Enemies following you on stairs
Questions, Explanations, Howtos
Dungeon Master
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Oh, by the way Crawl comes with a design document which has something to say about unavoidable deaths. Press ?n in the game to read it.
You should also be aware of the existence of very long streaks (a single player winning games back to back -- the online playing mode means that cheating is not possible). This basically means that, given enough experience and care, almost every game can be won. However, only very few players can pull this off.
Dis Charger
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Dungeon Master
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
We're waiting for your document then!
Dungeon Master
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Vestibule Violator
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
One death that also felt really unfair but can be clearly attributed to severe mistakes on my part is from back when bolt bouncing was not limited to two hits. I was in Zot, without rElec, despite knowing that there are enemies with powerful electric attacks. After stepping into the entrance to a room I saw a storm dragon. It was in a really really nice position for bolt bouncing and immediately trizapped me. I was dead instantly, as a DD with 31 AC, 28 EV, and IIRC significantly more than 100 current HP. It must have gotten very nice damage rolls. Much more avoidable than the other death, but not fun.
Both of these games went from no enemies in sight to dead without any reaction being possible.
Unavoidable deaths are much more common in the early game of course. Still pretty rare though, as the streaks some players have gotten prove.
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Galefury wrote:
Unavoidable deaths are much more common in the early game of course. Still pretty rare though, as the streaks some players have gotten prove.
I think certain species are more prone to insta-death than others and suspect streakers avoid those.
Did I make a lame complaint? Check for Bingo!
Totally gracious CSDC Season 2 Division 4 Champeen!
Vaults Vanquisher
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Blades Runner
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
And you should definitely mention that that is a screenshot from an old version of crawl (back before the kenku->tengu rename)
Vestibule Violator
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Siegurt wrote:Well, it takes over 2 turns to climb or decend stairs (2.3 to be specific) so if I was an enemy I'd certainly whack you for free
Because it only takes them 1 turn to go up the stairs. Makes perfect sense...
Vestibule Violator
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Galefury wrote:Hm, I once got paralyzed by a sphinx right after opening a door, then shot to death by the yaktaur captain next to it before I could react. I was even wearing a MR ring. Granted, it was a vault, so OOD enemies were to be expected, and I was with Ash so I knew for sure there was a very dangerous enemy behind that door. It was avoidable by simply leaving that door closed and going somewhere else, but it certainly didn't feel fair.
One death that also felt really unfair but can be clearly attributed to severe mistakes on my part is from back when bolt bouncing was not limited to two hits. I was in Zot, without rElec, despite knowing that there are enemies with powerful electric attacks. After stepping into the entrance to a room I saw a storm dragon. It was in a really really nice position for bolt bouncing and immediately trizapped me. I was dead instantly, as a DD with 31 AC, 28 EV, and IIRC significantly more than 100 current HP. It must have gotten very nice damage rolls. Much more avoidable than the other death, but not fun.
Both of these games went from no enemies in sight to dead without any reaction being possible.
Unavoidable deaths are much more common in the early game of course. Still pretty rare though, as the streaks some players have gotten prove.
I think we need to differentiate between "unfair" deaths and unavoidable deaths. Falling off a wall in spider form onto a bolt trap and dying is an unfair death. It is entirely avoidable by only traveling where you have already traveled and not going farther than you need to when at low HP. Taking a crystal spear to the face from an ancient lich and dying from almost full HP feels unfair is definitely not unavoidable and is probably not even unfair.
While I can't easily go through all my morgues, I can think of other actually unfair and possibly unfair deaths, but I think I've only had a few unavoidable deaths, mostly dealing with D:1 entries and fast monsters like roaches and jackals.
Vestibule Violator
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
rebthor wrote:Siegurt wrote:Well, it takes over 2 turns to climb or decend stairs (2.3 to be specific) so if I was an enemy I'd certainly whack you for free
Because it only takes them 1 turn to go up the stairs. Makes perfect sense...
Actually the more I think about this, the less logical in game terms it actually is. A monster that is a step away from the stairs is able to
- move to the stairs (generally 1 turn for most monsters)
- go up the stairs (2.3 turns for a player)
- attack you while going up the stairs (generally 1 turn for most monsters)
Dungeon Master
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Vestibule Violator
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Vestibule Violator
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Perhaps the tutorial should note this in some way so that a brand new player wouldn't be confused by the incongruity?
Ziggurat Zagger
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Re: Enemies following you on stairs
Things that don't start next to you can come up and poke at you while the vortex spins up, but they aren't caught in the vortexy bit itself so when you disappear and reappear upstairs, they don't come with you.
The truth is that Crawl doesn't have real staircases, it has overly-complicated magic rube goldberg machines.
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