Frostbite

[Sar]

I got a chance to play a bit with the new fixedart axe, Frostbite. For those who don't know, it's a +8 executioner's axe {freezing cloud, *Noise +Fly rC+}. The "freezing cloud" part refers to the fact that it makes a freezing cloud under an enemy it strikes... occasionally. Now, I used it from Lair till Pan and, apart from being a +8 executioner's axe, which is a powerful weapon by itself, it didn't feel too special for me. It felt at its most useful in Snake, where the clouds would slow down nagas and snakes... but doesn't the regular freeze brand do the same? I find that it's hard not to compare it to Firestarter, the great mace fixedart that innerflames things it hits and is a hilarious weapon that is really fun to use. Frostbite comparatively is very disappointing. Another thing about it, that is more of an interface screw, is how the clouds fuck up autofight - it will refuse to move into clouds so you have to do it manually (Firestarter bypasses that by also making clouds underneath you).

I guess the question is - is Frostbite supposed to be just a flavourful weapon, not different in its power from a regular old executioner's axe? Or is it supposed to be something more?

Also the tile for it looks like fat Wucad Mu.

[bcadren]

I have to say, all but the noise sound fairly boring. Though I suppose it's the only fixedArt exec axe (Woe doesn't count) so it's got that going for it and that's nice.

[Sar]

Maybe it should sometimes shoot mini-glaciates at the things it hits???

[bcadren]

Maybe it should sometimes shoot mini-glaciates at the things it hits???

OK. "It sounds pretty boring." is not code for "It should be the most brokenly powerful weapon in the game. Muahahaha!"

[daggaz]

Why wouldn't it have freeze as well as freezing cloud?? Especially considering the cloud effect is only a percentage on hits. You would likely outdamage that thing with a +9 executioners of freezing you made yourself.

[Sar]

I actually have no idea if it has the regular freeze brand or not. And if mini-glaciate is too strong, maybe at least cone-shaped freezing clouds with random length?

[bcadren]

At least it's better than Punk (which can only be described as a BORING SLING).

[Sar]

I only remember than Punk exists when weapon acquirement gives it to me out of the blue.

[bcadren]

I only remember than Punk exists when weapon acquirement gives it to me out of the blue.

I ascended a Centaur that used Punk (and two greatslings that were clearly better than [and oddly similar to] Punk).

the +7 greatsling of Havoc {speed, rPois}
(You bought it in a shop on level 4 of the Orcish Mines)

the +10 greatsling "Qujy" {freeze, rN+}
(You found it on level 6 of the Pits of Slime)

Also had the Black Knight's Barding, Amulet of Four Winds, an MR+ Slay+6 ring...was a nice game. (Used Sling + Large Shield for ranged and Blade Hands for close).

[TeshiAlair]

1.....you used a centaur without bows? Was that just for shields?

2. Rather than shooting a glaciate, which is insane, why not make it have a chance to either just freeze into a block.

Or simulacrum reap

[Airwolf]

Ozo's Refridgeration or Metabolic Englaciation? Icemail?

Edit: Passive Freeze?

[Sar]

It's a HUGE AXE, it should do DAMAGE instead of increasing your defences.

[pubby]

I hate how the clouds that Frostbite and Firestarter create wreck pathing. Every second: "Are you sure you want to walk into that cloud of foo?"

Why can't they provide immunities to their cloud types?...

[Sar]

Well, it's less of a problem with Firestarter because it makes fire clouds underneath you too.

[HardboiledGargoyle]

why not make it have a chance to either just freeze into a block

This is pretty good. Turn monsters into blocks of ice when they would normally just die instead. The game may slow down a bit if you just want to tabtabtab but hey look at Frostbite now.

[Croases]

When you attack an ice block, it should slide off towards the direction you pushed it, hitting anything on its path for ice damage and destroying itself in the process (but monsters still have to attack and break the block because there are no arcades in the dungeon and they never played Snow Bros).

There, tabbing problem solved!

[bcadren]

1.....you used a centaur without bows? Was that just for shields?

UC and Blade Hands (Melee) and Great Sling + Large Shield (Ranged)...it was mostly a melee character. Also had ungodly AC (Black Knight's Horse Barding and +9 Shadow Dragon Armour) 52/15/26 defenses Without the Shield/Gloves Melded; 49/14/0 with melded (no other buffs) 55/22/0 (all other buffs) [Stoneskin, Phase Shift]

[crate]

1.....you used a centaur without bows? Was that just for shields?

did you know that even if centaurs could not even wield bows they would still be in the top 2 most powerful races in crawl?

[bcadren]

1.....you used a centaur without bows? Was that just for shields?

did you know that even if centaurs could not even wield bows they would still be in the top 2 most powerful races in crawl?

Top 2? What's the 1 then? Troll? Felid? Spriggan?

[crate]

dd, you can argue about the ordering

[bcadren]

dd, you can argue about the ordering

I...hate DD and somewhat disagree (only in that DD without Makh, Pakellas, Trog or a Vampiric Weapon is a pain in the ass). With no healing, DD is pretty bad...I've tried it, even playing as optimally as possible (ranged character avoiding all melee)...run out of MP completely..miserable slow death.

[duvessa]

the thing about DD is that it actually has more healing than any other race in the game

[bcadren]

the thing about DD is that it actually has more healing than any other race in the game

Because an average of ~200 HW charges of for an average of 38 HP each. (assuming you got 50 mMP and spent all of it)...so 7600 HP over the whole game...that's not that good. [and that's assuming a no-magic at all build since you destroy your MP to do that.]

[Blade]

It's not practical or reasonable to discuss DD outside of the context of DD*Makhleb, Ely, Pak, or Trog, since that is literally the way DD was designed to be played. It's like talking about Sp*Chei. It just doesn't make sense. DD is not number one because of DDAK, it is number one because it's incredible when used how it was designed.

[bcadren]

Yea, Blade is mostly right. DD^Ely isn't sustainable anymore though because of the slowish Exploration piety not giving enough healing.

[Piginabag]

the thing about DD is that it actually has more healing than any other race in the game

Without "thanks" your responses are like that of a raving lunatic, though aptly, finally.

[Floodkiller]

Yea, Blade is mostly right. DD^Ely isn't sustainable anymore though because of the slowish Exploration piety not giving enough healing.

This is an exaggeration. I won this DDFE^Ely during the 0.16 tournament (after double damage was patched) despite my several poor strategic/skilling choices throughout the game. The only times my piety was an issue was after finishing Depths (I was a bit low, so I re-entered Abyss after already grabbing the rune on the way down to refill it quickly instead of exploring Zot for it) and Zot:5 (after abusing divine protection). Food was (or should have been) a non-issue: I only have 5 rations left because I was casting LCS and Iron Shot a lot at 11.9 Spellcasting and 30 Int throughout Zot because I had plenty of food left when I started it and didn't realize how quickly I was burning through my stores until Zot:5. In both cases, misplaying caused those shortages (especially in Zot:5), mainly due to a desire to complete the combo for the last slot in Nemelex's Choice before going to sleep and heading to work the next day (and potentially see someone else win the combo before I got home). Note that I also still had more than enough MP to spare for more device recharging on my heal wounds wand if I were desperate for preserving either food or piety.

DD^Ely is still very much sustainable, even for a player that is not nearly as skillful. It just isn't as strong as it was under old Ely, which gives a sore comparison point. I would not play it again, but only because of my opinion that Ely (new and old) is monotonous.

[lethediver]

This weapon was good on my +25 axe hill orc of qazlal...

[Sar]

It is good, but it's not good because of its special effect, it's good because it's a +8 exec axe. Which is a bit boring IMO.