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is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Wednesday, 9th August 2017, 20:01
by gameguard
If not, why do we have 5 pips for max MR? I see alot of new players wearing 5 pips of MR, often sacrificing other resistances to get it.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Wednesday, 9th August 2017, 20:50
by CanOfWorms
the enchantress can, technically speaking

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Wednesday, 9th August 2017, 22:48
by duvessa
Ancient liches and Pan lords can.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 01:32
by Airwolf
Paralysis (and maybe other effects) from chaos-branded melee (Eldritch Tentacles, some random Panlords, but not Killer Klowns) doesn't check MR at all!

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 03:10
by duvessa
Oh, and also vault sentinels.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 06:12
by VeryAngryFelid
I remember checking a game where PC got paralyzed by A.Lich despite having 5 pips.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 08:06
by 4Hooves2Appendages
The game doesn't display more than 5 pips, but what happens if I wear 6 items of MR+? Is there a cap, or do I keep getting (diminishing) returns?

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 08:07
by VeryAngryFelid
There is no cap and there are no diminishing returns, it is linear increase. You will see 0% for all monster spells.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 09:11
by 4Hooves2Appendages
Sorry for the lack of clarity, the 'diminishing' was aimed at the actual increase in benefit. Once all monsters spells have been reduced to a literal 0%, the benefit of adding further MR+ is of course 0, so as diminished as it can get.

So for a hypothetical near-invincible zig character, walking around with 4 sources of MR+ from gear might be quite reasonable.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 09:28
by VeryAngryFelid
I believe having even 1% chance to be paralyzed is incompatible with near-invincible. 5 pips is a must for me unless I have 4 pips and a ring of MR to swap as needed.
You can check it easily, just equip different MR items and check Ancient Lich via "?/m".

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 10:38
by 4Hooves2Appendages
Is the chance to be affected number rounded? Is 0% really <0.5%?

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 11:12
by VeryAngryFelid
  Code:
/**
 * Compute success chance for MR-checking spells and abilities.
 *
 * @param mr The magic resistance of the target.
 * @param powc The enchantment power.
 * @param scale The denominator of the result.
 * @param round_up Should the resulting chance be rounded up (true) or
 *        down (false, the default)?
 *
 * @return The chance, out of scale, that the enchantment affects the target.
 */
int hex_success_chance(const int mr, int powc, int scale, bool round_up)
{
    const int pow = ench_power_stepdown(powc);
    const int target = mr + 100 - pow;
    const int denom = 101 * 100;
    const int adjust = round_up ? denom - 1 : 0;

    if (target <= 0)
        return scale;
    if (target > 200)
        return 0;
    if (target <= 100)
        return (scale * (denom - _triangular_number(target)) + adjust) / denom;
    return (scale * _triangular_number(201 - target) + adjust) / denom;


Edit. Removed wrong info.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 12:00
by 4Hooves2Appendages
Rounding up would make more sense. I would be annoyed if it said 0% and then I end up paralysed.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 12:11
by neil
Monster hex success chances are rounded up before being displayed (hex_chance in describe.cc), while player hex success chances are rounded down (desc_success_chance in spl-cast.cc). The idea is precisely what 4H2A alluded to: it would be annoying to be told that something bad (being affected by a monster hex, or failing to affect a monster with your own hex) had a 0% chance of happening, then have it happen.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 14:35
by Shtopit
I just got enraged by a moth of wrath at +++++, but I don't know if it checks MR.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 14:44
by VeryAngryFelid
It does not.

Re: is there any monster that can beat 4 pips MR?

PostPosted: Thursday, 10th August 2017, 18:45
by Reptisaurus
Still, it probably is confusing to show more than 4 pips.