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back in my day

PostPosted: Saturday, 29th August 2015, 08:25
by n1000
http://pastebin.com/i9dtztmA original post (rip)

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Saturday, 29th August 2015, 08:38
by tedric
this post deserves an "epic thank" button

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Saturday, 29th August 2015, 14:04
by twelwe
get em nonethousand

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Saturday, 29th August 2015, 17:13
by moocowmoocow
I feel shame and self hatred after reading this.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Saturday, 29th August 2015, 17:22
by archaeo
moocowmoocow wrote:I feel shame and self hatred after reading this.

I thought that's how you were supposed to feel after reading posts in the Tavern

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Saturday, 29th August 2015, 18:46
by Arrhythmia
OP you should get a divorce and marry a woman you love.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Saturday, 29th August 2015, 23:55
by Aule
n1000 wrote:millennials are turnips.

Note to self: Saying someone has no balls is crass; calling them turnips is multiple-thanks-worthy.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 00:28
by dynast
GET OUT OF THE COMPUTER GRANDMA!

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 01:37
by rockygargoyle
Aule wrote:
n1000 wrote:millennials are turnips.

Note to self: Saying someone has no balls is crass; calling them turnips is multiple-thanks-worthy.

Oh man, I've been waiting the whole month for the "let's find things to get mad at" game!

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 02:12
by Aule
y u mad bro?

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 03:45
by yesno
The average participant is male (92%), 24 years old, and lives in the USA (46%)

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 05:20
by Aule
yesno wrote:
The average participant is male (92%), 24 years old, and lives in the USA (46%)

So are those who are older to be considered above average, and those who live in Australia below average?

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 06:56
by yesno
once i quaffed the red potion, i began to see liberal elven turnipification for the dungeon it truly is, and now i know there's no going back

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 15:58
by yesno
thats right. lap up the funnies gentlemen

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 18:17
by Sprucery
I once posted a line containing the words "hot pussies" and the post was deleted by a mod...

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Sunday, 30th August 2015, 18:40
by rockygargoyle
Context matters

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 12:24
by scorpionwarrior
Aule wrote:
n1000 wrote:millennials are turnips.

Note to self: Saying someone has no balls is crass; calling them turnips is multiple-thanks-worthy.


I agree, its so unfair that people value funny ironic posts over weird whiny screeds about which playstyle is more manly than others

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 18:44
by Lasty
Aule is correct that using "pussies" as an insult isn't acceptable here.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 18:54
by mps
Less offensive and more accurate.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 21:25
by tasonir
Need to go further back with the crawl references imho, I've only been playing since .9 and I recognized all of them. I assume the scrolls at ugly thing is just for preventing item destruction, I don't think there was anything unique to ugly things and scrolls.

How about something like "My ogre mage was so smart he could count exactly how much experience he had!" (example: http://crawl.akrasiac.org/rawdata/jarmo ... 9-1243.txt)

Or, kids these days are so terse with their rF, back in my day we said R-fire and we liked it fine that way!

Back in my day, we were actually rewarded for collecting gold, because we knew what value is! Not some commie-everyone-is-equal hippyland like you folks these days!

Need to find some more .1 and .2 players, if they aren't all speaking in tongues by now...

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 21:46
by tedric
back in my day, misogynist comments aimed at nobody in particular weren't actually insults when they were wrapped in an obvious layer of parody

this is exactly the sort of pussyfooted mod-damn coddling that turns promising young crawlers into turnips in the first place

now get off my lawn

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 21:48
by Arrhythmia
lasty you dense motherfucker

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 22:03
by Sprucery
Back in my day we did with one rune what the kids today need 3 runes for. And Zot:5 was a quick and clean in-out operation because we knew how to control teleports.

  Code:
 Dungeon Crawl version 3.20 character file.


Jysky the Destroyer (Hill Orc)

(Level 23 Fire Elementalist)

Experience : 23/483477

Strength 18     Dexterity 12     Intelligence 16

Hit Points : 172          Magic Points : 30

AC : 23          Evasion : 12          Shield : 9

Gp : 114


You escaped.

You worship Vehumet.

Vehumet is exalted by your worship.

You are not hungry.


  Inventory:

Hand weapons

 a - a +5,+5 short sword of slicing (weapon) (687gp)

Armour

 i - a +2 orcish cloak (worn) (160gp)

 j - a +2 helmet (worn) (198gp)

 s - a +2 shield of protection (worn) (539gp)

 u - a +1 pair of gloves (worn) (61gp)

 w - a +4 dwarven scale mail of fire resistance (worn) (2453gp)

 x - a +1 pair of boots (worn) (65gp)

Magical devices

 b - a wand of fireball (5) (135gp)

 f - a wand of teleportation (5) (60gp)

 F - a wand of frost (17) (117gp)

 I - a wand of disintegration (2) (75gp)

 J - a wand of invisibility (7) (87gp)

 M - a wand of lightning (8) (180gp)

 N - a wand of hasting (3) (72gp)

Comestibles

 c - a bread ration (80gp)

 v - 9 royal jellies (2520gp)

Jewellery

 e - an amulet of the gourmand (105gp)

 l - the ring "Xuminynon" (595gp)

 n - the amulet "Tu" (neck) (560gp)

 p - a +4 ring of intelligence (350gp)

 q - an amulet of resist corrosion (210gp)

 r - a ring of life protection (left hand) (420gp)

 t - a ring of protection from magic (280gp)

 y - a ring of magical power (280gp)

 z - a +5 ring of intelligence (420gp)

 C - a ring of see invisible (140gp)

 D - an amulet of clarity (210gp)

 E - a +0,+5 ring of slaying (210gp)

 G - a ring of fire (right hand) (434gp)

Potions

 d - 5 potions of healing (100gp)

 g - 2 potions of restore abilities (100gp)

 K - a potion of mutation (50gp)

Books

 h - a book of Charms (250gp)

Orbs of Power

 k - the Orb of Zot (10000gp)

Miscellaneous

 B - a serpentine rune of Zot (1200gp)

 H - a lamp of fire (500gp)



 You have 1 experience left.


   Skills:

 + Level 12 Fighting

 + Level 17 Short Blades

 + Level 5 Darts

 + Level 10 Armour

 + Level 9 Dodging

 + Level 7 Stealth

 + Level 2 Stabbing

 + Level 9 Shields

 + Level 12 Traps & Doors

 + Level 11 Unarmed Combat

 + Level 8 Spellcasting

 + Level 20 Conjurations

 + Level 18 Fire Magic



You have 2 spell levels left.

You know the following spells:

 a - Burn

 b - Throw Flame

 c - Conjure Flame

 d - Sticky Flame

 e - Bolt of Fire

 f - Fireball

 g - Fire Storm

 h - Iskenderun's Mystic Blast

 i - Repel Missiles


           Mutations & Other Weirdness

Your mind is acute (Int +1).

You digest meat inefficiently.

You can control translocations.

You can teleport at will.

You can spit poison.

You can sense your immediate surroundings.

Your muscles are flexible (Dex +1), but weak (Str -1).


Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 22:04
by Moose
How is it that anyone finds the term "pussy" so offensive?

If I understand correctly, it's comparing someone to a female cat, which (supposedly) is meek and timid.

I find it a bit trigger-happy on the modding here.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 22:24
by Arrhythmia
Moose wrote:How is it that anyone finds the term "pussy" so offensive?

If I understand correctly, it's comparing someone to a female cat, which (supposedly) is meek and timid.

I find it a bit trigger-happy on the modding here.


oh my god it's a vagina. don't try to tip-toe around this by acting ignorant.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 22:25
by ZipZipskins
Arrhythmia wrote:oh my god it's a vagina.


that's what I say every time I have sex

I'm engaged somehow

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 22:36
by Moose
Arrhythmia wrote:
Moose wrote:How is it that anyone finds the term "pussy" so offensive?

If I understand correctly, it's comparing someone to a female cat, which (supposedly) is meek and timid.

I find it a bit trigger-happy on the modding here.


oh my god it's a vagina. don't try to tip-toe around this by acting ignorant.


I don't think it was used in the context of it being a vagina, and I'm not pretending to be ignorant.
If you call someone a pussy, you are typically accusing them of being shy, or timid.

Just like when I say that I rode my uncle's ass last night, I'd hope that you'd all assume I went for a donkey ride.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 22:53
by yesno
i wonder why women don't post here

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 23:27
by tedric
Actually, the etymology of "pussy" as an insult is pretty confusing and unclear -- the senses of "feminine", "cat-like", "timid" and "vagina" have been so muddled together in various combinations for so many centuries that it's basically impossible to untangle them. But etymology is far less relevant than the fact that, these days, the most common uses are intended to explicitly or implicitly insult women, so even innocuous uses -- like "pussycat" or "pussyfooted", which I used above and is very clearly from the "cat-like" sense of walking gently on fuzzy little feet -- are burdened with a sense of guilt-by-association misogynism.

But the question of whether a word can be considered an offensive insult is different from questions of appropriate use (and moderation) of those words in the context of this forum. I support moderation of direct insults aimed at another poster; I have no objection, but do give a little eyeroll, to the moderation of the parodic use in the OP of this thread. And in general I think unexpected terms like "turnips" make for much more clever insults anyway!

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 23:36
by onget
Discrimination is one of the theme of DCSS.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Monday, 31st August 2015, 23:57
by Dharmy
FR: language = turnip

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 00:27
by yesno
if there's one thing i know women love in this world it's when men take a brief break from video games to argue among themselves about misogynist words

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 01:43
by Aule
TL;DR: sporks :roll:

Spoiler: show
I probably shouldn't do this, but I feel again that I have to explain myself, even knowing it cannot penetrate the skulls of the incitants against me, here.

This seems to have started when I wrote that aforementioned "screed" (though there is inarguably nothing "whiny" about it; whiny would more accurately characterize the characterization). The thing is, when I wrote that "screed," I thought I was being funny. I was laughing when I wrote it, and I thought that many others might also be amused. Obviously, I was wrong, and this hasn't been the first time that something I though was amusing others found to be "weird" (believe it or not). So I "manned up" and made my due apologies, because it is never my intention to truly offend anyone.

Now, in this thread, I was also laughing when I observed the obvious double standard in play regarding pussies. I thought is was amusingly ironic that there would be two separate standards, but I'm also not so naive as to believe the standards have only to do with the words themselves. It is partly, if not mostly, the one doing the speaking that determines how the words are received, usually, and that someone thought to be "weird" will be less likely to find appreciation than anyone considered "hip" or "cool." This also is a common double-standard at work across the spectrum of humanity, and one thing that I in my weirdness have never really understood, ever since I was very little, when my weirdness became apparent (which, by the way, was a long, long time ago). Human beings never outgrow that cliquishness, probably because it's some kind of hardwired primate neurology.

So what happens is that those who hate continue to do so, holding grudges, and attack when they see their opening. Maybe they really want to come right out and say, "Go away," but they're just too timid.

One thing I know for sure is that any discussion of misogyny has no place in this thread, because the OP's use of the female organ and my use of the male organ to state pretty much the same thing (admittedly to vastly different degrees of effectiveness) - "don't be so damn timid" - are not in and of themselves hateful toward women. To characterize either example as misogyny is to not understand the meaning of the word. Nobody is hating on females by simply lobbing around common genital organ words or expressions that are in relatively equal use by all sexes and age groups.

Full disclosure: I personally love women, and I have always felt myself to be about 50% female and 50% male. I get along with women far better than men, truth be told, and my platonic women friends outnumber my male friends. I would say that tossing around the word, misogyny, as a label is itself offensive, because it cheapens a meaningful word, diluting it into meaninglessness.

So, fine, I'm weird, I don't make friends easily. If you really have that hard of a time being civil toward someone different than yourself, then maybe you might want to look into that to see what's really behind it. And if you do seriously want me to go away, I will be happy to do so. If you want me to be someone else, though, then you might as well just say go, and it really doesn't matter at that point whether you are civil or an asshole about it.

For the record, I applaud the OP for a funny and engaging post. Sorry my lack of wittiness (but not wit) seems to have ruined things. I even tried to let it pass with more "humorous" commentary, but, no, it wasn't to be, because I'm not really humorous to many (but don't confuse that with "to none"), but also because those axes must be ground.

You should also know that the mods turned down my suggestion to only allow posts from me under strict supervision. (True story, almost.)

Maybe we should repost that poll?

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 02:53
by rockygargoyle
You shouldn't take this (or anything online, for that matter) forum so seriously, it's very easy to misinterpretate things and worry about something that doesn't even matter

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 04:09
by n1000
what the fuck is this

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 04:11
by n1000
im furious

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 04:31
by Sar
n1000 wrote:what the fuck is this

liberal turnipification of the Tavern

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 06:02
by duvessa
tasonir wrote:Or, kids these days are so terse with their rF, back in my day we said R-fire and we liked it fine that way!
nobody ever said "r-fire", they always said rF; the game changed to the players' language, not the other way around

tedric wrote:Actually, the etymology of "pussy" as an insult is pretty confusing and unclear -- the senses of "feminine", "cat-like", "timid" and "vagina" have been so muddled together in various combinations for so many centuries that it's basically impossible to untangle them. But etymology is far less relevant than the fact that, these days, the most common uses are intended to explicitly or implicitly insult women, so even innocuous uses -- like "pussycat" or "pussyfooted", which I used above and is very clearly from the "cat-like" sense of walking gently on fuzzy little feet -- are burdened with a sense of guilt-by-association misogynism.

But the question of whether a word can be considered an offensive insult is different from questions of appropriate use (and moderation) of those words in the context of this forum. I support moderation of direct insults aimed at another poster; I have no objection, but do give a little eyeroll, to the moderation of the parodic use in the OP of this thread. And in general I think unexpected terms like "turnips" make for much more clever insults anyway!
when i was in 1st grade at recess i saw a girl with a stuffed Tweety doll, and i thought it would be clever to call her "pussycat" since in the cartoons Tweety was always saying "i tawt i taw a puddy tat". (i was 5 at the time, you see, so it was clever to me)
for some reason the "cat" part didn't come out and i just said "pussy". i thought it was just slang for "cat" and didn't realize it was ever used as an insult, let alone a gendered one, or that it could also mean vagina. so i got a card for that. they also didn't explain what "pussy" meant, so i was really confused. when i told my mom after school she laughed for a solid minute or so

another time i read "what the hey" in one of the books in school and got a card for saying that at recess too, because my 5 year old voice made it sound like "what the hell". i kept trying to tell them "i said what the hey, not what the hell" but it always just sounded like i was saying "what the hell" twice, they could never figure it out, and it didn't occur to me to write it down or something

there was also one of those dumb steering wheel things on the playground, but the actual steering wheel was missing, so there were just the two holes where it was mounted. i put my middle finger in one of the holes, it got stuck, and eventually (like 20 minutes later) the janitor had to squirt soap on it to get it out. i spent the rest of the day showing my swollen, red finger to people and unknowingly flipping them off in the process. somehow i didn't get in trouble for this

fuck i hated school

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 08:52
by mps
duvessa wrote:fuck i hated school


Guess you should've fucking educated yourself then.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 09:04
by Sprucery
In Tavern, fuck is never out of context, unlike pussy.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 11:09
by emikaela
yesno wrote:i wonder why women don't post here

We do, you just have to stop assuming that everyone is male until proven otherwise

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 11:25
by Lasty
Sprucery wrote:In Tavern, fuck is never out of context, unlike pussy.

"Fuck" isn't ever a gendered insult.

Edit: just to be clear, the problem isn't describing people's body parts or swearing. The problem is that "pussy" used as an insult has a history of being used to gay-bash and insult "woman-ish" behavior. I know it's being used ironically in the original post, but I'm sure you can think of other contextually-problematic words that you wouldn't feel are acceptable even in irony.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 11:31
by onget
Spam rant in the roguelike is very common.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 11:39
by yesno
emikaela wrote:
yesno wrote:i wonder why women don't post here

We do,


no we don't

you just have to stop assuming that everyone is male until proven otherwise


when talking about video games this would be stupid perfectionist remove assumption

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Tuesday, 1st September 2015, 11:39
by mps
emikaela wrote:
yesno wrote:i wonder why women don't post here

We do, you just have to stop assuming that everyone is male until proven otherwise


Good point, but I think yesno's talking about all the women who don't post because of the guys yesno's pissed off at in this thread. Who knows how many people that could be?

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Wednesday, 2nd September 2015, 16:29
by Wahaha
mps wrote:Good point, but I think yesno's talking about all the women who don't post because of the guys yesno's pissed off at in this thread. Who knows how many people that could be?

I'm not sure if you're sarcastic, but I'll answer seriously anyway for anyone who is seriously thinking about this.
The answer is zero. There are zero women who don't post here because someone used the word "pussy" and similar.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Wednesday, 2nd September 2015, 16:33
by Sandman25
emikaela wrote:
yesno wrote:i wonder why women don't post here

We do, you just have to stop assuming that everyone is male until proven otherwise


Just to clarify. Is the post thanked by women only?

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Wednesday, 2nd September 2015, 17:15
by byrel
Lasty wrote:
Sprucery wrote:In Tavern, fuck is never out of context, unlike pussy.

"Fuck" isn't ever a gendered insult.

Edit: just to be clear, the problem isn't describing people's body parts or swearing. The problem is that "pussy" used as an insult has a history of being used to gay-bash and insult "woman-ish" behavior.


Uhhh... And the word tramp has been used to insult women who didn't hold to a particular moral code. And if I used it as an insult in the context it would be problematic, and potentially moderatable. It's contextually problematic.
but I'm sure you can think of other contextually-problematic words that you wouldn't feel are acceptable even in irony.

What the heck? What in the world does contextually-problematic mean to you if not 'only a problem in context'? And if the word is only a problem in context, then no, I don't agree that's unacceptable in all contexts. That makes no sense at all. Or are you suggesting that contextually problematic words are entirely unacceptable in ironic contexts? I honestly can't make out a sensible meaning for this sentence, which undoubtedly indicates I'm misunderstanding somehow.

Just for a history lesson on this word: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=pussy
Note that the term being applied to female genetalia is only attested back to the 19th century, while the term applied as an endearment to women and an insult to male wimpyness is attested to the 16th. The use to apply to a cat is only attested to the 18th century.

So historically, it's:
1580 Effeminate men/endearment to women
1720 Cat
1879 Genitalia

In other words, historically it's a term like effeminate; it indicates that the behavior is being considered typical of a women as opposed to a man (with the exact behaviors it applies to being very culture-dependent.)

That all being said, history of terms is fairly irrelevant to moderation. I've never heard the term used of a gay person before. I've heard it used fairly indiscriminately of men and women who are perceived to need to be less sensitive in some way. There are quite a lot of gays with thick skins, where the word seems entirely out of place by any usage I've heard. I don't think it's a gay-specific insult, and I don't think there was any intent in this thread to use it to refer specifically to homosexuals.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Wednesday, 2nd September 2015, 17:55
by Rast
Also, n1k was using it in a literary context, so even if the word was really as offensive as "f*g" or "n*gg*r", it should still be permitted in that usage.

Re: back in my day

PostPosted: Wednesday, 2nd September 2015, 18:27
by moocowmoocow
Sorry but I have contextual problem with the word turnip. The leafy vegetables have long disparaged my turnip ancestors for living in the dirt (as if we could choose otherwise). I know it's being used ironically, but this disrespects the historical struggle of associating "turnip" with "negligent of one's hygiene". To be honest, it triggers me to even have to explain this.