
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Post Saturday, 5th May 2012, 14:46

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

mageykun wrote:It's not every time, thankfully.
Henzell wrote:Summons a temporary executioner, green death, blizzard demon, balrug, or cacodemon. Hostility chance is reduced (but never to 0) by invocations skill. Hostile if 1d(20 + Invocations * 3) <= 4 (e.g. 1/5 at 0 skill, 1/11 at 8 skill, 1/17 at 16 skill).

And usually the best cure for a hostile summon is a friendly summon or two to kill it, or distract it while you get away. So you had the right idea.

Also you should mind that only the strongest demons have chances to appear hostile in the newest stable version.
If you find any mistakes or typos in my post, feel free to PM me about it. Thanks in advance!

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Post Saturday, 5th May 2012, 17:18

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Pick any giant rocks/javelins for your troll before entering lair and have at least 4-5 skill in throwing for some better accuracy. Now hydras don't look so threatening. Especially if worshipping Trog, get that throwing skill up to 8 at least to start receiving awesome stuff like steel/silver javelins on a regular basis.
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Post Sunday, 6th May 2012, 11:41

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

When the learndb says not to let a tentacled monstrisity constrict you, do not think "Eh, I'm a minotaur fighter that has slain all in its path. Surely I can kill it quickly before the constriction starts to hurt". You can't and it will. I managed to survive that little faux pas of reasoning, but it was the closest call I've had in many hours (61/257 HP with a yaktaur captain shooting me with flaming arrows, desperately waiting for the teleport to kick in).

EDIT: When entering a level with -cTele, remember to actually remove your ring of teleportation. Had a small heart attack when i deposited me next to about 10 elves. Fortunately I'm strong enough at this point to kill them with barely a scratch on me, but still... On the other hand, I suppose it's better to learn this lesson on Elf 3 than Zot 5.

EDIT 2: If, after scrying the loot at the bottom of Elf, you don't see anything particularly useful but find yourself thinking "Maybe that ring will be useful. Let's go in anyway", STOP. Step away from the keyboard and recite to yourself: "Elves know Banishment". Keep reciting this until it sinks in. Then consider once again if you really, really need that loot. (I managed to escape with only a single Str -1 mutation and my life thanks to my cloak of +Lev. I shall consider this a lucky break and have graciously decided to let the elves keep their stuff.)
Wins: DEWz^Veh (4 runes), DEWz^Veh (15 runes), DEWz^Sif (3 runes), HOBe^Trog (3 runes), MiDK^Yred (3 runes), DECj^Sif (4 runes), GrBe^Trog (3 runes), DECj^Vehu (3 runes), MiFi^Wu Jian (3 runes), DEFE^Veh (3 runes), DEFE^Veh (15 runes)

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Post Sunday, 6th May 2012, 18:07

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

FalconNL wrote:EDIT 2: If, after scrying the loot at the bottom of Elf, you don't see anything particularly useful but find yourself thinking "Maybe that ring will be useful. Let's go in anyway", STOP. Step away from the keyboard and recite to yourself: "Elves know Banishment". Keep reciting this until it sinks in. Then consider once again if you really, really need that loot. (I managed to escape with only a single Str -1 mutation and my life thanks to my cloak of +Lev. I shall consider this a lucky break and have graciously decided to let the elves keep their stuff.)
If you find any mistakes or typos in my post, feel free to PM me about it. Thanks in advance!

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Post Monday, 7th May 2012, 15:51

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

MyOtheHedgeFox wrote:
mageykun wrote:It's not every time, thankfully.
Henzell wrote:Summons a temporary executioner, green death, blizzard demon, balrug, or cacodemon. Hostility chance is reduced (but never to 0) by invocations skill. Hostile if 1d(20 + Invocations * 3) <= 4 (e.g. 1/5 at 0 skill, 1/11 at 8 skill, 1/17 at 16 skill).

And usually the best cure for a hostile summon is a friendly summon or two to kill it, or distract it while you get away. So you had the right idea.

Also you should mind that only the strongest demons have chances to appear hostile in the newest stable version.

I think that's for the greater demon spell, not for the makhleb ability. AFAIK all Makhleb summons have a chance to be hostile.
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Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 17:02

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

high spellpower Invisibility (8 hashes) can give you yellow glow from no glow.
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Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 17:59

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Assuming that of all your unidentified potions those you have most are potions of curing,is a very bad idea. Especially, when you are poisoned and those you have most are potions of poison...
In 90% of all cases, those ARE potions of curing, though. Very, very mean.

That leads to the question, when it is best to quaff-identify your potions. Too early and you die from said potion of poison. Too late and you will die anyway.

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Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 18:39

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

atticus712 wrote:Assuming that of all your unidentified potions those you have most are potions of curing,is a very bad idea. Especially, when you are poisoned and those you have most are potions of poison...
In 90% of all cases, those ARE potions of curing, though. Very, very mean.

That leads to the question, when it is best to quaff-identify your potions. Too early and you die from said potion of poison. Too late and you will die anyway.


This is one reason of several why you should scroll-ID potions as quickly as the scrolls become available. Generally speaking, even jewelry identification can wait until you've got the basic emergency potions sorted out.

Swamp Slogger

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Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 20:26

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

When facing an orb of fire, please do remember to wear your rings of rF, as they make for much better orb guardians than the actual ones.
Wins: DEWz^Veh (4 runes), DEWz^Veh (15 runes), DEWz^Sif (3 runes), HOBe^Trog (3 runes), MiDK^Yred (3 runes), DECj^Sif (4 runes), GrBe^Trog (3 runes), DECj^Vehu (3 runes), MiFi^Wu Jian (3 runes), DEFE^Veh (3 runes), DEFE^Veh (15 runes)
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Abyss Ambulator

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Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 20:44

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

I'll only quaff ID once I have the valuable potions (curing, heal wounds, cure mut) IDed as well as Mutation and Decay. Though by then it usually that means I have most of the others IDed too.
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Halls Hopper

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Post Tuesday, 8th May 2012, 22:25

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

FalconNL wrote:When facing an orb of fire, please do remember to wear your rings of rF, as they make for much better orb guardians than the actual ones.


And/or anti-magic weapon if you have it.
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Blades Runner

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Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 18:35

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Train spellcasting even if you never want to learn a spell. A good 3-4 levels will do. I forgot about doing that and ended up getting stuck between a rock and a hard place (an Unseen Horror) with my TrMo of Chei. My backup plan was Slouch, but... yea, cant cast slouch with 3 mana!
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Abyss Ambulator

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Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 18:40

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Invo (and evo in trunk) give mp also. There is absolutely no reason to train spellcasting if you're not...you know...casting spells.

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Post Wednesday, 9th May 2012, 22:54

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

I'm going to second blade on this one.

Invocations not only increases your mana pool similar to spellcasting, but it also positively effects almost all god abilities in one way shape or form, usually by increasing the chance of using it successfully.
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Post Thursday, 10th May 2012, 07:19

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

You can use arrow keys + diagonal vi-keys.

To easily remember where they are: they are Here, around the H: Y U No 'Buse them?
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Post Thursday, 10th May 2012, 08:10

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

This is probably very obvious to the more experienced players, but red draconian breath is incredible in the early-mid game. If you position an enemy between yourself and a wall, you get to place a Conjure Flame *under* them even if the breath misses. This kills just about anything not fire resistant in a few turns.

Lair Larrikin

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Post Thursday, 10th May 2012, 12:47

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Actually it's even better than that, as you can choose where the breath ends ( . key), which is where the cloud is placed, no need for a wall behind them.

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Mines Malingerer

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Post Thursday, 10th May 2012, 14:47

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Hubris kills. Do not brag about the artifact bardiche of speed and other resistances you just found to your Finances on your merfolk gladiator. Along with your brand new demon trident and other cool stuff. You'll get turned into a pig and splatted by Kirke.

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Post Thursday, 10th May 2012, 15:42

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

You shouldn't brag to your finances anyway, they hardly ever care how you're doing in crawl since you're not out there making money.

Temple Termagant

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Post Friday, 11th May 2012, 07:59

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

I've learned that Sonja is a Sigmund of D:10+.
So many deaths on L14 chars.
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Lair Larrikin

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Post Friday, 11th May 2012, 20:33

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

FalconNL wrote:When the learndb says not to let a tentacled monstrisity constrict you, do not think "Eh, I'm a minotaur fighter that has slain all in its path. Surely I can kill it quickly before the constriction starts to hurt". You can't and it will. I managed to survive that little faux pas of reasoning, but it was the closest call I've had in many hours (61/257 HP with a yaktaur captain shooting me with flaming arrows, desperately waiting for the teleport to kick in).

^this
Only difference is that i died with my first promising MeBe :cry:

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Post Sunday, 13th May 2012, 11:53

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

TSO doesn't like it if you attack holy beings... even if they are just clones made by Mara!

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Post Monday, 14th May 2012, 15:40

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Apparently Ash's portal detection will also detect portal feature mimics. This can lead you to the middle of a Pan lord vault. Without the portal out you expected.
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