I want nausea back


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Vestibule Violator

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 17:53

I want nausea back

And also remove automatic chunk eating, and add back in chunk rot/named chunks(simulacrum just isn't the same!).

Also, just a side note, please bring back branded ammo, spear/weapon throwing, and damaged throwing nets.

EDIT: Itemdest
Last edited by Tiktacy on Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 02:01, edited 1 time in total.
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Barkeep

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 18:11

Re: I want nausea back

so, 0.12?

Slime Squisher

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 18:35

Re: I want nausea back

I wouldn't mind having branded ammo. Dealing 25% (?) more damage is pretty good.
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Vestibule Violator

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 19:26

Re: I want nausea back

archaeo wrote:so, 0.12?


No, 0.12 doesn't have the new art for TRJ and hellions.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 20:42

Re: I want nausea back

archaeo wrote:so, 0.12?
Tiktacy's making fun of the str weight person, not seriously asking for nausea back

Sar

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 21:03

Re: I want nausea back

bring back itemdest

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Slime Squisher

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 21:25

Re: I want nausea back

Sar wrote:bring back itemdest

They already did, it's called *Fragile
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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 21:26

Re: I want nausea back

infinitevox wrote:
Sar wrote:bring back itemdest

They already did, it's called *Fragile

Any connection between itemdest and *Fragile is superficial at best.
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Ziggurat Zagger

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 21:43

Re: I want nausea back

Sar wrote:bring back itemdest

but this is not a thread for serious suggestions
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FeEE{HOIEMiAE}GrGlHuWrGnWrNaAKBaFi{MiDeMfDe}{DrAKTrAMGhEnGnWz}
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Slime Squisher

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 22:27

Re: I want nausea back

ydeve wrote:
infinitevox wrote:
Sar wrote:bring back itemdest

They already did, it's called *Fragile

Any connection between itemdest and *Fragile is superficial at best.


I disagree heartily.
*Fragile is basically the same to me as scrolls burning due to sticky flame or potions bursting due to freezing.
It's a game mechanic that is annoying at best and makes items worse than useless.
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Barkeep

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 22:32

Re: I want nausea back

duvessa wrote:
archaeo wrote:so, 0.12?
Tiktacy's making fun of the str weight person, not seriously asking for nausea back

dang, right over my dumb head.

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Post Tuesday, 10th May 2016, 22:58

Re: I want nausea back

Itemdest is still in the game, it just happens from monster inventories (especially Maurice) and Zot traps (wand charges) instead of fire/cold attacks.

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 04:11

Re: I want nausea back

infinitevox wrote:
ydeve wrote:
infinitevox wrote:They already did, it's called *Fragile

Any connection between itemdest and *Fragile is superficial at best.


I disagree heartily.
*Fragile is basically the same to me as scrolls burning due to sticky flame or potions bursting due to freezing.
It's a game mechanic that is annoying at best and makes items worse than useless.

They are 100% different design-wise. itemdestr lowers the number of consumables while *Fragile "prevents" you from removing equipment.

Look up the threads on itemdestr if you want to understand more.

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 06:47

Re: I want nausea back

what, no permanent corrosion back?

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 06:55

Re: I want nausea back

infinitevox wrote:I disagree heartily.
*Fragile is basically the same to me as scrolls burning due to sticky flame or potions bursting due to freezing.
It's a game mechanic that is annoying at best and makes items worse than useless.

i'm gonna break CYC kayfabe here and ask, sincerely: can you explain yourself further? What exactly makes *fragile so bad? What's a scenario in which it's "worse than useless?"

I'm really curious here, since this isn't the first time i've seen this sentiment, and I feel like I'm missing something here.

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Slime Squisher

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 08:14

Re: I want nausea back

I've had *Fragile spawn on several randart weapons I wore-ID'd where my primary killdudes was evokable Rods. (Sure, "don't wear-ID" but remove curse is more plentiful than ID)
So now I can't evoke if I want to keep the weapon AND I'm out hundreds of gold from buying it out of a shop. And since I picked the weapon, I don't have enough gold to buy that randart cloak the shop also had for sale.
Now you can argue that the stats on the weapon could have been total crap, this is true, but now there's yet /another/ mod that shows up and single-highhandedly ruins the item.
Other randarts can be offset (if you have a bad roll or two) by the rest of your EQ, or the -3 Str can be shouldered, so those can be mitigated. *Fragile cannot.

I understand it was introduced to try and force people into "strategic decisions", but there's really nothing strategic about it. The item has been turned into a consumable, which is the complete opposite direction that the design philosophy for the game has been declared.

It's also a UI nuisance. If I accidentally swap the wrong ring b/c I'm not paying 100% attention, I just lost my item permanently. Which to me is very similar to: I saw a mottled dragon and hit "tab" once before trying to drop scrolls, now my teleport scrolls are all burnt up.

I'll hit back on this more tomorrow, I just realized what time it was. >.>
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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 08:15

Re: I want nausea back

infinitevox wrote:It's also a UI nuisance. If I accidentally swap the wrong ring b/c I'm not paying 100% attention, I just lost my item permanently.


Don't fragile items prompt before letting you swap?

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 10:36

Re: I want nausea back

does it ask when you equip it too?

Tartarus Sorceror

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 13:10

Re: I want nausea back

I pretty much never equip artifact items without iding them anymore. Too many *contam and distortion weapons...

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 18:10

Re: I want nausea back

PleasingFungus wrote:
infinitevox wrote:I disagree heartily.
*Fragile is basically the same to me as scrolls burning due to sticky flame or potions bursting due to freezing.
It's a game mechanic that is annoying at best and makes items worse than useless.

i'm gonna break CYC kayfabe here and ask, sincerely: can you explain yourself further? What exactly makes *fragile so bad? What's a scenario in which it's "worse than useless?"

I'm really curious here, since this isn't the first time i've seen this sentiment, and I feel like I'm missing something here.


People don't like losing their stuff. *Fragile makes them lose their stuff.

You could potentially accomplish a similar but less extreme "no swapping" property by letting randarts have the curse-on-equip of the Obsidian Axe, although I don't know how much better or worse that would really be.

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Shoals Surfer

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Post Wednesday, 11th May 2016, 18:34

Re: I want nausea back

genericpseudonym wrote:People don't like losing their stuff. *Fragile makes them lose their stuff.

You could potentially accomplish a similar but less extreme "no swapping" property by letting randarts have the curse-on-equip of the Obsidian Axe, although I don't know how much better or worse that would really be.


It would make swapping take one more turn than with a vanilla, uncursed, unfragile item.

Your first two sentences sum it up. People are psychologically attached to their stuff and dread the possibility of having to make a strategic decision of a fragile item - they are used to being able to switch around items at will and the Fragile ego pretty much just takes them out of their comfort zone in this regard.
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Post Thursday, 12th May 2016, 01:21

Re: I want nausea back

infinitevox wrote:I've had *Fragile spawn on several randart weapons I wore-ID'd where my primary killdudes was evokable Rods. (Sure, "don't wear-ID" but remove curse is more plentiful than ID)
So now I can't evoke if I want to keep the weapon AND I'm out hundreds of gold from buying it out of a shop. And since I picked the weapon, I don't have enough gold to buy that randart cloak the shop also had for sale.
Now you can argue that the stats on the weapon could have been total crap, this is true, but now there's yet /another/ mod that shows up and single-highhandedly ruins the item.
Other randarts can be offset (if you have a bad roll or two) by the rest of your EQ, or the -3 Str can be shouldered, so those can be mitigated. *Fragile cannot.

I understand it was introduced to try and force people into "strategic decisions", but there's really nothing strategic about it. The item has been turned into a consumable, which is the complete opposite direction that the design philosophy for the game has been declared.

OK, I think I see what you're saying. If you buy a *Fragile randart, that purchase can be worse then useless, since characters who depend on weapon-swapping probably aren't going to want to use a *Fragile weapon. (Unless that weapon is strong enough to encourage you to switch playstyles, of course!) That seems like a relatively niche circumstance, but i can understand why it could be annoying.

It's still odd to me, though: how is *Fragile any different from *Contam or *Drain here? It's not any more common, and both of the latter properties actively penalize your character for wear-iding an artefact with it (if you don't want to keep using that artefact). Are you even more annoyed by those?

As an aside, I'd disagree that *Fragile items are 'consumables'. Most of the time, I'd think, swaps to *Fragile items would be strategic, not tactical.

lethediver wrote:Don't fragile items prompt before letting you swap?

adozu wrote:does it ask when you equip it too?

Yes, to both.

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Post Thursday, 12th May 2016, 11:13

Re: I want nausea back

PleasingFungus wrote:It's still odd to me, though: how is *Fragile any different from *Contam or *Drain here? It's not any more common, and both of the latter properties actively penalize your character for wear-iding an artefact with it (if you don't want to keep using that artefact). Are you even more annoyed by those?

It might be that you can take off a *Contam or *Drain item, suffer the effects once, then put it back on at a later time when you won't need to unequip it, after you have weened yourself off of relying on whatever swap items you are using. With *Fragile, you either accept the loss of power to your character now or the loss of using the item later.

That said, I don't mind *Fragile, but that's probably because I rarely have a good use for identify scrolls past the early game aside from artifact ID.

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Post Thursday, 12th May 2016, 17:49

Re: I want nausea back

genericpseudonym wrote:People don't like losing their stuff. *Fragile makes them lose their stuff.


I think this hits the nail on the head. People have an irrational dislike of "losing" stuff. Losing a "useful" (but really useless) *Fragile weapon is seen as worse than unequiping an otherwise identical *Contam weapon, even though the reverse is actually true.

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Post Thursday, 12th May 2016, 23:11

Re: I want nausea back

But you don't lose *fragile items unless you unequip them.

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Post Thursday, 12th May 2016, 23:23

Re: I want nausea back

Just have fragile items always preidentified, already.

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Post Saturday, 14th May 2016, 22:39

Re: I want nausea back

Rast wrote:Just have fragile items always preidentified, already.

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