How to get good weapon as DD of Makhleb?

[arandomperson12]

You cannot guarantee a executioner's axe of holy wrath/antimagic, as Makhleb does not give/brand weapons for you. Likely, you will have to use a freezing battleaxe or some other unoptimal weapon.

[Sar]

A good battleaxe is good enough. If you get a scroll of acquirement early though, you might want to try wishing for a weapon.

[Airwolf]

It's optimal to keep using the starting hand/war axe until an exec axe drops.

[dowan]

It's optimal to keep using the starting hand/war axe until an exec axe drops.

This isn't true... I wasn't sure if you were joking or something, but I want to make it clear this is not true.

You get a good weapon like most everyone else, you find it on the floor, buy it in a shop, or use an acquirement scroll. A good weapon for a DD is probably a battleaxe like Sar said. A broad axe is also good, and you can use a shield. An exec axe is quite expensive to get good at skillwise, but they are good once you finally have enough skill.

Generally, your desired endgame weapon as a DD will be a battleaxe/broad axe though. So when you find one, use your EA scrolls on it, when you find branding, if you don't already have a good branded one, use it.
Holy wrath and antimagic are pretty bad brands for most of the 3 rune game. A battleaxe of freezing/flaming/vorpal/elec are good weapons, a vampiric one is obviously awesome, especially for a DD, but don't count on getting one.

[arandomperson12]

I am talking about all runes.

[Shtopit]

If you are into two handed, I often find a hostile executioner's axe in the Hall of Blades.

[dowan]

Nothing wrong with a battleaxe of freezing for extended either. But in extended you'll probably find enough EA scrolls to enchant up an exec axe anyway, if you are so inclined.

[Sar]

I am talking about all runes.

Battleaxe works for all runes too.

[Magipi]

Before you go into extended, you have access to no less than 4 areas of plentiful loot (Vaults, Slime, Elf, Crypt).

[arandomperson12]

If you are into two handed, I often find a hostile executioner's axe in the Hall of Blades.

But it often has a bad brand, and getting a good brand with scrolls of brand weapon is not guaranteed.

Before you go into extended, you have access to no less than 4 areas of plentiful loot (Vaults, Slime, Elf, Crypt).

I never really saw the loot in those areas as being particularly good. Nearly all of it is useless junk (stones, sling bullets), stuff you already have enough of (scrolls of remove curse), weapons/spellbooks that you are not skilled for, food, evocables that could be helpful but are usually not worth a inventory slot (sack of spiders, box of beasts) and coins (mostly useless in the late game).

[dowan]

What "good brand" are you even looking for? Anti-magic? Vorpal, freezing, flaming, and elec are all great brands for extended, and everywhere else.

If you absolutely must have the best brand for extended, why not drop Makhleb and change to TSO? Then you can have your HW axe, along with heal on kills for most everything you'll encounter in extended. Or, if you for some reason insist on clearing extended with mahkleb, join TSO, kill crypt for piety, HW your weapon, change back to Makhleb. It's a bad idea, but it's the only way to guarantee a HW weapon for extended with mahkleb.

[Magipi]

If you plan to do extended, I do not recommend DD. Torment is extra annoying with DD, and Tomb (which has an extreme torment density) will make you want to abandon the project.

Pick some good, strong non_DD character, like Mi, HO, Gr. And Makhleb is great.

[njvack]

My (successful) first trip through extended was a DD^TSO; it was fine. I actually liked switching from Mak to TSO before extended; angels are great, you'll heal enough, and Makhleb's wrath is basically "yo dawg i herd you like demons"

[arandomperson12]

Makhleb wrath seems really dangerous. The wrath is triggered by gaining exp, so if you get hit by a lcs in or after a difficult fight, you will probably die.

[BabyRage]

How to get good weapon as DD of Makhleb?

Same as non-DD of non-Makhleb.

[Shard1697]

Likely, you will have to use a freezing battleaxe or some other unoptimal weapon.

A freezing battleaxe is a great weapon. Good base type, good brand. What's the problem?

If you think weapon gifts are a strong reason to go Oka/Trog, you are mistaken. You get fine weapons without them and often they just give you crap. Don't rely on their gifting as a crutch.

[nago]

If you are into two handed, I often find a hostile executioner's axe in the Hall of Blades.

But it often has a bad brand, and getting a good brand with scrolls of brand weapon is not guaranteed.

Before you go into extended, you have access to no less than 4 areas of plentiful loot (Vaults, Slime, Elf, Crypt).

I never really saw the loot in those areas as being particularly good. Nearly all of it is useless junk (stones, sling bullets), stuff you already have enough of (scrolls of remove curse), weapons/spellbooks that you are not skilled for, food, evocables that could be helpful but are usually not worth a inventory slot (sack of spiders, box of beasts) and coins (mostly useless in the late game).

Ok this is a troll topic.
Anyway spend all your ?acq on weapon and be happy. Or go always Trog. Or use that battleaxe because it is good.

[dowan]

Hey, ignorance isn't trolling. I mean, it could be a troll topic I suppose, but it could also be a legitimately misinformed player. I did have the same initial reaction to that post though...

[arandomperson12]

I do not have a DD character, I am just wondering how I would play one. Also, I think that box of beasts/spider sack are only really good for creating a one turn barrier between a monster and you during the orb run, as the summons do not deal enough damage/have enough health to stand up to enemies such as gold dragons, executioners, fiends, etc.

[Hands]

I do not have a DD character, I am just wondering how I would play one. Also, I think that box of beasts/spider sack are only really good for creating a one turn barrier between a monster and you during the orb run, as the summons do not deal enough damage/have enough health to stand up to enemies such as gold dragons, executioners, fiends, etc.

Sack of spiders and box of beasts are really good for killing things too.

[Shard1697]

With high evo sack/box are quite strong.

[Sar]

I think that box of beasts/spider sack are only really good for creating a one turn barrier between a monster and you during the orb run, as the summons do not deal enough damage/have enough health to stand up to enemies such as gold dragons, executioners, fiends, etc.

You should actually try using those things with decent/high Evocations skill. I think the results might surprise you, in a positive way.

[Airwolf]

It's optimal to keep using the starting hand/war axe until an exec axe drops.

This isn't true... I wasn't sure if you were joking or something, but I want to make it clear this is not true.
...

Point take about not being able to tell if I was joking. The OP's suggesting that a battleaxe of freezing was "unoptimal" struck me as particularly absurd, even given the way Tavern throws around "optimal".

[dowan]

Heh, I kind of figured as much, but you never know sometimes.

I think it's fair to say there is a pretty clear optimal brand for extended, and that brand is HW. Even optimal-er would be to have one max enchanted HW weapon, and one max enchanted AM weapon... and while we're at it a max enchanted speed branded one too... I guess if you're really lucky oka or trog might give you those things.

[ZipZipskins]

I would personally almost always rather have an antimagic weapon than a holy wrath weapon if I have to have one or the other

[Airwolf]

Yeah, OK, HW or AM and biggest weapon of the type is best for extended, but that's hardly important: you'll have enough opportunities to get such a weapon for extended if you think you "need" it. You have to be more flexible with your mid-/end-game weapon or you're stupidly swinging a +2 war axe of venom against vault wardens and they kill you.

[dowan]

I would personally almost always rather have an antimagic weapon than a holy wrath weapon if I have to have one or the other

That's an interesting debate. HW is useful against more of the enemies, and it's effective against pretty much anything AM would be effective against in extended. AM is pretty good for shutting down a dangerous spellcaster, but of course killing the spellcaster in half the time is also quite good for shutting them down, and it's not as if AM prevents all spells from working, and spellcasting enemies don't always cast spells. Dead enemies never cast spells or perform any other attacks.

Against self healing pan lords AM is probably way better, but I think HW's more general applicability makes it better overall. Either is a great brand for extended. Both is even better, but I usually don't get enough EW scrolls for 2 endgame weapons, plus whatever I use during the 3 rune portion of the game.

[nago]

AM is almost always better against a single target, HW is better against groups, but you shouldn't fight group of dangerous enemies as usual so...

[dowan]

I don't understand that logic, HW works just as well against single targets as it does against groups.

[and into]

In brief:

Going Trog/Okawaru does not guarantee an "optimal" weapon.

You do not need an optimal weapon to win with any number of runes.

Executioner's axe may not be an optimal choice over a battleaxe, even in a long (15 rune) game.

[Magipi]

Going Trog/Okawaru does not guarantee an "optimal" weapon.

This is mostly true in Oka's case, but Trog is exremely reliable to give you a top-level antimagic weapon (which is the best of the best).

[and into]

Going Trog/Okawaru does not guarantee an "optimal" weapon.

This is mostly true in Oka's case, but Trog is exremely reliable to give you a top-level antimagic weapon (which is the best of the best).

On an infinite time line, either will give a top-tier weapon eventually. Trog is more reliable, certainly, but neither guarantees a great, or even a good weapon. Particularly not early enough for it to really matter.

Just a little while ago I ascended a berserker who stuck with Trog all game and used a great mace of draining I found on the floor around (IIRC) Lair. On like, Zot:2 or 3, Trog gifted a +10 artefact g mace of crushing and rF+, that was the only weapon gift that even competed with what I had picked up off the ground.

I brought this up simply to disabuse the OP of thinking that 1.) you need to go Trog/Okawaru to get a great weapon, 2.) you are guaranteed a great weapon if you go with Trog/Okawaru. Neither is true!