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[proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 03:36
by Hellmonk
I made a fork, and now I also made a post about it. This is my post about it, now updated since this fork is actually a big enough deal to need a consolidated changelog ayy lmao.

VERY IMPORTANT STATEMENT ON DESIGN GOALS
My design goals are to make an incredibly tavern/crawl-irc fork and to incorporate a bunch of dank memes into it. You can expect:
  • Content removals galore. Less floors, less experience, less monsters, less items
  • dumb monster renames
  • dumb monster reworks
  • a more streamlined crawl experience, by which I mean it's shorter because I removed stuff
  • pain and death (I hope)
  • bugs that I can't figure out how to fix
  • incompetence

EXTREMELY COOL STUFF I HAVE DONE SO FAR
  • Unfeatures:
    • Food.
    • Curses.
    • Upstairs.
    • Identification.
    • Deep water and lava instakills. You can swim (slowly) through deep water and lava but cannot attack or cast spells. Lava will also damage you every turn.
    • Monsters using consumables.
    • Recasting buff spells over and over. A whole host of buff spells and all form spells have become "permabuffs" that reserve an amount of maximum mp that depends on their spell level and what your success rate would be. The effect continues until you choose to end it, you do something the spell is not compatible with (wear heavy armour with ozos for example), something drops your max mp below zero, or you equip something with the -cast property.
    • Most traps. Random traps are gone; some vault-placed ones still exist but will automatically reveal.
    • Player ghosts.
    • Carrying duplicate wands. They stack instead.
    • Carrying spellbooks in inventory. They're goldified, no longer taking up an inventory slot.
    • Blowguns. Needles of poison, curare, and frenzy live on as darts.
    • The out of depth clock. Monsters don't spawn over time except in abyss/on orbrun. More monsters spawn upon level generation to compensate.
    • The staves and long blades skills. Staves are merged into maces & flails, long blades are merged with short blades into blades, which all stab and do not riposte.
    • Slings and the slings skill.
    • Scythes. Sigmund and Reapers are weaponless and get AF_REACH instead.
    • Poison magic. Some of the spells are retained in other spell schools.
    • The conjurations school and the conjurer background. Many of the pure conj spells live on elsewhere.
    • Energy randomization.
    • Paralysis from stat zero. Other penalties of stat zero still apply.
    • Not being able to train skills. You can train whatever you want, regardless of your inventory items.
    • Picking up ammo that you fired. It always mulches instead. Ammo drops are increased to compensate. Ammo-consuming spells take more ammo to cast.
    • Displaying hashes for monster stats. AC, EV, and MR are displayed numerically instead.
    • Not knowing how much damage you dealt. Most damage sources will list the damage dealt numerically in addition to various !!!s.
    • Halved experience from ally kills.
    • Orbrun teleport restrictions throughout zot. They apply only on orbrun again.
  • Dungeon changes:
    • No lair. Late dungeon sometimes gets lair-like ruined levels.
    • No crypt.
    • No tomb.
    • Orc is on D:15.
    • Only one sbranch. It's 3 floors and on Orc:2.
    • Vaults is accessible from the sbranch, is 3 floors, and is not runelocked. You can also take a shortcut to get there from D:15.
    • Elf is a timed portal vault on Depths:1.
    • Slime is 4 floors and shows up on vaults:3. You can take a shortcut there from Orc:2.
    • Depths is 3 floors and is accessible from Slime:4, via a shortcut from Vaults:3, or via a shortcut from D:15.
    • Pan is exactly five floors (named lords in a random order followed by holypan) and is always accessible from U:3.
    • Hell branches are on a roulette; you get one instead of four. Hell is accessible from Zot:5 and requires the orb to enter.
    • Orbrun teleport delay is shorter. Carrying the orb no longer reduces your stealth.
    • Abyss has no rune, no experience, and no items. Try not to go there.
    • No labyrinths, desolation of salt, or zig portals.
    • Wucad Mu's monastery is no longer a possible wizlab.
    • Monster spawn lists are altered for several areas, including dungeon, vaults, depths, and zot.
  • Species and background changes:
    • Ghouls get no regen when enemies are in los (slow regen 2) and get a weaker makhleb-style heal on kills. They no longer rot.
    • Vampires get their near-starving stealth level, otherwise they're like a satiated level vampire in regular crawl.
    • Kobolds get incredibly bad stats, incredibly great aptitudes, and the evolution mutation when they reach level 2.
    • Barachians were called frogtaurs, but then they got removed.
    • Removed species: High elf, halfling, deep dwarf, centaur, felid.
    • Removed backgrounds: warper, venom mage.
  • Monster changes:
    • Caustic shrikes are now acid robins. Shard shrikes are now cool robins.
    • Iron trolls are fast instead of slow.
    • Hell knights have nastier spell sets.
    • Orb spiders are elec-immune, lose their AI gimmick and some hd, and can blink, cast lightning bolt, and cast orb of electricity instead of orb of destruction.
    • Hydra heads don't get severed. They start with an extra head compared to normal crawl.
    • Killer klowns get blink close instead of random blink and attack twice.
    • No AF_CHAOS panlords.
    • Deep elf elementalists lose their unique spell and repel missiles. Instead they get dig, cast more frequently, and have better hp.
    • Elemental wellsprings no longer damage themselves when casting spells.
    • Hungry ghosts are now angry ghosts, with much better damage and AF_RAGE.
    • Death oozes can drain speed with their attack.
    • Phantoms blink close and attack to inflict weakness.
    • Silent spectres don't radiate silence, instead casting it very frequently. They also hit a lot harder and are fast.
    • Juggernauts attack faster (200% delay rather than 450%) and cleave.
    • Tzitzimimeh are once again called shadow fiends.
    • Electric eels can leave the water and can constrict you.
    • Removed monsters: boulder beetle, orange crystal statue, hippogriff, sky beast, red devil, kraken, iron golem, leopard gecko, necrophage, river rat, Maurice, every single draconian except the basic (non-colored) one.
    • New monsters: ghost robins, subtractor snakes, mutatatotots, antimatter elves, orb children, THE GIAGGOSTUONOs, zotlings, zotbots, plutonium crabs, giant giants.
  • God changes:
    • Sif Muna gives an Ashenzari-style boost to magic skills.
    • Trog and Okawaru gifts are costlier (longer gift timeout).
    • Troggites can't burn spellbooks.
    • Okawaru's active abilities cost more piety.
    • Trog and Okawaru have faster piety decay. Dith has slower piety decay.
    • Gozag's potion petition and call merchant are more expensive.
    • Chei's abilities have lower mp costs.
    • Qazlal gives more passive SH, has improved scaling on upheaval and disaster area, and gets a new cloud surge ability instead of elemental force.
    • Makhleb loses greater destruction in exchange for the ability to hurl damnation. Passive healing is a little lower and lesser servant is more expensive.
    • Dithmenos doesn't care about fire and has monster detection and sinv as passives.
    • Yred permits gargoyle worship.
    • Zin "gifts" mutation removals starting at ***, no longer has a remove all mutations capstone.
    • Removed gods: Fedhas, Ashenzari, Beogh.
  • Item changes:
    • Elec brand does less damage.
    • Crystal ball of energy is an xp-gated evoker and doesn't do bad things aside from int drain.
    • Rings of fire and ice don't have opposite element weakness.
    • Item generation hands out more books and less wands.
    • Ego body armor is a little more common.
    • Boots can have the dexterity ego and cloaks can have the stealth ego.
    • Amulets are slightly rarer relative to other jewelry.
    • Amulet of faith is slightly less effective.
    • Amulet of magic regeneration is significantly better.
    • Removed potions: blood, experience, degeneration.
    • Removed scrolls: identify, remove curse, random uselessness.
    • Removed rings: protection from fire, protection from cold, teleportation, loudness, flight, stealth.
    • Removed amulets: gourmand, inaccuracy, harm.
    • Removed staves: poison, energy.
    • Removed wand of random effects.
    • No more nets.
  • Spell changes:
    • Necromutation is level 6.
    • Magic Dart is Air.
    • Searing Ray is Fire and does partially nonelemental damage.
    • Dazzling Spray is Fire/Hexes.
    • Force Lance is level 3 Earth/Translocations.
    • Orb of Destruction is Earth.
    • Fulminant Prism is level 5 Air.
    • Conjure Ball Lightning is level 7.
    • Mephitic Cloud is level 4.
    • Silence is level 4.
    • Sticks to Snakes is Transmutations/Summoning.
    • Haste is level 9 and does not cause contamination over time.
    • Invisibility is level 7 and does not cause contamination over time.
    • Cigotuvi's Embrace is like a defensive song of slaying that gives temporary AC and SH when you kill an appropriate monster, and is no longer the worst spell in the game.
    • Song of slaying, repel missiles, deflect missiles, ring of flames, haste, invisibility, cigotuvi's embrace, ozocubu's armour, aura of abjuration, death channel, darkness, regeneration, infusion, excruciating wounds, and all form spells are "permabuffs".
    • Other conjurations not listed here have the conj school dropped with no other change.
    • Removed (player) spells: Shock, Throw Flame, Stone Arrow, Bolt of Magma, Lightning Bolt, Bolt of Cold, Lehudib's Crystal Spear.
    • You can see your spellpower as a number, rather than hashes.
  • Memes:
    • Default name for failed name generation is "dong" instead of plog.
    • Extremely dank new randart names.
    • There's a casual mode if you want to have an easier time.
    • Liches say some funny lines from the hot twitter account dasharez0ne.

THINGS I WILL DO IN THE FUTURE, IF I AM ELECTED SUPREME TAVERN PRESIDENT
  • remove more experience and dungeon levels
  • remove all the consumables that Tavern thinks are overpowered
  • generate lair-like levels in late dungeon MISSION COMPLETE
  • remove a bunch more monsters
  • remove or nerf a bunch of op spells
  • remove a bunch of pointless spells
  • revert "Hellfire -> Damnation"
  • remove food MISSION COMPLETE
  • remove player ghosts MISSION COMPLETE
  • more memes
  • a whole bunch of amazing ideas I havent even thought of yet (patches welcome)

You can check out my fork at https://github.com/Hellmonk/hellcrawl. I will keep working on it until I get bored. Feel free to post your best ideas in here, and if they are not totally stupid and I can implement them with my "local community college compsci freshman with brain-eating amoeba" level of coding ability I will probably do it.

Thanks 4 reading,
Hellmonk

E: you can also play online now.
chequers wrote:Now available on CPO: https://crawl.project357.org/


E once again: you can now play on CBRO as well as on CPO. Happy hellcrawling.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 06:00
by lethediver
make items not generate in pan/abyss

make pan shorter

hellmonk pls

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 06:53
by phloomp
Looking forward to playing this! Here are some other nice things to remove if you feel like it:
Remove poison magic
Remove confusion
Remove ammo
Remove all ranged sources of poison usable by the player

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 14:42
by Shard1697
remove upstairs :twisted:

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 14:48
by BabyRage
Rename giant frog to Pepe, rename blink frog to Rare Pepe.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 14:59
by VeryAngryFelid
Why "Tiles might not work"? Do you mean you haven't tried yet?

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 15:07
by Baldu3
- Remove food
- make sif muna give books at 1 *

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 15:16
by Lasty
Hellmonk wrote:
  • renamed caustic shrikes to acid robins, in the laziest way possible

God damn it, not acid bees? I miss when they were acid bees.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 17:17
by Hellmonk
lethediver wrote:make items not generate in pan/abyss

maybe
lethediver wrote:make pan shorter

yeah
phloomp wrote:Remove poison magic

if it isnt too hard
phloomp wrote:Remove confusion

will do something about confusion ""eventually""
phloomp wrote:Remove ammo

was thinking guaranteed mulch instead, since that will save me the trouble of balancing ranged combat
phloomp wrote:Remove all ranged sources of poison usable by the player

that will take a while, but i'll do my best
Shard1697 wrote:remove upstairs :twisted:

sounds hard, patches welcome
BabyRage wrote:Rename giant frog to Pepe, rename blink frog to Rare Pepe.

no, but I will rename prince ribbit to pepe the frog
VeryAngryFelid wrote:Why "Tiles might not work"? Do you mean you haven't tried yet?

it didn't work for me when I tried it, but I might have missed something with how to build tiles
Baldu3 wrote:- Remove food

on my list already
Baldu3 wrote:- make sif muna give books at 1 *

sounds good, will look into it
Lasty wrote:God damn it, not acid bees? I miss when they were acid bees.

I guess the shrikes could be acid bees and chiller bees, but I would have to change their glyphs and tiles

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Sunday, 18th September 2016, 20:23
by Dungeoneer
add lava orcs back please

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 01:39
by Siegurt
Dungeoneer wrote:add lava orcs back please

Dont forget djinn and sludge elves

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 02:09
by Baldu3
- If you don't chop poison out, add ignite poison to poison start book (and cut it's damage by half, it's completely overpowered with toxic radiance, but otherwise poison book start is SO BORING!).

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 02:12
by PleasingFungus
if you cut ignite poison's damage by half, it'd do dramatically less damage than the poison itself would

i really, really doubt that ignite poison + otr is 'overpowered'.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 03:25
by Baldu3
Ignite poison removes most of the kiting downside of poison.

1. cast toxic radiance
2. walk back 2 steps
3. cast ignite poison
4. repeat if needed

- Normal orcs and other early monsters are 1 iteration of the combo (need 2 cells to kite, 4 actions, 7 mana), orc warriors and yaks are 2 iterations (4 cells, 8 actions, 14 mana), elephants / death yaks / orc knights are 3 iterations (6 cells, 12 actions, 21 mana), orc warlords are 4 iterations (8 cells, 16 actions, 28 mana).
- Combo never misses and hits all monsters on screen.
- Combo makes very little noise.

It's funny for a while but it quickly stops because without the missing/kiting part there is almost no risk, no challenge.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 04:41
by all before
1 s-branch/game (or only 2 runes for the win, one of which must be non-S)

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 04:50
by chequers
Now available on CPO: https://crawl.project357.org/

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 05:07
by Hellmonk
chequers wrote:Now available on CPO: https://crawl.project357.org/

This should include my newest changes.
  • unbreak a whole bunch of des stuff I broke the first time
  • increase named panlord floor chance by a lot
  • remove player ghosts

I will try to update about once a week.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 08:17
by Gongclonker
This is pretty nifty so far!

My request: Remove paralysis. Rupert paralyzed me for 7 turns when he came into view, went berserk, and killed my FoWr with a battleaxe of chopping. Salt.

EDIT: It was a TrMo. Good grief, y'all.

Spoiler: show
Putting the rest under here so it doesn't derail the thread...

I've been coding RPG-related crap for the last few weeks and am totally in the zone. If you want to put some original vaults in, I'm willing to design some. And, I got a 'bot that knows monsters by name/depth/stats, it pits 'em together in Arena mode. We could adapt it to make up vaults that were appropriate for an area. Here's a "typical Dungeon floor" it just created:

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Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 08:30
by Sar
Gongclocker wrote:Rupert paralyzed me

Gongclocker wrote:FoWr

Hmmm.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 13:13
by Lasty
Baldu3 wrote:Ignite poison removes most of the kiting downside of poison.

1. cast toxic radiance
2. walk back 2 steps
3. cast ignite poison
4. repeat if needed

- Normal orcs and other early monsters are 1 iteration of the combo (need 2 cells to kite, 4 actions, 7 mana), orc warriors and yaks are 2 iterations (4 cells, 8 actions, 14 mana), elephants / death yaks / orc knights are 3 iterations (6 cells, 12 actions, 21 mana), orc warlords are 4 iterations (8 cells, 16 actions, 28 mana).
- Combo never misses and hits all monsters on screen.
- Combo makes very little noise.

It's funny for a while but it quickly stops because without the missing/kiting part there is almost no risk, no challenge.


This combo is about equally effective if you skip the Ignite Poison part. OTR is really good right now.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 15:42
by Baldu3
Agreed that toxic radiance is excellent right now, but it needs lots of space and turns to kite any bag of hp. In any case, this isn't the thread for this discussion, so let's agree to disagree, and i'll repeat suggestion:
- add ignite poison to poison start book (if won't do try to find a fun lv2 spell to add in there, poison start is hard to enjoy more then very few times)

Also I had forgot another important suggestion earlier:
- remove traps (i just had an awfully unlucky (but very funny for spectators) trap death while walking over known "safe" terrain to reach an upstairs to rest, stepping in a previously unfound zot trap, getting cast into the abyss, getting found by lightning dogs while trying to rest, getting temporary mutation no regeneration while escaping dogs waiting for teleport to kick in, teleporting in another pack of lightning dogs, dying)

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 15:51
by VeryAngryFelid
+1 for removing traps, it's in the same "fun" category as player ghosts.

Ignite poison would be too powerful in VM starting book since it has Mephitic Cloud also. I remember I had a game where I got Poison Breath mutation (as Na of course) and had Ignite Poison early, that was hilariously OP.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 15:54
by dpeg
Baldu: That story sounds very much like an advertisement for traps!
The bad part is that "safe space" bit, but that can be fixed without throwing away traps.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 16:01
by VeryAngryFelid
dpeg wrote:Baldu: That story sounds very much like an advertisement for traps!
The bad part is that "safe space" bit, but that can be fixed without throwing away traps.


Some theory.
I autoexplore into opening a door, centaur shoots at me with arrow of dispersal, I get blinked adjacent to Sonja with dagger of chaos, she hits me, I get paralyzed and die. Is it fun? Definitely yes. Is it good for the game? I am not sure.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 17:37
by PleasingFungus
How exactly would you fix that? (That specific case can't happen in trunk, but you can certainly find other examples of "autoexploring to your death".)

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 17:57
by VeryAngryFelid
I was trying to say that having interesting situations from something (for example, from traps) does not necessarily mean that "something" is good and should stay in game.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 18:04
by infinitevox
Can we get a special "Duvessa" branch?
-Spawns between D:1 & D:3
- Area is a long straight hallway filled with jackal packs and gnolls equipped with maces of draining
- "Boss" is a Cacoderm named Nawod that malmutates 90% more often while saying "Use tactics to avoid bad mutations!"

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 18:10
by and into
infinitevox wrote:- "Boss" is a Cacoderm named Nawod that malmutates 90% more often while saying "Use tactics to avoid bad mutations!"


FR: Cacoderm. New elephant-type Pan/Abyss enemy.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 18:27
by infinitevox
and into wrote:
infinitevox wrote:- "Boss" is a Cacoderm named Nawod that malmutates 90% more often while saying "Use tactics to avoid bad mutations!"


FR: Cacoderm. New elephant-type Pan/Abyss enemy.


They never forget you, and can/will follow you up/down stairs and through portals until either you kill them or they kill you.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 19:43
by BabyRage
infinitevox wrote:Can we get a special "Duvessa" branch?
-Spawns between D:1 & D:3
- Area is a long straight hallway filled with jackal packs and gnolls equipped with maces of draining
- "Boss" is a Cacoderm named Nawod that malmutates 90% more often while saying "Use tactics to avoid bad mutations!"

It should be giant gecko branch.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Monday, 19th September 2016, 21:13
by phloomp
The mention of Duvessa has reminded me of other important removals:
- Remove monster invisibility
- Remove allies (Watered-down version: remove all permanent allies)
- Remove reaching (or at least remove it for monsters (or at least arrange things so that every monster type either always has reaching or never does))

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 00:50
by Baldu3
- reduce noise of lightning bolt

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 03:02
by VeryAngryFelid
Please fix a bug with boulder beetle removed, I cannot enter Vaults 2 (tried twice).

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 03:19
by Hellmonk
VeryAngryFelid wrote:Please fix a bug with boulder beetle removed, I cannot enter Vaults 2 (tried twice).

Found the problem, am working on it (the problem is I don't know what I'm doing and missed a bunch of stuff in mon_pick).

E: I think it's fixed, sent chequers a pm on irc to update the build. Also removed merfolk avatars and worms. There's a reason I put incompetence as a feature in the op. It's not just a meme, it's a promise!

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 06:20
by lethediver
Hey OP Im playing on CPO, im gonna play your fork for as long as u update.

Vanilla DCSS is just too long and grindy for my tastes. Thanks for the effort bro.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 08:40
by CypherZel
Remove duvessa

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 12:13
by Baldu3
- Make bolt of magma 0% or 50% resistable by rF+ instead of 55%

ps: thanks for making this!

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 14:02
by VeryAngryFelid
Thank you Hellmonk and chequers!
I can proceed now.

Hellmonk , have you changed unrandrarts generation? Or was I just lucky to get 3 unrandarts before first rune?

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 14:08
by Hellmonk
No changes to item generation yet, other than you will naturally get less items because there are less floors.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Tuesday, 20th September 2016, 14:11
by VeryAngryFelid
Please don't change it, standard crawl has too many consumables IMHO.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Wednesday, 21st September 2016, 04:31
by VeryAngryFelid
After clearing Vaults 1-3 and Elf 1-3 the game started to feel easier, maybe decrease Depths and Zot to 4 floors too? I bought two potions of experience after clearing Depths 3 (went from XL 24 to 26) so it was like a normal game after that.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Wednesday, 21st September 2016, 05:06
by Hellmonk
VeryAngryFelid wrote:After clearing Vaults 1-3 and Elf 1-3 the game started to feel easier, maybe decrease Depths and Zot to 4 floors too? I bought two potions of experience after clearing Depths 3 (went from XL 24 to 26) so it was like a normal game after that.

Yeah, I think more cuts will happen eventually. I want to reform/remove some consumables and spells first, maybe tweak some monster sets as well. I'm considering the single sbranch rotation idea proposed in this thread and possibly removing a floor from elf as well. Still lots of potential places for cuts. How long did your game take compared to your typical turncount/real-time in crawl?

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Wednesday, 21st September 2016, 07:11
by CypherZel
Is poison magic removed?

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Wednesday, 21st September 2016, 09:41
by goodcoolguy
I tried this. It's kind of nice. You might want to look at mid-dungeon spawns. Too many junk monsters, a little too much experience lost without lair, but a lot closer to the right level than with lair. Only one lair branch would be good too.

e: Some particular offenders: Sky beasts (should be removed entirely), frogs, orcs below warrior tier, hippogriffs. Maybe try replacing these with more wyverns and wasps, elves, maybe death yaks and hydras past d:10 or so.

e2: Also gnolls past like d:6, not so good. Maybe try vanilla merfolk with one fancy merfolk to replace the gnoll shaman/sergeant packs. Probably orc high priest/sorceror + warrior packs would be good replacements for the kobold demonologist + random kobolds packs too.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Wednesday, 21st September 2016, 12:32
by VeryAngryFelid
Hellmonk wrote:How long did your game take compared to your typical turncount/real-time in crawl?


Slightly faster in turncount but slower real-time. Australian server is slow for me, I am offline player mostly.

HuBe in your fork
  Code:
 The game lasted 06:37:42 (70094 turns).


For comparison, MuBe in 0.18 offline
  Code:
The game lasted 05:09:00 (79817 turns).

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Wednesday, 21st September 2016, 15:41
by HardboiledGargoyle
You could already get less XP and fewer consumables if you played Mummy, so you're not getting much new in that regard if you're playing MiBe or something. The bigger benefit here, I think, is reducing the repetitiveness of fighting the same monsters too many times with the same character, which makes you become bored with your build.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Wednesday, 21st September 2016, 16:48
by VeryAngryFelid
While fighting the same monsters less times is useful, main benefit for me is increased difficulty due to reduced XP and items (both consumables and gear). I felt really underpowered in late Dungeon, Orc, Lair branches, Vaults 1-3, Elf, early Depths and that's with rather powerful combo. I felt ok in late Depths, Vaults 4 and Zot.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Thursday, 22nd September 2016, 01:11
by WingedEspeon
Any advice on compiling under windows? I have tried all of the compiling methods under install.txt and they all failed. Visual stuidio is telling me it couldn't load the solution when building dependencys and the others seem to be complaining about a lack of DeJaVu fonts.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Thursday, 22nd September 2016, 03:59
by PleasingFungus
Try popping in to the ##crawl-dev channel on freenode; gammafunk or someone can try to help you out there.

Re: [proclick] new fork, hellcrawl

PostPosted: Thursday, 22nd September 2016, 08:49
by DracheReborn
Congrats Sandman25/FuriousCat. Only online win so far for hellcrawl, I think?

Possible issue with uniques placement. I ran into a floor with at least 4 uniques (Josephine, Nessos, Rupert, and Blork in Orc:2). I'm pretty sure the same thing can happen in regular crawl, but I'm wondering if it's more common in hellcrawl because of fewer places that some uniques can generate.