I think we learned an important lesson today.


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

Halls Hopper

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Post Tuesday, 12th July 2011, 19:51

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

All WizLabs are concentrated evil and want to you to die a horrible death.
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Vestibule Violator

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Post Wednesday, 13th July 2011, 08:38

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

So prepare your makeshift HEV-suit made of nice "branded" armour, teleport control, controlled blinks, branded weapons and a nice collection of combat and utility spells.
If you find any mistakes or typos in my post, feel free to PM me about it. Thanks in advance!

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 13th July 2011, 23:10

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

If you read a tele scroll and then read a second tele scroll while the first tele is still active, the second scroll will cancel the first scroll.

hxy

Slime Squisher

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Post Thursday, 14th July 2011, 05:24

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Silent spectre is a great help when clearing Crypt:5 "eye to eye with the evil" vault :)
I should have kept him around for clearing Tomb...

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Zot Zealot

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Post Friday, 15th July 2011, 09:12

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Dowan will cast buffs on Duvessa. Hmm.
I am sure I played flawflessly. This was an utmost unfair death. -- gorbeh

Snake Sneak

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Post Friday, 15th July 2011, 15:44

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

It is bad to identify a wand of fireball right next to a rat at level 2.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Friday, 15th July 2011, 16:30

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

speciesxx wrote:It is bad to identify a wand of fireball right next to a rat at level 2.


Always ID wands by aiming at least three squares away (fireball), at an angle (lightning), and at a wall (digging/disintegration).

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Post Friday, 15th July 2011, 17:46

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Grimm wrote:
speciesxx wrote:It is bad to identify a wand of fireball right next to a rat at level 2.


Always ID wands by aiming at least three squares away (fireball), at an angle (lightning), and at a wall (digging/disintegration).

And of course, at a trivial natural enemy, so it the target doesn't turn into something crazy (polymorph, though the rat->boggart example makes this less important), get fast enough to beat you (haste), stab you to death (invisibility), or just resist so you still don't know what you have (slow, paralyze, disintegrate, confuse, enslave).

And hit it once first with a dart so it has room to heal, just in case.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Friday, 15th July 2011, 17:56

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Grimm wrote:
speciesxx wrote:It is bad to identify a wand of fireball right next to a rat at level 2.


Always ID wands by aiming at least three squares away (fireball), at an angle (lightning), and at a wall (digging/disintegration).


But NOT a corner wall (lightning).
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Blades Runner

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Post Saturday, 16th July 2011, 18:51

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Never drop scrolls before killing a fire drake.

You will forget to pick them up again, then find yourself pushed off a staircase, then outflanked by war dogs and hydra after discharging all your wands, then die. It would have been easier to pick up the blinking and teleport scrolls and live.

Vaults Vanquisher

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Post Saturday, 16th July 2011, 18:59

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

While we're on the subject, never drop your scrolls before fighting a fire-breather and then stay on the same square while fighting it! Fire blasts can destroy scrolls on the ground, too... and it works the same way for potions and cold blasts. Drop your fragile items out of sight!

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Zot Zealot

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Post Sunday, 17th July 2011, 09:01

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Those little 'X' squares around the outside of freezing clouds are there for a reason!
I am sure I played flawflessly. This was an utmost unfair death. -- gorbeh

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 18th July 2011, 10:10

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

jejorda2 wrote:And of course, at a trivial natural enemy, so it the target doesn't turn into something crazy (polymorph, though the rat->boggart example makes this less important), get fast enough to beat you (haste), stab you to death (invisibility), or just resist so you still don't know what you have (slow, paralyze, disintegrate, confuse, enslave).

And hit it once first with a dart so it has room to heal, just in case.


I no longer ID wands on monsters for the very reasons jejorda2 lists here. If a wall shot does not ID the wand, fire it at yourself (on a cleared level of course) and that will ID all of the abovementioned wands with zero risk to the player.

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Blades Runner

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Post Monday, 18th July 2011, 10:37

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

and then you get paralyzed, and wandering hydra that was just around a corner goes "rofl, dorf snack!"
P.s. Hydras are jerks

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Blades Runner

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Post Monday, 18th July 2011, 11:12

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Grimm wrote:I no longer ID wands on monsters for the very reasons jejorda2 lists here. If a wall shot does not ID the wand, fire it at yourself (on a cleared level of course) and that will ID all of the abovementioned wands with zero risk to the player.

targeting yourself with a wand of polymorph may not be the best idea, for the same reason that trying the mutation potion is often considered harmful.
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Vestibule Violator

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Post Monday, 18th July 2011, 13:28

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Wands of polymorph other do not work on yourself, so if there is no effect...
If you find any mistakes or typos in my post, feel free to PM me about it. Thanks in advance!

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Through each ripple and wave...
Through every living being...
The Verse binds us all as one.
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Snake Sneak

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Post Monday, 18th July 2011, 21:04

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Snapping turtles can attack you even when you're surrounded by allies. :cry:
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Abyss Ambulator

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 06:39

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Not all Spider Nests are potential death traps with nine Centipedes/Scorpions/other insect serving as a welcome squadron and foreshadowing the other 80 foes packed within. Some are much smaller with fewer enemies who instead of swarming abuse the cling ability. These layouts are much safer and easier if you're careful, but also seem to be less rewarding.
The best strategy most frequently overlooked by new players for surviving: not starting a fight to begin with.
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Sewers Scotsman

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 07:50

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Just because the description for dire elephants says they're not as bad as hellephants doesn't mean they're not going to kick your stinky sorry kobold ass in two shots, berserk or no berserk.

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Zot Zealot

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 08:51

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Tangling with Ophanim is a great way to turn your huge shambling herd of undead allies into a small group of severely damaged undead allies.
I am sure I played flawflessly. This was an utmost unfair death. -- gorbeh
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Slime Squisher

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 10:48

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Do not join up with Okawaru until ALL your Demonspawn mutations are known. Just because you figure it will be unlikely that you will Demonic Guardian does NOT mean the RNG will consider it unlikely.
Human kind cannot bear very much reality.
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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 12:05

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

dolphin wrote:Do not join up with Okawaru until ALL your Demonspawn mutations are known. Just because you figure it will be unlikely that you will Demonic Guardian does NOT mean the RNG will consider it unlikely.

I read in a spoiler once (before the big change to demonspawn mutations around 0.6) that the conjuration and summoning mutations would never be given to Makhleb worshippers, because they already had similar demon-themed powers and didn't need those mutations. It seems like Okawaru worshiping demonspawn should be barred from receiving the guardian mutation.
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Blades Runner

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 12:31

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

I had that mutation with Oka during my last win. Everything went fine. Maybe because I was gladiator with katana(good night sweet prince)

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 20:27

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

jejorda2 wrote:I read in a spoiler once (before the big change to demonspawn mutations around 0.6) that the conjuration and summoning mutations would never be given to Makhleb worshippers, because they already had similar demon-themed powers and didn't need those mutations. It seems like Okawaru worshiping demonspawn should be barred from receiving the guardian mutation.


That potential was intentionally removed. There was too much potential for it to become a mandatory, tedious chore to try blocking off all mutations perceived as undesirable before getting too far in the game. Nowadays, your demonspawn will have all his or her mutations decided at chargen, and will not be dissuaded from getting all of them by anything short of death.

You know you're safe to go Okawaru if you have any two of the following, at any level:

Spines
Powered by Death
Powered by Pain
Magic Resistance
Cold Resistance
Nightstalker
Magic Mapping

These all compete with Demonic Guardian.

The odds of getting Demonic Guardian on a starting demonspawn are 25%, of course, and if you've only revealed one mutation on this list and it isn't Demonic Guardian the odds of getting Demonic Guardian for your second mutation are still about 14%. Not all that uncommon.

Vaults Vanquisher

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 22:41

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

When you're literally starving, eat your goddamned permafood that you already have. Don't waste time butchering a corpse.

Because dying of starvation when you're carrying a pile of meat rations is possibly the most noobish, loserly death that has ever been perpetrated in the entire history of Crawl.

(sighs)

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 19th July 2011, 23:09

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

That's fantastic.

Halls Hopper

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Post Wednesday, 20th July 2011, 04:43

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

That Orc throwing runed hand axes. He's a lot more dangerous when they're hand axes of distortion and you get sent to the abyss...
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Zot Zealot

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Post Wednesday, 20th July 2011, 08:59

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

ctrl-O brings up the dungeon overview. This is great.
I am sure I played flawflessly. This was an utmost unfair death. -- gorbeh

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Dungeon Master

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Post Wednesday, 20th July 2011, 10:28

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

OdiumTheologicum wrote:That Orc throwing runed hand axes. He's a lot more dangerous when they're hand axes of distortion and you get sent to the abyss...

Seriously? Melee brands have no effect when the weapon is thrown. At least for the player, but I'm pretty sure it's the same for monsters. If you're positive that's what happened, you should fill a bug report.
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Halls Hopper

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Post Thursday, 21st July 2011, 04:20

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

galehar wrote:
OdiumTheologicum wrote:That Orc throwing runed hand axes. He's a lot more dangerous when they're hand axes of distortion and you get sent to the abyss...

Seriously? Melee brands have no effect when the weapon is thrown. At least for the player, but I'm pretty sure it's the same for monsters. If you're positive that's what happened, you should fill a bug report.

Well. No one was within melee range of me. I was on dungeon lvl 4 I think. And an orc was throwing axes at me. On the fourth one, it hit, I was sent to the abyss. I believe they were just runed hand axes. They may have been orcish though. I can't remember. I thought that was normal.
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Blades Runner

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Post Thursday, 21st July 2011, 06:26

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

can't you tell from the character dump?
Wins: DDBe (3 runes, morgue file)

Halls Hopper

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Post Thursday, 21st July 2011, 13:29

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

absolutego wrote:can't you tell from the character dump?

Well. This was early in my crawl experience. Very early. And I had a problem with ghosts. So. I kinda deleted my morgue folder in hoping that my 5 summoners wouldn't keep coming back to haunt me. =x
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Zot Zealot

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Post Thursday, 21st July 2011, 16:28

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Alligator Snapping Turtles are like Alligators... with reaching :shock:
I am sure I played flawflessly. This was an utmost unfair death. -- gorbeh

Dungeon Dilettante

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Post Friday, 22nd July 2011, 11:15

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Be sure you've got Scroll of Remove Curse before trying on any unindentified randart in the Maze. It may be cursed and with *TELE property.

Made this mistake yesterday. There was not enough space in inventory for the minotaur's loot, so I decided to try on and then drop some of randarts. Funny, but by mistake I had read Remove Curse (the only scroll) instead of Detect Curse before doing that.
Wins: NaWz(3 runes), KoBe(3), MfCr(15), DsAK(4)

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Friday, 22nd July 2011, 13:59

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Scroll of fear will make a polar bear berserk, not run.

I really wish I had been spoiled on that before going into that Ice Cave.

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Abyss Ambulator

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Post Friday, 22nd July 2011, 15:12

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

There's an Ossuary with a Guardian Mummy in a small chamber with most of the treasure. Just because the game tells you he moves slowly doesn't mean you can Passwall in, grab the stuff while out running him, and then teleport out. He'll somehow manage to stay caught up to you.
The best strategy most frequently overlooked by new players for surviving: not starting a fight to begin with.

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Abyss Ambulator

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Post Friday, 22nd July 2011, 15:33

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

It is perfectly possible to find a troll on D:1 without tripping the OOD timer.
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Lair Larrikin

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Post Friday, 22nd July 2011, 15:53

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

It is also perfectly possible to find a centaur on D2 - just a few steps from the stairs. A few steps too many. :P

Halls Hopper

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Post Saturday, 23rd July 2011, 01:40

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Grimm wrote:Scroll of fear will make a polar bear berserk, not run.

I really wish I had been spoiled on that before going into that Ice Cave.

Whoa. Apparently most bears are like that. Thanks for the heads up lol.

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Abyss Ambulator

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Post Saturday, 23rd July 2011, 06:24

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

TwilightPhoenix wrote:There's an Ossuary with a Guardian Mummy in a small chamber with most of the treasure. Just because the game tells you he moves slowly doesn't mean you can Passwall in, grab the stuff while out running him, and then teleport out. He'll somehow manage to stay caught up to you.



Long after you're dead, you learn said treasure chamber has secret doors. :oops:
The best strategy most frequently overlooked by new players for surviving: not starting a fight to begin with.

Halls Hopper

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Post Saturday, 23rd July 2011, 07:45

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Whenever you play a fighter, you'll find many spell books before dungeon level 7. > .>
And no good weapons.

Mines Malingerer

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Post Saturday, 23rd July 2011, 08:01

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

dont spam summon demon if you are sleepy or drunk,you WILL get mutated by a hostile neqoxec :o

Halls Hopper

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Post Sunday, 24th July 2011, 00:05

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Read-identifying a scroll of immolation can be even more dangerous when you are surrounded by four ghoul friendlies who suddenly decide to not be friendly anymore. This prelude to YASD was made even more embarassing by the fact that immolation was the last unidentified type of scroll in the game.

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Zot Zealot

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Post Sunday, 24th July 2011, 20:52

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

^ I've done that too.
I am sure I played flawflessly. This was an utmost unfair death. -- gorbeh

Lair Larrikin

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Post Sunday, 24th July 2011, 22:24

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

A ring of poison resistance will save you from Sonja's curare needles. It will not, however, save you from stupidly charging into melee with her only to be eaten by an Abyssal welcoming party fifty frantic turns later.

Halls Hopper

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Post Monday, 25th July 2011, 17:51

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

7 straight hours of game play can be fun, but breaks should be considered if you want a serious attempt for a win.

For some reason, being able to make good judgement calls becomes a lot harder when you are fried, and the likelihood of botching a physical input is far more probable.

Also, Boris is a total beast.

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Vaults Vanquisher

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Post Monday, 25th July 2011, 21:23

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Teleport traps on Zot:5 will always send you into the chamber with the most ancient liches and orbs of fire. This chamber will probably also contain some orb guardians with a moth of wrath. If you somehow manage to survive all this long enough to teleport away with your last few HP, you will of course end up in ANOTHER chamber with ancient liches and orbs of fire who will proceed to nail your coffin shut.

(Goddammit! And I was so close to adding Draconians to my list of Berserker wins, too...)

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 26th July 2011, 08:23

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Ensure that your main blade and your flaming blade are on letters widely spaced on the keyboard. If they are for example on a and s respectively, you might in a moment of inattention give your hydra foe five or six extra heads, an eventuality that will not redound to your benefit.

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Zot Zealot

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Post Tuesday, 26th July 2011, 11:17

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

Slime is much easier with Resist Corrosion.

I have no idea why I never noticed this before, either.
I am sure I played flawflessly. This was an utmost unfair death. -- gorbeh

Abyss Ambulator

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Post Wednesday, 27th July 2011, 15:38

Re: I think we learned an important lesson today.

However powerful you are, however many runes you have and Pan Lords you have defeated, there is something in the Abyss that can kill you.

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