Another please God(s) Help Me Thread I'm a Newbie

[cort]

OK I really suck at this game. I've played 124 games and my best score is 6200. I died on level 10. I've read much of the wiki and have a couple of questions please. I understand dying is half the fun but I'm starting to have a lot less fun now.

I've been playing a MDFi and using Trog or Okarwuu (sp) depending on whose alter I find 1st because they are supposedly the easiest.

1. Is there any way to get rid of the ghosts?

2. WTF is up with Sigmund on Level 2?

3. What is a good plan regarding identifying scrolls, potions, etc?
What I've been doing is trying to make it to level 3 and then going through all my scrolls until I find the ID scroll. Once I find the ID scroll I've been using them to ID the rest of my scrolls, rings, weapons, armor and amulets that aren't cursed and didn't ID when I put them on, and then my potions. I usually try a couple of potions until I find the Healing ones but I stop trying them after that because it seems there are some pretty nasty potions.

4. I start out with a hand axe and have only been changing to other axes. This has led to not a lot of weapon choices. Should be trying out all the glowing/runed daggers, short swords, whips, spears, etc that drop? Any weapons a MDFi should not use?

5. I've been wearing the heaviest armor I could find. I usually last a lot longer once I find a suit of plate. Is this the right strategy?

6. I've been using darts for missile weapons and thats pretty much it. I've never found a crossbow. Are slings a good weapon for a MDFi?

7. In 124 games I've found exactly one item with poison resistance. I've cleared the sewers several times, never cleared the mines or any of the other 'special' dungeons. I always seem to get to level DL 6 or 7 and die from some orc confusing me or ogre smashing me, or IjbJQW summoning 50 guys on me. I've never seen a hydra. I just suck.

8. Is it worth it to pick up weapons and/or armor on lower levels (4-5-6) that are not runed? Is there a chance they have some pluses?

9. Is there any benefit to going back up levels? Can you find new items and gain more XP? Should I never go below level X until you have items that do Y?

10. Should I not be playing a MDFi? Are they a cruel joke?

Thank You very much for the help.

[cort]

7. I don't see a question here.

Just me wallowing in self-pity. Thanks for the advice. Now to the wiki to read up on a Berserker and Venom Mage.

[Galefury]

Right, ninjad. Of course. Anyway:

Some general notes: reading the wiki is fine, but it often has outdated information, and some of the guides are pure rubbish. Try to use the knowledge bots for most of your questions, it's more up to date than the wiki. The IRC channel is also great, and very active most of the time. There are competent people there, you quickly get answers to your questions, and if someone gives bad advice someone will probably correct him. Same for this forum, but the answers come a little slower.

Some general advice: crawl is all about picking your battles. When you're at 3 HP it's too late, you already screwed up. If you know fighting something will probably kill you, run to the nearest stairs and leave the level while it's still a space away and cant follow you.

Fight in corridors, that way you wont get overwhelmed as easily.

Now about your questions:

1. Play a Necromancer, learn Dispel Undead, get lots of exp by busting all the ghost. Alternatively, encounter the ghost, then don't die on the same level. This should remove it from future games. Die on the same level and both the old and new ghost will spawn together.

2. Crawl hates you and wants to make you suffer, that's what's up. Just run away the moment you see him, unless you're playing a slow species you should be fine.

3. This is a matter of much dispute.

This is my approach:
I use ID scrolls to ID potions, then jewelry, then scrolls, then weapons.

Don't waste ID scrolls on scrolls early on. They are mostly harmless to read-id, and you will just waste some resources by read-iding. Just be careful if you're wearing a blunt weapon and don't have remove curse.

I sometimes quaff-ID potions, but this is the most complicated part of the id game. Drinking mutation or wasting cure mutation can really screw you over, but often you wont have enough scrolls to ID all your potions, and some of them are extremely helpful for getting out of tight situations (heal wounds, healing, might, haste and berserk are the most important ones for this). For me it really depends on how many ID scrolls I find. I usually use my ID scrolls on potions before anything else.

Rings and amulets I just put on and wear for a while. If it's cursed it will probably auto-id, and you usually find RC early. If it's cursed and doesn't auto-id it's probably hunger. The only one really likely to screw you is ring of teleport. Hunger and inaccuracy you will probably notice if you're paying attention, just take them off if they're not cursed. If piety is important to me I sometimes don't try to wield-id amulets because of faith. Then again, faith is best if piety is important to you, so this is a matter of taste.

Armors I might want to wear I just put on. Same for sharp weapons if I'm mostly a caster. As a MDFi you need to be more careful. But your starting weapon sucks anyway, so you might as well try others. Try to have remove curse with you. Don't bother with non-runed/embroidered/etc. stuff unless you're desperate. Branded things are always runed or something, and artifacts are marked as artifacts. So you wont miss anything really important by ignoring non-runed things.

4. If you find something good that crosstrains with your main skill and you have good aptitude for (for and axe MDFi this is only maces and flails) it might be worth trying if your current weapon sucks. Only do this if you really cant find any nice axes though. Try to stick with one weapon skill. For weapons you shouldn't use just check out your aptitudes with m*.

5. For a non-casting MDFi it probably is. But feel free to use medium weight armors if they have good enchantments.

6. Crossbows only become common later in the game. Darts are mostly fine early on. With MDFi I try to focus on melee and use crossbows only if I'm not using a shield (this hasn't happened so far).

7. Remember that you can run away to the nearest stairs. Also you usually regenerate faster than the monsters, so running away for a while, then fighting on can help. Don't forget to use god abilities and consumables. If something looks hard, don't wait until it gives you trouble, instead use the options you have while you can actually still fight. Drinking might when at 3 HP will not save you. Drinking might just before you start attacking might make the fight easy. For ogres I like using poison needles if I have a blowgun.

8. There is, but as I said above, don't bother unless you're desperate. If you see something with a batter base type than your current weapon or your current weapon sucks in other regards you should definitely try it, but that's pretty much it. They might be cursed, and are never branded, so even if you might miss something with good pluses you won't miss a branded item by ignoring these.

9. Not really. If you found all the items on a level you found all the items on a level. New enemies spawn, but rarely, so you will run out of food. Also stronger monsters start spawning after a while, so you might as well just go down and get some items in the process. There are many branches you shouldn't enter without specific resistances. Just check the bots or ask here, or check the wiki.

10. Heavy armor MDFi of Oka is very strong in 0.8. But there are lots of easier combinations.

If you're looking for something without spellcasting you could try Kobold Berserker. Or some other berserker.

Spriggan Enchanter is one of the easiest chars to win with, but you will have to make good use of stabbing and stealth and some spells. And have to rely on god abilities to fight many types of enemies. Most gods work for this, Nemelex and Oka are two of the easier choices (not sure about Oka in 0.8, he was really great for SpEn when he had might).

Deep Dwarf Necromancer of Makhleb is another very powerful combo, but also relies on magic and god abilities for many things (like healing for example). Works best as a hybrid IMO, but can be turned into anything.

The strongest mage background is Ice Elementalist, but Wizards are much easier early game. Transmuter is also really awesome throughout the game, but you have to get used to using forms which can take a while.

[Tiber]

1. Run from the ghost until you're stronger than it. If you're always playing the same type of char, you should pretty much always have the same speed, so just run to the nearest up stairs, and go down another one. Then beat him up after you've grown a few levels for some good exp.

2. As long as he doesn't confuse you, response #1 should work fine. Or if you find a blowgun, poison him to death.

3. That's about right.

4. That's the crappy thing about axes. They do have the best 2-hander though, unless you're playing an ogre and can use a giant spiked club.

5. That's mostly fine.

6. Don't bother with darts, except steel or darts of dispersal. Javelins, blowguns, and weapons of returning are the only reason to care about throwing. Oh, and stones for jellies too I guess. But if you're going Trog or Oka, turn throwing off unless you really like getting them as god gifts.

7. That's the RNG for you.

8. Orcish weapons have a 50% chance of having -1 accuracy and another 50% chance for +1 damage. Elven have a chance for up to +2 to-hit. Dwarven have a chance for +1 to-hit, and/or +1 to damage, or +1 to AC for armor. This goes even if they have no adjective in their name.

[mrbobbyg]

KoBe is a really good and easy start. Ditch that axe as fast as you can and find a short blade. Then zerk, zerk, zerk. Use Brothers in Arms if you see a really big threat.

[cort]

Thank you all very much for the advice in the thread. I started a KoBe and 1st one died on 2nd level because I went down and there were 3 worms at the stairs and was one shot. 2nd one I found a elven short sword of venom +3, +2 Got that enchanted to +5,+3 right now and got leather armor of fire protection. No rings yet though. Currently level 10 and working through the mines.

Thanks a bunch.

[mrbobbyg]

Quick piece of advice. For most characters, do the lair before the mines, especially Orc:4.

[cort]

Yeah, I met my demise on Orc 4 or 5. I'm not sure I've ever been to the lair. Swamp a bunch but not the lair I don't think. I'll keep an eye out for it.

[jejorda2]

That shield you start with as a fighter has a pretty big penalty. If you find a buckler, use that. Otherwise, don't wear a shield at all until you get your weapon skill high enough that the @ command tells you your attack speed is average or better.

Or play Dwarven Gladiator and pick up the first heavy armour you find.

[Galefury]

Swamp is accessed through Lair, so either you haven't been to Swamp or you have been to Lair. Anyway, don't enter Orc:4 with a lowlevel char, it's infested with hordes of Ogres or other stuff nowadays. Plus I heard stone giants can spawn in Orc, and I have met warlords and saint roka there myself. So seriously, be careful in there. Orc is very random. Lair is much more predictable, so do that first.

KoBe is pretty fun, and really strong once you get the hang of when to use what abilities. Especially you need to learn when to berserk and when not to berserk, and you must never forget that you have brothers in arms. When in doubt, BiA. Trog's Hand helps against casters and when your HP are getting low. Wear light armor. Probably switch to maces to use a demon whip eventually, but short blades work fine too (berserk lets them do good damage, and they're fast, and you will probably be gifted a nice quickblade or sabre long before you get a demon whip).

[cort]

Thanks again for all the advice everyone. I got my KoBe to level 13. I even found the lair (I thought the sewers were the swamps). I made it to the 8th level of the lair and forgot to switch to my quick blade from my saber before fighting a 6 headed hydra.

The 17 headed hydra killed me

However I had 31,000 points which is 23k more than I've ever had before.

It was interesting in that I had not found a decent weapon (was using a +3,+2) short sword until I was about level 10 and Trog gifted me a +5,+4 quick blade. I still had not found any decent armor (was wearing +2 leather). And then Trog gifted me a saber of protection (which led to me drying by the hydra). Even without good equipment the KoBe was very tough. Berzerk, Trogg's hand and Brothers in Arms can keep you going a very long while and food was never an issue.

So, thanks again all.

[Galefury]

That +5/+4 quickblade was one of the best early gifts you could realistically hope for. Unfortunately not branded, but still awesome for a level 10 KoBe. Definitely better than a saber of protection against most things, especially when zerking.

[Ququman]

Noob in Arms here ! (or Brother in Noobiness ?)
I'd like to concur (is it the right word for this I wonder ?) : Mountain Dwarves, powerhouse or not, seem hard to play imo. I mean they're so slow, it's very hard to flee
Also, I think that in some way casters are easier than melee characters. It might just be me, but I have had more success with casters than melee chars.
Like Conjurer (ice) for example, or Ice elementalist (deep elf ofc), gotta love Mephitic Cloud.

This might be worth a try ?

[Galefury]

Deep Elves are generally not easy to play. Try a Naga for some fun casting, being slow makes the game play very differently. They have great apts to compensate. Go Cheibriados for bonus points. NaIE of Chei is actually not hard, you can cast Freezing Cloud really early and kill everything with that, plus early high powered Throw Icicle is really good. Good melee capabilities too, stat boosts make everything better. It's not easy either because you cant run away, but it's definitely interesting to play.

If you want an easy caster you could do Merfolk Ice Elementalist of whatever (bad Conjurations apt, but that really doesn't matter much, play as a hybrid with onehanded polearms, maybe use Sif Muna for a good chance to get refrigeration, but many gods will work well), Deep Dwarf Earth Elementalist of Makhleb (haven't played this one, but its supposed to be easy in 0.8 because lots of earth spells got buffed and DD is really strong in general, probably will be my next char), Merfolk Transmuter of whatever (a real badass, use unarmed combat instead of polearms unless you find a really really good one, almost every god is awesome for this one) or HEAE of whatever (AE has great utility and offense, so really everything you need, bolt bouncing is fun, maybe use Vehumet). Also Wizards have a fairly easy early game, but you're screwed if you don't find a good book soon. Conjurer(ice) is also very nice.

[asdu]

Deep Elves are generally not easy to play. Try a Naga for some fun casting, being slow makes the game play very differently.

Personally, I find DE pretty easy. Low HP really olnly becomes a seriously liability in the late game, when thing that hit hard from afar start appearing, but in the early game they can deal with pretty much anything with sheer blasting power (and/or mephitic cloud ), especially since their excellent magic aptitudes allow them to upgrade their spells much earlier than any other race would be able to (as long as they find the books).
Nagas' slow speed, on the other hand, is a serious disadvantage until you get your hands on Swiftness, Spider Form, cTele and the like. Granted, they have many more HP than Deep Elves, but they'll find themselves losing said HP more often than a race with normal movement speed.

Deep Dwarf Earth Elementalist of Makhleb (haven't played this one, but its supposed to be easy in 0.8 because lots of earth spells got buffed and DD is really strong in general, probably will be my next char)

Ugh. I've tried this recently (actually, it was DDEE of Elyvilon, which also meant constant near-starvation), and I have to say I thoroughly hated it. Earth is still definitely the weakest elemental school. Not too tough early game, and LRD is a fun spell, but Earth magic's lack of versatility (in the damage-dealing department, apart from LRD, it's all about high-damage, short-ranged, single-target nukes) and the fact it makes it even harder to train Air (sinergy with Charms, cloud spells) make it painful and, IMO, dull later on. But the biggest letdown is when you finally manage to get Shatter castable and you realize it's completely useless against flying monsters, and it just so happens that a great deal of the scary stuff can also fly. Maybe I didn't quite "get" what EE's are about, but i'd advice a budding young Earth elementalist to branch out into Ice magic as soon as he finds a relevant book

[Galefury]

I'm currently playing DDEE of Makh, and it has been pretty easy so far. I only just beat Lair:8, so late game being dull or hard can still happen, but so far this guy plays pretty cool. Blast some dudes, whack some dudes, summon some demons, blow up the dungeon. Fun activities for the whole family.

Also I'm not planning to take this guy into extended, so scary flyers won't be too relevant I think.