What's the reasoning behind Frogs?

[Implojin]

So then whats the real reason for removing High Elves?

If I had to guess, I'd say High elves were a relatively uninteresting species in terms of gameplay,
feeling somewhat like tengu but with weapon specialization like merfolk.
Especially with Ogres now also having newly-improved casting apts, there's a
very wide range of hybrid/magic-oriented species, with High Elves being
increasingly redundant.

this is just a hypothesis, tho. i could be wrong

(also, unlike frogs and formicids and whatever, high elves were literally tolkein elves. not like, "oh, if you stretch, you can sort of see a similarity", just straight-up tolkein rips)

>skipping right over the part about their fabulous golden hair
priorities plz, 0/10, would not write lewd frogfics

(don't worry i'm sure duvessa will post some shortly)

[Lasty]

[duvessa]

priorities plz, 0/10, would not write lewd frogfics

(don't worry i'm sure duvessa will post some shortly)

oh you're gonna wish it was just frogfics

[Vajrapani]

The species just seem so...inoffensive. The aptitudes are fairly flat across the board, and they're limited by being slow just because they have something that's about as reliable as uncontrolled blink. Damn, so amazing 10/10 race.

[VeryAngryFelid]

IMHO only species with unique mechanics are good to add at this point. Mi with headbutt, Fo with stasis, VS with no healing etc. To make Frogs good we'd need to remove blink from other species (or probably change Blink to level 5-6 so Frog will be the only species who can blink early and in heavy armour). Otherwise it's just yet another boring species, roughly equivalent to HuWr, HuWz or anything with Dith.

[Arrhythmia]

It amuses me that people think adding Frogs is a move away from traditional fantasy fare. Bullywogs from D&D, Slann from Warhammer. Or that Formicids are somehow super new and what not, *cough* thri-kreen *cough* *cough* playable in dark sun *cough*.

They changed the name of Tengu from Kenku but the species itself is taken straight from D&D, they just change to name to a japanese folklore thing to avoid the issue. Don't flatter the devs. They aren't doing shit in this regard. Removing Sludge Elves and keeping Deep elves? Deep elves are completely from D&D drow, sludge elves were at least somewhat original. High Elves being taken from tolkien? O really? Name me the actual proper name of the branch of elves that crawl High Elves mimic? Cuz its not the High elves that were in middle earth, the blond ones stayed in Valinor and the high elves of tolkien were actually a catch-all term for 3 kindred. Again crawl High elves are from D&D. Hah! But if we acknolwedged that then we would need to remove Tengu/Kenku one of the species that supposedly through some form of twisted logic can replace HE since its an even more obvious usage of D&D stuff since the name Kenku was completely made up.

The devs current hipster-esque bad excuse for removing things as being tolkien-like while simultaneously mashing in tons of D&D stuff or even worse thinking they are being original when they aren't because they apparently have no knowledge of what they are scorning to begin with. Dunno its just sad. I am just waiting for them to remove humans since they exist in <insert any fantasy setting here> and basically any other species can replace them for any background.

frogs aren't inspired by any of those things, they're just frogs. because they jump real good, like a frog.

in general, i'm sure if you mine enough fantasy settings you can find some precedent for just about any race, especially since "humanoid version of animal X" is a very obvious way to build a species. i don't think that's particularly damning.

but let's look at your specific example. according to wikipedia, thri-kreen are humanoid mantis-men, with exceptional jumping abilities, sharp claws, venomous bites, and psychic abilities. they like weird fancy polearms and crystal throwing weapons. formicids are humanoid ant-men, with tunneling abilities, antennae, and stasis. they like two-handed weapons and big shields.

they both have six limbs, because they're both based on insects. but given that, they're just about as different as two races can be.

formicids were copied wholesale from the scorpion men who guard the cave of the sun in the epic of gilgamesh and for this, there will be a reckoning

[ZipZipskins]

Um they aren't called scorpicids okay

[duvessa]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kuk_(mythology)

[PleasingFungus]

i think beetle-hats are just the thing frogs need to really 'pop'... the perfect finishing touch

[twelwe]

its only a matter of time before rolling attack and the hulk

[scorpionwarrior]

So then whats the real reason for removing High Elves?

If I had to guess, I'd say High elves were a relatively uninteresting species in terms of gameplay,
feeling somewhat like tengu but with weapon specialization like merfolk.
Especially with Ogres now also having newly-improved casting apts, there's a
very wide range of hybrid/magic-oriented species, with High Elves being
increasingly redundant.

this is just a hypothesis, tho. i could be wrong

(also, unlike frogs and formicids and whatever, high elves were literally tolkein elves. not like, "oh, if you stretch, you can sort of see a similarity", just straight-up tolkein rips)

You could very easily use the same argument against hill orcs if beogh didn't exist.

[Shard1697]

beogh also, arguably, shouldn't exist

[scorpionwarrior]

idk, I still have fun with the occasional Beogh game, seeing how far into zot I can keep my warlords alive. There's just no good reason for beogh to only accept one species. I get it, orcs are big dumb racist pricks, but that doesn't really seem worth preserving when it gets in the way of better gameplay.

[ichbins]

For quite a while I have a penguin race in mind that I want to mod in in my local game to replace merfolk (... well, once I learn how to mod this game, that's it). They also have slow movement and a "glide" skill for compensation - the option to move at extremely high speed into a given direction for a fixed amount of tiles, so basically a kind of semi-controlled blink that needs positioning.

It's time to get them in, get rid of frogs and merfolks and bring HE back!

[Elitist]

For quite a while I have a penguin race in mind that I want to mod in in my local game to replace merfolk (... well, once I learn how to mod this game, that's it). They also have slow movement and a "glide" skill for compensation - the option to move at extremely high speed into a given direction for a fixed amount of tiles, so basically a kind of semi-controlled blink that needs positioning.

It's time to get them in, get rid of frogs and merfolks and bring HE back!

That there penguin does not sound like a bad idea. Maybe boulder beetles with more speed?

[Shtopit]

More importantly, boulder beetles that don't keep rolling uncontrollably until they hit a wall if they miss their target. It's hilarious to watch on a monster, but it would be enraging as a PC.

[ThreeInvisibleDucks]

Do frogs get to leap? Felids don't, and they do goodstabs. They are stealthy enough to not need them anyway. You'd maybe get a goodstab or two more if they had them, but good stealth apt does pretty much the same. Without goodstabs, a jump attack is pretty much useless.