Grammar suggestion


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Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 6393

Joined: Friday, 17th December 2010, 18:17

Post Monday, 31st January 2011, 20:11

Grammar suggestion

The remove curse announcement

"You feel as if something is helping you."

would to me sound better as

"You feel as though something is helping you."

Slightly more old-fashioned, therefore in keeping with Crawl's punctiliousness in such matters.

Blades Runner

Posts: 546

Joined: Monday, 20th December 2010, 14:25

Post Sunday, 6th February 2011, 15:56

Re: Grammar suggestion

Maybe even "has helped", since the effect is once-off, not continuous.

Dungeon Master

Posts: 3618

Joined: Thursday, 23rd December 2010, 12:43

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 12:14

Re: Grammar suggestion

I like this. If someone with native tongue and sufficient authority tells me this is good, I'd use it.

Snake Sneak

Posts: 110

Joined: Monday, 20th December 2010, 21:11

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 16:13

Re: Grammar suggestion

They both sound equally correct to me. (native speaker)

The first 4 results on google also confirm these can be used interchangeably

http://www.google.com/search?q=as+if+vs+as+though

Blades Runner

Posts: 546

Joined: Monday, 20th December 2010, 14:25

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 17:26

Re: Grammar suggestion

I'm native and I'm confident about "has helped". Just "You feel that something helped you" would be more streamlined. No need for "as if/though" at all.

More colorful and precise (but not a nod to Rogue, if I recall) is "A darkness has been lifted from your equipment."

There are a few other grammar oddities that I'll try to put here as I run across them.

This isn't a grammar problem but it sounds awkward relative to other choices: "Sabre of flaming/freezing" I think could be
  • "Sabre of fire/ice" (sounds coolest to my ear and most fantasy-like; frost/cold/flame are other options but I wouldn't prefer them) or
  • "Flaming/freezing sabre" (describes what the sabre look like {it's on fire; it's really cold} but would be obvious)

Or is there a reason that melee and missile weapons are at present differentiated? ("Bow of flame")

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 6393

Joined: Friday, 17th December 2010, 18:17

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 17:55

Re: Grammar suggestion

smock wrote: "You feel that something helped you"


How about "You feel something helping you."?

Blades Runner

Posts: 546

Joined: Monday, 20th December 2010, 14:25

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 18:12

Re: Grammar suggestion

Grimm wrote:
smock wrote: "You feel that something helped you"


How about "You feel something helping you."?


That's simpler but to some extent it suggests that you will be helped into the near future. I guess it depends on whether messages report on what has just occurred (at the end of an action) or on what will occur soon (on this turn or the next turn). I don't know. In any case it's a relatively minor issue. As an aside, I'd go for flavor over grammar any day!

Snake Sneak

Posts: 92

Joined: Friday, 17th December 2010, 21:31

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 18:34

Re: Grammar suggestion

I think the message should say something like, "Your cursed items glow softly and fade."

It only takes one reading to figure out what the original message means, and a player may read a spoiler to figure it out anyway. I don't think it's necessary to have that level of obfuscation on an identified, beneficial scroll (other than I think it's NetHack's original message).

Snake Sneak

Posts: 92

Joined: Friday, 14th January 2011, 18:32

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 19:40

Re: Grammar suggestion

minmay wrote:I'm a native speaker and think that "your cursed items glow softly and fade" sounds much better than any of the others here.

I agree.

Dungeon Master

Posts: 3618

Joined: Thursday, 23rd December 2010, 12:43

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 20:00

Re: Grammar suggestion

I am fine with removing obfusciation. Also with "cursed items glowing" -- but why do the items "fade"? As I see it (non-native speaker), the curse is fading, not the item!?
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Blades Runner

Posts: 623

Joined: Thursday, 23rd December 2010, 19:17

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 20:16

Re: Grammar suggestion

dpeg wrote:I am fine with removing obfusciation. Also with "cursed items glowing" -- but why do the items "fade"? As I see it (non-native speaker), the curse is fading, not the item!?

I agree. It seems as item fades into nothingness. So curse lifted and item disappears? It's a bit confusing for me (also not a native speaker) and there's more crawlers around that know English even worse than me :lol:

Blades Runner

Posts: 546

Joined: Monday, 20th December 2010, 14:25

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 20:25

Re: Grammar suggestion

Perhaps: "Your cursed items glow momentarily" or "The darkness lifts from your cursed items."
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Vestibule Violator

Posts: 1533

Joined: Thursday, 16th December 2010, 20:52

Post Monday, 7th February 2011, 20:42

Re: Grammar suggestion

I agree with improving clarity, not just grammar. These suggestions are good.

I think what was meant is that the glow fades. "Glow momentarily" captures this.

However, be careful that the message is not too much like some of the random uselessness effects. I think those scrolls sometimes cause items to glow momentarily.

TGW

Halls Hopper

Posts: 82

Joined: Thursday, 16th December 2010, 22:14

Post Sunday, 13th February 2011, 02:35

Re: Grammar suggestion

"The darkness lifts from your cursed items" is great.

If a scroll is identified when read, the identified name should appear in the read message instead of the unidentified name. This would reduce the number of questions about random uselessness effects.

Crypt Cleanser

Posts: 726

Joined: Friday, 11th February 2011, 18:46

Post Sunday, 13th February 2011, 04:47

Re: Grammar suggestion

Since cursed items are described as "deathly cold", I was thinking something like "A warm, soothing feeling passes through your equipment."

For this message the author Tiber has received thanks:
vintermann

Slime Squisher

Posts: 404

Joined: Sunday, 13th February 2011, 13:57

Post Sunday, 13th February 2011, 14:11

Re: Grammar suggestion

Some great suggestions here! Since most players are likely to use this scroll a few times, would it add flavor to use several and choose randomly?

My thoughts: Continue the cursed = cold imagery and still be informative, e.g:
"The terrible chill slowly fades from your cursed equipment."

Tiber, I have to say that this one hit me on another level entirely:
"A warm, soothing feeling passes through your equipment."

That brings rather different things to mind for me. ;) How about:
"Your cursed equipment begins to vibrate as you read this scroll, building to a shattering climax. You hear a spectral voice telling you that you are special and promising to call you sometime." :twisted:
Oh, wait...

Another wacky suggestion could be that when you drive the curse out of the item, it has to go somewhere else, perhaps generating a "malevolent cloud" of poisonous or confusing vapors. This could have some tactical use, particularly in the early game, but these scrolls are rare enough not to unbalance things. ?

Ziggurat Zagger

Posts: 6393

Joined: Friday, 17th December 2010, 18:17

Post Saturday, 19th February 2011, 02:34

Re: Grammar suggestion

Instead of

"You feel less confused"

how about

"You regain presence of mind"

Blades Runner

Posts: 555

Joined: Tuesday, 4th January 2011, 13:38

Post Sunday, 20th February 2011, 12:02

Re: Grammar suggestion

Grimm wrote:Instead of

"You feel less confused"

how about

"You regain presence of mind"


Hmmm ... How about "Your mind is clear again." ?
... and forgive us our YASDs,
As we forgive our developers,
And lead us not into the Abyss,
But deliver us from Sigmund,
For Thine is the Roguelike,
the Orb and the Victory,
now and forever.

7hm

Snake Sneak

Posts: 109

Joined: Wednesday, 2nd February 2011, 03:20

Post Thursday, 3rd March 2011, 03:13

Re: Grammar suggestion

smock wrote: "Your cursed items glow momentarily" or "The darkness lifts from your cursed items."


I think both of these are very good options.

It's a pretty minor change though, and what we have is fine. If you're going to stick with what we have, "you feel as though" sounds more "proper" than "you feel as if".

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