CSDC Week 3 - DsTm, CLOSED


Official tournaments, but also any competition, challenge of the week or other player initiative for competitive crawling.

Zot Zealot

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Post Sunday, 9th February 2014, 23:49

CSDC Week 3 - DsTm, CLOSED

Please use this thread for discussion of all things pertaining to Week 3 of the Crawl Sudden Death Challenges competition.

Week 3: DsTm

Tier I Bonus: Enter Depths before entering Lair.
Tier II Bonus: Enter Depths:6 before entering Lair.


NOTE: Unless otherwise specified, you do not need to win the game to get points for the bonus challenges.

CSDC Season 1 Results and Standings

Week 3 Challenge Wins
Last edited by WalkerBoh on Thursday, 13th March 2014, 01:10, edited 5 times in total.

Shoals Surfer

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 01:41

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Yay!!! Such an awesome build!

Shoals Surfer

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 02:33

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

I might be the first person out. Famine or feast for me. Hasted Prince Ribbit spoiled the fun.
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Shoals Surfer

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 10:43

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

This combo looks like a good candidate for either season high score or season min turn count win...

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 13:06

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

My game was not too long as usual. Barely retreated from D8 Wyvern upstairs but some Wights generated on previously cleared level, retreated to other upstairs where an Orc was generated, barely escaped upstairs again but there was an Orc Priest on D6. I had unknown potion of invisibility perhaps I should have quaffed them.
Main reason of the death is that I forgot to activate heroism vs that Wyvern :(

Dungeon Master

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 14:59

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Or maybe it was going Okawaru...

Abyss Ambulator

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 15:54

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Got absolutely dunked this week. First a +0/+3 venom dagger goblin on D1, then Sigmund on D2. I managed to !brilliance into spider form and get away, only to run into 4 gnolls.
Three wins: Gargoyle Earth Elementalist of Ash, Ogre Fighter of Ru, Deep Dwarf Fighter of Makhleb (0.16 bugbuild :( )

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 17:30

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

wheals wrote:Or maybe it was going Okawaru...


Maybe so. I tried several DsTm offline before starting that game and I realized I cannot play pure Tm (unless I am OpTm of Chei but it does not work well with no-Lair conduct).
Thus I decided to join Oka for Demon Whip (good for Ds) with little EXP required so I could hybridize early. Training high UC, some Transmutations and Spellcasting looked too much to me.
Now I am playing pure DsTm, at least SDC forces me to win with combos I really don't like ;)
Also it looks like I cannot play well under high pressure, being too emotional hurts :(

Cocytus Succeeder

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 17:35

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Sandman25 wrote:Thus I decided to join Oka for Demon Whip (good for Ds) (...)


I do not understand your reasoning.

First, the chances of Okawaru gifting you a good demon whip are negligible.
Second, Oka is very good for unarmed fighters, as Heroism is even stronger unarmed than otherwise.

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 17:47

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Magipi wrote:
Sandman25 wrote:Thus I decided to join Oka for Demon Whip (good for Ds) (...)


I do not understand your reasoning.

First, the chances of Okawaru gifting you a good demon whip are negligible.
Second, Oka is very good for unarmed fighters, as Heroism is even stronger unarmed than otherwise.


I was doomed as UC because I have little experience with Tm of non-Chei. Maybe I should have spent one week training offline and then start playing ;)
Oka grants weapons, I don't really need Demon whip, Heroism would help with Great Mace or whatever I get. UC is weaker than melee middle game, especially with branded weapons and I really wanted to branch into conjurations (I had good books in my $ list and amulet of Faith on my neck) so I was trying to minimize EXP on weapons/UC/Transmutations.
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Spider Stomper

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 18:31

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Image

hue
take it easy
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Spider Stomper

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 18:52

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Cheibrodos wrote:Image

hue


And then I died to staircase Jessica who hasted herself before I got a turn. No good potions.
take it easy
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Shoals Surfer

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 19:07

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Damn this was fast. Got double teamed by two orc wizards :D

Zot Zealot

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 21:03

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

And that's when everyone realized DsTm is actually harder than DrCK...

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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 22:26

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Cheibrodos wrote:
Cheibrodos wrote:Image

hue


And then I died to staircase Jessica who hasted herself before I got a turn. No good potions.


Almost the same thing here; I also had claws, but I did manage to make it to lair before dying. Lair was really, really nasty. Realized that even while hasted you still can't outrun black mambas (doh), komodo dragons are really bitches, and it's very, very hard to fight hydras in leather armor, even when you have ~15 ac. Eventually died running back up 2 floors trying to escape mobs that were chasing me, and went up into a hydra that I had previously ran down to get away from. Was hoping it wouldn't be right at the stairs, but alas, it was.

http://dobrazupa.org/morgue/tasonir/mor ... 204101.txt

Final action was another potion of speed but I didn't last through the hydra's attack to get away...
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Spider Stomper

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Post Monday, 10th February 2014, 23:04

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

It turns out my unfortunate death was on the wrong account! Whoops! It seems my next one might go a bit better.

Image
take it easy

Zot Zealot

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 01:29

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Well you were only xl3 anyways, so didn't matter anyways. Grats on hitting the Tier I bonus though. I expect the early exp potion had something to do with it…

Shoals Surfer

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 04:56

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

So fucking stupid. Had a great set of mutations, then tangled with an orc warrior rather than using the rather copious set of tools at my disposal to run and/or win.

One more hit...

http://crawl.berotato.org/crawl/morgue/ ... 045159.txt

Zot Zealot

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 05:55

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Same here. Was walking across a cleared D:9 to another downstairs on account of bees, a troll popped up at LoS. I started to run away then said, "Aw hell, I can surely beat him with ease!" Took 50+ dam in 2 turns and that was that.

Especially bitter as I died with an unID'd experience potion in my inventory. :x

Unarmed Combat 27.0

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 06:32

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

I was thinking of going Oka with this build. Is this a good idea?

I know Oka benefits all forms of melee combat, including unarmed, but would it be better to go with a weapon? Will Oka still gift a lot of weapons if you've only trained UC, or will his gifts be more weighted towards armor without any weapon skills trained?
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Tartarus Sorceror

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 06:46

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

diviton wrote:I was thinking of going Oka with this build. Is this a good idea?

I know Oka benefits all forms of melee combat, including unarmed, but would it be better to go with a weapon? Will Oka still gift a lot of weapons if you've only trained UC, or will his gifts be more weighted towards armor without any weapon skills trained?


Oka is fine, don't worry. Just remember, if you're concerned about weapon gifts, that even if you wanted a battle axe, you probably did not want the -2 -3 battleaxe of the moon {contam, Str-3} that he just gave you.
take it easy
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Spider Stomper

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 06:59

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

I just think of Okawaru as a heroism dispenser and nothing more. He's still great.
take it easy

Barkeep

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 07:07

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

diviton wrote:I was thinking of going Oka with this build. Is this a good idea?

I know Oka benefits all forms of melee combat, including unarmed, but would it be better to go with a weapon? Will Oka still gift a lot of weapons if you've only trained UC, or will his gifts be more weighted towards armor without any weapon skills trained?


Actually the +5 skill boost from Heroism does more for unarmed combat compared to other forms of melee, due to the fact that UC damage is more skill-dependent than any other melee.

But even if that weren't the case, you already have a weapon from your background—your fists. You don't need a god to gift you a good weapon nor worry about finding one; this is one of the main advantages of UC. The other is all the support you get from tmut spells. Transmuters start with both, so you should just use your fists.

Okawaru will still give you lots of weapons, but one of the great things about transmuters is you don't even have to go through the trouble of wielding or inspecting those weapons in the (usually vain) hope that they will be good. You can just ignore them entirely. I actually find Okawaru a lot more enjoyable with UC to be honest.

Cocytus Succeeder

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 08:55

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Little addendum: if you want a good weapon you can always go Trog - but hoping for a good specific demon weapon is optimistic even in that case.

A question for WalkerBoh: so, if I register a new account, different from the one of the competition, can I play DsTm (or other active competitions' combo), without worrying about splatting? (yeah, I know I could play offline, but I still prefer online :D )
screw it I hate this character I'm gonna go melee Gastronok
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Snake Sneak

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 09:45

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Arrhythmia wrote:
diviton wrote:I was thinking of going Oka with this build. Is this a good idea?

I know Oka benefits all forms of melee combat, including unarmed, but would it be better to go with a weapon? Will Oka still gift a lot of weapons if you've only trained UC, or will his gifts be more weighted towards armor without any weapon skills trained?


Oka is fine, don't worry. Just remember, if you're concerned about weapon gifts, that even if you wanted a battle axe, you probably did not want the -2 -3 battleaxe of the moon {contam, Str-3} that he just gave you.


Yes that is absolutely correct, his weapons are utter pig dung anyway. His main appeal is heroism + finesse. I think with the demonspawns bad apts can be offset by the heroism. Also he has magical amazing muts of amazingness and I will forever hate him for that.

P.S. if you splat this demonspawn I will never let you come to my house again.
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Zot Zealot

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 16:20

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

A question for WalkerBoh: so, if I register a new account, different from the one of the competition, can I play DsTm (or other active competitions' combo), without worrying about splatting? (yeah, I know I could play offline, but I still prefer online)

Yeah you can play on any alt, offline, or other account you want. I only count the game(s) on the account listed on the scoring sheet. So if you splat fast on nago2, no worries. But if you get an amazing score with nago2, it won't count. :wink:

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Post Tuesday, 11th February 2014, 21:35

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Tense start -- I encountered a D:1 gnoll+whip at XL 1 and was nearly one-shotted. I survived thanks to a pair of very early throwing nets.

...and I splatted to a centaur...
Wins: DsWz(6), DDNe(4), HuIE(5), HuFE(4), MiBe(3)
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 03:29

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Haven't played my challenge combo yet, but I received a transmuter book on a different character - did Spider Form get removed in trunk?
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Tartarus Sorceror

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 05:36

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

No.
take it easy

Unarmed Combat 27.0

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 06:08

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Did a little practice run offline and Okawaru makes Unarmed insanely dangerous. Died on Lair:8 because I thought it'd be fun to tussle with a random Fire Crab. Seemed silly out of depth and I had no rF, but I had already gotten a feel for the build, which was the point, so I took him on. Bad call, apparently.
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Dis Charger

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 10:33

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Quick deaths for me too.
Gnoll on D:1, Ijyb waiting on D:2, orc wizard on other D:2 stairs... But I was not level 4 !

Second attempt, gnoll pack on D:3, no problem, back on D:2, orc wizards on a cleared level :(
Game over !
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Halls Hopper

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 12:14

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Yay, just got the tier I bonus! Dephts 2 is too tough for me though ; it has a large vault with all 3 downstairs and lots of monsters, I quit after expending much of my consumables. Maybe time to get a rune?

Got the weirdest luck in this game, too : several dragon hides, but no ?EA ...
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Spider Stomper

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 17:36

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

A spy wrote:Yay, just got the tier I bonus! Dephts 2 is too tough for me though ; it has a large vault with all 3 downstairs and lots of monsters, I quit after expending much of my consumables. Maybe time to get a rune?

Got the weirdest luck in this game, too : several dragon hides, but no ?EA ...


I've been having the opposite problem...
take it easy

Halls Hopper

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 18:33

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Well...

Just got the Spider rune, experienced the new Siren AI in Shoals, and decided to quit.

Unarmed Combat 27.0

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 19:33

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Hit D:7. Since I'm not used to playing online, the Player Ghosts are really throwing me for a loop. Working on getting Blade Hands castable since that + heroism means things die quick. I'm also working on my fighting/dodging to make sure I don't die too easily before that. Blade Hands is at about 30% right now. After all that, I might get Ozo's online since I still don't know if I'll end up going pure melee or maybe a conjurer hybrid depending on what the dungeon gives me.

My mutations are Antennae 1, Hooves 2, Claws 1, Powered by Death and Saprovore. Night really fond of them, but I guess I'll take what I can get.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 19:43

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

A spy wrote:Well...

Just got the Spider rune, experienced the new Siren AI in Shoals, and decided to quit.


Yeah first time I encountered a Siren in the shoals was annoying as crap (I was playing a Be that hadn't picked up any ranged attacks) managed to kill it with wands then went back and picked up some ranged weapon I'd left laying around to deal with the others.

A monster which you *have* to fight at range is a little tedious, but now I know "Have some ability to do damage at range" is a new requirement for the Shoals.
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Slime Squisher

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 22:31

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Fastest death, I didn't even get a morgue file.

DsTm Insei D:1 slain by a hobgoblin 1 27 00:00:42 2014-02-12 21:36:49 0.14-a0

Just bad rolls, had appendage up and everything, I only missed, hobgob only hit, he didn't even have a fancy weapon.

Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 22:47

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

cerealjynx wrote:Fastest death, I didn't even get a morgue file.

DsTm Insei D:1 slain by a hobgoblin 1 27 00:00:42 2014-02-12 21:36:49 0.14-a0

Just bad rolls, had appendage up and everything, I only missed, hobgob only hit, he didn't even have a fancy weapon.


Well, if you are wounded and the monster you are fighting is not, it is optimal to run away until your HP are restored. Provided you have room of course.

Crypt Cleanser

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 23:07

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

cerealjynx wrote:Fastest death, I didn't even get a morgue file.

DsTm Insei D:1 slain by a hobgoblin 1 27 00:00:42 2014-02-12 21:36:49 0.14-a0

Just bad rolls, had appendage up and everything, I only missed, hobgob only hit, he didn't even have a fancy weapon.

You did get a morgue file: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/cerea ... 213649.txt
It's just that scores of 0 arent's shown in CAO's overview, so there's no link, but you still can find it in http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/cerealjynx/ directory (or wherever else you were playing).

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Post Wednesday, 12th February 2014, 23:38

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

diviton wrote:Hit D:7. Since I'm not used to playing online, the Player Ghosts are really throwing me for a loop. Working on getting Blade Hands castable since that + heroism means things die quick. I'm also working on my fighting/dodging to make sure I don't die too easily before that. Blade Hands is at about 30% right now. After all that, I might get Ozo's online since I still don't know if I'll end up going pure melee or maybe a conjurer hybrid depending on what the dungeon gives me.

My mutations are Antennae 1, Hooves 2, Claws 1, Powered by Death and Saprovore. Night really fond of them, but I guess I'll take what I can get.



Without dump it's hard to say, but BH to 30% in D:7 is probably a overkill in transmutation - to win with tm it's much better to focus on UC early on and just use spider form rather than rushing for BH. Furthermore, with claws as muts I wouldn't go for BH (just spider form to kite and run away, and ice form against some foes like hydra). Finally, I don't suggest conjurer hybrid for a Tm, until very late game (and maybe never with a race as Ds): to be strong you need fighting, uc (very expensive), dodging, some armour, a bit of tm, spellcasting and eventually charms and translocation. Going also with conjuration means a lot of experience, more than the usually found in a 3-runes games (at least, until zot)
screw it I hate this character I'm gonna go melee Gastronok

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 00:10

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

nago wrote:Furthermore, with claws as muts I wouldn't go for BH


Does it mean Blade Hands cancel Claws 3 mutation?

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 00:18

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Yes - they actually do some more damage than claws 3, but also require more transmutation training, significantly empairs spell success and block wands. UC is very strong by itself, with claws is exceptionally good, so I don't think bh are worth over them.
screw it I hate this character I'm gonna go melee Gastronok

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 01:52

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

I didn't realize BH canceled claws. Very good advice, sir.

I'm going to focus more on Fighting/UC/Dodging and rely on heroism instead of getting BH.

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 03:30

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Yay! I at least got one point this round. My DgCj and DrCK didn't get far at all, but I managed to take this character to the Depths before I stepped into the Lair. Centaur Warriors made it really tough and I lost a lot of consumables, so we'll see if that ends up biting me in the ass, but at least I get some sort of score for this character. You do get that point even if you die, right?

Anyway, I'm in Lair now. A couple of questions.

1. What kind of armor should I wear? I found an MDA, but I could definitely wear something heavier since I don't plan on casting anything more challenging than BH for some time. I know heavy armor hurts UC, though I don't know by how much.

2. How do I show a character dump when playing online?

Zot Zealot

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 04:18

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Congrats on getting the bonus! And yes, you keep that point even if you die.

1) I'd go for lighter armor on a UC fighter. The MDA sounds pretty good. Heavier armor will cause a lot of variation in your attack speed with UC unless you get enough armor skill to cancel it out. As a Ds, I'd say that exp would be better served going into other places than armor (though it's probably still worth getting armor up to 8 or so anyways).

2) Press # in-game to dump your character file, and then you access the dump file by going into ##crawl and typing !dump. Depending where you're playing, you might need a symbol other than ! (e.g. &dump or %dump), but someone in ##crawl can help with that. I just know !dump is for CAO since that's where I play.

Unarmed Combat 27.0

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 04:27

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Thank you.

Also, how do you check an enemy online? You know, that screen that says "It looks dangerous" and "It knows the following spells", etc.

Zot Zealot

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 04:38

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Use %??. For example, typing "%??frederick" displays:
  Code:
Frederick (@) | Spd: 10 | HD: 21 | HP: 159 | AC/EV: 0/10 | Dam: 27 | weapons, items, doors, spellcaster, see invisible | Res: magic(140) | Chunks: contam | XP: 3749 | Sp: mystic blast (3d25), b.cold (3d30), invisibility, iron shot (3d36) | Sz: Medium | Int: normal.

You can also do "??frederick" to display a short blurb describing the enemy:
  Code:
frederick[1/2]: A svelte fighter-mage, wearing a gold-rimmed monocle. SPELLS INCLUDE: mystic blast, bolt of cold, invis, iron shot. Formerly known as Adolf.


All of this information can also be found by going here (accessible on the crawl.develz.org page under "Knowledge Bots") and typing in whichever monster you desire to learn about.

Dungeon Master

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 04:44

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

type xv

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Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 05:21

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

wheals wrote:type xv


Yessss, thanks

Edit: Finished Lair. Quite easily. I have UC at 16, Fighting around 11 and Dodging at 10. Transmutations are at 10 and Blade Hnads is about 8% I think. I still haven't used it once though. Finding it really hard to get 6 pips of piety with Oka though. I was gifted a +2 pair of gloves that give me +3 dex. I've been wearing them and I barely notice the damage difference without claws, but is this a mistake?

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Joined: Friday, 8th February 2013, 12:00

Post Thursday, 13th February 2014, 15:02

Re: CSDC Week 3 - DsTm

Every rank in Claws mutation increases base damage by 2, it is a relatively small bonus when your base damage becomes 24 (base 3 + 16 for UC skill + 5 with Heroism)
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