Stabber Gear?

[cloud4ge]

I started a DsGl of Okawaru, and I found a +5 heavily runed leather armor and +1 dagger of draining on D:4.

Is this gear worth starting up a stabber with? What does a late game stabber even look like gearwise? Are Ds mutations suitable for it?

Alternatively, I could just use this supped-up leather armor until I find a heavy armor that beats it.
Though, I'm not sure the draining brand is worth switching from staves to short blades.

[Wahaha]

Stabber gear is an item that gives invis or the spell and any dagger (brand and + doesn't really matter). Any character can start stabbing with a little skill training when they get invis, it depends if you want to play that way.

If you don't want to stab (and you don't if you don't have invis yet) then a quarterstaff is better than a dagger of draining and a lot more so if you're with Okawaru because you can get a lajatang.

A heavy armor is not necessarily the best thing for DsGl.

[mopl]

a +5 heavily runed leather armor.

I'm not sure to understand what you're saying...

[daggaz]

Invis is just one way to stab. Confusion, paralysis, and just plain stealthiness are others. The armour is a very nice find for the early game (normal ac bonus on leather is 3, im assuming this is some randart?), but you would end up switching it out eventually for either higher ac dragon armour or some randart with decent egos. The weapon is nothing special, and as mentioned, you dont need anything special to stab, all daggers get a great damage bonus.

Theres no real reason to switch over here, but no real reason not to, either. Just keep in mind that small blade damage is pitifully weak if you aren't stabbing, and it takes a lot of player skill to survive in this latter case. Long blades cross train conveniently with short blades, but thats something to think about in the midgame.

[cloud4ge]

Invis is just one way to stab. Confusion, paralysis, and just plain stealthiness are others. The armour is a very nice find for the early game (normal ac bonus on leather is 3, im assuming this is some randart?), but you would end up switching it out eventually for either higher ac dragon armour or some randart with decent egos. The weapon is nothing special, and as mentioned, you dont need anything special to stab, all daggers get a great damage bonus.

Theres no real reason to switch over here, but no real reason not to, either. Just keep in mind that small blade damage is pitifully weak if you aren't stabbing, and it takes a lot of player skill to survive in this latter case. Long blades cross train conveniently with short blades, but thats something to think about in the midgame.

I was thinking about that since last game I was easily tabbing my way to three runes with a GrGl using a demon blade. That is until I mindlessly traveled through a wall in the Slime Pit, killing myself in the goo (distracted, tired, and feeling invincible). It was a real shame. +9 demon blade of flaming, +10 full plate of rF, +2 boots of running, +2 cape rP, +2 Helm of Int, +2 gloves of archery, +5 Shield mR++ rN+, +6 ring of evasion, +4 ring dex, amulet of resist mutation ... Since then, I'm addicted to Gl of Oka. I can't stand Berserker.. I started playing this game a couple weeks ago after watching zoopy joobles play ice elementalist on youtube. It's pretty great as long as I can get throw icicle up and running.

[Jarlyk]

One nice thing with stabbing is that it's not a huge XP investment, so you can easily use it for a bit then transition to something else depending on books, mutations, items, etc. The fun part of Ds (for me anyway) is adapting to the mutations you get, which might mean going unarmed if you get really early Claws 2/3, taking advantage of Stealth if you get the stealth mutations, etc. Note that even if you're not stabbing, Stealth can still be pretty useful, as it helps you pick and choose your fights. Light armour also makes it pretty easy to get spells online, which can free up XP for general utility skills like Fighting, Dodging, Evocations, etc.

[daggaz]

KoAs of Oka is a pretty solid stabber that forces you to learn either to use more consumable options in the early game thanks to your low hps, or to use your stealth to real advantage. On the other hand, you level up stupid fast, as well your apts are really high for important things which makes it more forgiving if you want to play around with skills. Ash is a great god, too, tho if you want to switch weapons much you cant really curse that slot, and you will learn quickly how great needles can be with an assassin.

[Berder]

The bottom line is that stabbing (whether through invisibility, stealth, or hexes) is a helpful alternative way to kill things, but it doesn't work on everything and it doesn't work all the time. Unless you're trying to sneak through the entire dungeon like a speedy ninja, which is dangerous, you'll still need ways to actually fight without stabbing.
Some options a stabber can use to fight when he can't stab:
- Magic. For example, if you can cast orb of destruction, iron shot, or shadow creatures, that's sufficient to get by.
- Focus on short blades melee. If you choose this you will want a quick blade of electrocution, antimagic, or distortion (e.g.via the warp weapon spell) if possible.
- Focus on long blades melee and get short blades through cross training. Or even focus on some other melee weapon. This is perhaps the most straightforward option.

[damiac]

You missed one big option: Chaos weapons. Chaos weapons can confuse and/or paralyze even magic immune enemies, making them stabbable. A chaos dagger is a great utility for a stabber.