Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?


Ask fellow adventurers how to stay alive in the deep, dark, dangerous dungeon below, or share your own accumulated wisdom.

Halls Hopper

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 04:57

Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Just grabbed this rouge like and have to say it's mostly impossible to play at the current settings. I have looked every where and can not find where to set the difficulty setting. The search on this forum is very weak so all i got was bogus results. Where do you choose how hard the enemy's are. Right now it is so bad I can't even get thru the tutorials. I have a handful of characters with 0 to 2 points total before being killed, and most of these where in the first room. There is something very wrong that fighters can hardly ever hit and mages can't cast spells correctly.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 05:04

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

The only difficulty settings available in crawl are which race and class you choose. If you want some suggestions you could give some information about what kind of character you would like to play and I'm sure people here would provide.

Swamp Slogger

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 05:08

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Yes, Crawl is very hard. Play a Minotaur Fighter. And don't rush at the enemy. When you see one, back up and fight it 10 spaces from where you met it. In a corridor, ideally, so you only fight them one at a time.

Try that. You'll make it through D1.

Good luck.
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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 05:21

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart Jedi wrote:Just grabbed this rouge like and have to say it's mostly impossible to play at the current settings. I have looked every where and can not find where to set the difficulty setting. The search on this forum is very weak so all i got was bogus results. Where do you choose how hard the enemy's are. Right now it is so bad I can't even get thru the tutorials. I have a handful of characters with 0 to 2 points total before being killed, and most of these where in the first room. There is something very wrong that fighters can hardly ever hit and mages can't cast spells correctly.


1) The difficulty setting is what race and background you choose. That's it. For an easier win play Minotaur Berserkers until you've got a 3 rune win, then play whatever.
2) The REAL way you adjust the game's 'difficulty setting' is by playing better and smarter. You can win this game even if you have no idea what you're doing, but if you want a win rate higher than 0.1% you need proper tactics and heuristics. When you have some time read viewtopic.php?f=5&t=12062&p=168975 and viewtopic.php?f=12&t=7699
3) By the way - Crawl is not 'unfair'. It is unforgiving of mistakes, but it is not unfair. Effective win rates of 95%+ are possible, possibly even higher. After the first few floors of the dungeon unwinnable situations (no prior player action could have averted it) are almost completely gone.
4) By the way x2 - Crawl's combat is VERY swingy and every single roll in the game can go horribly in favour of the enemies and against the favour of your HP. It starts with fighters that miss and mages that miscast and continues with monster melee and conjurations that have incredibly high maximum damage hits. Yet you can win almost every game (95%+) of Crawl through discretion, figuring out what your escape/panic options are, backing away from monsters so you fight one on one whenever possible, and using them early. If you ever think 'just one more hit and the enemy will be dead', you will miss or roll 0 damage, so don't fall into the trap of thinking combat in Crawl is predictable/consistent.

Good luck & enjoy Crawl!

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 12:51

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Which game type are you playing? The normal game starts with mostly stuff like rats and cockroaches on the first level, with only a few of the tougher adders, kobolds, or hobgoblins on the first level. Mashing the arrow keys should get you through the first few levels most of the time, even though that's not a good plan for the long term. If 'most' of your characters are getting killed in the first room, you might be playing one of the other game modes. 'Dungeon Sprint' is a one-level game that uses the same game engine but works more as a puzzle game than a dungeon crawler, and if you're starting a game of that you aren't going to get a representative experience.

Halls Hopper

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 20:21

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

If I am dieing before finishing the tutorials isn't something wrong?

I have been trying draconian melee and magic types. I load the normal "Dungeon Crawl" and get attacked by a hobgoblin and one or move jackals instantly. There is no way to flee, other than leaving the dungeon, as I'm in the starting room and enemy's are between me and the door.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 20:24

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Melee and magic types isn't very specific. What background are you? If you are using a mage background, do you know how to cast spells? If you have a melee background, you should be able to "walk into" a mob to attack it, and if you have a decent starting weapon, that should be pretty effective.

That said, hobgoblins and jackals can and do kill D:1 characters, although it shouldn't happen repeatedly.

Barkeep

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 20:36

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Uh, for the tutorial, fight the ooze instead of the wyvern. Go back to the corridors when rats are following you so you only fight one at a time. I have no idea how you could die to training dummies.

For the regular game: A jackal pack right at the start in an open room in which three or four of the jackals all see you and there are no corridors nearby—or a similar such situation—can be a guaranteed death. On the plus side, those starts are rare, and you've only dedicated about 30 seconds to the character, so that's only a concern if you are going for win streaks.

You should almost never move toward an enemy upon first seeing it.

Early on, pick up stones, darts, tomahawks, and the like and throw them at enemies as they approach. Throughout the game, stones/darts can still be useful to draw the attention of enemies and lure them away one at a time.

How you move controls how enemies move, since the movement AI of nearly all enemies is basically the same and pretty simple, so you should focus on learning how to position yourself to minimize the number of enemies attacking you. Corridors and various dungeon features (like doors) can be very useful here.

Spectate other players on Webtiles, there are links under "Playing Online" from the main site.

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Swamp Slogger

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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 20:46

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart Jedi wrote:If I am dieing before finishing the tutorials isn't something wrong?

No. One of the most important lessons to learn in Crawl is: get used to dying.

I have been trying draconian melee and magic types. I load the normal "Dungeon Crawl" and get attacked by a hobgoblin and one or move jackals instantly. There is no way to flee, other than leaving the dungeon, as I'm in the starting room and enemy's are between me and the door.

A minotaur fighter can and will kill both of those guys with just the tab key.

Seriously. Try one. Use o to move around. When you see a bad guy, back into a corridor and fight. When you get hurt hit 5 until you are fully healed. Hit o to move around some more. You will clear D1 doing just that, in three tries or less.
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Post Tuesday, 29th July 2014, 23:37

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart Jedi wrote:If I am dieing before finishing the tutorials isn't something wrong?

Crawl isn't the only roguelike where you can die in the tutorial (I can also think of Sil's tutorial, great game btw)

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 30th July 2014, 00:15

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I was able to get past the dragons in POWDER's tutorial by startscumming it until it generated a wand of polymorph.

Halls Hopper

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 01:47

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I just can't figure out what to do with this. I have tried minotaurs, orcs, dwarfs, humans, elfs with fighters, gladiators, and berserker. They all mostly die on levels 1 or 2 to hordes of enemy's. I have tried to run away bu t just killed from behind. Have tried to heal with hitting 5 but damage is done faster so that is just another way to die. The berserker seams impossible to play as there isn't enough food to find.

I have had the best luck with magic using types as they have good stand off attack, but not much better. Always end up going around a corner, or down stairs, and find something that i can't kill before it gets close. Can't escape it so death is certainly close at hand.
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Swamp Slogger

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 03:15

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Sounds like you are moving towards enemies when you are a fighter. And fighting in the open. As I said above, when you see an enemy, move back into a corridor so you fight them one at a time. After you kill them use 5 to rest and heal to full. Then explore more.

Go here: https://crawl.s-z.org/#lobby

And pick one of the folks playing a low level fighter and watch what they do. Odds are you will find someone decent and you can learn by watching how they play. You don't even need to sign in to watch.
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Barkeep

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 03:21

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart: Part of running away is knowing what you can run away from. If you're playing a MiBe, you can't run away from bees, jackals, or centaurs, among several other monsters. You can use the e(x)amine menu (hit x, move the cursor to an enemy, hit v) to learn more about enemies, including whether or not it's faster than you.

All hitting 5 does is "rest until interrupted or 100 turns have passed, whichever comes first" You can't use 5 to heal in the middle of battle; use it when there are no enemies present and none are likely to come tearing after you around the corner.

There's plenty of food, it's just hiding in your enemies' bodies. Hit "c" when standing over an enemy's corpse to butcher it. If it has meat you can eat, it will automatically be added to your inventory (as long as you have room). Berserkers should only be using their abilities when it's actually needed, but there's a huge amount of food in the game; you can afford to use berserk a lot more often than you need to and still have more than enough food.

Otherwise, I agree with blink. On CSZO, you can sort games by XL; pick somebody playing a low-level character and watch how they navigate the opening floors.

Slime Squisher

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 03:34

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Is there any real difference in trunk builds on akrasiac vs c-z? Or just the experimental branches?
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Barkeep

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 03:35

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

cerealjynx wrote:Is there any real difference in trunk builds on akrasiac vs c-z? Or just the experimental branches?

IIRC, each server updates on its own schedule, but CSZO and CAO both seem like they're equally up-to-date most of the time as far as Trunk goes.

Halls Hopper

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 20:23

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Just tried a Minotaur Berserker and got killed in the first room again. Started in a U shaped room with me at the bottom of the room and all the enemy's at the top. Before I could move tree spaces there was an ooze, a bat, a kobold, a rat, and two goblins in the open end of the room. Couldn't move around them, and just died quick since can't hit with weapons. What the bloody hell should I do?
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Sar

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 20:26

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Play online and ask somebody to watch, or ask somebody to run a demo game for you.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Thursday, 31st July 2014, 22:10

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart Jedi wrote:Just tried a Minotaur Berserker and got killed in the first room again. Started in a U shaped room with me at the bottom of the room and all the enemy's at the top. Before I could move tree spaces there was an ooze, a bat, a kobold, a rat, and two goblins in the open end of the room. Couldn't move around them, and just died quick since can't hit with weapons. What the bloody hell should I do?


The game comes with a tutorial.
The tutorial has been qualified by multiple groups of Quality Assurance trainees.
Try playing it first.

Then when you play, use the "tab" key when monsters are visible, and the 'o' key to explore when they are not visible.
Use the 5 key when they are not visible and you are hurt.
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Pandemonium Purger

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Post Friday, 1st August 2014, 00:28

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart Jedi wrote:I just can't figure out what to do with this. I have tried minotaurs, orcs, dwarfs, humans, elfs with fighters, gladiators, and berserker. They all mostly die on levels 1 or 2 to hordes of enemy's. I have tried to run away bu t just killed from behind.

When you run away, are you running into unexplored/uncleared territory?
If so, stop doing that and all your problems are solved.

Also, seconding
Play online and ask somebody to watch, or ask somebody to run a demo game for you.

A lot of people would be willing to help, myself included.

Swamp Slogger

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Post Friday, 1st August 2014, 02:00

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Sar wrote:Play online and ask somebody to watch, or ask somebody to run a demo game for you.


Sar is right. Most folks on the servers are pretty friendly. Just pop in, be civil, and ask for a intro run. I'm on CSZO and CBRO these days. Under Blink. If you see me there, pop in and let me know you want me to watch you do a starter run. I'll be glad to help.

Halls Hopper

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Post Friday, 1st August 2014, 05:24

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I must be getting a buggered version or something, but mine shows as 0.14.1, and have downloaded it twice.

I have looked everywhere in it and find no mention of online gaming, online connection, or any way to view a game (in progress or finished). There is no game mode for online and I find no way to set up connection protocols. I tried to search here for help about "online" but all it got was an errors.
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Pandemonium Purger

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Post Friday, 1st August 2014, 05:34

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart Jedi wrote:I must be getting a buggered version or something, but mine shows as 0.14.1, and have downloaded it twice.

I have looked everywhere in it and find no mention of online gaming, online connection, or any way to view a game (in progress or finished). There is no game mode for online and I find no way to set up connection protocols. I tried to search here for help about "online" but all it got was an errors.

The local and online versions of Crawl are different.
http://crawl.s-z.org/#lobby <-- go here
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Tomb Titivator

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Post Saturday, 23rd August 2014, 19:08

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I am 99% sure you are all getting trolled. He said he was resting in combat.

Crypt Cleanser

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Post Saturday, 23rd August 2014, 21:48

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

snow wrote:I am 99% sure you are all getting trolled. He said he was resting in combat.

I don't see where he said that. Also, even if he did say it, he simply may have made a grammatical misstatement, since there are a few other such common mistakes in his posts.
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Tomb Titivator

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Post Saturday, 23rd August 2014, 22:12

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

He can't be a troll, those have a really easy time with the early game.
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Shoals Surfer

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Post Saturday, 23rd August 2014, 22:36

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

try a gargoyle fighter/zerker

gargoyles have natural armor and poison immunity
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Blades Runner

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Post Sunday, 24th August 2014, 18:52

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I'm just curious about the significance of Lawndart's signature since he did not come back and tell you guys whether he succeeded in getting past 1st-2nd levels. I am assuming that it means he did figure out, found the rest of the game astoundingly easy as a MiFi and is now experimenting with ways to make himself miserable as a NaFi of Chei.
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Pandemonium Purger

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Post Monday, 25th August 2014, 01:16

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Hopeless wrote:I'm just curious about the significance of Lawndart's signature since he did not come back and tell you guys whether he succeeded in getting past 1st-2nd levels. I am assuming that it means he did figure out, found the rest of the game astoundingly easy as a MiFi and is now experimenting with ways to make himself miserable as a NaFi of Chei.

We're really missing out if he doesn't play online :'(

Halls Hopper

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Post Tuesday, 26th August 2014, 20:19

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

He won a MiFi of Oka, here's the YAVP: viewtopic.php?f=12&t=13464&p=187436

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 07:04

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Hopeless wrote:I'm just curious about the significance of Lawndart's signature since he did not come back and tell you guys whether he succeeded in getting past 1st-2nd levels. I am assuming that it means he did figure out, found the rest of the game astoundingly easy as a MiFi and is now experimenting with ways to make himself miserable as a NaFi of Chei.

You mean enjoying a leisurely stroll in the land of the overpowered death wrecking snake ball of doom? Because I'm fairly sure that's the strongest combo the game has ;)
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Blades Runner

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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 14:37

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

tasonir wrote:
Hopeless wrote:I'm just curious about the significance of Lawndart's signature since he did not come back and tell you guys whether he succeeded in getting past 1st-2nd levels. I am assuming that it means he did figure out, found the rest of the game astoundingly easy as a MiFi and is now experimenting with ways to make himself miserable as a NaFi of Chei.

You mean enjoying a leisurely stroll in the land of the overpowered death wrecking snake ball of doom? Because I'm fairly sure that's the strongest combo the game has ;)


It certain is powerful until you find yourself out of options. Mainly my problems with it have stemmed from over-use of slouch. Getting that piety back is killer. I haven't been playing the last 3 months or so because I have been busy with other games and taking a break but I do think about my prior games a lot. I am not as gung ho for NaXX^Chei after losing a bunch of times with it. DrXX^Chei strung me a long for a while too.

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 14:59

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

why are you replying seriously to tasonir praising Cheinagas

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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 15:29

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I think something everyone forgets about me and chei nagas is that I played chei nagas in .10, which meant level 1 constriction, and I believe that was also before constriction was nerfed. And constriction damage is based on strength. If you can tolerate losing all the nice changes over the last 5 versions, try a .10 chei naga. It was nerfed for a reason. Nowadays, the early game is much more tricky. You're still very strong in the end, but the early game sucks.

One of my favorite anecdotes about this is mikee's streak of 22 wins: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/players/mikee.html

Look at his DECj win - it's version .11. The next game, he plays NaTm. What version? Mysteriously downgraded to .10. Next game with a VpSu is back to .11. Mikee is not a fool :)

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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 16:45

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

This thread reminded me that I forgot to play NaFi of Chei to see how bad the combo really is. Thanks, I will play it next ;)
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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 22:53

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Sar wrote:why are you replying seriously to tasonir praising Cheinagas

I think Tasonir praising Chei Nagas isn't unpredictable however I wasn't entirely in disagreement with his statement Sar so I felt the need to say so while pointing out how trappy the combo is. And yeah its mostly early game problems but when does early game stop being early and just start being all game? I had lots of trouble past early vaults with Nagas of Chei. Had several die in Zot, and generally had awful luck whilst playing them which I put down to the RNG disagreeing with my choice of combo. (Naga barding exists?? Yes it does I have seen it in every non-naga game I have played.)

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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 23:13

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I usually get naga barding from acquirement so yes, they are very rare while also very important. Too luck-dependent and thus bad IMHO.

Sar

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Thursday, 28th August 2014, 23:26

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

They're extremely good items so I think it's OK if they're rare; I've won 24 Nagas so far and each of them had a barding (and most didn't go farther than 3 runes). I almost always use my first acquirement on armour when I play a Naga, though; I value barding AC a lot.

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Post Friday, 29th August 2014, 00:14

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Somehow this thread has gotten way off track. Think its time to be locked and/or archived.

My first post was almost a month before my win and I have learned a lot since then. I found a lot of online resources are available to explain how game play works. The biggest piece of of the puzzle was learning that it is mostly random, and even the best players can have a lot of characters die in first couple of floors.

snow wrote:I am 99% sure you are all getting trolled. He said he was resting in combat.

When I first went thru the manual I read that you heal when resting, so I was trying to say alive. Didn't work of course.
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Post Friday, 29th August 2014, 00:40

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Lawndart Jedi wrote:Somehow this thread has gotten way off track. Think its time to be locked and/or archived.

My first post was almost a month before my win and I have learned a lot since then. I found a lot of online resources are available to explain how game play works. The biggest piece of of the puzzle was learning that it is mostly random, and even the best players can have a lot of characters die in first couple of floors.

It's random, but not insanely random. The best players can win 95% of the characters they start (when they're playing to optimize win rate)

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Post Tuesday, 2nd September 2014, 16:40

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Patashu wrote:The best players can win 95% of the characters they start (when they're playing to optimize win rate)


Is there data to back up this claim? And does playing to optimize win rate meaning playing the easiest possible combo, or 95% of any viable start? Or can these 'best players' even win 95% of games started as a OgAE?

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Post Tuesday, 2nd September 2014, 16:43

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

I believe the best players can win 95% games with every possible combo except xxCK.

<offtopic>What's so bad with OgAE?</offtopic>

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Post Tuesday, 2nd September 2014, 18:13

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

damiac wrote:
Patashu wrote:The best players can win 95% of the characters they start (when they're playing to optimize win rate)


Is there data to back up this claim? And does playing to optimize win rate meaning playing the easiest possible combo, or 95% of any viable start? Or can these 'best players' even win 95% of games started as a OgAE?
http://crawl.akrasiac.org/scoring/streaks.html

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Joined: Friday, 8th November 2013, 17:02

Post Wednesday, 3rd September 2014, 16:49

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

So, if you take a snapshot of the best players at their best, and discount all their other games, they have a win rate of 100%. OK, that's true of any player with any win ever.

I'm not doubting really good players can win the majority of games they play, I am just curious where this 95% number is coming from? Because the link Duvessa gave doesn't have anything to do with overall win rates.

What I see is that one time, some players managed to have a 95% win rate across about 20 games. Impressive, sure, but it's pretty silly to extrapolate that and claim those players are good enough to maintain such a win rate.

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 11111

Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Wednesday, 3rd September 2014, 17:06

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

damiac wrote:Impressive, sure, but it's pretty silly to extrapolate that and claim those players are good enough to maintain such a win rate.


Optimal play is really tedious: manual exploration, stones throwing, 10+ tiles retreat before fighting any monster, pillar dancing for HP/MP regeneration/first attack, frequent changing of trained skills, stash management (before 0.15) etc.
So I believe those players are good enough, they just don't want to play this way without getting paid ;), they want to have fun.

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 8778

Joined: Sunday, 5th May 2013, 08:25

Post Wednesday, 3rd September 2014, 20:34

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

damiac wrote:So, if you take a snapshot of the best players at their best, and discount all their other games, they have a win rate of 100%. OK, that's true of any player with any win ever.

I'm not doubting really good players can win the majority of games they play, I am just curious where this 95% number is coming from? Because the link Duvessa gave doesn't have anything to do with overall win rates.

What I see is that one time, some players managed to have a 95% win rate across about 20 games. Impressive, sure, but it's pretty silly to extrapolate that and claim those players are good enough to maintain such a win rate.
Well what would convince you? Do you just want an account with a >95% winrate? Because I can give you dozens of those.
The point of linking to the streaks page is to show that it is easy to win Crawl very consistently, not to specify a certain win rate.

Crypt Cleanser

Posts: 723

Joined: Monday, 9th June 2014, 13:39

Post Wednesday, 3rd September 2014, 21:38

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Perhaps by selectively choosing starting combos that are stronger, yes. But the rng plays a large role in the success of characters starting out squishy. Starting with no weapon is also a bit ridiculous. Take this image as a typical example of a start. What would you do to make sure the character does not die? Because this is always a fatal start for this character when I try to play it, not matter how I approach the problem (and I've had many opportunities).

Image

  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup version 0.15.0-13-gb296d5c (webtiles) character file.

0 Aule the Magician (level 1, -1/10 HPs)
             Began as a Deep Elf Wizard on Sept 3, 2014.
             Slain by a jackal (2 damage)
             ... on Level 1 of the Dungeon.
             The game lasted 00:00:59 (25 turns).

Aule the Magician (Deep Elf Wizard)                   Turns: 25, Time: 00:01:00

HP  -1/10        AC  2     Str  4      XL: 1   Next:  0%
MP   1/6         EV 12     Int 22      God:
Gold 0           SH  0     Dex 13      Spells:  1 memorised,  7 levels left

rFire  . . .     SeeInvis .     (no weapon)
rCold  . . .     Clarity  .     a - +0 robe
rNeg   . . .     rCorr    .     (no shield)
rPois  .         rRot     .     b - +0 hat
rElec  .         Spirit   .     (no cloak)
SustAb .         Warding  .     (no gloves)
rMut   .         Stasis   .     (no boots)
Gourm  .                        (no amulet)
MR     .....                    (no ring)
                                (no ring)

@: very slightly contaminated, not resistant to hostile enchantments, unstealthy
A: no striking features
a: no special abilities


You were on level 1 of the Dungeon.
You were not hungry.

You visited 1 branch of the dungeon, and saw 1 of its levels.

Inventory:

Missiles
 e - 12 stones (quivered)
Armour
 a - a +0 robe (worn)
 b - a +0 hat (worn)
Comestibles
 d - a bread ration
Books
 c - a book of Minor Magic   
   
   Spells                             Type                      Level
   *Magic Dart                        Conjuration                  1
   Blink                              Translocation                2
   Call Imp                           Summoning                    2
   Repel Missiles                     Charms/Air                   2
   Slow                               Hexes                        2
   Conjure Flame                      Conjuration/Fire             3
   Mephitic Cloud                     Conjuration/Poison/Air       3


   Skills:
 + Level 2.4 Dodging
 + Level 2.4 Stealth
 + Level 4.4 Spellcasting
 + Level 1.1 Conjurations
   Level 1.1 Summonings
   Level 1.1 Translocations


You had 7 spell levels left.
You knew the following spells:

 Your Spells              Type           Power        Failure   Level  Hunger
a - Magic Dart            Conj           #...         10%         1    None


Dungeon Overview and Level Annotations

Branches:
Dungeon (1/15)           

Altars:

Message History

* * * LOW HITPOINT WARNING * * *
Casting: Magic Dart
Confirm with . or Enter, or press ? or * to list all spells.
You don't have enough magic to cast that spell.
Throwing (i - inventory): e - 19 stones (quivered)
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - jackal
Aim: a jackal (heavily wounded)
You throw a stone. The stone closely misses the jackal.
The jackal barely misses you.
Throwing (i - inventory): e - 18 stones (quivered)
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - jackal
Aim: a jackal (heavily wounded)
You throw a stone. The stone barely misses the jackal.
The jackal barely misses you.
The jackal bites you but does no damage.
Throwing (i - inventory): e - 17 stones (quivered)
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - jackal
Aim: a jackal (heavily wounded)
You throw a stone. The stone barely misses the jackal.
The jackal barely misses you.
Throwing (i - inventory): e - 16 stones (quivered)
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - jackal
Aim: a jackal (heavily wounded)
You throw a stone.
The stone hits the jackal but does no damage.
The jackal is heavily wounded.
The jackal bites you.
* * * LOW HITPOINT WARNING * * *
Throwing (i - inventory): e - 15 stones (quivered)
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - jackal
Aim: a jackal (heavily wounded)
You throw a stone. The stone closely misses the jackal.
The jackal closely misses you. x2
Throwing (i - inventory): e - 14 stones (quivered)
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - jackal
Aim: a jackal (heavily wounded)
You throw a stone.
The stone hits the jackal but does no damage.
The jackal is heavily wounded.
The jackal bites you but does no damage.
Throwing (i - inventory): e - 13 stones (quivered)
Press: ? - help, Shift-Dir - straight line, f/p - jackal
Aim: a jackal (heavily wounded)
You throw a stone.
The stone hits the jackal but does no damage.
The jackal is heavily wounded.
The jackal bites you.
* * * LOW HITPOINT WARNING * * *
The jackal bites you.
You die...

    ######
    #.<..#
    #....#
    #....#
    #@h.(#
    ##++##
    .......
  .......###
#hh....#.#
 ......#.#
 ......#..
  .....##.#
     ?.#


You could see a jackal.


Notes
Turn   | Place    | Note
--------------------------------------------------------------
     0 | D:1      | Aule, the Deep Elf Wizard, began the quest for the Orb.
     0 | D:1      | Reached XP level 1. HP: 10/10 MP: 6/6
    25 | D:1      | Slain by a jackal


Action                   || total
-------------------------++-------
Throw: Stone             ||     7
 Cast: Magic Dart        ||     5

Tomb Titivator

Posts: 909

Joined: Thursday, 3rd January 2013, 20:32

Post Wednesday, 3rd September 2014, 22:20

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

close door, press 5 a few times, open door, repeat if necessary
Wins (Does not include my GrEE^Veh 15-runer...stupid experimental branch)

For this message the author tedric has received thanks: 3
Arrhythmia, duvessa, Lasty

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 3037

Joined: Sunday, 2nd January 2011, 02:06

Post Wednesday, 3rd September 2014, 22:22

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

damiac wrote:Or can these 'best players' even win 95% of games started as a OgAE?


Pick up the first club you see, go Trog when you find the altar.

Aule wrote:Take this image as a typical example of a start. What would you do to make sure the character does not die? Because this is always a fatal start for this character when I try to play it, not matter how I approach the problem (and I've had many opportunities).


Shut the door. Mash 5 a couple times to allow a couple hundred turns to pass. Open the door from the northwest. The two wandering jackals will have moved randomly and will probably be out of line-of-sight, and the one that noticed you will probably have failed one of its tracking checks while you were out of sight and may have wandered off too. It is very likely that you can now clear the immediate area and then start hunting down the wandering jackals. If not, then just shut the door again and repeat the process.

Eh, ninjaed. Not going to delete it now.

Crypt Cleanser

Posts: 723

Joined: Monday, 9th June 2014, 13:39

Post Wednesday, 3rd September 2014, 23:11

Re: Dieing in first room - Difficulty setting?

Well, if you examine the morgue, you'll see that I took on only one, and after emptying MP with dart and throwing stones until his last breath, he could not kill the lone jackal. Any other suggestions?
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